I always wondered to myself if the pvp in SWTOR really was fun. I loved premades of 4 in guild running with friends and a couple of pugs was a grand time. But what I never could get over was the combat dependency on CC's. I don't need to write a list of all of them like most rage-quitters because well, anyone reading this knows em anyways.

 

A fresh 50 dropping into a warzone, well 'you're gonna have a bad time'. Not just for a few matches, but realistically until you have 80%+ Battlemaster gear or better. I don't have any suggestions to fix the mundane PVP this game boasts but what I will say is that I do seriously believe combat could be much more interesting if status effects such as bleed, slow, poison and such played a much bigger roll than stuns and mezzes. Controling the effects on your character, such is the system in Guild Wars uses, makes the good players dominate the bad, and gear means NOTHING. I'm not entirely sure why people love grinding? I understand that it seperates the dedicated players from the lameo's who play once a week but why should it?

 

I used to play a game called Fury, for pc. It was a miserable failure and more buggy than Diablo 3 on release night, but the PVP was incredible. Almost 0 stuns, and the whole goal was controlling your opponents energy generation my manipulating their different types of energy. No gear restrictions or skill restrictions (very similiar to the Secret World in fact). The gear? Tiered and free. The more powerful the gear, the more points it had. You had 1000 points and all skills had levels with points as well. Creating a build was a highly strategic and thought provoking process, involving long hours of testing to find the best fit between gear and skills point levels (the higher the point level on the skill the higher it's dps or affect rate). Brilliant!

 

SWTOR promotes cookie-cutting. If you wantch youtube videos each class in its role (tank, healer, dps etc.) Has 1 superior build and that's what the goodies run. The WZ's are boring and please don't deny it folks, we all know us PVP'ers have been shunned by Bioware and even though PVP is not this games focus we lost our poorly designed Open World and have only 4 WZ's that are all really the same, minus Huttbal.

 

The point? Reduce the cooldown on our stun break (most are 1.5 minutes). Reduce the number of stuns and introduce a few new abilities like transfer status effects, like 2 random negative effects get transferred to the nearest oponent. In combat stuns should FILL THE RESOLVE BAR. Why is it that 2 do this? If i'm in combat do I really want to run in get a 4 second stuns, get destroyed, get out, 2 more seconds and dead? What does my skill level matter at that point, even during the second I popped my escape, my resolve is full and I have half health... Bleh. I'll miss you SWTOR, and the community is pretty good here (D3'ers are the worst i've ever seen). Just some food for thought as i move on to enjoy some of the other great MMO's out there. Cheers! Please share your thoughts as well, is PVP where it should be, and am really alone in the stun issue? Thanks.

 

Slix

 

Sllix 50 Gunslinger

ShatterShot 50 Shadow

Hammerfistadon 50 Guardian

Path 1.4 seem more fluid and less stunny. I just came back and its stun stun stun stun. It's garbage. Back to guildwars, which I recognize is a crap too.

I agree that stuns are far too powerful in this game, but I'm not sure if I agree with your suggestions on how to fix it.

 

I think everyone will have different ideas on how to fix this, and at the end of the day it is bioware that will decide. The best we can do is to agree on a problem, and hope that Bioware hears us.

 

I haven't met a single person in game that have approved of the change to resolve in 1.4. I personally liked Resolve, I thought it was a much better system than diminishing returns. I don't like it in 1.4 though. People can overlap CC and not be punished for it, that is very, very bad. You might argue that they waste CC but in this game, that doesn't really matter. Is there any class that doesn't have at least two ways of CCing an opponent? People are incredibly sloppy with CC and they get to get away with it.

 

Personally I would like to see them go back to 1.1 and try to evolve the pvp from there again.

Resolve system needs a complete overhaul.

after changes to resolve, CC was fine in PVP. well, except for the crowd that thinks any CC is too much CC. the problem now is stunbubbles. until BW removes or fixes it WZs will continue to be stunzones.

resolve system needs a complete overhaul.

 

^^ qfe

patch 1.4 was the worst patch there ever was, no one asked for more stuns. Pre 1.4 it was a bit over the top but it wasnt that bad because the resolve system seemed to work. BUT <=====

 

BW what is the point of resolve at the moment? by the time it fills up you are dead THEN <===

 

you get the pleasure of watching it drop as you stand in the rez zone waiting to be released. why in gods name would you want to make a change to a game that was already CC heavy even worse? its just silly, to be honest i am here because I love star wars and that is the only thing keeping me from leaving.

 

At beta you had such a wonderful game, every aspect of it had me chopping at the bit for launch, the only thing really wrong with pvp at that point was the Op's/scoundrel bug that alowed for 2 shooting people, the resolve bar filled in my opinion at a normal pace.

 

You will bleed those subs faster with this 1.4 change than any other bad decision you will make when it comes to pvp.

Remove all stuns and rebalance. Keep the roots, snares, knockdowns and mezzes. Just gotta lose the stuns. PvP would be so much more fun.

 

It'll never happen though. Too much work to rebalance and I suspect the stuns are there to lighten the server-side processing load.

also tough to do given abils like gbtf. you also have to consider how vital stuns are as interrupts. nearly every melee has an interruptable channel. it's possible to rebalance. it's just...man. iunno. there's nothing to interrupt on an op. you have to freeze them @ ~30%.

Remove all stuns and rebalance. Keep the roots, snares, knockdowns and mezzes. Just gotta lose the stuns. PvP would be so much more fun.

 

It'll never happen though. Too much work to rebalance and I suspect the stuns are there to lighten the server-side processing load.

 

The stuns are there because of all the people who spent 6 months whining about Marauders. True Story. Bioware didn't say so directly, but what they DID say was that they changed the resolve system so that "melee classes" weren't running around the WZs "like wrecking balls, with full resolve bars". I mean really, to whom do you think they are referring?

 

They couldn't nerf their (meaning Maras) damage because anyone paying attention knows they weren't doing more damage than PTs anyway.

 

They couldn't nerf their survivability, because contrary to popular belief, they die as much on average per WZ as any other DPS class, they just have two very noticeable abilities that make people feel like they are "cheating death".

 

So how do you nerf a class that Bioware said was "performing exactly as they expected"? You make a sweeping change that affects (and annoys) EVERYBODY, but that just happens to annoy/affect Maras a little bit more.

 

We have a ridiculous amount of CC in this game because people aren't as good at running away from people, as they are running towards them. So now we ALL get to spend a little more time standing still, so people can get better at it. Plain and simple.

The stuns are there because of all the people who spent 6 months whining about Marauders. True Story. Bioware didn't say so directly, but what they DID say was that they changed the resolve system so that "melee classes" weren't running around the WZs "like wrecking balls, with full resolve bars". I mean really, to whom do you think they are referring?

 

They couldn't nerf their (meaning Maras) damage because anyone paying attention knows they weren't doing more damage than PTs anyway.

 

They couldn't nerf their survivability, because contrary to popular belief, they die as much on average per WZ as any other DPS class, they just have two very noticeable abilities that make people feel like they are "cheating death".

 

So how do you nerf a class that Bioware said was "performing exactly as they expected"? You make a sweeping change that affects (and annoys) EVERYBODY, but that just happens to annoy/affect Maras a little bit more.

 

We have a ridiculous amount of CC in this game because people aren't as good at running away from people, as they are running towards them. So now we ALL get to spend a little more time standing still, so people can get better at it. Plain and simple.

 

well said. thank you for a shred of logic in this bloated QQ thread

Stuns are a part of this game. Don't like stuns? Don't play this game.

 

I like that a well-timed stun, knockback, snare, etc can turn the tide in a WZ, allow your team to complete a cap or let the ball carrier score in Huttall.

 

Stuns are a part of this game. Save your breaker to stop the cap. Be patient.

The stuns are there because of all the people who spent 6 months whining about Marauders. True Story. Bioware didn't say so directly, but what they DID say was that they changed the resolve system so that "melee classes" weren't running around the WZs "like wrecking balls, with full resolve bars". I mean really, to whom do you think they are referring?

 

They couldn't nerf their (meaning Maras) damage because anyone paying attention knows they weren't doing more damage than PTs anyway.

 

They couldn't nerf their survivability, because contrary to popular belief, they die as much on average per WZ as any other DPS class, they just have two very noticeable abilities that make people feel like they are "cheating death".

 

So how do you nerf a class that Bioware said was "performing exactly as they expected"? You make a sweeping change that affects (and annoys) EVERYBODY, but that just happens to annoy/affect Maras a little bit more.

 

We have a ridiculous amount of CC in this game because people aren't as good at running away from people, as they are running towards them. So now we ALL get to spend a little more time standing still, so people can get better at it. Plain and simple.

Looking back on some of the decisions BW has made I'd say that you're vastly overestimating their ability. The resolve system is not an intended mara nerf, it's just them screwing up......again. I mean, why would they try to hide it and blame the changes on something els, especially when that something els is the complete opposite to what happened? BW is not in a position to have its' credibility tested, that ship sailed 11 months ago.

Stuns are a part of this game. Don't like stuns? Don't play this game.

 

I'm not even sure how best to address this ridiculous statement.

 

I like that a well-timed stun, knockback, snare, etc can turn the tide in a WZ, allow your team to complete a cap or let the ball carrier score in Huttall.

 

Stuns are a part of this game. Save your breaker to stop the cap. Be patient.

 

 

 

Stuns of this magnitude are simply a crutch and tactically shallow. Don't confuse knockbacks and snares with hard stuns, because they don't completely remove control of your character.

Edited November 24, 2012 by Sowwy

Long live Stun Wars The Old Republic!

 

I keeed, I keeeed.

 

But seriously, the buddy system is a good way to minimize the stun vs. stun fights. I always try to stick close to someone who can cleanse stuns (I'm specced into purge on my Sorc) so that we're not stunned long enough to make a difference. In Huttball obviously being stunned for 3 seconds can change the outcome of the game, but in Alderaan and Void Star 3 seconds didn't make or break things that often (sometimes it does, but more often it doesn't).

Stuns of this magnitude are simply a crutch and tactically shallow. Don't confuse knockbacks and snares with hard stuns, because they don't completely remove control of your character.

 

Are we playing the same game? Last I heard, a well-timed Cover Pulse, Overload, Flashbang, Whirlwind or four second stun is a GREAT way to allow your team to cap a node after clearing it. Each side gets the same tools.

 

And I'm not confusing them. A four second stun rarely leads to death unless you're being focused and then the stun is not your whole problem. The Sorc bubble stun is a bit of a problem but that tree needs some kind of love since most agree it's DPS is subpar; a solution for that may be in the works.

 

Stuns and ther forms of CC are part of this game.

I'm a marauder and thus can't admit my class is too strong or any other class is too weak.

 

Cool story brosith.

How can people be advocating the removal of stun? Seriously. Sure they ruin PvP but they are essential to PVE (FP's, Ops, story). So fix one part of SWTOR by breaking the others?

How can people be advocating the removal of stun? Seriously. Sure they ruin PvP but they are essential to PVE (FP's, Ops, story). So fix one part of SWTOR by breaking the others?

 

Whats pve?

How can people be advocating the removal of stun? Seriously. Sure they ruin PvP but they are essential to PVE (FP's, Ops, story). So fix one part of SWTOR by breaking the others?

I'm all for the stun bubble ( a somewhat biased view as a sorc/sage) but please tell me that you are kidding? Since when has stun bubble been crucial to the success of PvE?

BW need to first ensure that every class is balanced or at least ensure that the classes have some sort of prominent viability in pvp. If they were to remove stuns now and leave the classes the way they were then hardly anyone would pvp.What BW have done is instead of successfully balancing the classes for pvp they tweaked other areas to make the classes that they knew weren't good for pvp a little bet better which in turn made the players who knew they were good against these classes QQ because they can't kill them quite as easily anymore.

 

Balance the classes then remove the stuns is all im saying.

I'm all for the stun bubble ( a somewhat biased view as a sorc/sage) but please tell me that you are kidding? Since when has stun bubble been crucial to the success of PvE?

 

I was responding to Social Scientist's avocation of removing ALL stuns not just the stun bubble

after changes to resolve, CC was fine in PVP. well, except for the crowd that thinks any CC is too much CC. the problem now is stunbubbles. until BW removes or fixes it WZs will continue to be stunzones.

 

How did the resolve change help with CC? It made CC worse because there's no longer a penalty for failing to time your CCs correctly. Now resolve is utterly pointless. By the time it's full your back in the spawn, watching it tick down uselessly. It's way worse than before. Stun bubbles are just insult to injury.

^^^ That's the whole issue. The entire reason for the resolve system is to counter the excessive amount of controlling effects being thrown about in warzones. The resolve system doesn't work now, nor has it ever worked.

 

A correctly functioning resolve system should standardize the amount of time over the course of the game that your character can be taken out of a fight. It should not matter whether you are fighting 1 player or 100. The amount of time you spend controlled should be approximately the same. An example. Let's say that someone stuns you for 4 seconds. Your resolve bar fills up and you are instantly granted immunity for 4 seconds. The resolve bar should be decaying constantly but each time it fills up to full you cannot be controlled for the duration of the immunity. This forces players to 'stagger" out their stuns rather than dumping them all on the target in a very short space of time.

 

The resulting game play ensures that all characters can still tactically use their stuns but on the flip side not feel as though they are being stunned to death. This sort of system is extremely easy to implement. Bioware already has a lot of the code in place.

If you like games that have pvp combat work the way you describe, there are plenty of them to pick from. Play those instead.