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Operative suvivability?

STAR WARS: The Old Republic > English > PvP
Operative suvivability?

Ttoilleekul's Avatar


Ttoilleekul
05.27.2019 , 11:40 AM | #1
Ok, my first post here, but I've been playing for 1.5 years. By no means am I the best player around, but I'm no slouch either. I main a 258 Guardian skank with full DPS stats in PVP. However on the following occasion I was playing my Vigilance Guardian (252 with 236 augs).

I'm really not one to jump to accusations of cheating and use of hacks, I've had accusations of cheating levelled at me, for example when I defeated two Assassins in a 2v1. A LOT of accusations of cheating can be answered by skill. But every now and then something happens that I cannot explain.

The scenario in question is Civil War, with a 248 Operative trying to cap vs 4 players. One of those players was me. A common situation, and I grant that done well, a skilled Operative can cap vs 4 players who don't know where to position themselves. But, I digress....

The operative in question was caught in a chain stun, at which point of course the 4 of us proceed to DPS him. He lost only 50% of his HP, before he scampered around the turret platform. My question is how can he lose only 50%? No matter the skill of the 4 other players, when the situation is reversed, my vigilance guardian is dead in seconds. In fact in the very same match a few minutes later I was 1v2 against 2 Operatives, once they chain stunned me my health bar vanished. Ofc I survived momentarily by using FD, but I was still dead.

So, I'm not accusing of cheating. I'm willing to be educated. How do Operatives do this? Since it is a common occurrence. In 1v1 I grant they are formidable, but I have a Ruffian Scoundrel too, and I can see no way to give them this kind of survivability when chain stunned.

Perhaps someone who knows more about the class could explain it to me?

Please though, if you reply by saying its all about skill and understanding of abilities, then can you actually give me a break down of how? Rather than just saying its skill. I'm quite happy to accept that this is not cheating if someone can explain to me how it's done.

foxmob's Avatar


foxmob
05.27.2019 , 03:13 PM | #2
did you notice and 'reflect' or 'dodge' fly texts?
Krack

Ttoilleekul's Avatar


Ttoilleekul
05.27.2019 , 04:02 PM | #3
Quote: Originally Posted by foxmob View Post
did you notice and 'reflect' or 'dodge' fly texts?
Must admit I wasn't looking for them, so I can't say. As I understand the class, any Damage reduction is minimal to non- existent while stunned? For example Guardian skanks can be specced to 30% damage reduction while stunned, and can activate Focused Defence while stunned. I'm no Scoundrel / Operative expert, but when I inspect my Scoundrel I see no equivalent damage reduction while stunned
.

Ttoilleekul's Avatar


Ttoilleekul
05.27.2019 , 04:08 PM | #4
[QUOTE=Ttoilleekul;9731837]Must admit I wasn't looking for them, so I can't say. As I understand the class, any Damage reduction is minimal to non- existent while stunned? For example Guardian skanks can be specced to 30% damage reduction while stunned, and can activate Focused Defence while stunned. I'm no Scoundrel / Operative expert, but when I inspect my Scoundrel I see no equivalent damage reduction while stunned
.

UltraFlashStar's Avatar


UltraFlashStar
05.27.2019 , 04:14 PM | #5
[QUOTE=Ttoilleekul;9731840]
Quote: Originally Posted by Ttoilleekul View Post
Must admit I wasn't looking for them, so I can't say. As I understand the class, any Damage reduction is minimal to non- existent while stunned? For example Guardian skanks can be specced to 30% damage reduction while stunned, and can activate Focused Defence while stunned. I'm no Scoundrel / Operative expert, but when I inspect my Scoundrel I see no equivalent damage reduction while stunned
.
If Scoundrel has 2 Stacks of Probe on then thatís 6% DR already, if they also have Pugnacity active thatís another 20%, if they have adrenal on then thatís another 15%, if they are specced into Ruffian when their shield drops they get 15% DR also.

If all these are active thatís: 56% DR, even when stunned
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Rion_Starkiller's Avatar


Rion_Starkiller
05.27.2019 , 04:18 PM | #6
Probably a combination of these things?

1. Operative Pugnacity/Stim Booster gives 20% DR for 15 seconds before he was stunned... assuming the utility is taken (and it very very often is).
2. Warzone Adrenal gives 15% DR.
3. Maybe he had Shield Probe up.
4. The 3 DPS with you might have been really bad.
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Quote: Originally Posted by EricMusco View Post
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DzastinBiberi's Avatar


DzastinBiberi
05.27.2019 , 08:14 PM | #7
Op could have popped Evasion before you stunned him and thats 3 sec of dodging all dmg towards him.

bUrself_'s Avatar


bUrself_
05.27.2019 , 08:20 PM | #8
damage reduction exists, many players do really really bad damage

also "reduced damage taken" hacks aren't really a thing

Quote: Originally Posted by DzastinBiberi View Post
Op could have popped Evasion before you stunned him and thats 3 sec of dodging all dmg towards him.
you cannot dodge attacks while hard stunned in swtor

SlimeyDoom's Avatar


SlimeyDoom
05.28.2019 , 01:55 AM | #9
Quote: Originally Posted by DzastinBiberi View Post
Op could have popped Evasion before you stunned him and thats 3 sec of dodging all dmg towards him.
No. If you get stunned when you pop evasion, you don't dodge any damage at all. Being stunned reduces dodge chance to 0% for the duration of the stun, that's why you always stun people during deflection, saberward, evasion, etc

Ttoilleekul's Avatar


Ttoilleekul
05.28.2019 , 03:07 AM | #10
So, as expected I had considered the possibility that he had conveniently popped all his utility self heals plus 2 stacks of probe right before he knew he was likely to get chain stunned... but this still leaves me with a doubt.... as I said I main a Guardian skank with 15k armour rating. In anticipation of the same scenario happening to me, I have often popped Saber Ward + Warding call in order to survive such situations, but even with all that tankiness I suffer massive HP loss against even the worst DPS players in the game. Say what you like about Scoundrels / Operatives, they do not have the same damage reduction as a Defence Guardian, I'm at 52% damage reduction before even popping any defences. They have better survivability yes, but not better damage reduction.

In fact in my time playing, the only scenario I know for a certain can always walk away from that situation is when I am tanking for a good healer. A good skank and a good healer can easily hold off 4 decent DPS players in WZ. I actually find it hilarious watching them try to focus my healer and not managing it. (4 extremely good DPS players will eventually win - but that's a different topic).. so... as I said I hate to make accusations of cheating, and I really want there to be an explanation for this.... but that sort of damage reduction looked a lot like my damage reduction when I am teamed with a healer. Which leads me to ask the question... can we absolutely rule out a healing bot?

In defence of the class I will admit that it is always Operatives trying to cap turrets vs 4 players, no other class can do it and you never see other classes trying. So yes, they have amazing survivability. But usually once caught in a chain stun they need to stealth out or die. Actually seeing one walk away was like.. huh??? I mean I've been 1v1 with Operatives and taken more than 50% of their HP by double stunning on my own.