I can't recall the number of times I've seen this system being abused; it's absolutely ridiculous.

 

For example,

 

I just join a flashpoint half way through and the tank and healer are just arguing and typing garbage into the chat and then the healer leaves. A new healer joins and now the tank and other DPS are still typing garbage into the chat and I really don't have a clue what they're talking about and then suddenly "You have been vote kicked reason: stupid". I think it was something about going through the exhaustion zone in battle of ilum and the fact they skipped some bosses or something but whatever it was about was no reason to cast a vote kick on me which only requires 1 more vote before I'm gone.

 

Countless other times I see vote kicks on people for just stupid reasons such as someone accidently pulls a mob, someone doesn't want to skip a boss which literally takes under a minute to kill anyway (cause it drops a daily commendation and some decent loot). Sometimes you just get really aggressive and angry people in your group where if everything doesn't go exactly how they want it to go, you're gone and it only takes one other idiot in your group to vote. I've seen vote kicks where I've voted NO and they still get kicked anyway.

 

Just thought I'd edit in some more examples that I've seen vote kicks for to really make my point:

 

- In collicoid war game if a player gets on the cannon before everyone gets into the flashpoint and causes a wipe, they may not know any better and may have never done the flashpoint before. Politely give them a warning and get on with it. If your tolerance is really that low then you shouldn't even be playing an MMO

- In Directive 7, when you get up to the 3 droids, if you kill the orange shielded one before you kill the non-shielded one, it will cause the blue shielded droid to become immune. If a player does not know any better then simply explain to them what they need to know and get on with it.

- In KUS when you get to the cannon part, you can jump onto some of your surroundings and make all the mobs evade. If someone in your group does not want to do this, then I think that's fair. Exploiting the game mechanics to get past that fight with ease was not intended and if a player does not want to do it this way then I don't see why they should have to.

- In collicoid war game I was doing the puzzle part where you have to work together fighting the droids and clicking the terminals to get to the next area. I was the healer and unlocked a barrier which the tank and 1 DPS ran to. There was an elite droid (gold star) behind it. The tank tells me to come with him to kill it and I ask him why since he's already got a DPS there to help him and I get vote kicked for "being a monkey" because I simply asked him why he wanted it that way. Him and the other DPS are more than enough to take on the elite droid. Don't get me wrong, I didn't refuse to do it, I was actually walking to there to help him, kicked anyway.

- I was in a group in the boarding party flashpoint with a stealther and pulled one really small mob which we could have technically stealthed past and he goes crazy, vote kick, gone.

- A player in your group refuses to go through the exhaustion zone in battle of ilum. Sorry but skipping pretty much everything by exploiting the exhaustion zone was not intended, if a player does not want to do it this way they shouldn't have to. From my experience with this, all I've seen by the group trying to do it this way is a ton of deaths from the exhaustion zone killing people over and over.

 

TL: DR

What this system NEEDS is for everyone in the group to vote before they are kicked (excluding the person actually being kicked of course), not just the initial vote kicker and one idiot.

Edited August 22, 2012 by Acegi

not sure if this is that big of a deal since you wouldnt want to play with the idiot votekickers anyways. ive had similar situations and just shrugged them off, q'd up again and usually im with a much nicer friendlier group in no time.

not sure if this is that big of a deal since you wouldnt want to play with the idiot votekickers anyways.

 

I would say it will become more common than people think if devs implement it, meaning lots of trouble for lone players who aren't very good at the game or don't have great gear (the stupidest reason ever to kick unless its a tier 2 instance, yet I'm willing to bet real money some ADHD kids will vote to kick those people regardless)

 

I say no to votekicking. Its asked basically only by people who think themselves better than others, for one.

Edited August 21, 2012 by Karkais

just put ppl on ignore and be done with them. when i see a que pop i scan to the tanks name and wait to see if they make it to the FP. if they drop group then i put them on ignore (12 now) and move on. if bw allowed /ignore to include legacy less tanks/healers would stop turning on dbag mode.

Vote Kicking is a necessary thing, though some definitley take advatage of it. I assume the main reason it was introduced is to kick off the person who got disconnected an never bothers to leave the group. In this case you get left with only 3 members and cannot complete the mission.

Maybe I havent done enough group finder queues(guessing I've done around 30-40) but I have yet to see votekick failing to do its job or seen it abused.

 

A quick list of things I have initiated or approved votekick for:

 

* A dps dies randomly in FE, has to run back. 5 minutes later the rest of the group have cleared to the next boss and he is still in fleet. When asked why he wasn't running he said "Im omw".

 

* Some dude pressing need on every single item(including bossdrops for other classes)

 

* A guy says "we are doing the optional boss", the other 3 members say "no". Guy goes ahead and pulls a bunch of trash we intended to skip, dies and starts cursing.

 

Of course, in these scenarios getting three people on board with a vote kick doesnt seem unreasonable so perhaps OP is right. I just have yet to see it abused, though.

In this case you get left with only 3 members and cannot complete the mission.

Did HM Directive 7 3 man the other night after the tank dropped and have done at least 4 others 3 man always without the tank. Of course these have been always without the tank on my healer. My wookiee is full Rakata so pretty much better geared than many Tank I have gotten in group finder. Pretty sure it would work for DPS too since Risha is even better geared than my wookiee.

 

So far I have not seen it abused either.

 

Only seen it done 3 times,

 

1. Tank dropped waited 10 mins and kicked.

 

2. Shadow signed up as a Tank was not a Tank (dps in dps gear). Thinking this was a bug.

 

3. Healer that refused to heal, but played as dps without the damage part.

 

I've seen more tanks drop after not getting the drop they wanted.

 

None of these made my ignore list. There are only two ways to make my ignore list 1) those that belittle others. There is a right way and a wrong way to tell people they are doing it wrong and someone one that moaning about every little thing a new 50 does for 1/2 the FP is doing it the wrong way. If you stop fighting to moan in the middle of the battle, then you are doing it the wrong way. You can abuse me...I don't care, but when you abuse others you make my list for all my toons including my healer.

 

2) Tanks that drop after a boss battle when they don't get the drop they wanted. Again not that big a deal to me when I on my healer, but on my DPS alts it is. However, they make all my ignore list.

 

I say majority should rule. 4 people in a group, it should take 3 votes if you assume the person being booted would vote no.

 

I by no means haven't gotten into a group where I didn't wanted to kick someone or quit myself. However, once I hit group finder I am committed to getting that group through, no matter its make up. I'm also willing to skip or fight anything in the FP depending on what the group wants to do.

Edited August 21, 2012 by mikebevo

Nah, 2 votes is fine. If 2 people want to kick you for some silly reason, you dont want to be with them any ways. I got kicked 2 times just becose I'm Assasin tank and they think they sucked (full black hole stuff beside weapon hilt, customized for max tanking stats, not max hp so have only 23500 hp)

healer ended in block list. better for me, wont land with him any more, and don't care of what dps thinks.

 

Other night I had healer who said he wont heal this group (my jugg tank and 2 maras).. 3 vote kick would be waste o 2 seconds since he refused to leave party (15 min lock out). (ignored list too)

Nah, 2 votes is fine. If 2 people want to kick you for some silly reason, you dont want to be with them any ways. I got kicked 2 times just becose I'm Assasin tank and they think they sucked (full black hole stuff beside weapon hilt, customized for max tanking stats, not max hp so have only 23500 hp)

healer ended in block list. better for me, wont land with him any more, and don't care of what dps thinks.

 

Other night I had healer who said he wont heal this group (my jugg tank and 2 maras).. 3 vote kick would be waste o 2 seconds since he refused to leave party (15 min lock out). (ignored list too)

 

Yes, sure you wouldn't want to be in a group with 2 idiots anyway, but if you're playing a DPS role and have waited over 20 minutes or more for a queue, you're willing to take whatever you get rather than waiting another 20 minutes.

Yes, sure you wouldn't want to be in a group with 2 idiots anyway, but if you're playing a DPS role and have waited over 20 minutes or more for a queue, you're willing to take whatever you get rather than waiting another 20 minutes.

 

I see your point. If I have to wait 9 seconds on my tank, I relog on my healer.... not patient one am I.

if those two will want to kick you, they may either refuse healing you / taunting off you, stop doing anything until you quit or make 3rd person join vote kick.

 

Remember, f2p is coming, and we will have more muppets there. One day, You may want to kick some player in greens L 25 who is marked as healer, dps spec, and pulling aggro on random avoidable mobs, just for funs.

i understand your pain and frustration. in all of the hms i have done on three of my 50s i have only seen a vote kick for a couple disconnects. even in these situations people were rather fast in voting and kinda clueless that getting a replacement tank or healer would take far longer than a extra 30 seconds or a minute to wait. what i have seen are tanks and healers just flat out leave group. all of these were sub par in ability but hey some other group can deal with them now.

 

i try not to put too many people on ignore that are tanks and healers. dps is different.

I was vote-kicked in my first HM mission (Black Talon) about midway through. The group was using shortcuts I wasn't familiar with and were expecting space barring. No one said this up front. When they started complaining about not space barring, I started doing it (hadn't even known it was expected), but when I drew aggro on a mob following the leader he got enraged and kicked me with one other voter, with a "tired of your crap, learn how to act properly and stop your noob ways". So I missed out on the daily credits and all.

 

All of this could have been avoided with a short statement when group was formed. A lot of players on HM mission simply fail to realize that sometimes there are brand new 50s who just don't know what is expected and need to be told.

 

Having said that, 95% of my FP experiences have been fun with a great bunch of helpful players.

ofc all of the group should agree when it comes to kicking a member. (exept the one beeing kicked ofc.)

if one in your group is ok with the one you wanna kick, then suck it up or leave yourself.

If he´s so bad all will agree to get him kicked.

Unfortunately you are at the whim of the tank and healer when you queue DPS. A new DPS will be found almost immediately but a new tank or healer can take upwards of 15 minutes. As such, if the tank or healer wants you gone they just threaten to leave group and everyone votes to kick you. It's not the way it SHOULD be, but its the way it IS.

 

Moral of this story: You want to avoid being kicked? Roll a tank.

I've never been kicked, but have been in groups that have kicked players for what I would deem petty and impatient reasons (not knowing the FP, accidentally agro, and not hitting space bar, etc.). If that happens while I'm on my DPS, I just stick with the group and try to make it through to the end., write the names down and add them to my Tank's ignore list. If it happens while I'm rolling my Tank, I will leave the group, and add the 2 members to my ignore list. It gives me time to take a 10 minute break (while waiting out the penalty), and then I'm back in que and back into a FP in seconds. Actions do have consequences.

just put ppl on ignore and be done with them. when i see a que pop i scan to the tanks name and wait to see if they make it to the FP. if they drop group then i put them on ignore (12 now) and move on. if bw allowed /ignore to include legacy less tanks/healers would stop turning on dbag mode.

 

lol, yeah.... in my experience, most abusive and obnoxious *****s are people rolling tanks or healers for some reason... and definetely legacy ignore would be nice. for the time being, i share my ignore list between my 2 toons.

thankfully, the group finder is server side only.

 

if you don't understand the reason of your kick, you could always ask them. i could be a misunderstanding or that they are terrible people, either way, you might wanna know.

 

i find that, though it happens, the social pressure of single server group finder, most bad act, including kick and leaving after (not) looting, are not as common as in an another famous mmo with cross server group finder.

not sure if this is that big of a deal since you wouldnt want to play with the idiot votekickers anyways. ive had similar situations and just shrugged them off, q'd up again and usually im with a much nicer friendlier group in no time.

 

It's more of a problem for Healers and DPS then it is for tanks. On my Vangaurd tank it's pretty much insta-Que, on my Sorc Healer I am normally queued for quite some time before it pops. So Tanks prolly wouldn't care but I am sure that a DPS or a Healer would get quite upset about it.

I never voted kick for stupid reasons like new 50's not knowing the tactics and such or for not spacebarring. They could just ask/explain the situation/rules.

 

In contrast, the players who jump at the kick button, are often the bad players. And when you make a comment about it, they start flashing titles and pointing at your "inferior" gear. That only happens when i am on my slinger, as he wears tionese-gear for FP's.

 

On my tanks, i had some of these db's before, but stay on the group now matter how much they hate me

If someone gets votekicked out of my group, I leave the group. I dont give a flying pig in hell's *** about your l33t titles (I have them all myself, but besides the point ). If you votekick someone for not spacebaring or anything like that, I put you on my ignore list on all my characters (only play on 2 characters, healer and tank), and tell everyone I play with to stay the fudge away from you.

 

Whoever does this kind of stuff = ignore. Very simple.

I have 2 level 50s, a Shadow tank and a Sentinel DD. I do more ops than FPs, and so far, I have only once experienced someone getting votekicked. It was somewhat understandable, and nevertheless severely indecent.

Oh, and it happened to myself

The Group Finder was rather new still, and I was drafted in as a replacement DD for someone who had lost his connection and was trying to rejoin them, although I did not know that. I was immediately voted out, leaving me stranded on Ilum, wasting my time first to get back to anywhere I could do something useful, and mostly by kicking me out of the GF queue.

Unsurprisingly, these people now are on my ignore list.

I can understand that they wanted to be decent to their missing member, but they transferred his misfortune - which was likely somewhat earned by his not planning for regular ISP-disconnects - to a random stranger, me, who had done nothing to deserve the waste of time.

That they saw themselves with no better way to help their member not lose his progress says something against the system, but it does not excuse them wasting my time and possibly that of any other DD in between me and their re-queued former group member.

I think the queue system might need a few tweaks in more than one place...

I vote kick a lot if its not following directions/disconnects and general trolling.. And especially people cheating queues by coming as tank but in dps

the groupfinder have put any potential tanks as tank by default for as long as i remember. maybe it have been fixed with the latest patch tho. Just saying some of the cheaters might not have done so on purpose.

actually, another use for the vote kick (as i found out last night) is to circumvent the group finder lockout. for example, i was in a group, someone had to leave, we ask group finder to "find replacement" and due to an awesome group finder bug, we get a second healer. we explain the situation to the second healer, he then says "please vote kick me, so that i dont get the group finder lockout" no problem. I try to find a replacement again, and we get a second tank, lol.

i agree with both partys on this one it should be a majority vote but also think why would u want to play with ppl who just think they are better than everyone its a game and ment to be fun the fact its swtor just makes it better i have been kicked for not knowing what happens on mandalorin raiders on my fist run i just called the guy a dick and left.

cheers for the post nice to see others also have problems with ppl who have no real concept of what playin an MMO is about

 

For example,

 

I just join a flashpoint half way through and the tank and healer are just arguing and typing garbage into the chat and then the healer leaves. A new healer joins and now the tank and other DPS are still typing garbage into the chat and I really don't have a clue what they're talking about and then suddenly "You have been vote kicked reason: stupid". I think it was something about going through the exhaustion zone in battle of ilum and the fact they skipped some bosses or something but whatever it was about was no reason to cast a vote kick on me which only requires 1 more vote before I'm gone.

 

Countless other times I see vote kicks on people for just stupid reasons such as someone accidently pulls a mob, someone doesn't want to skip a boss which literally takes under a minute to kill anyway (cause it drops a daily commendation and some decent loot). Sometimes you just get really aggressive and angry people in your group where if everything doesn't go exactly how they want it to go, you're gone and it only takes one other idiot in your group to vote. I've seen vote kicks where I've voted NO and they still get kicked anyway.

 

Just thought I'd edit in some more examples that I've seen vote kicks for to really make my point:

 

- In collicoid war game if a player gets on the cannon before everyone gets into the flashpoint and causes a wipe, they may not know any better and may have never done the flashpoint before. Politely give them a warning and get on with it. If your tolerance is really that low then you shouldn't even be playing an MMO

- In Directive 7, when you get up to the 3 droids, if you kill the orange shielded one before you kill the non-shielded one, it will cause the blue shielded droid to become immune. If a player does not know any better then simply explain to them what they need to know and get on with it.

- In KUS when you get to the cannon part, you can jump onto some of your surroundings and make all the mobs evade. If someone in your group does not want to do this, then I think that's fair. Exploiting the game mechanics to get past that fight with ease was not intended and if a player does not want to do it this way then I don't see why they should have to.

- In collicoid war game I was doing the puzzle part where you have to work together fighting the droids and clicking the terminals to get to the next area. I was the healer and unlocked a barrier which the tank and 1 DPS ran to. There was an elite droid (gold star) behind it. The tank tells me to come with him to kill it and I ask him why since he's already got a DPS there to help him and I get vote kicked for "being a monkey" because I simply asked him why he wanted it that way. Him and the other DPS are more than enough to take on the elite droid. Don't get me wrong, I didn't refuse to do it, I was actually walking to there to help him, kicked anyway.

- I was in a group in the boarding party flashpoint with a stealther and pulled one really small mob which we could have technically stealthed past and he goes crazy, vote kick, gone.

- A player in your group refuses to go through the exhaustion zone in battle of ilum. Sorry but skipping pretty much everything by exploiting the exhaustion zone was not intended, if a player does not want to do it this way they shouldn't have to. From my experience with this, all I've seen by the group trying to do it this way is a ton of deaths from the exhaustion zone killing people over and over.

 

TL: DR

What this system NEEDS is for everyone in the group to vote before they are kicked (excluding the person actually being kicked of course), not just the initial vote kicker and one idiot.