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Objective pvp is a mess

STAR WARS: The Old Republic > English > PvP
Objective pvp is a mess

Lhancelot's Avatar


Lhancelot
02.16.2020 , 09:10 PM | #21
Quote: Originally Posted by Eastiano View Post
I did 75 pvp today, got huttball, my team didn't even bother witb objectives and we lost 6-0 pretty quick.
I was healing so got fucused quite s lot and figured, oh well, my team must be dmg farming...

End of game, 2 players broke 1k dps and not even by much lol -_-

**** this game, I've had enuff between the ineptitude of the devs, their mollycoddling and double standards and this is what we are left with?
I love those matches where your entire team is numbers farming, then when it's all said and done... your teams highest can't even break 1k dps.

I think the same thing everytime, at least if you going to farm numbers you better put up something decent. lol.
Quote: Originally Posted by TrixxieTriss View Post
I’d still like to know how you find someone’s legacy name if they don’t display it?
Quote: Originally Posted by omaan View Post
Uh you don't know it because it is a secret knowledge of ranked players who use it to see the real appearance of other players through the force.

Storm-Cutter's Avatar


Storm-Cutter
02.17.2020 , 05:08 AM | #22
Basically everything about the objectives maps need serious work. - They are hardly changed since launch. - But abilities and CDs and such are way more powerful and varied now, so the objectives are somwhat harder to achieve, so no-one bothers.

When yo look at Hit Points of each character, then the HPS and DPS thet players can pump out, all the gap-closers making melee able to jump or pull to ranged, the added stealth options, the FOTMs of mercenaries and assassins upsetting the mixture, the DCDs that some classes have making them hard to kill, the added teleport that was given to snipers and Gunslingers, the added stuns and extra stuns and CC and slows and roots....

Every time I see someone alone trying to channel a cap ( door, turret or whatever) a stealth class pops out and stops it. When you can get a CC on them, someone else attackes them and breaks it. - It's an excercise in frustration. - So people simply deathmatch, hoping that one clued-up person will play the objectives, meaning that none do.

- And there seem to be a large proportion of players that can't defend two nodes out of three and win, but have to try capping the third, leaving the team over-stretched and exposed to a counter attack.

THere are also a larger number who just quit the minute the tide turns against them, leaving the remainder of the team losing with reduced numbers until the inevitable happens.

PLayers get little or no recognition for plating the objectives - even scoring 5x the next highest scorer still rarely warrants even an mvp vote - after that everyone gets the same. - so there's no real incentive.

Sure a win counts for 2x but even that isn't much better reward than 2x quick losses.

It needs a huge overhaul - but that's a long wait for a train that don't come.
-Storm Cutter.
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mothbanquet's Avatar


mothbanquet
02.17.2020 , 05:59 AM | #23
While I still have good fun in regs no matter the tier, I have a high tolerance for repetition. Even then, after 8 or so years with only a tiny handful of new objective maps, most of which are inferior to the originals then what's to be expected? You get out what you put in. Sadly, and I say that because I genuinely enjoy the PvP in this game, one just has to face the fact that it's nothing more than a sideshow to the main event and is treated accordingly. It's stale, repetitive and it's going to take a genuine effort - starting with a slew of new and exciting objective maps - to make 8v8 a big draw again. Probably more of an effort than BW will be willing to make.

Floplag's Avatar


Floplag
02.17.2020 , 11:19 AM | #24
Some intriguing comments and rationalizations im reading, but at the end of the day it all comes down to one thing, choice.
We all know the rules, we all know how it plays, and we all know (or should know anyway) that dps makes little difference unless it in pursuit of the objectives. I've seen a lot of people with silly high damage on the losing end of people playing the way the map was designed.
Play how you want, its your dime, but lets not pretend its anything other than our own decision to play outside the lines so to speak.
Floplag - Merc/Mando
Referral link, cause why not: http://www.swtor.com/r/wdLxth

Lhancelot's Avatar


Lhancelot
02.18.2020 , 12:31 AM | #25
Quote: Originally Posted by mothbanquet View Post
While I still have good fun in regs no matter the tier, I have a high tolerance for repetition. Even then, after 8 or so years with only a tiny handful of new objective maps, most of which are inferior to the originals then what's to be expected? You get out what you put in. Sadly, and I say that because I genuinely enjoy the PvP in this game, one just has to face the fact that it's nothing more than a sideshow to the main event and is treated accordingly. It's stale, repetitive and it's going to take a genuine effort - starting with a slew of new and exciting objective maps - to make 8v8 a big draw again. Probably more of an effort than BW will be willing to make.
I think at this point we can refer to the past regarding PVP as the “good old days” which makes me sad, because for many years I anticipated the next big update that would bring PVP to higher levels. Instead, every large update has accomplished the exact opposite.

The funny thing is it took me this long to finally throw the towel in and concede to the death of this game and PVP as it once was. I say it’s funny because looking at the bigger picture I think BW threw the towel in long before I ever did.

Oh well. SWTOR will go down in history as the MMO that should have been and could have been, a real disappointment in how the game was managed after launch. A gold mine sat on and never mined. Opportunities squandered beyond belief. I could write a hundred more cliches but rather not so I won’t.
Quote: Originally Posted by TrixxieTriss View Post
I’d still like to know how you find someone’s legacy name if they don’t display it?
Quote: Originally Posted by omaan View Post
Uh you don't know it because it is a secret knowledge of ranked players who use it to see the real appearance of other players through the force.

farren_whyde's Avatar


farren_whyde
02.18.2020 , 12:36 PM | #26
I'm so glad this has been posted/brought up.

I'm completely objective-focused in Unranked Warzones. There has always been the odd occasion of your/opposing team forgoing objectives to farm/harass/ruin (depending on success) the warzone, granted.

But since November 2019-ish? (I didn't play for a few months) there has been a marked increase (to me, anyway) in the number of Unranked Warzones where objectives become superfluous...

When did this become a 'thing'? Guess it snowballed? Is everyone just trialling the new Set Bonuses & Tacticals? Maybe it's a phase. Maybe not.

You see it in Voidstar, when even though one team has the edge, they make no effort to plant a bomb.

You see it in Queshball, when people ignore the ball and scrap all around it.

Civil War, when they have the edge in mid, and don't cap the turret.

Odessen, when there's over 50% of your team fighting on the other side of the uncontrolled active control points.

I play on Darth Malgus, flitting between my Scoundrel/Operative, Sage/Sorcerer, Vanguard/Powertech. I suppose it's serendipity when you end up on a team that wants to win by objectives. As above, just seems to be a huge increase in the numbers of warzones where you're told, "**** the ball, fight!"

Just never known it so prevalent before! Not professing to be expert, but you can put out numbers AND play objectively.

I dunno, it's just striking to me.

Kind regards,

Wellard/Wyles
I'm just not a lightsaber kind of person.

Pekish's Avatar


Pekish
02.18.2020 , 01:48 PM | #27
I think it is quite easy to explain if you add up all the reason:

A) DIFFICULTY
to do DPS each class as a guide and is relatively easy to follow instruction, ultimately is more or less always those couple of rotation two offensive and two defensives over and over (rarely really matter who your enemy or where you are! Just use the right rotation, and the right gear is all written down)
Vs
there are guides for warzone, but each warzone is different. They depend a lot from the enemy as well. You will need to have an awareness of surrounding counting people in your area react differently depending on what your team is going to do and locate them at all times looking in the map. Plus, you will need to learn other skills other than just doing DPS (carry the ball, team play, defending, stalling, ambushing, that's a lot of rotations to remember!)

B)REWARD/RECOGNITION
at the end of the match, you have a number that tells you how much DPS you did. It is easy enough for you to understand and easy enough for others to see! You can brag with others even when you lose. You never feel you lost. You did the biggest number!
Vs
You may have low DPS low kill and have made a perfect game defending, practically you may have been the one that saved the match, or that made your team win, but there will be nothing to show for! and nobody will know! Can't brag really.

C)ENTERTAINMENT
Dps you are in the center of the action for the all-time die and run back always doing something.
vs
Slow action objective (even if more meaningful) there is a lot of running around positioning yourself strategically and waiting but usually much much less action and very compressed in few heavy moments (easier to screw up and feel useless)


Add A+B+C =
easy to learn and execute +
rewarding as personal fame (people remember names of big DPS), recognition by others/bragging rights +
fun overall, much more active, less waiting, and "wasting" time running around.

Why would anybody try to do something HARDER that gives you no way of a realistic understanding of your performance? It won't show to your team that you did well nor that you know your class and ultimately may force you to wait and do close to nothing for 3-4 minutes at a time or to run around doing very little for 1-2 minutes?

Are we really asking why people ignore Objectives?

farren_whyde's Avatar


farren_whyde
02.18.2020 , 01:50 PM | #28
Quote: Originally Posted by Pekish View Post
I think it is quite easy to explain if you add up all the reason:

A) DIFFICULTY
to do DPS each class as a guide and is relatively easy to follow instruction, ultimately is more or less always those couple of rotation two offensive and two defensives over and over (rarely really matter who your enemy or where you are! Just use the right rotation, and the right gear is all written down)
Vs
there are guides for warzone, but each warzone is different. They depend a lot from the enemy as well. You will need to have an awareness of surrounding counting people in your area react differently depending on what your team is going and locate at all times your team looking at the map. Plus, you will need to learn other skills other than doing DPS (carry the ball, team play, defending, stalling! that's a lot of rotations to remember!)

B)REWARD/RECOGNITION
at the end of the match, you have a number that tells you how much DPS you did. It is easy enough for you to understand and easy enough for others to see! You can brag with others even when you lose. You never feel you lost. You did the biggest number!
Vs
You may have low DPS low kill and have made a perfect game defending, practically you may have been the one that saved the match, or that made your team win, but there will be nothing to show for! and nobody will know! Can't brag really.

C)ENTERTAINMENT
Dps you are in the center of the action for the all-time die and run back always doing something.
vs
Slow action objective (even if more meaningful) there is a lot of running around positioning yourself strategically and waiting but usually much much less action and very compressed in few heavy moments (easier to screw up and feel useless)


Add A+B+C =
easy to learn and execute +
rewarding as personal fame (people remember names of big DPS), recognition by others/bragging rights +
fun overall, much more active, less waiting, and "wasting" time running around.

Why would anybody try to do something HARDER that gives you no way of a realistic understanding of your performance? It won't show to your team that you did well nor that you know your class and ultimately may force you to wait and do close to nothing for 3-4 minutes at a time or to run around doing very little for 1-2 minutes?

Are we really asking why people ignore Objectives?
All very well, but lacking 'teamwork'.
I'm just not a lightsaber kind of person.

Pekish's Avatar


Pekish
02.18.2020 , 01:53 PM | #29
Quote: Originally Posted by farren_whyde View Post
All very well, but lacking 'teamwork'.
that's a pro skill if we pretend people even care about others we lost it from the start! I don't even bother to reach that level of sophistication.

I just take an example of 2 single-minded players only care about their own fun and their playstyle and bragging right (more or less 90% of players)

Teamwork is a skill that really comes in play only for 5%-10% of players nowadays so there is no point in expecting it

farren_whyde's Avatar


farren_whyde
02.18.2020 , 01:56 PM | #30
Quote: Originally Posted by Pekish View Post
that's a pro skill if we pretend people even care about others we lost it from the start! I don't even bother to reach that level of sophistication.

I just take an example of 2 single-minded players only care about their own fun and their playstyle and bragging right (more or less 90% of players)

Teamwork is a skill that really comes in play only for 5%-10% of players nowadays so there is no point in expecting it
Despite everything, I'm eternally optimistic deep down.
I'm just not a lightsaber kind of person.