As surely some may have noticed in my posts on the forums and my forum signature I am not a fan of the abomination that is the Eternal Alliance. It is a parody in my opinion of what the Republic and Empire are supposed to be, especially as it contradicts all the lore previously established with the Great Hyperspace War and the Galactic War. Look, I understand it was useful and necessary when Arcann, subsequently Vaylin, was ruling the Eternal Empire and the Eternal Fleet. However, I am of the most passionate opinion that the moment that Vaylin was defeated and the Outlander ascended the Eternal Throne the Alliance should have been disbanded. We should have been given the choice to either keep the Imperial forces or the Republic ones after taking control of Zakuul and the Throne and perhaps even been given the choice to commit ourselves to either the Republic or Empire so that Zakuul and territories belonging to it would be annexed by that faction. The Eternal Alliance should not have been founded, especially not with that name (come on, how many eternal and infinite things are we going to have).

I would have understood if we could have really given shape to the Alliance, like do we favour Imperial assets more or Republic ones? Do we have Imperial or Republic influences in our hierarchy/political system in the Alliance? It would have been so interesting in the situation that the more favour we showed to the Republic, then Imperial assets would leave us, the more Imperials got our favour, Republic forces left us. Sure, have the option to also keep both forces with you so you'd have to take a bit of Republic and a bit of Empire to keep both happy, but if we could have given shape to our Alliance ourselves I would not have hated it as much as I do now. Why do I have to accept Beywan Aygo as my commander of the military if I am a Sith? Why couldn't I have replaced him with Admiral Ranken for example after we save her in chapter 15? The same goes for others, why do I have to keep Ogurobb around when I could have replaced him with Eckard Lokin for example? Really it was a gigantic missed opportunity with the Alliance, to actually have the players be able to give shape to it through such choices and actions, who is in charge of what and the ability to replace them. I would have loved to execute Sana-Rae and replace her with Xalek, or Senya, or Cytherat even had that been an option. The point is, depending on what class I play I loathe the fact I have to accept this or that character in charge of this part of the Alliance. Especially considering the fact that every single time it will be the same story, the same faces, no replay worth, bland and too repeated. Whether you are Sith, Jedi, Imperial Agent or Republic Trooper, it's all the same, every single time and I hate it.

Also, it is my opinion that the Eternal Alliance should not be as independent as it is. Classic SWTOR is the galaxy mainly divided by the Galactic Republic and Sith Empire and that should be it. Sure, I am all for minor factions around the stars, but that's the key word, "minor". We should have become a vassal of the Galactic Republic or Sith Empire depending on our Alliance makeup and choices, remaining a minor power under one of the two major factions in the galaxy. Instead, we are left with an overpowered godmode fleet that can basically nuke every planet the Commander would want to, leaving him or her way too overpowered for a story to remain enjoyable, at least for me. I don't want to be that powerful, I don't want to dictate the fate of the galaxy. Sure, let me influence things but being one of many who influence it, but basically with the Eternal Fleet you can reshape the galaxy into any image that you choose, just like Valkorion stated. Sure, when Valkorion, Arcann and subsequently Vaylin was in charge of it, it was acceptable as it was an interesting enemy to combat. But leaving us, the player character, in charge of such a plottool was a mistake of epic proportions in my personal opinion.

Allow us to be the hero, yes, but let us be one of the heroes, not the one and only epic hero. Because that was how SWTOR started and what I loved about it, my characters were one of the eight heroes that rose up to have some influence over the galaxy. That was what made the story and narrative epic, what we have now isn't in my opinion. It's too big, too epic and because of that it becomes bland and unbelievable. It becomes one of the many way too milked out epic hero stories that are retold time after time. The charm of the ending of the eight class stories was that we attained a position of power and influence, yes, we became important players on the field, but we weren't the most important player. The moment that changed with KotFE and KotET the story lost its charm ans hasn't been able to regain it since.

So, in order to return to the charm of the original class stories and its epicness, I am of the firmest opinion that the Eternal Alliance needs to end. Sure, give people who like the Eternal Alliance the option to stay and keep commanding it, as there are also those who like it and that is fine, naturally, as everyone should be able to make their hero or heroine the way they want them to be. However, it is of the most vital importance for the successful continuation of the narrative that we are given the option to abandon/disband the Eternal Alliance and return to our original factions. Not only will that choice improve the narrative by tenfold, but it will also fullfill the dream and request of many players who are desperately hoping for the return of multiple unique storylines. One Alliance, one Empire and one Republic narrative would really enrich the game once more and return some of its former glory. Devs, you wonder how to bring back players or gather new ones, let me tell you, this is one step you need to make. Return to multiple unique storylines, three are enough, just stop this trail run of a narrative, please.

But most importantly... give us the option/choice to end the abomination that is the Eternal Alliance.

I really like this part.

Allow us to be the hero, yes, but let us be one of the heroes, not the one and only epic hero. Because that was how SWTOR started and what I loved about it, my characters were one of the eight heroes that rose up to have some influence over the galaxy

And I agree, the alliance needs to end, it was fun, it had its purpose, but I've had enough. Hopefully the current story will lead us there.

TL;DR

But based on the title, I agree.

The KOTFE/KOTET story should be retconned and the people responsible for writing it fired and taken to civil court to be sued for losses.

I'll make an argument for the alternative here, just for kicks.

Some of our characters have evolved beyond the Republic or the Empire. I main a light-side pub who sided with the Republic on Iokath; however, every single time the phrase "imps" was spoken ("teach those imps" "those imps on the run"... that kind of thing) my character flinched. Or I did. (Sometimes I get us confused.)

She hasn't forgotten that people from both sides fought and bled together to defeat the Eternal Empire and she surely hasn't forgotten that the person who pulled her out of carbonite was a Sith. She's now at the point where she sees people as people and not as a tally mark on one side or the other - so the derogatory "us vs. them" attitude of the Republic flat-out doesn't work for her anymore. I really, really hated being shoehorned into that decision and the awful assumptions that were made by other characters about my comfort level with it.

And let's say we continue to get shoehorned....who in the republic can actually send us out on a quest? While I get nostalgia for the class stories (which are GREAT) I also understand we can't go backwards and be sent about the galaxy on tasks by someone who wasn't there for the big stuff we just went through. Same with my dark-side Sith. She doesn't have a boss anymore and is unlikely to accept one.

Anyway - I understand the departure from classic Star Wars conflict is not okay with a lot of people. I get that. However, I am wary about the idea of pushing us back onto a side that doesn't reflect who our characters may have evolved into.

I'll make an argument for the alternative here, just for kicks.

 

Some of our characters have evolved beyond the Republic or the Empire. I main a light-side pub who sided with the Republic on Iokath; however, every single time the phrase "imps" was spoken ("teach those imps" "those imps on the run"... that kind of thing) my character flinched. Or I did. (Sometimes I get us confused.)

 

She hasn't forgotten that people from both sides fought and bled together to defeat the Eternal Empire and she surely hasn't forgotten that the person who pulled her out of carbonite was a Sith. She's now at the point where she sees people as people and not as a tally mark on one side or the other - so the derogatory "us vs. them" attitude of the Republic flat-out doesn't work for her anymore. I really, really hated being shoehorned into that decision and the awful assumptions that were made by other characters about my comfort level with it.

 

And let's say we continue to get shoehorned....who in the republic can actually send us out on a quest? While I get nostalgia for the class stories (which are GREAT) I also understand we can't go backwards and be sent about the galaxy on tasks by someone who wasn't there for the big stuff we just went through. Same with my dark-side Sith. She doesn't have a boss anymore and is unlikely to accept one.

 

Anyway - I understand the departure from classic Star Wars conflict is not okay with a lot of people. I get that. However, I am wary about the idea of pushing us back onto a side that doesn't reflect who our characters may have evolved into.

That is exactly why I am vouching for 3 unique storylines, one Alliance, one Empire and one Republic. Those characters who have evolved into something beyond Empire or Republic then those can stay with the Alliance, but don't force other characters who still are diehard Imperial or Republic loyalists to remain with something that is contradictory to the way they are played. It breaks immersion, very hard even, in my opinion.

So three unique storylines would not only allow everyone of us to play their characters the way they want to play, we'd also get story diversity and the highly requested multiple unique storylines.

Why couldn't I have replaced him with Admiral Ranken for example after we save her in chapter 15? The same goes for others, why do I have to keep Ogurobb around when I could have replaced him with Eckard Lokin for example? Really it was a gigantic missed opportunity with the Alliance, to actually have the players be able to give shape to it through such choices and actions, who is in charge of what and the ability to replace them. I would have loved to execute Sana-Rae and replace her with Xalek, or Senya, or Cytherat even had that been an option. The point is, depending on what class I play I loathe the fact I have to accept this or that character in charge of this part of the Alliance. Especially considering the fact that every single time it will be the same story, the same faces, no replay worth, bland and too repeated. Whether you are Sith, Jedi, Imperial Agent or Republic Trooper, it's all the same, every single time and I hate it.

]

This so many times this.

I feel that the story team were crazy. At the end of Kotet the entire galaxy should have been in chaos, the eternal alliance should have been sacrificed to destroy the eternal empire with both the republic and the empire at war but in a bad place.

This would have been the perfect setting to return the player to their class ship, with a handful say between 6 and 8 class specific companions trying to work towards whatever goals they needed. This allows you take the story anywhere, want to be trying to procure supplies from smugglers it makes sense, taking down a rogue sith lord with you and one companion it makes sense, fighting off Bounty Hunters set on you by people that feel you trashed Zakuul it makes sense. The story arcs are infinite. As opposed to, send in the Eternal fleet, Send in the Knights or Skytroopers or so the republic is attacking me on this train, have every republic world destroyed by my invincible fleet. None of which we ever do which makes No Sense.

If you are going to put people in charge of the most powerful empure/alliance, there needs to be a map in their base which they select what activities they are going to send their army and navy on. Only there are not the resources to do this so you get what is sadly a weird unpalatable mess.

This so many times this.

 

I feel that the story team were crazy. At the end of Kotet the entire galaxy should have been in chaos, the eternal alliance should have been sacrificed to destroy the eternal empire with both the republic and the empire at war but in a bad place.

 

This would have been the perfect setting to return the player to their class ship, with a handful say between 6 and 8 class specific companions trying to work towards whatever goals they needed. This allows you take the story anywhere, want to be trying to procure supplies from smugglers it makes sense, taking down a rogue sith lord with you and one companion it makes sense, fighting off Bounty Hunters set on you by people that feel you trashed Zakuul it makes sense. The story arcs are infinite. As opposed to, send in the Eternal fleet, Send in the Knights or Skytroopers or so the republic is attacking me on this train, have every republic world destroyed by my invincible fleet. None of which we ever do which makes No Sense.

 

If you are going to put people in charge of the most powerful empure/alliance, there needs to be a map in their base which they select what activities they are going to send their army and navy on. Only there are not the resources to do this so you get what is sadly a weird unpalatable mess.

I agree so passionately with you. The fact that the story team made us the ruler of everything and commander of the eternal fleet was the biggest mistake they could make. Indeed, there should have been chaos and we should have returned to our original faction or even defect to the enemy and take the story on from there. I really think we should not have been put on the Eternal Throne or left in command of the Eternal Fleet. They have backed themselves into a narrative corner unless they do a giant reset by destroying the Alliance and Odessen preferably too.

I'll make an argument for the alternative here, just for kicks.

 

Some of our characters have evolved beyond the Republic or the Empire. I main a light-side pub who sided with the Republic on Iokath; however, every single time the phrase "imps" was spoken ("teach those imps" "those imps on the run"... that kind of thing) my character flinched. Or I did. (Sometimes I get us confused.)

 

She hasn't forgotten that people from both sides fought and bled together to defeat the Eternal Empire and she surely hasn't forgotten that the person who pulled her out of carbonite was a Sith. She's now at the point where she sees people as people and not as a tally mark on one side or the other - so the derogatory "us vs. them" attitude of the Republic flat-out doesn't work for her anymore. I really, really hated being shoehorned into that decision and the awful assumptions that were made by other characters about my comfort level with it.

 

And let's say we continue to get shoehorned....who in the republic can actually send us out on a quest? While I get nostalgia for the class stories (which are GREAT) I also understand we can't go backwards and be sent about the galaxy on tasks by someone who wasn't there for the big stuff we just went through. Same with my dark-side Sith. She doesn't have a boss anymore and is unlikely to accept one.

 

Anyway - I understand the departure from classic Star Wars conflict is not okay with a lot of people. I get that. However, I am wary about the idea of pushing us back onto a side that doesn't reflect who our characters may have evolved into.

This is exactly how I feel on it, playing as a former Imperial character. My character has worked with people from both sides of the aisle. She's evolved past the faction wars, and finds it a bit tiresome to have been pulled back into them with Iokath. She's also now her own boss, and prefers that greatly to taking orders from an Emperor or a Supreme Commander.

I would not want to go back to the days of fighting against various villains simply because they happen to hang the other flag. IMHO it's old and tired and boring. So I hope that whatever happens with the story, they do give those of us who appreciate the Alliance a chance to hang on to it and operate outside of the factions.

This is exactly how I feel on it, playing as a former Imperial character. My character has worked with people from both sides of the aisle. She's evolved past the faction wars, and finds it a bit tiresome to have been pulled back into them with Iokath. She's also now her own boss, and prefers that greatly to taking orders from an Emperor or a Supreme Commander.

 

I would not want to go back to the days of fighting against various villains simply because they happen to hang the other flag. IMHO it's old and tired and boring. So I hope that whatever happens with the story, they do give those of us who appreciate the Alliance a chance to hang on to it and operate outside of the factions.

And naturally all power to you! I really think that the Alliance should remain as an option for those who want to play their characters that way, but currently all of us are forced to play like that. Those who want the classic SWTOR feel are being denied to have it, so I am naturally pleading for an expansion of choices so that those who want can return to their original factions and experience the narrative from that perspective

And naturally all power to you! I really think that the Alliance should remain as an option for those who want to play their characters that way, but currently all of us are forced to play like that. Those who want the classic SWTOR feel are being denied to have it, so I am naturally pleading for an expansion of choices so that those who want can return to their original factions and experience the narrative from that perspective

Choices are indeed good. We've seen that on Iokath with the decision to ally with one faction or another, so perhaps that will continue and expand. Having three story branches (Alliance, Imperial, Republic) would be a positive thing that would give everyone the playing atmosphere they like.

Choices are indeed good. We've seen that on Iokath with the decision to ally with one faction or another, so perhaps that will continue and expand. Having three story branches (Alliance, Imperial, Republic) would be a positive thing that would give everyone the playing atmosphere they like.

Exactly, I especially agree with the last part of your post. I have seen people requesting multiple unique storylines so often, I know of course that is difficult due to the limited resources Bioware has at the moment but perhaps it's something they can consider for in the future and perhaps request more resources from EA. I know it's a naive thing to hope and want, but I really think that if EA put some more money and people into this game it would be incredibly profitable and go through a rejuvenation Really, reintroducing multiple unique storylines, not 8 like was before, 2 or 3 would be enough, would really call back a part of the playerbase that left as well as garner interest from new fresh players!

"Classic" Star Wars does not involve the Republic or Sith Empire at all. It featured The Galactic Empire vs a ragtag Rebel Alliance.

The Old Republic itself and an Empire that is run by a ruling class of Sith is something are things that weren't part of the classic Star Wars stories that we got to see until relatively recently. That's not to say I think those are bad additions to the setting. I'm really glad we got to enjoy them, but my point is that the Star Wars formula doesn't necessarily need to always repeat the exact same thing. You can change things up without compromising what makes something a traditional Star Wars story. I wouldn't have wanted to only ever have stories where there are only a handful of Force users in the galaxy for example.

The Eternal Empire and the Alliance fit the traditional Star Wars mold pretty well. There's an evil Empire, there's a underdog Rebel Alliance. The leader(s) of the antagonists are super evil Force Users. And a family is divided by the battle lines of both sides. The Knights of Zakuul are not as corrupted as the Sith, but they are clearly the bad guys.

They don't have the ability to continue 8 separate class stories, and so I think the basic premise of being the hero to save the galaxy is the best they could do. It's not like the last couple expansions made any sense with 8 separate protagonists either.

And while the Eternal Alliance presumably won't last forever, I'm glad that we actually get to enjoy our success of toppling the Eternal Empire at least for a while. If everything ended in chaos, then there would be complaints that our character was a failure who can't accomplish anything anymore.

It would have been better to get more customization of the Alliance and the NPCs that served in it, but we're already going in the direction of more Republic vs Empire content. The Eternal Alliance doesn't necessarily need to be ditched in order to do that.

I don't think that's a bad compromise, but I suppose this is one issue that they are never going to be able to please everyone. There is always going to be complaints about spending SO MUCH time away from Republic vs Empire stories. And there is always going to be complains about going back to Republic vs Empire stories AGAIN.

I agree! I really enjoyed the game up until those two expansions. Felt less like Star Wars and more like Final Fantasy!

Besides, I've known since 1977, 40 freaking years, no one destroys the Star Wars galaxy lol

I would hate for the story to go back, plus i like Zakuul (like Valk says it's like the empire but better) i hope it gets a better treatment than the Gree or Voss, that just gets sidelined and replaced by something i consider less interesting.

The alliance can become progressively more oppressive and tyrannical, and for the DS people that's just how they like it, while the LS people can leave the alliance and join some kind of new/old/true alliance movement that opposes tyranny, eventually they can rename themselves, and the alliance becomes the new Sith empire while the other faction can go back to being the republic, remain as the alliance or even become something else.

LS players will not mind if they are called something else as long as they can be LS, while i think DS want to be Sith and nothing else.

One of the worst things about most fiction these days is that everyone thinks it's cool to just bomb stuff into oblivion, which is a pretty stupid thing to do because all you get is less of something, no one gains from that, plus if you satisfy people's need to see something destroyed, that's all you will do from then on because you can bet there's lots of other stuff they want to see destroyed.

That said, technically speaking, destroying Zakuul wouldn't be much of a problem, because the planet is just a bunch of instances, sure it will be disappointing just like Ziost was, but the precedent already exists.

But if you chose DS, you're the ruler of Zakuul, Iokath and Odessen. You own the Eternal Fleet, and an army of skytroopers. Why would you go back to serve Acina or Malcolm? The alliance, is just a name. It's not an alliance after KOTET. It's our power base, our troops. (that reminded me of Moff Pyron... bring him back, Charles!!)

Unless we get to rule the new Empire or the Republic... but that would be too much I guess.

PS: I need the Zakuul palace stronghold, and I need it now! LOL

 

PS: I need the Zakuul palace stronghold, and I need it now! LOL

Yes...yes indeed! It's time to move in the palace of my prince.

My former wrath has done being somebody's wrath and doesn't consider herself a sith anymore. She has found a home in the alliance and evolved beyond the Imp vs. Pub mindset. Sure she might still has some prejudice against the Republic as a whole but she no longer consider them as the enemy. And she has become friends and allies with many of them. Reverting back to the old faction war will done a disservice to what she has accomplished.

So no, I don't want the Alliance to end. It'll be OK if they offer a choice and dod separate storylines but I don't know if they have the resources to pull it off.

Yes...yes indeed! It's time to move in the palace of my prince.

Maybe the palace will come with a certain romance *wink*