... Operative and Scoundrel healers. Nothing else, and it's getting really boring. 9 rated WZ's and not a single other healer. Go into randoms... fotm re-rolls in every game. Why even have other healing classes if you are going to make one outperform to the degree they are now? Bioware, I have some high hopes for arena 2.4 but how can you let this stand? Are we just supposed to hack it until October? I certainly won't be sticking around for that long in these conditions. Please do something soon so the PvP can be fun. Thanks.

.. but wait the game is balanced the OP healers will tell you. It's you that lack skill and need to L2P in order to kill them. You see all the OP healers in this game are so freaking good at the game, it's you that need to improve. They are amazing players man. Your class energy/resource management skill is a complete joke in comparison to the extremely difficult energy management of an operative healer.

Just give up.. they are better, they are playing a very difficult class. One DPS is not supposed to kill a healer, right? Perhaps if you got better at interrupting their heals you would probably see how easy is it to kill operative healers.

And in fact you are not supposed to beat them, team work man, team work.

^^

That's a typical response from the likes of kweasa. I honestly want to see his face when the OP healers will get a treatment like commando healers got in SWTOR 1.2

Then I will quote all the ridiculous posts of all the Op Healing is Balanced just to add insult to injury.

.. but wait the game is balanced the OP healers will tell you. It's you that lack skill and need to L2P in order to kill them. You see all the OP healers in this game are so freaking good at the game, it's you that need to improve. They are amazing players man. Your class energy/resource management skill is a complete joke in comparison to the extremely difficult energy management of an operative healer.

 

Just give up.. they are better, they are playing a very difficult class. One DPS is not supposed to kill a healer, right? Perhaps if you got better at interrupting their heals you would probably see how easy is it to kill operative healers.

 

And in fact you are not supposed to beat them, team work man, team work.

 

^^

That's a typical response from the likes of kweasa. I honestly want to see his face when the OP healers will get a treatment like commando healers got in SWTOR 1.2

 

Then I will quote all the ridiculous posts of all the Op Healing is Balanced just to add insult to injury.

Aw, I love QQ'ers about OP/Scoundrels before breakfast.

Funny, you don't see any GOOD PvP'ers from top rated guilds like I AM LEGEND or Deja Vu complaining about them. Why? Because they know how to play. They know PvP is about objectives and doing what is needed to win the game. If they can't down a healer, then they at least understand that they need to pull him away from healing his teammates and worry about self-survival. The point of PvP is strategy, not slamming your face into your keyboard until you hit every one of your I WINZ BUTTONZ.

Please tell me why you feel like a single DPS should be able to jump on a single healer and roflstomp his face in the dirt. And then tell me why it would still make sense for healers to even exist in the game. Because that's basically what I feel you people want.

You will brush this post off, saying,"Oh, another L2P'er". But guess what? It's the truth. L2P.

Aw, I love QQ'ers about OP/Scoundrels before breakfast.

 

Funny, you don't see any GOOD PvP'ers from top rated guilds like I AM LEGEND or Deja Vu complaining about them. Why? Because they know how to play. They know PvP is about objectives and doing what is needed to win the game. If they can't down a healer, then they at least understand that they need to pull him away from healing his teammates and worry about self-survival. The point of PvP is strategy, not slamming your face into your keyboard until you hit every one of your I WINZ BUTTONZ.

 

Please tell me why you feel like a single DPS should be able to jump on a single healer and roflstomp his face in the dirt. And then tell me why it would still make sense for healers to even exist in the game. Because that's basically what I feel you people want.

 

You will brush this post off, saying,"Oh, another L2P'er". But guess what? It's the truth. L2P.

Please tell me why you feel like when a single DPS jumps on a single healer why is it that, that single healer can live FOREVER.

A Healer Should NEVER be able to survive a single DPS for a LONG time. He should be able to survive through some cooldowns and then through his def cooldowns.

After this he should be all out of Energy/ammo/force whatever healers use... And this is true for all healers EXCEPT OP/Scoundrels, they can just keep on healing Everything forever and a year more.

(This is why they are OP, in my oppinion)

Question:

Can the healer kill the DPS?

A Healer Should NEVER be able to survive a single DPS for a LONG time.

Out of interest, why not?

Aw, I love QQ'ers about OP/Scoundrels before breakfast.

 

Funny, you don't see any GOOD PvP'ers from top rated guilds like I AM LEGEND or Deja Vu complaining about them. Why? Because they know how to play. They know PvP is about objectives and doing what is needed to win the game. If they can't down a healer, then they at least understand that they need to pull him away from healing his teammates and worry about self-survival. The point of PvP is strategy, not slamming your face into your keyboard until you hit every one of your I WINZ BUTTONZ.

 

Please tell me why you feel like a single DPS should be able to jump on a single healer and roflstomp his face in the dirt. And then tell me why it would still make sense for healers to even exist in the game. Because that's basically what I feel you people want.

 

You will brush this post off, saying,"Oh, another L2P'er". But guess what? It's the truth. L2P.

You completely missed the point.

I believe the OP's emphasis was that operative healers are far and away the best for the healing role when compared with other ACs due to their limitless resource pool, numerous escapes, lack of reliance on casted abilities, etc., not that healers in general are over tuned (though I'd agree that in the present metagame they are).

It's almost universally accepted that in order to be competitive in RWZs you must bring at least 1 operative healer. That does not suggest they are evenly balanced with the other ACs that perform the role.

They know PvP is about objectives

Doesn't take a genius to figure out that if you can't kill someone, you will never accomplish any of the objectives.

Why? All objectives require you to click on something (Civil War / Hypergate / Denova) or kill someone (Huttball) in order to win.

3 out of the 4 objectives can be eternally prevented from being capped so long as an immortal Scoperative is standing around poking people trying to cap them. Huttball becomes moot if you can never kill the enemy carrier.

Remind me again how PVP is not about killing people?

Doesn't take a genius to figure out that if you can't kill someone, you will never accomplish any of the objectives.

 

Why? All objectives require you to click on something (Civil War / Hypergate / Denova) or kill someone (Huttball) in order to win.

 

3 out of the 4 objectives can be eternally prevented from being capped so long as an immortal Scoperative is standing around poking people trying to cap them. Huttball becomes moot if you can never kill the enemy carrier.

 

Remind me again how PVP is not about killing people?

He is trying to divert the attention from the real issue. Notice how he doesn't deny that Operatives have an extremely good survivability because he knows his arguments wouldn't stand a chance, instead we are being fed the standard healer BS: DPS shouldn't be unable to 1vs1 a healer.

I understand if every DPS spec could 1vs1 a healer, but this is very far from truth. Ranged DPS is just a minor annoyance to healers, especially with all the root cleansing. And then you get a few melee DPS specs that just need a little effort and attention from the healer to avoid the damage.

If RDPS cannot kill a healer, then all MDPS specs should be a complete hard counter to them.

Doesn't take a genius to figure out that if you can't kill someone, you will never accomplish any of the objectives.

 

Why? All objectives require you to click on something (Civil War / Hypergate / Denova) or kill someone (Huttball) in order to win.

 

3 out of the 4 objectives can be eternally prevented from being capped so long as an immortal Scoperative is standing around poking people trying to cap them. Huttball becomes moot if you can never kill the enemy carrier.

 

Remind me again how PVP is not about killing people?

***** at your team mates for not helping you burst down the healer, a healer is responsible for keeping 3 to 5 people alive, if one dps spec could burst them down there would no point to healers at all. You either have one person stunning, ccing, and interuppting, or every single dps should be focusing on the same one. You can't be responsible for your teamamtes but neither can the healers you're ************ about play worse just to make you happy.

As for OP being OP, I kind of agree, but I occasionally play medic, and I can tell you in all honesty, if my opposing team knows what they're doing, I can be effectively neutralized at all times. It's when a team has 2 or 3 really good healers that things get ****ed up.

Please tell me why you feel like when a single DPS jumps on a single healer why is it that, that single healer can live FOREVER.

If he is a good healer and you suck as a DPS, then yes he will live forever. Don't suck.

Doesn't take a genius to figure out that if you can't kill someone, you will never accomplish any of the objectives.

Not true. One healer that can't be killed is not the deciding factor in winning or losing a WZ. If a DPS can't kill a healer by himself, he should be good enough to neutralize him and force him to worry about self-healing rather than healing his teammates. If you can't at least do that, you need to L2P your class. A healer that isn't allowed to heal his mates = dead mates. Which = Win for you.

Remind me again how PVP is not about killing people?

It is about killing people...in Arena Since we don't have Arena, we only have Warzones...and each Warzone has it's own objectives to win. If all you do is jump around on people to get your kill count up and you lose a WZ, maybe you're the reason your team failed.

Most of the pugs I'm in that I lose, it's when a solid DPS keeps me from healing my mates by neutralizing me to the point to where I self-heal constantly while the other DPSers blow up my mates.

Most of the pugs i'm in that I win, it's when crappy DPSers (like those in this thread, I assume) stay on me and try to kill me as opposed to neutralizing me, making way for my mates to cap nodes and doors while I emote /lol at them.

Worry about being good enough to keep me out of the fight while keeping your objectives in mind instead of putting all your focus into ending my life.

Now, as someone else pointed out, if you don't suck you should have no problem killing me. Watch some Rated videos. L2P.

He is trying to divert the attention from the real issue. Notice how he doesn't deny that Operatives have an extremely good survivability

I don't deny that at all. If the Op knows how to play his class. If you knew how to play yours, it wouldn't matter to you.

The ONLY thing that makes us OP, IMO, is scamper. Our DPS Op's need it, we don't. If I were able to choose a nerf that would shut you guys up, scamper would be it.

instead we are being fed the standard healer BS: DPS shouldn't be unable to 1vs1 a healer.

If that were easy to do, there would be no point to having healers and it would be pointless for anyone to roll the class.

I don't think it's any coincidence that the ones I see complaining about it in Gen chat are the same ones that i've seen in WZ's that can't even put up 100k damage and they finish WZ's with little to no medals. Obviously, I don't know how good any of you are in this thread, but based on your QQ'ing I would bet you're among them. Time to complain about something else.

If a DPS can't kill a healer by himself, he should be good enough to neutralize him and force him to worry about self-healing rather than healing his teammates

if you don't suck you should have no problem killing me. Watch some Rated videos. L2P.

Great argument, A++, would read again.

You state on one hand that a healer is going to keep himself up versus one DPS. You state on the other hand if I can't kill you alone I should L2P.

"Neutralizing" a Merc/Mando who actually has to stop and cast is one thing.

"Neutralizing" a Scoperative who is rolling around like a cracked-out Wildebeast and virtually never has to cast anything to put out plenty of HPS is another.

But in both cases I should be able to solo you, right? Roll Tactics / AP as a Van / PT and get back to me. We can't all be unstoppable Maras, Sins doing 10k shots, or face-on-keyboard SmashJugs.

Great argument, A++, would read again.

 

You state on one hand that a healer is going to keep himself up versus one DPS. You state on the other hand if I can't kill you alone I should L2P.

 

"Neutralizing" a Merc/Mando who actually has to stop and cast is one thing.

 

"Neutralizing" a Scoperative who is rolling around like a cracked-out Wildebeast and virtually never has to cast anything to put out plenty of HPS is another.

 

But in both cases I should be able to solo you, right? Roll Tactics / AP as a Van / PT and get back to me. We can't all be unstoppable Maras, Sins doing 10k shots, or face-on-keyboard SmashJugs.

True but in teh DPS position you're presumably assisting other DPSers, unfortunatley in this game you have to let your team mates choose the atrget in most instances because tehy won't be smart enough to follow your lead. If a front-end burst DPS begins to attack a healer, you should drop whatever it is you're doing and assist him, the healer will either die or escape, either way he's not healing for the time bing, now you and the other DPS characters need to ALL attack one target to burst him down, taking advantage of the lack of heals. One of the saddest parts of this game, which could be remedied with VOIP, is people so rarely know how to operate as a team. That leaves players like you, who know better, to make up the difference by allowing the bads to choose the targets, and assisting them. As for CCing healers, it should pretty much be done by operatives, assassins, and marauders. If you're assisting your teammates in whatever ridiculous target they decided to take down (90% of the time it's the tank) there should be one of the above classes *********** with the healer, if not it's not the healer's fault, it's just that you wound up on a bad team, not something you can really do anything about.

Now as for operative being more viable then other healers, I agree, and I don't think it's exactly fair, but they far from break the game. Also when you have 3 operative healers surrounded by tanks, **** get's stupid, and a balance to counteract large groups of healers seems fair to me. Nothing that makes it impossible for them to heal each other, but perhaps reduce the effectiveness of it.

Source: I play a healer, and a healer-killer, I know how to play my class and counter it.

Great argument, A++, would read again.

 

You state on one hand that a healer is going to keep himself up versus one DPS. You state on the other hand if I can't kill you alone I should L2P.

 

"Neutralizing" a Merc/Mando who actually has to stop and cast is one thing.

 

"Neutralizing" a Scoperative who is rolling around like a cracked-out Wildebeast and virtually never has to cast anything to put out plenty of HPS is another.

 

But in both cases I should be able to solo you, right? Roll Tactics / AP as a Van / PT and get back to me. We can't all be unstoppable Maras, Sins doing 10k shots, or face-on-keyboard SmashJugs.

Sorry I should have been more clear and less confusing and dismissive. Here is what I believe:

-I think that a typical healer should survive a typical DPS.

-I think that if you are a great DPS and i'm just a typical healer, you should have no problem killing me.

-When I say L2P, I mean strive to be better than typical. I don't think i'm a typical healer, I'd grade myself as pretty good. If you can't kill me, then instead of whining about it you should strive to get better or learn teamwork. If i'm pretty good and I get face rolled by a really great marauder who bosses Rated's like noone's business, then it makes me wanna be better than 'pretty good' and I try to improve. I don't run to the forums and cry for nerfs.

The only reason I think this is even an issue (people complaining about Op/Scoundrel healers being OP) is because they want to be able to win by relying on themselves alone. Unfortunately, that's not how Warzones work. It takes teamwork and strategy to complete the objectives, unless you are facing people who have the downs. The fact that people don't realize this is mind-boggling. It's not about kill count and stomping people in the dirt 1v1, the fact that there is more to it than that pisses these QQ'ers off and they just scream for healer nerfs instead of learning to play the game.

Please tell me why you feel like when a single DPS jumps on a single healer why is it that, that single healer can live FOREVER.

the ops healer has limitless resources, a lot of cc, and amazing escape abilities. dodge > roll > vanish = immortal. dirty kick > cleanse > roll > los > heal = immortal. 4 ppl on you? no problem! flash bang > dodge > roll > vanish = immortal. their aoe healing is marginally behind sages (in practice). their single target is marginally behind mandos (in practice). their versatility, mobility, survivability, utility and resource management are head and shoulders above sages and mandos.

I don't really care if they are left alone and the other classes are buffed, but healing is so good across the board that you almost have to nerf scoundrel heals, because buffing the other classes will just lead to more stalemates.

Question:

Can the healer kill the DPS?

yes. any dps that cannot cleanse will die to a healer 1v1. and many who can cleanse/off heal, don't realize that they need to until it's too late. that's my experience, at any rate.

yes. any dps that cannot cleanse will die to a healer 1v1. and many who can cleanse/off heal, don't realize that they need to until it's too late. that's my experience, at any rate.

a deception sin, concealment operative, or a tank will beat a healer 1 on 1, but it's more likely the healer op will just flee.

OP healers should be hotfixed a long time ago.

The question here isn't whether one DPS can take down a healer.

The question is why the **** is takes four or five DPS to take down a guarded operative healer.

Healers are OP when your team has none.

Good dpsers are OP when your team has none.

/get a better comp

/thread

The only reason I think this is even an issue (people complaining about Op/Scoundrel healers being OP) is because they want to be able to win by relying on themselves alone. Unfortunately, that's not how Warzones work. It takes teamwork and strategy to complete the objectives, unless you are facing people who have the downs. The fact that people don't realize this is mind-boggling. It's not about kill count and stomping people in the dirt 1v1, the fact that there is more to it than that pisses these QQ'ers off and they just scream for healer nerfs instead of learning to play the game.

I blame WOW PVP for this mentality,

I play a DF Scoundrel...

At least no one calls my spec OP or fotm. I guess that's one nice thing about having SB Scoundrels everywhere. They make me feel like a special little snow flake.