tekhiun Posted January 8, 2014 Share Posted January 8, 2014 Bioware tried this already, when they put the Datacubes in the Cartel Packs. The forums got p-oed about it, saying that Lore doesn't belong there. I'm pretty sure they'd get ever angrier if BW sold Class Story content in the CM. It's quite different selling something as a direct purchase, than putting on a gambling pack. I would imagine this wouldn't be done in the "story packs" model, where you would have the chance to get the story line you wanted and if you got one you didnt need you would just dish it out on the gtn, but more like a mini expansion sort of feature. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AshlaBoga Posted January 8, 2014 Share Posted January 8, 2014 It's quite different selling something as a direct purchase, than putting on a gambling pack. I would imagine this wouldn't be done in the "story packs" model, where you would have the chance to get the story line you wanted and if you got one you didnt need you would just dish it out on the gtn, but more like a mini expansion sort of feature. If they did add Class Story Packs I'd prefer them to not costs CCs. After all, RotHC didn't cost CCs, it cost real money. Seems more palatable that way. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord_of_Mu Posted January 8, 2014 Share Posted January 8, 2014 I'm inclined to follow the same train of thought as one of the earlier posters. Why not just go with a larger paid expansion? You could throw in a few planets, some class story, new game features and a bunch of system improvements. And you could sell it on a three tier system and offer a discount to subs on the top two tiers. That way Subs and free players can buy the cheapest basic expansion for the same price, but subs get a reduction for digital deluxe and collectors edition. Once the expansion nears the end of it's life cycle, reduce the overall price to a quarter of the price previously listed and do the same for the deluxe to both subs and free players. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Merwanor Posted January 8, 2014 Share Posted January 8, 2014 I would gladly pay for more class stories, it is the one thing that makes this game unique. And it is just sad that the developers and EA made end game boring and like every other MMO. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alec_Fortescue Posted January 8, 2014 Share Posted January 8, 2014 I wouldn't say that lore doesn't belong to cartel market. The problem with the cubes was that they were random drops from gambling boxes!!! And if you really think it doesn't belong in CM, there is also swtor.com/buy :] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Desolaytore Posted January 8, 2014 Share Posted January 8, 2014 Bioware tried this already, when they put the Datacubes in the Cartel Packs. The forums got p-oed about it, saying that Lore doesn't belong there. I'm pretty sure they'd get ever angrier if BW sold Class Story content in the CM. Well we shouldn't have to *********** gamble for new story content. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ZionHalcyon Posted January 8, 2014 Author Share Posted January 8, 2014 Well we shouldn't have to *********** gamble for new story content. People have a very good point in that what happened was cutscenes, not story or playable content, was put into those packs. Comparing a cutscene that was tucked into a cartel pack to buying an actual leg of a singular class's story DIRECTLY in the cartel market is like comparing apples and oranges, or like comparing a fire truck to a Ferrari because they both have the color red. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
branmakmuffin Posted January 8, 2014 Share Posted January 8, 2014 I mean, seriously. Why not? DDO is a good template. Subs get access to the new area for free and a week early, F2P and Freemium members have to pay Store currency to unlock the pack, but once they unlock it they own it TOR has gone a fundamentally different route when it comes to "crippling" non-subs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vandicus Posted January 8, 2014 Share Posted January 8, 2014 TOR has gone a fundamentally different route when it comes to "crippling" non-subs. ^ For those unfamiliar with it, most of the 1-max level content(I believe its higher than level 20 by now) in DDO is locked behind a paywall. It'd sort of be like paying for each planet and flashpoint individually as a one-time unlock, or having the alternative to subscribe to have everything unlocked(not including their cash shop items, just talking about content here), though when you unsub you lose the access. I'm not sure how you could sell content on the CM without violating or otherwise radically changing the current premise of a subscription. General rule of thumb has been cosmetics on the Cartel Market, content available as part of a subscription. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KyaniteD Posted January 8, 2014 Share Posted January 8, 2014 (edited) Why not a DLC in the manner of ME, one that buys more story content but doesn't affect game play for those who don't have it? I.e. not an expansion like RotHC, not raising level cap, crew skill level cap, skill tree etc. etc. ME DLCs brought new companions and weapons. Those could be an incentive, but shouldn't be "better" than anything already existing in the game, i.e. not giving any advantage or extras beyond cosmetics. (Not like HK-51 and Treek, who have uniquely effective skill sets and crew skill crit bonus.) With the first Rakghoul event and Bounty Contract Week they already proved that level-adjusted content can be provided even without instances, so I don't see why it shouldn't be possible to offer more story content for level 50s - 55s while leaving everything else as it is for those who don't purchase it. I would happily pay for it. I'd preorder it one year in advance to help finance it. On the other hand, making individual class stories purchasable on the cartel market could put them at a price at which they can be traded on the GTN. That way players with more disposable income and less time to earn credits and players with more available playtime than disposable income could both benefit from it. Edited January 8, 2014 by KyaniteD Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arkerus Posted January 8, 2014 Share Posted January 8, 2014 (edited) Its not the cost, its the setup. As been repeated MANY times its not the cost. Its the setup for all the voice acting, scripting, writing that has to happen for class stories. It may BE cost prohibitive but Bioware has explicitly stated voice acting is not costly and it is not the reason we don't see additional class stories. Selling class stories on the CM is a ridiculous idea for two reasons: 1. It views the entire class story debate as being a cost debate, and its not. That isn't how business works anyway. No one at EA/Bioware is saying "OOH STUPID US, why don't we just make a million dollars by selling it on the CM??" That's not how a company looks at the project. They look at everything. They look at setup time, ROI, feasibility, support, etc. Its obvious from a design perspective that doing global stories works better for the game as a whole. 2. Even if they DO extend class stories putting them on the CM is product suicide. Shoot, I love this game and if they did that I would leave as well. Edited January 8, 2014 by Arkerus Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alec_Fortescue Posted January 8, 2014 Share Posted January 8, 2014 (edited) Why not a DLC in the manner of ME, one that buys more story content but doesn't affect game play for those who don't have it? I.e. not an expansion like RotHC, not raising level cap, crew skill level cap, skill tree etc. etc. ME DLCs brought new companions and weapons. Those could be an incentive, but shouldn't be "better" than anything already existing in the game, i.e. not giving any advantage or extras beyond cosmetics. (Not like HK-51 and Treek, who have uniquely effective skill sets and crew skill crit bonus.) I would happily pay for it. I'd preorder it one year in advance to help finance it. That's what I keep suggesting :l Same can be done about pazaak - Sell it as DLC to avoid age ratings affecting the core game. Edited January 8, 2014 by Alec_Fortescue Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arkerus Posted January 8, 2014 Share Posted January 8, 2014 (edited) Why not a DLC in the manner of ME, one that buys more story content but doesn't affect game play for those who don't have it? I.e. not an expansion like RotHC, not raising level cap, crew skill level cap, skill tree etc. etc. ME DLCs brought new companions and weapons. Those could be an incentive, but shouldn't be "better" than anything already existing in the game, i.e. not giving any advantage or extras beyond cosmetics. (Not like HK-51 and Treek, who have uniquely effective skill sets and crew skill crit bonus.) With the first Rakghoul event and Bounty Contract Week they already proved that level-adjusted content can be provided even without instances, so I don't see why it shouldn't be possible to offer more story content for level 50s - 55s while leaving everything else as it is for those who don't purchase it. I would happily pay for it. I'd preorder it one year in advance to help finance it. On the other hand, making individual class stories purchasable on the cartel market could put them at a price at which they can be traded on the GTN. That way players with more disposable income and less time to earn credits and players with more available playtime than disposable income could both benefit from it. Its not a question of finance. That is why creating a solution that "finances" the story content isn't the solution. And to have a solution, you need a problem. Bioware, not making any more individual class stories, is not as much a problem as it is a DESIGN CHOICE. Edited January 8, 2014 by Arkerus Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ZionHalcyon Posted January 8, 2014 Author Share Posted January 8, 2014 (edited) its not the cost, its the setup. As been repeated many times its not the cost. Its the setup for all the voice acting, scripting, writing that has to happen for class stories. It may be cost prohibitive but bioware has explicitly stated voice acting is not costly and it is not the reason we don't see additional class stories. Selling class stories on the cm is a ridiculous idea for two reasons: 1. It views the entire class story debate as being a cost debate, and its not. That isn't how business works anyway. No one at ea/bioware is saying "ooh stupid us, why don't we just make a million dollars by selling it on the cm??" that's not how a company looks at the project. They look at everything. They look at setup time, roi, feasibility, support, etc. Its obvious from a design perspective that doing global stories works better for the game as a whole. 2. Even if the do extend class stories putting them on the cm is product suicide. Shoot, i love this game and if they did that i would leave as well. 2) devs, do it now Edited January 8, 2014 by ZionHalcyon Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
branmakmuffin Posted January 8, 2014 Share Posted January 8, 2014 ^ For those unfamiliar with it, most of the 1-max level content(I believe its higher than level 20 by now) in DDO is locked behind a paywall. It'd sort of be like paying for each planet and flashpoint individually as a one-time unlock, or having the alternative to subscribe to have everything unlocked(not including their cash shop items, just talking about content here), though when you unsub you lose the access. I'm not sure how you could sell content on the CM without violating or otherwise radically changing the current premise of a subscription. General rule of thumb has been cosmetics on the Cartel Market, content available as part of a subscription. In LotRO (and DDO? Haven't played it since it went F2P), you can earn significant store coins in game, so it;s quite possible to unlock just about every "non-free" area without paying a dime, as long as the player is willing to put in the time. I'm not disputing your post at all, just adding more info. So yeah, if TOR worked like LotRO does, we'd get "free" access to the starting planets, the fleet, the capital worlds and our class quests (the equivalent of the Epic quest line in LotRO), but all non-class quests beyond the capital world would be unavailable unless subbed or the planet is purchased with CCs. Each system has its non-sub "annoyances." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ZionHalcyon Posted January 8, 2014 Author Share Posted January 8, 2014 In LotRO (and DDO? Haven't played it since it went F2P), you can earn significant store coins in game, so it;s quite possible to unlock just about every "non-free" area without paying a dime, as long as the player is willing to put in the time. I'm not disputing your post at all, just adding more info. So yeah, if TOR worked like LotRO does, we'd get "free" access to the starting planets, the fleet, the capital worlds and our class quests (the equivalent of the Epic quest line in LotRO), but all non-class quests beyond the capital world would be unavailable unless subbed or the planet is purchased with CCs. Each system has its non-sub "annoyances." The pay wall would be anything beyond the level 50 class stories. Keep in mind, you have to pay for new planets anyway in the form of an expansion. The class stories would be an addition to that planet, released one profession at a time over time, and those who want the planet and yet dont want the class stories don't have to pay for the class stories - they can just level with the planet mission ala makeb. All bioware promised was free 1-50 anyway. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
branmakmuffin Posted January 8, 2014 Share Posted January 8, 2014 The pay wall would be anything beyond the level 50 class stories. Keep in mind, you have to pay for new planets anyway in the form of an expansion. The class stories would be an addition to that planet, released one profession at a time over time, and those who want the planet and yet dont want the class stories don't have to pay for the class stories - they can just level with the planet mission ala makeb. All bioware promised was free 1-50 anyway. What you're asking for is what many have asked for: the ability to purchase future non-free expansions/content updates with CCs (in addition to money). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ZionHalcyon Posted January 8, 2014 Author Share Posted January 8, 2014 I still think the idea is sound. Few players are going to be all "yes, charge me more for content!" But the reality isn't what they want, its what will they do, and will enough of them do it? There was HUGE backlash against microtransactions and then the cartel market. Still is. Guess what? Cartel Market is their #1 moneymaker. Its allowed them to develop for the game again. Players generally want everything they can as free as they can. I get that. But I do think there is a market here, and that there are people willing to pay for extended adventures as relates to class stories - enough of them to warrant development in that area... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ZionHalcyon Posted January 8, 2014 Author Share Posted January 8, 2014 What you're asking for is what many have asked for: the ability to purchase future non-free expansions/content updates with CCs (in addition to money). just because many have asked for it doesn't make it a bad idea. in fact, it only establishes that there would be a market there for it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
branmakmuffin Posted January 8, 2014 Share Posted January 8, 2014 just because many have asked for it doesn't make it a bad idea. You're mighty defensive. All is said was it's been asked for before. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ZionHalcyon Posted January 8, 2014 Author Share Posted January 8, 2014 You're mighty defensive. All is said was it's been asked for before. repeated attacks make one defensive. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KyaniteD Posted January 8, 2014 Share Posted January 8, 2014 Its not a question of finance. That is why creating a solution that "finances" the story content isn't the solution. And to have a solution, you need a problem. Bioware, not making any more individual class stories, is not as much a problem as it is a DESIGN CHOICE. I don't see the problem. Currently, the planet stories and overall story are the same for every class and independent of individual class stories. A continuation of class story could be just as independent of the overall story as it is from level 1-50. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ZionHalcyon Posted January 8, 2014 Author Share Posted January 8, 2014 I don't see the problem. Currently, the planet stories and overall story are the same for every class and independent of individual class stories. A continuation of class story could be just as independent of the overall story as it is from level 1-50. Yup. Thats the idea. The only thing is I'd write the class stories in such a way that it gives light to why the player would do the planetary story - as in, the class story is the real motivation for the character undertaking the faction quest. Think about how much more sense Makeb would be for a Sith Inquisitor if you had an accompanying class story that reveals there was some arcane sith artifact on makeb, and the Inquizzy thought Darth Marr's mission would be the perfect cover for recovering said artifact without the dark council's knowledge? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nydus Posted January 8, 2014 Share Posted January 8, 2014 Then, over time, release the individual class quests on that planet for a fee of cartel coins - something that continues the adventure of your character. Can release different professions throughout the year, and just before the next planet comes out, have all of them go on sale in a bundle pack, like they have discounted for hypercrates of cartel packs. It isn't a bad idea; but as I think has been stated it might lead to an imblanace in that some of the classes seem to be more popular than others. For example, we know that there are more imperials than republic so the money-making impetus here would be to focus on the imperial classes. I don't know about you, but I'd be pretty irritated if I have a Republic Trooper (I don't) and no new story content is released. It's a careful balancing Act. Honestly, I think the future will be faction quests with class content incorporated into it. Like Makeb, but my hope would be that it would be more detailed class content then that! - Arcada Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arkerus Posted January 8, 2014 Share Posted January 8, 2014 2) devs, do it now Sorry bub. Not gonna happen. Welcome to real life. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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