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Trauma in PVP


KendraP's Avatar


KendraP
04.01.2020 , 05:43 PM | #11
Seeing as the "ideal" team has one healer for 2 dps and a tank, yes, by very definition he must be able to out heal one dps whacking on him. Otherwise how is he supposed to be able to heal himself while also keeping his tank up, while also healing every dps on his team? As you say, healers exist to support their team.

If they cant keep themselves up, they cant support the team?

sebakonkol's Avatar


sebakonkol
04.02.2020 , 01:34 AM | #12
Quote: Originally Posted by alchemicsoul-DJ View Post
I know this concept has been brought up before- but what would it take to actually introduce an actual trauma mechanic to this game that would act as a counter to the runaway healing I witness in PVP? When a moderately-skilled DPS (say Fury Marauder or Lightning Sorc) can average about 4 mil damage in a warzone and the average op/merc healer can average 5-6 mil heals, the numbers don't even out. And we all know how hard it is to get any randoms in regs to hard-swap when necessary.

I'm not saying healing itself needs to be debuffed or nerfed- but the healers in this game have got to have a counterpoint. And instead of hobbling the healers ad nauseam, it would be valuable to add a debuff that could be applied by DPS players.

Please, comment. Am I barking up the right tree here?
Snipers and Marauders can apply trauma already. I think Assassin with some set bonus/tactical can apply it as well

Problem is that Shatter Shot (for sniper) and Crippling Slash (for marauder) deals very low damage and costs some resources and GCD, so its not used mostly

TitusOfTides's Avatar


TitusOfTides
04.02.2020 , 11:38 AM | #13
Quote: Originally Posted by KendraP View Post
Seeing as the "ideal" team has one healer for 2 dps and a tank, yes, by very definition he must be able to out heal one dps whacking on him. Otherwise how is he supposed to be able to heal himself while also keeping his tank up, while also healing every dps on his team? As you say, healers exist to support their team.

If they cant keep themselves up, they cant support the team?
I think this is oversimplified and very misleading. Team composition and fights are more dynamic than just throwing HPS and DPS into an algorithm.

Tanks mitigate damage, often by more than 50% through guards and taunts. The healer is typically the benefit of this mitigation. By your logic, a healer and tank should be able to hold off 4 DPS - with little to no effort, and room to spare. The tank is what allows the healer to survive 2 DPS in your example. Why would you even assume all the responsibility falls on the healer? Additionally, wouldn't every tank/heal match essentially end in a stalemate according to your reasoning?

DPS should most often be applying damage every second, but there's so much more to it than that. People on these forums often focus on JUST HPS and DPS, but we are not dummy parsing or trying to take down a boss on a timer in this scenario.

In PvE, the tank will typically hold aggro and only minor damage will fall on the DPS - greatly reducing the need to 'heal everyone at once', or whatever fallacy everyone here keeps clinging to. In PvP, it is not so black and white. Your implication is that healing far beyond what is needed in endgame PvE content is the bare minimum for PvP, and you are wrong.

Fights against other humans are more complex, and shouldnt even be dumbed down to this level of false equivalency.

I think I'm smart too, so maybe I can say /delete or whatever.
There has been an awakening. Have you felt it?

KendraP's Avatar


KendraP
04.02.2020 , 12:35 PM | #14
My point was actually going against the concept of simple number equivalency. Thats kind of the point, that it's sort of dumb to think that one healer should have the same hps as 1 dps does damage.

I leave the details up to BW. But if a healer cant heal himself, much less anyone else, why bother bringing a healer?

LD_Little_Dragon's Avatar


LD_Little_Dragon
04.02.2020 , 04:10 PM | #15
Quote: Originally Posted by TitusOfTides View Post

In PvE, the tank will typically hold aggro and only minor damage will fall on the DPS - greatly reducing the need to 'heal everyone at once', or whatever fallacy everyone here keeps clinging to.
PVE is more than hammer station. Raid wide damage where everyone loses massive hit points can, and does, happen.

Whatever your issue is with heals in pvp (and you really shouldn't have one) needs to be kept away from screwing with PVE. Heals were nerfed pretty strongly already in 6.0 since for level 75 content dps and hitpoints increased roughtly 200%, while heals increased roughly 150%.

What you should be doing is nerfing all those dps self-heals. At the very least stop giving dps medals for hitting a dcd self-heal ability.
Stealthy heals, stealthy dps, stealthy tank.

KumbayaGOD's Avatar


KumbayaGOD
04.02.2020 , 10:53 PM | #16
Quote: Originally Posted by alchemicsoul-DJ View Post
I know this concept has been brought up before- but what would it take to actually introduce an actual trauma mechanic to this game that would act as a counter to the runaway healing I witness in PVP? When a moderately-skilled DPS (say Fury Marauder or Lightning Sorc) can average about 4 mil damage in a warzone and the average op/merc healer can average 5-6 mil heals, the numbers don't even out. And we all know how hard it is to get any randoms in regs to hard-swap when necessary.

I'm not saying healing itself needs to be debuffed or nerfed- but the healers in this game have got to have a counterpoint. And instead of hobbling the healers ad nauseam, it would be valuable to add a debuff that could be applied by DPS players.

Please, comment. Am I barking up the right tree here?
you not a dog so you cant bark
http://www.swtor.com/r/vczzh2 click here for referal code you you get: FREE TRANSFER , FREE STUFFS, FREE 7 DAYS SUBSCRIPTION, FREE UNLOCK AND MORE

sebakonkol's Avatar


sebakonkol
04.03.2020 , 01:41 AM | #17
Quote: Originally Posted by LD_Little_Dragon View Post
PVE is more than hammer station. Raid wide damage where everyone loses massive hit points can, and does, happen.

Whatever your issue is with heals in pvp (and you really shouldn't have one) needs to be kept away from screwing with PVE. Heals were nerfed pretty strongly already in 6.0 since for level 75 content dps and hitpoints increased roughtly 200%, while heals increased roughly 150%.

What you should be doing is nerfing all those dps self-heals. At the very least stop giving dps medals for hitting a dcd self-heal ability.
DPS with selfheals got hit hard by 6.0. Mercs, sorcs and juggernauts survivalabillity has lowered a lot (compared to 5.10)
I don`t know about opers, not playing them, but I heard Lethality suffers from this issue as well

Lhancelot's Avatar


Lhancelot
04.03.2020 , 03:51 AM | #18
Quote: Originally Posted by LD_Little_Dragon View Post
PVE is more than hammer station. Raid wide damage where everyone loses massive hit points can, and does, happen.

Whatever your issue is with heals in pvp (and you really shouldn't have one) needs to be kept away from screwing with PVE. Heals were nerfed pretty strongly already in 6.0 since for level 75 content dps and hitpoints increased roughtly 200%, while heals increased roughly 150%.

What you should be doing is nerfing all those dps self-heals. At the very least stop giving dps medals for hitting a dcd self-heal ability.
Nah, it's not the plethora of DCDs in the game, huge speed boosts DPS get etc. etc. It's HPS being too high. It just shows you, how people of a certain mentality do not change even when they are conceded to.

The DPS crowd got what they wanted, a buff to burst, and HPS lowered. You sad, pathetic incompetent players got what you wanted, HPS has been nerfed substantially with 6.0!

Yet here we are months later having people cry and whine about heals?

I don't think BW did it on purpose I think they are so incompetent it just happened that way in 6.0 tbh. That being said, as noted above all the bull **** DCDs that heal your precious DPS ought to be removed first before HPS are nerfed again.




TL;DR

Stop making DPS brain dead by giving them massive DCDs that overlap and actually reduce the necessity of healers in PVP.

Why cater to this group of anti-social players anyway, if it's ever a niche group of PVPers whining about anything it's always pure DPS players. Just **** and play the game already and L2P.

At this point, if you struggle against healers it's purely a L2P issue nothing else. Stop looking for blame why you fail in PVP so miserably, instead look in the mirror not at healers.
Please join the discussion on how to improve rewards for PVP
HERE
http://www.swtor.com/community/showt...82#post9840582

Rotatorcuffs's Avatar


Rotatorcuffs
04.03.2020 , 07:25 PM | #19
It doesn't have to be a passive or active ability for every class, but I would like it if they made a tactical/set bonus for every class that had a trauma mechanic.

tynt's Avatar


tynt
04.09.2020 , 10:36 AM | #20
Heals in pvp are too strong when combined with DCDs, guard, cc, ect. To top this off, HPS is still higher than DPS. Do we really want a game where everyone is playing godmode healer and noone ever dies?