I don't care about 300 EU Jedis hiding around or the novelization or whatever anyone can come up with.

 

What matters is the movies, and in that sense, the answer is simple - plot device for Lucas to setup the old trilogy, otherwise it makes no sense.

 

For that matter, I don't give a crap about that novelization text, what the movie showed was Yoda weakening from falling, but so was Palpatine from the force blast, Yoda could had perfectly continued fighting, and maybe defeating him. From that whole fight scene, it seems a totally balanced fight with neither combatants stronger than the other.

 

I've never seen that fight scene as "Yoda being defeated", or "Palpatine being stronger", it's on and suddenly Yoda goes away for no reason other than the script needed it. They weren't exactly cowards, Lucas could and should have done a better job with the setup to the original trilogy.

I disagree. I saw Sidious being unhappy the entire time fighting mace. I then see him being unhappy in his lightsaber battle with Yoda. I then see him laughing when he's throwing the senate "chairs" at Yoda. I also see him, when Yoda throws it back at him, have an "Oh darn" expression rather than taking him seriously. To me it makes perfect sense. Sidious was bested in lightsaber combat by Windu. He was losing in said combat against Yoda. When he started using his force powers Yoda began to get overwhelmed. At this point Sidious was having fun up until Yoda employed his best technique which at best forced a draw.

You forget he also blasted Yoda's lightsaber from his hand moment's before the fall with his force lightning. Disarming him. Had they not been on the senate podium. Yoda would have been unarmed. Sidious did not lose his weapon.

Not to mention.. the novelization is Canon. Leland Chee was hired to handle continuity. The EU is Canon. Saying otherwise makes me wonder why you play this game considering it's also EU.

I disagree. I saw Sidious being unhappy the entire time fighting mace. I then see him being unhappy in his lightsaber battle with Yoda. I then see him laughing when he's throwing the senate "chairs" at Yoda. I also see him, when Yoda throws it back at him, have an "Oh darn" expression rather than taking him seriously. To me it makes perfect sense. Sidious was bested in lightsaber combat by Windu. He was losing in said combat against Yoda. When he started using his force powers Yoda began to get overwhelmed. At this point Sidious was having fun up until Yoda employed his best technique which at best forced a draw.

 

You forget he also blasted Yoda's lightsaber from his hand moment's before the fall with his force lightning. Disarming him. Had they not been on the senate podium. Yoda would have been unarmed. Sidious did not lose his weapon.

 

Not to mention.. the novelization is Canon. Leland Chee was hired to handle continuity. The EU is Canon. Saying otherwise makes me wonder why you play this game considering it's also EU.

This is a different age, I like Star Wars but from the movies. What drew me in KOTOR and continues to draw me in TOR is Bioware. Besides, there's no Lucas movies in this age. Can Lucas contradict it? Possible, but highly unlikely.

The "modern" SW era is the movies, and everything else I don't care about. I don't need to tell you how much stuff the new trilogy and the clone wars cartoon changed or deleted from EU fiction. The fact they hired someone to handle continuity is almost irrelevant, they have done that and then change it anyway or make a mistake. Fact is, Lucas didn't write the novel, he wrote the movie, so that's the Star Wars Ep 3 story that matters. Anything Lucas didn't write or cared for directly keeps getting retconned or deleted, so the EU... yeah, don't care for it aside from the KOTOR era.

As for what you said, force pull to get saber back. I also didn't read an "oh darn" expression in that scene, but an "oh %#&". Besides the fact that crazy people tend to go nuts and laugh like crazy, so that doesn't mean anything. Sidious was just nutty in several parts of the film, I might add. Ian McDiarmid played him with a certain... joker-ish panache.

This is a different age, I like Star Wars but from the movies. What drew me in KOTOR and continues to draw me in TOR is Bioware. Besides, there's no Lucas movies in this age. Can Lucas contradict it? Possible, but highly unlikely.

 

The "modern" SW era is the movies, and everything else I don't care about. I don't need to tell you how much stuff the new trilogy and the clone wars cartoon changed or deleted from EU fiction. The fact they hired someone to handle continuity is almost irrelevant, they have done that and then change it anyway or make a mistake. Fact is, Lucas didn't write the novel, he wrote the movie, so that's the Star Wars Ep 3 story that matters. Anything Lucas didn't write or cared for directly keeps getting retconned or deleted, so the EU... yeah, don't care for it aside from the KOTOR era.

 

As for what you said, force pull to get saber back. I also didn't read an "oh darn" expression in that scene, but an "oh %#&". Besides the fact that crazy people tend to go nuts and laugh like crazy, so that doesn't mean anything. Sidious was just nutty in several parts of the film, I might add. Ian McDiarmid played him with a certain... joker-ish panache.

It wasn't an "oh ****" expression. He makes a motion as if he's snapping his fingers before he merely leaps to another platform. The Joker, as you mentioned, also laughs a lot when having fun too. Usually when he's getting what he wants. Also pulling your saber to you takes time and what's to stop Sidious from merely doing it again? Yoda couldn't beat him. The film makes that clear. Also the EU is Canon. While Lucas contradicts it he also takes what he likes and adds stuff in it. He's completely changed story pitches and completely turned down other stories. Like it or not. The old republic is just as Canon as the rest of the EU.

Yoda is weaker than Sidious. This is fact.

I like to say.

DARTH MAUL SHOULD HAVE KILLED EVERYBODY.

That would've atleast been a tad bit more interesting.

OH and of course the first time he really fights he gets his ANUUUSSS kicked. That's just sad.

It wasn't an "oh ****" expression. He makes a motion as if he's snapping his fingers before he merely leaps to another platform. The Joker, as you mentioned, also laughs a lot when having fun too. Usually when he's getting what he wants. Also pulling your saber to you takes time and what's to stop Sidious from merely doing it again? Yoda couldn't beat him. The film makes that clear. Also the EU is Canon. While Lucas contradicts it he also takes what he likes and adds stuff in it. He's completely changed story pitches and completely turned down other stories. Like it or not. The old republic is just as Canon as the rest of the EU.

 

Yoda is weaker than Sidious. This is fact.

The movie is ambiguous and leaves it open for interpretation. Just because it's fact "in your mind" doesn't mean it's actually fact. For me Yoda = Sidious.

Canon is G-canon, which means Lucas wrote it. All the rest doesn't matter, including the novelization, radio drama, action figure fact sheets, and whatever else you can think of. I don't care if KOTOR / TOR are canon or not, I like them for what they are, fun RPGs that have Bioware quality storytelling. I just said it's unlikely Lucas will ever mess with them, so in that regard at least I connect with them.

Let's agree to disagree and leave it at that.

The movie is ambiguous and leaves it open for interpretation. Just because it's fact "in your mind" doesn't mean it's actually fact. For me Yoda = Sidious.

 

Canon is G-canon, which means Lucas wrote it. All the rest doesn't matter, including the novelization, radio drama, action figure fact sheets, and whatever else you can think of. I don't care if KOTOR / TOR are canon or not, I like them for what they are, fun RPGs that have Bioware quality storytelling. I just said it's unlikely Lucas will ever mess with them, so in that regard at least I connect with them.

 

Let's agree to disagree and leave it at that.

It isn't just in my head apparently. C Canon is Canon too as long as it doesn't contradict G. The above doesn't contradict it. You can't see Yoda's thoughts. We do know he gave up. I'll agree to disagree but according to the rules of Canon. The novelization is still Canon.

It isn't just in my head apparently. C Canon is Canon too as long as it doesn't contradict G. The above doesn't contradict it. You can't see Yoda's thoughts. We do know he gave up. I'll agree to disagree but according to the rules of Canon. The novelization is still Canon.

Didn't see the novelization in the movie theater, so no, don't care. Said before, Yoda gave up because the script required it, there was little logic to it other than setting up his exile on Dagobah.

George Lucas just lost his ability to tell stories. The whole plot and dialogue seems like it was rushed and improperly thought through.

I don't think prequels will ever work in any format.

They should have made the Admiral Thrawn trilogy or Jedi Academy trilogy. Seems silly to have stopped at ROTJ and then come up with crappy prequels 16 years later.

I don't care about 300 EU Jedis hiding around or the novelization or whatever anyone can come up with.

 

What matters is the movies, and in that sense, the answer is simple - plot device for Lucas to setup the old trilogy, otherwise it makes no sense.

 

For that matter, what the movie showed was Yoda weakening from falling, but so was Palpatine from the force blast, Yoda could had perfectly continued fighting, and maybe defeating him. From that whole fight scene, it seems a totally balanced fight with neither combatant stronger than the other.

 

I've never seen that fight scene as "Yoda being defeated", or "Palpatine being stronger", it's on and suddenly Yoda goes away for no reason other than the script needed it. They weren't exactly cowards, Lucas could and should have done a better job with the setup to the original trilogy.

Interesting points.

I always thought a better ending would have been the Emperor being saved by hundreds of clone troops entering the battle, forcing Yoda to flee. Rather than Yoda falling and saying I'm off then.

Yoda = Emperor.... Anakin=Obi wan.... The two fights (Anakin/Obi)(Yoda/Emperor) are a clear contrast of eachother... Anakin arrogantly persisted to keep fighting, resulting in a loss. Yoda retreating, forced a tie. I believe Lucas used these two fights to contrast the decisions of Jedi/Sith, and the repricutions of their decisions.

Yoda's retreat is not a loss... to consider it a loss is totally unintelligent.

If you have speculation against this, remember Russia's retreat tactic in WWII (Scorched Earth). Falling back to fight another day is in no way a loss, it is in fact a very well strategized battle technique.

Yoda = Emperor.... Anakin=Obi wan.... The two fights (Anakin/Obi)(Yoda/Emperor) are a clear contrast of eachother... Anakin arrogantly persisted to keep fighting, resulting in a loss. Yoda retreating, forced a tie. I believe Lucas used these two fights to contrast the decisions of Jedi/Sith, and the repricutions of their decisions.

 

Yoda's retreat is not a loss... to consider it a loss is totally unintelligent.

 

If you have speculation against this, remember Russia's retreat tactic in WWII (Scorched Earth). Falling back to fight another day is in no way a loss, it is in fact a very well strategized battle technique.

Canon wise it was a loss. I posted both the novelization and Leland Chee's viewpoints. Considering Leland Chee controls Canon well..