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Madness Assassin PVP Question about spec.

STAR WARS: The Old Republic > English > Classes > Shadow / Assassin
Madness Assassin PVP Question about spec.

IInox's Avatar


IInox
07.20.2014 , 08:21 AM | #11
Are u getting more dps with more crit?

Actually I'm getting some more power mods/enh to test various sets up..we'll see..

On 1on1 I'm not sure, if you dodge high crits with resilience you win in balance, tho a shadow can use resilience aswell to purge dots..I'm not a pure pvp player so I don't know..

FinalArbiter's Avatar


FinalArbiter
07.20.2014 , 02:01 PM | #12
At first when I tried this spec, I had 25 percent crit chance counting everything. My DPS and healing were both kinda low for WZs with that much crit.

Then later I replaced some of my power mods and moved into 30 percent crit chance and I think I saw my DPS got noticably higher but it's hard to say for sure. I was just testing on the Warzone Dummy and noticed a LOT more DoTs ticking for 1-1.3k. Also my self-heals were higher so I prefer keeping it this way.

Even though everyone says crit chance is bad, I think I perform noticably better having 30 percent or more (with this spec anyways). But as you said, you will probably have to run some actual parses to see. I'm only going off what I see from the Warzone dummy.

Quote:
On 1on1 I'm not sure, if you dodge high crits with resilience you win in balance, tho a shadow can use resilience aswell to purge dots..I'm not a pure pvp player so I don't know..
Really? You can use resilience to purge dots? I thought there was a talent in the Balance/'Madness tree that prevented that. It's called Psychic Absorption for Shadows and Devour for Assassins. Does it not work?

IInox's Avatar


IInox
07.20.2014 , 02:35 PM | #13
Quote: Originally Posted by FinalArbiter View Post
At first when I tried this spec, I had 25 percent crit chance counting everything. My DPS and healing were both kinda low for WZs with that much crit.

Then later I replaced some of my power mods and moved into 30 percent crit chance and I think I saw my DPS got noticably higher but it's hard to say for sure. I was just testing on the Warzone Dummy and noticed a LOT more DoTs ticking for 1-1.3k. Also my self-heals were higher so I prefer keeping it this way.

Even though everyone says crit chance is bad, I think I perform noticably better having 30 percent or more (with this spec anyways). But as you said, you will probably have to run some actual parses to see. I'm only going off what I see from the Warzone dummy.


Really? You can use resilience to purge dots? I thought there was a talent in the Balance/'Madness tree that prevented that. It's called Psychic Absorption for Shadows and Devour for Assassins. Does it not work?
Well not all players. Oberei, Xinika and Evoxile are for 30% cirt chance and actually I'm sitting at 29.5 but i want to test by myself the low set up.

0crit rating is not also a good point imho, crit is bad but 200/250 crit points are worth anyway.

talents says: "cleansable" . resilience PURGES not CLEANSES

PhatMcMuffins's Avatar


PhatMcMuffins
07.21.2014 , 11:46 AM | #14
Wakajinn (0/31/15) is inferior to both full deception post-2.0 and full madness post-2.8. The version of the spec pre-2.0 was great. It has less burst than deception and less sustained and aoe pressure than madness.

Kinda off topic but i saw it mentioned earlier and thought i'd chime in
<Occasional Crops>
Qarum - Alan Rails - Dazkkum - Fake Doors - Eight-six

Vrajl's Avatar


Vrajl
07.21.2014 , 12:30 PM | #15
Quote: Originally Posted by PhatMcMuffins View Post
Wakajinn (0/31/15) is inferior to both full deception post-2.0 and full madness post-2.8. The version of the spec pre-2.0 was great. It has less burst than deception and less sustained and aoe pressure than madness.

Kinda off topic but i saw it mentioned earlier and thought i'd chime in
Could you post a link with this spec on torhead or something. But if its what I think think it is, I use it all the time in pvp. I find that it has more burst then full deception because a recklessnessed death field crits harder then shock as an opener. Its not as sustainable as madness, but that's not how it should be played IMHO

IInox's Avatar


IInox
07.21.2014 , 02:17 PM | #16
if you are still talking about pvp, deception has the highest burst. (well pve too imho)

Vrajl's Avatar


Vrajl
07.21.2014 , 03:33 PM | #17
Quote: Originally Posted by IInox View Post
if you are still talking about pvp, deception has the highest burst. (well pve too imho)
I was talking pvp. Maybe I'm just doing it wrong, but voltaic slash isn't all that great of a technique and death field is. Its not as sustained, but very bursty.
And IMHO, deception rocks for PVE. I prefer it to madness for the fun factor in SM, especially for the DF fights. I just wish it was up to par with madness.

PhatMcMuffins's Avatar


PhatMcMuffins
07.21.2014 , 04:28 PM | #18
Quote: Originally Posted by Vrajl View Post
I was talking pvp. Maybe I'm just doing it wrong, but voltaic slash isn't all that great of a technique and death field is. Its not as sustained, but very bursty.
And IMHO, deception rocks for PVE. I prefer it to madness for the fun factor in SM, especially for the DF fights. I just wish it was up to par with madness.
death field in wakajinn will not hit harder than a recklessnessed discharge. couple that with a proc'd maul and shock.

Voltaic is a strong filler compared to most fillers. It hits harder than thrash does and builds voltage. Voltage at 2 stacks auto triggers surging charge on your next shock. I've hit almost 4k with just the surging charge. Add that to the 5-6k you can get from shock. If you're getting more burst from wakajinn, you're not playing deception properly. The spec is average at best since 2.0. The playstyle is still kinda fun but full madness just enhances that play style of semi-mid-ranged play.

also, comparing death field to voltaic is silly. its apples to oranges. Death field is a burst AoE. Voltaic is a filler and a good one at that, that also builds voltage for shock.

A simple opener for deception is Spike > Recklessness > Discharge > Duplicity Maul > Voltaic x 2 > shock > low slash > duplicity maul. Thats if i remember everything correctly. its been a while since i played deception.

With madness buffs, you can get your death field fix by simply playing the full spec. For performance, its full spec either deception or madness

EDIT: Here is the Wakajinn spec
You could swap oppressing force for sith defiance and insulation for obfuscation but thats preference.

As you see, you lose all the flow of deception. you no longer auto-proc duplicity off low slash and spike. shock will hit for less without the added auto-surging charge from voltage. You do less damage to low health targets, which is important for burst specs because you NEED to kill that target quickly to fulfill your roll
<Occasional Crops>
Qarum - Alan Rails - Dazkkum - Fake Doors - Eight-six

IInox's Avatar


IInox
07.21.2014 , 04:37 PM | #19
Quote: Originally Posted by Vrajl View Post
I was talking pvp. Maybe I'm just doing it wrong, but voltaic slash isn't all that great of a technique and death field is. Its not as sustained, but very bursty.
And IMHO, deception rocks for PVE. I prefer it to madness for the fun factor in SM, especially for the DF fights. I just wish it was up to par with madness.
u can't beat

LW > MC > FP+FB > PJ > FiB


Yeah for some fights u can play infiltration but..Balance outperforms it in all ways..

PhatMcMuffins's Avatar


PhatMcMuffins
07.21.2014 , 05:22 PM | #20
just fyi, everything i post is from a pvp perspective. i don't know anything about PvE beyond flashpoints haha
<Occasional Crops>
Qarum - Alan Rails - Dazkkum - Fake Doors - Eight-six