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Madness Assassin PVP Question about spec.

STAR WARS: The Old Republic > English > Classes > Shadow / Assassin
Madness Assassin PVP Question about spec.

FinalArbiter's Avatar


FinalArbiter
07.15.2014 , 11:07 PM | #1
What is the most popular madness sin pvp spec right now? I googled and saw a few but they seemed rather inefficient.

IInox's Avatar


IInox
07.16.2014 , 04:21 AM | #2
take a look on my signature. hf

FinalArbiter's Avatar


FinalArbiter
07.16.2014 , 07:44 AM | #3
Quote: Originally Posted by IInox View Post
take a look on my signature. hf
Alright thanks that spec looks good, and I tweaked it a bit to my liking: 5/2/39. Basically I just replaced Torment with Corrupted Flesh because I think it's more useful.

My question is...is Torment really all that important? Whenever I run WZs, I almost never run out of Force, even without Force talents. The reason is that there is a lot of kiting and CC in PVP. I'm always getting knocked away, slowed, stunned, etc. so I spend half the time closing the gap and such anyways waiting for the next time I can get close enough to pull off an instant Mind Crush/Crushing Darkness. There is hardly ever a time where I'm just sitting there bashing someone to death in which case, yes, I would eventually run out of Force. I always attack the healers, and they attempt to kite the crap out of me, which means I get time to Force regen anyways. Nobody in their right mind is just going to let me pump out my rotation on them for an extended period of time.

I read the note where the guide recommended replacing Oppressive Force for Corrupted Flesh, but I think 10 second CDR on hard stun is a bit more valuable than saving 2 Force on every melee attack. Honestly saving 2 force per melee attack just doesn't seem all that special to me compared to an additional 15 percent damage reduction from DoTs which could easily make the difference between dying and surviving an encounter with another madness/balance spec. I could see Torment being useful if this spec made frequent use of Shock...but it really doesn't. Am I wrong to think this way?

IInox's Avatar


IInox
07.16.2014 , 10:25 AM | #4
you right but it's istuational too corrupet flash imho, it doesn't change at all, they are preferes u know

If you mean thi note:

"This is the generic build where you can play any WZs, you can change some talents:
-2x Pinning Resolve/Oppressing Force +2x Mind Ward/Corrupted Flesh
-1x Psychokinesis/Torment +1x Lambaste (more 4fun tip to do huge deeps vs lowbies stacking together"

they are just suggestions, I never do them..I just play the standard build

FinalArbiter's Avatar


FinalArbiter
07.17.2014 , 07:42 PM | #5
Well my modified version of your spec is working great on my Shadow. I'm not really running out of Force except for in drawn-out Arenas so yeah, I would say Torment/Psychokinesis is for the most part useless. On the other hand the 15 percent DoT reduction has helped a lot in dueling Madness sorcs and Madness sins. The damage of this spec seems really good, a lot more consistent than Deception.

Thanks for the link, that guide is really awesome. Keep it up.

IInox's Avatar


IInox
07.18.2014 , 04:17 AM | #6
Quote: Originally Posted by FinalArbiter View Post
Well my modified version of your spec is working great on my Shadow. I'm not really running out of Force except for in drawn-out Arenas so yeah, I would say Torment/Psychokinesis is for the most part useless. On the other hand the 15 percent DoT reduction has helped a lot in dueling Madness sorcs and Madness sins. The damage of this spec seems really good, a lot more consistent than Deception.

Thanks for the link, that guide is really awesome. Keep it up.
this is not mine btw.

My guide is about infiltration.

IInox's Avatar


IInox
07.18.2014 , 04:56 PM | #7
i tryed balance without torment andf i don't like it at all.. at leat in arenas..

how much dps are u doing btw? on normal warzones

FinalArbiter's Avatar


FinalArbiter
07.20.2014 , 01:50 AM | #8
Yeah I just recently respecced into Torment after running like 20 warzones of Madness (actually Balance, cuz I play Shadow but I'll use Sin terms here since its sin forums). I found that 10 second CDR on hard stun isn't that useful. On the other hand it's nice to have more Force so you can pull off more Assassinates and such in cluch moments. So basically I followed the tooltip, saying to sacrifice the 10 second CDR on stun for 15 percent DoT damage reduction.

As for DPS, it all depends if I have a healer on me or not. With a healer I almost never die and can pull really good numbers. My highest so far has been 950k in Voidstar map. I was constantly DPSing (no reason to force cloak or stealth at all really), I had a healer on me at all times, and the enemy was trying to kill our healers which meant they mostly ignored me, allowing me use Assassinate basically every time it procced and using Recklessness+ Death Field + Instant Crushing Darkness whenever it was available.

I've learned to taunt pretty well so I get semi-decent protection numbers too. It really helps when your mass AoE taunt doubles as a defensive cooldown for this spec. >_>

Without a healer, it's completely different. I have to be very careful since I'm fairly squishy and getting focused equals death if I don't have force cloak up, but I still usually get 3rd or 4th top DPS. The top DPS in my games is usually the Vanguards/Balance Sages/Dirty Fighting Gunslingers. It's really hard to out-DPS them at the moment.

When I get better with the class I'm going to switch to the 0/31/15 hybrid. I really think it's the best spec out there right now, but on the other hand it requires a lot more skill to play perfectly, and I'd rather not mess with it until I'm at least decent with the easy-mode spec known as Madness. :P

IInox's Avatar


IInox
07.20.2014 , 05:19 AM | #9
So are you playing with torment now?

Yeah well CD reduction, dmg reduction from DoTs are both viable, it's just, u know, preferences imho.

Maybe torment can be more usefull in Arena but I like to spam my melee hit to not miss any raze proc.

I'm still mastering this spec, my best DPS is 2015 in voidstar, average i do 1500/1600 counting just fights with smooth fights, healers, etc.

Actually the 0/35/15 is not the best spec anymore..imho at the same lvl of Balance just because it has nice burst but Balance for Arenas is better actually..too much sustain dps to ignore him

FinalArbiter's Avatar


FinalArbiter
07.20.2014 , 06:03 AM | #10
Yes I'm playing with Torment now! You were right, it's definitely necessary for this spec, considering that the entire goal is high sustained DPS.

I'm sticking with the 15 percent DoT Damage reduction, and sacrificing the 10 second cdr on hard stun. Overall I'm very pleased with the spec and now that I bought all the basic Obroan level crit mods and enhancements I need, I'm pushing out some major sustained DPS. I'm currently saving up for augments and brutalizer stuff.

I think the two specs are both good for PVP, but they are good at different things. 0/31/15 is better for burst and jumping into a large group of enemies because it's less squishy. This is probably due to the Darkswell/Masked Assault talent, which makes that spec a lot more useful against instant focus fire, unlike Madness spec which takes some time to get fired up and self-healing a lot.

I think which spec is better largely depends on if you have a healer or not. Because if you do have a healer, Madness is probably the number one spec that will eventually tear through everything if you don't stop it. If it's allowed to survive for a few GCDs, then it can get a large amount of self-healing going.

But...If you're in more of a 1v1 situation, which happens quite often in Warzones if you like to solo-cap/solo-guard nodes, I think an Assassin running 0/31/15 would crush a full Madness Assassin every single time. There is just way too much deadliness in Recklessness->Death Field->Discharge->Shock and that's completely disregarding their ridiculous opener which gives 2 free Maul procs from 2 stun abilities.