so, our money gets there.. I get it..

and the only thing I miss is that we COULD HAVE our SWTOR characters in engine and enviromnents.

I guess they just learned a LOT out of what happened here.

I mean, even the sounds are very similar to those we have now..

It IS a SWTOR redone, but why the hell this game is not in SW world?

No SW? No game for me.

This is going to bomb so much.

So far everyone I've talked to who went to E3 has said that both Anthem and Division 2 are just awful. More so the dev's are on board with Microsoft and the Xbone. Really the only thing those games will do is help Destiny 2. Its a shame Bioware could have been putting out games like Mass Effect and Dragon Age Origins and rather we get what we have been getting.

Really them and Bethesda have let me down so much. I'm just glad we have CDRP with Witcher 3 and Indies like the guys who did Kingdom Come and Square with FFXIV to pick up what's gone wrong.

so, our money gets there.. I get it.. .

Of course it doesn't. If people think that SWTOR is bringing in enough cash to help pay for another IP, I think they're being delusional.

Anthem has it's own budget I'm pretty sure and unless the people from BW Austin who are working on Anthem (a bunch of them do) are still paid from the SWTOR budget, there is no link between SWTOR revenue and the Anthem budget.

I will say that Anthem looks good combat wise but the one thing that really matters to me is story and how you can engage with characters in the world and feel connected. And that's the one topic they barely say anything about, except we know we won't have companions, no romance, not the convo wheel to make choices and in the Story parts in your town you are in first person so you can't even see your character.

So how I'm supposed to be connected to my character, the world and the people in the world is a mystery.

In that sense I really wish they hadn't ruined SWTOR for me with 5.0 because, well, I wish I could still enjoy SWTOR.

Yes yes blame Anthem for the lack of investment in SWTOR. Please, the game has had budget cut after budget cut since launch. Even if Anthem wasn't a thing we'd still be in the same situation and you people would be blaming DA4 or whatever Bioware would be working on.

I will say that Anthem looks good combat wise but the one thing that really matters to me is story and how you can engage with characters in the world and feel connected. And that's the one topic they barely say anything about, except we know we won't have companions, no romance, not the convo wheel to make choices and in the Story parts in your town you are in first person so you can't even see your character.

 

So how I'm supposed to be connected to my character, the world and the people in the world is a mystery.

Agreed, the game looks interesting combat wise and the exploration seems to be really nice which was something I was looking forward to, I love exploring. But the story is the main part of the games, and even though I'm definitely intrigued by the plot points they've released so far I can't help but feel a little disappointed I won't be customizing my character, the javelin suits look nice but there's a person underneath that suit which I really would like to customize. I'm also wondering how the story will work, they've said that there are choices and that everyone has their own story so I'm giving them the benefit of the doubt so far. I started out SWTOR not expecting to feel immersed and interested in the lore of the game so I'm hoping they'll be able to do the same with Anthem, time will tell.

Here is a preview of your sub/cm money at work,

HMH?

/5char

Yes yes blame Anthem for the lack of investment in SWTOR. Please, the game has had budget cut after budget cut since launch. Even if Anthem wasn't a thing we'd still be in the same situation and you people would be blaming DA4 or whatever Bioware would be working on.

 

 

Agreed, the game looks interesting combat wise and the exploration seems to be really nice which was something I was looking forward to, I love exploring. But the story is the main part of the games, and even though I'm definitely intrigued by the plot points they've released so far I can't help but feel a little disappointed I won't be customizing my character, the javelin suits look nice but there's a person underneath that suit which I really would like to customize. I'm also wondering how the story will work, they've said that there are choices and that everyone has their own story so I'm giving them the benefit of the doubt so far. I started out SWTOR not expecting to feel immersed and interested in the lore of the game so I'm hoping they'll be able to do the same with Anthem, time will tell.

As a side note the lead producer on Anthem is Ben Irving. I think you might've heard that name before.

Bioware has fallen so low they've resorted to directly copying other games... Namely Destiny and WarFrame....

And we all know what happened to both those games.

I guess Anthem will be Bioware's last game. There wont be a Bioware anymore after 2019.

SWTOR RIP 2011-2021.

As a side note the lead producer on Anthem is Ben Irving. I think you might've heard that name before.

Yes, I did... we all did... I would give him the benefit of the doubt but considering Galactic Command I'm betting Anthem will feature new and exciting ways to grind for RNG, I'm still checking out the game if I can but that will put a sour note on the progression of my character.

Yes, I did... we all did... I would give him the benefit of the doubt but considering Galactic Command I'm betting Anthem will feature new and exciting ways to grind for RNG, I'm still checking out the game if I can but that will put a sour note on the progression of my character.

I am looking with interest at Anthem but I see some pitfalls and their promises about story are still only promises. Well, let me correct myself there. We do know some things and they all point at the opposite. I'm still interested how we are going to feel connected to our characters without actually being able to see them unless suited up in full body armour. I'm also still interested to find out how we will feel connected to the world as we won't have companions to take along on our adventures and no romance which can add depth to such a connection. And I'm really interested how the story will appeal after seeing KotFE/ET and ME:Andromeda's story "quality". And I'm really interested to see how I with feel engaged in the stories without the dialogue wheel as we know it.

Ben Irving really put SWTOR in a bad position and I do wonder how much influence he has on the game as lead produced. BioWare seems, and I do say seems, to have blinders on and blame failures on the players rather than themselves.

But Galactic Command has been a disaster for this game. Too many people left, server merges happened and now they are doing what they can to keep the game alive. Don't get me wrong, I think they can keep it alive but the game would've been much better off without Irving's leadership. So I can only hope the BioWare culture of today allows him to learn from those mistakes and make better calls.

I know a lot of people are hating on Keith cause he didn't deliver what they felt he promised but to me it seems that, although it may not be what you or I want, that he does see the realities and is making decisions based on what this game needs rather than what people are asking for. I have to applaud him for that because it can't be easy to steer this ship and keep it floating at the same time. He identified GC now as a secondary gearing system for example.

Now I've got 3 or 4 things that I'd need changed before I'd consider coming back to this game but because of what they need to do, I do not expect them to be able to do it. It's a learning experience for me as well in the end and I can see that more clearly now from some of the discussions I've engaged in against perhaps better judgment.

Anthem is going to be built on what they've learned in other games they made. Considering it's an online game and the combat we've seen, I think it's fair to state that they are looking towards SWTOR and Mass Effect: Andromeda.

Andromeda was problematic but the combat was smooth and that's what they seem to be building on. So that's good news. I'm really rather more worried about things like reward systems though their explanations about the cash shop do seem to indicate they learned something. Perhaps they learned from SWTOR that direct sales in the end can be quite profitable. Perhaps that's a reason why I am still interested in discussing SWTOR because it's also part of BioWare and where BioWare is going I feel.

But I'm pretty sure that SWTOR and Anthem have separate budgets and I do not believe that there is much of an investment possible from whatever profits they still manage from SWTOR. My fear for Anthem is that it will be fun to play if you're into co-op but it will lack the depth that we've seen in BioWare games before.

Time will tell I guess, but I really hope Ben Irving learned some things because he was either delusional, believing his own nonsense or just a bad salesman. Either way, it cost SWTOR dearly and even though the game isn't dead, I certainly see it as a close call.

And who knows, maybe Anthem will be very grindy with poor RNG chances so you'll feel compelled to spend at the cash shop. All in all, I find it safer to let the game release and see what the reactions are to the actual game and then decide.

But who knows, if Anthem does well, they may clear a little extra budget for SWTOR.

I am looking with interest at Anthem but I see some pitfalls and their promises about story are still only promises. Well, let me correct myself there. We do know some things and they all point at the opposite. I'm still interested how we are going to feel connected to our characters without actually being able to see them unless suited up in full body armour. I'm also still interested to find out how we will feel connected to the world as we won't have companions to take along on our adventures and no romance which can add depth to such a connection. And I'm really interested how the story will appeal after seeing KotFE/ET and ME:Andromeda's story "quality". And I'm really interested to see how I with feel engaged in the stories without the dialogue wheel as we know it.

 

Ben Irving really put SWTOR in a bad position and I do wonder how much influence he has on the game as lead produced. BioWare seems, and I do say seems, to have blinders on and blame failures on the players rather than themselves.

 

But Galactic Command has been a disaster for this game. Too many people left, server merges happened and now they are doing what they can to keep the game alive. Don't get me wrong, I think they can keep it alive but the game would've been much better off without Irving's leadership. So I can only hope the BioWare culture of today allows him to learn from those mistakes and make better calls.

 

I know a lot of people are hating on Keith cause he didn't deliver what they felt he promised but to me it seems that, although it may not be what you or I want, that he does see the realities and is making decisions based on what this game needs rather than what people are asking for. I have to applaud him for that because it can't be easy to steer this ship and keep it floating at the same time. He identified GC now as a secondary gearing system for example.

 

Now I've got 3 or 4 things that I'd need changed before I'd consider coming back to this game but because of what they need to do, I do not expect them to be able to do it. It's a learning experience for me as well in the end and I can see that more clearly now from some of the discussions I've engaged in against perhaps better judgment.

 

Anthem is going to be built on what they've learned in other games they made. Considering it's an online game and the combat we've seen, I think it's fair to state that they are looking towards SWTOR and Mass Effect: Andromeda.

 

Andromeda was problematic but the combat was smooth and that's what they seem to be building on. So that's good news. I'm really rather more worried about things like reward systems though their explanations about the cash shop do seem to indicate they learned something. Perhaps they learned from SWTOR that direct sales in the end can be quite profitable. Perhaps that's a reason why I am still interested in discussing SWTOR because it's also part of BioWare and where BioWare is going I feel.

 

But I'm pretty sure that SWTOR and Anthem have separate budgets and I do not believe that there is much of an investment possible from whatever profits they still manage from SWTOR. My fear for Anthem is that it will be fun to play if you're into co-op but it will lack the depth that we've seen in BioWare games before.

 

Time will tell I guess, but I really hope Ben Irving learned some things because he was either delusional, believing his own nonsense or just a bad salesman. Either way, it cost SWTOR dearly and even though the game isn't dead, I certainly see it as a close call.

 

And who knows, maybe Anthem will be very grindy with poor RNG chances so you'll feel compelled to spend at the cash shop. All in all, I find it safer to let the game release and see what the reactions are to the actual game and then decide.

 

But who knows, if Anthem does well, they may clear a little extra budget for SWTOR.

Don't get me wrong I'm trying to remain open minded about but I do admit the game could suck. I'm very worried about feeling connected to my character as well, dressing up and customizing their faces is something I really enjoy doing it because it allows me to create someone based on the role I want to play and I'm one of the players who loves playing SWTOR space barbie since I just love getting the right outfit for my character. And I'm also worried about that aspect of it, story, the game has an interesting premise but will it deliver? Time will tell. As a sidenote I do enjoy very much KOTFE and KOTET plus I enjoyed Andromeda, my biggest criticism of them is it could've been much more than it was, KOTFE and KOTET really could've used more codex entries and side-quests to explore Zakuul and the political and social aspects of their society, we get a little here and there but it's not something on the levels of the republic and Empire. The best thing we have is a few chapters like Kaliyo's where we learn how Zakuulans like seeking cheap thrills since their lives are so sheltered. As for Andromeda my biggest criticism is the clear DLC bait for a quarian ark and multiple plot points left unfinished which I guess were supposed to either be DLC or a sequel, the game does feel incomplete without DLC IMO and it's something that I heard about Inquisition as well, trespasser is that game's actual ending and the game's story wouldn't feel as complete without it.

Yes while I commend Irving on the story part, despite my criticisms about it, I loved KOTFE/KOTET but he should've listened to player feedback more often. I think it's important the game designers do try to hold their own vision but they must allow the playerbase to shape it just a little bit, so they can take the ideas that would enhance the vision, as an example what if when people complained about the lack of multiplayer content Ben did a flashpoint tied in to the story? Or perhaps even a raid. I genuinely think SF could've been either of those depending on how much of a budget he was willing to give it or even how long and hard would it be to develop alongside the monthly chapters, again I'm not a game dev so perhaps it would've been impossible to do both.

I agree, Galactic Command's initial launch was a terrible terrible idea, now a days it is tolerable, it is a grind for sure and the RNG aspect of it still sucks. But at least I can farm my unassembled components from duplicates or pieces I don't need/want and still work towards the goal of achieving gear, or do a raid and get a unassembled piece. I don't know whether to blame Bioware or EA for trying to shove RNG into the game, regardless of who's to blame I really hope Anthem doesn't has a similar progression system, I don't mind having to spend 2 hours in one raid provided I know what I'm getting out of it. And I agree, CG hurt the population, most of my friends left the game because of it and I can't say I blame them, I only stayed myself because the game's story kept me here and because of the promises of "fixing" and upgrading the system, which is what they did albeit a little too late to fix all of the damage credit where credit is due however. I do hope Ben learned his lesson, there's a lot riding on Anthem and I'd hate it to see it fail just because of one man, again I re-iterate my point of enjoying the KOTFE/KOTET storylines but Ben should've listened to feedback about CG and many other things, it would've avoided a lot of problems and I hope Anthem doesn't suffer the same fate.

Yes although I never thought Keith would be the messiah some people in the forums were claiming he's still doing a better job than Ben did, I understand he has a budget which is why I don't hold it against him the content release schedules an example. And I applaud him for that comment, again one of the reasons Ben and the team cited for CG was to be more inclusive, and I think they've achieved that. I myself never did NIM raids yet my main is able to be fully geared with 248 gear, was it a grindy and legnthy process to do that? Yes, but it's a secondary process and I'm ok with taking it longer to achieve the best gear to players who just use CG as opposed to getting the unassembled piece in case I did NIM. Overall the only changes I could think of CG is maybe tweak the RNG further, I've lost count over how many times I got a duplicate but again at least that helps me gain more components to upgrade my gear so again the system is now a tolerable secondary system, the biggest fault of CG was alienating the playerbase who was used to grind but wasn't used to RNG, we would grind crystals or raids and get our gear directly, galactic command made us have to grind for a chance to get it with raids at first only dropping guaranted pieces in the final boss which made farming pieces even more of a pain through. Call me spoiled but I like working towards the goal as opposed to the chance that I might reach such goal.

Well if the game doesn't suit you anymore then I don't blame you for leaving, I've seen some goodbye and rant threads that usually derailed into hate spewing the game and people's own unrealistic expectations for it (Not saying we shouldn't hold Keith accountable for when he screws something up, like galactic conquest, just saying we need to understand we're not going to get the same treatment we did in the 2.0 to 3.0 era) and I think that is harmful. I myself am not expecting a SOR sized expansion, maybe half of SOR. Again I could be wrong but I think it's important to keep the perspective of "This is the game now. It's not going to go back to the way it was" otherwise it'll be more harmful to me, creating false expectations then hating the game for it instead of saying "All right. This is the game now, people might enjoy it but I don't so it's my time to say goodbye".

It's kind of a weird thing apparently, again it's not an MMORPG in the sense of multiple players running around in the same world. Apparently you'll be able to play it solo, I think, and invite people into your own world and such, once the mission is done I think you'll go back to the player hub which is solo as well, so only you as a player will be there. It's a shared world in the sense that if a storm is happening to you it's happening to everyone else as well, correct me if I am mistaken though as this concept is new to me and I might misinterpreted it.

Indeed I have my criticisms of Andromeda as I stated it earlier, but the combat was the smoothest in the series, the gameplay was amazing and as much as I love the story more than the gameplay I do appreciate when devs can make a gameplay feel fun. Yes I am also worried about the rewards system, I'll re-iterate I don't mind grinding to need to get good gear to beat a more difficult mission, but if I spend hours doing a mission just for the chance to get the weapon or armor piece I need then I'll feel like it wasn't rewarding which will make me not want to play the game, it'll be Galactic Command all over again and I think that is bad. Yes, hopefully there will be more direct sales, again I love playing SWTOR space barbie and I don't mind wasting a bit of money for nice cosmetics, provided I know what I'm getting it. Yeah I understand, even though SWTOR isn't getting that much attention I believe by running an online game such as Anthem they'll use their knowledge from SWTOR, hopefully SWTOR will them a better idea of how to run an online gam.

Yeah I also think they both have separate budgets which is why I don't buy into the whole argument of "Anthem is taking away your stuff". I know Keith has stated that some people who want to work on SWTOR are working on Anthem and vice-verse in one podcast but again if people think Austin devs working on the game is stealing our resources then we should also blame Andromeda since I'm pretty sure some Austin devs worked on there as well. Overall my point is we shouldn't blame Anthem for the state our game is now, it's unfair to a game that hasn't launched and a bit idiotic to assume we would be in a better position ,if I may be a little bold here, if Anthem wasn't being developed. Yeah the co-op sounds like a really fun idea, heck Charles mentioned how the idea for SWTOR was "What if you played KOTOR with your friends" and the vanilla game really balances it out multiplayer experience with your own personal story, I'm hoping Anthem will be able to do the same but as I said time will tell.

Who knows what Ben thought when introducing CG to the game. Again I don't know whether to blame him for it or if this was an EA thing to try and make customers have to pay to get access to endgame content and having to said content more because of RNG, one of the reasons I avoid the multiplayer from ME and DA is because despite them being really fun to play the progression is tied behind loot crates which may or may not give you the weapon/character you want/need, and again you can pay for credits to buy said loot crates and I thought they thought "hey this would be a good idea to implement in SWTOR" at EA HQ or something, but I'm getting into my own conspiracy theories so I'll stop now. So regardless of wheter Irving was just being a bad salesman and it wasn't his decision or if he genuinely thought it was a good idea it cost SWTOR a lot of players and alienated a bunch of them, as much as KOTET was my favorite expansion lore-wise bring my favorite story content since launch I'm not going to sugarcoat the massive player exodus following Galactic Command.

There's always that chance, but I agree with your point of "let's wait and see" I myself don't think I'll be playing at launch since I doubt I'll have the hardware for it and it'll be a while before I can upgrade my PC for it so by the time I get to try it out for myself the game will most likely be out already unless it's delayed so much it becomes the new half-life 3. Who knows, it's a possibility but I don't find it probable, unless a minor surge in subs happen, Keith stated he needs reason to increase the budget and again I'm not a game dev but I think a higher subscription base would count towards said reason, I think what we have is what we're going to get until the license expires or EA declares maintenance mode but I could be wrong and I hope I am.

Jokes and my own rants aside it was a good conversation, thanks for being civil about it it is a rare sight these days.

Of course it doesn't. If people think that SWTOR is bringing in enough cash to help pay for another IP, I think they're being delusional.

 

Anthem has it's own budget I'm pretty sure and unless the people from BW Austin who are working on Anthem (a bunch of them do) are still paid from the SWTOR budget, there is no link between SWTOR revenue and the Anthem budget.

 

I will say that Anthem looks good combat wise but the one thing that really matters to me is story and how you can engage with characters in the world and feel connected. And that's the one topic they barely say anything about, except we know we won't have companions, no romance, not the convo wheel to make choices and in the Story parts in your town you are in first person so you can't even see your character.

 

So how I'm supposed to be connected to my character, the world and the people in the world is a mystery.

 

In that sense I really wish they hadn't ruined SWTOR for me with 5.0 because, well, I wish I could still enjoy SWTOR.

We are actually talking about EA here so this is pretty possible. If former swtor's crew members like Ben Irving were transferred to Anthem where is a guarantee that they also dont transfer resources to anthem? We dont have any evidence but knowing ea, watching people who worked in swtor in the past now working anthem, watching how much they renew cartel market every week yet ignoring other aspects of the game makes me feel like they just getting last possible cash in order to use it for other projects

We are actually talking about EA here so this is pretty possible. If former swtor's crew members like Ben Irving were transferred to Anthem where is a guarantee that they also dont transfer resources to anthem? We dont have any evidence but knowing ea, watching people who worked in swtor in the past now working anthem, watching how much they renew cartel market every week yet ignoring other aspects of the game makes me feel like they just getting last possible cash in order to use it for other projects

+1 to this. you should be a detective because you just positively identified the killer.

As a side note the lead producer on Anthem is Ben Irving. I think you might've heard that name before.

Mr. MalaVEE Quinn himself. <.< (yes I hold a grudge)

Anthem doesn't do it for me, I can honestly say I'm not interested. I would've preferred more money get put into this game.

Don't get me wrong but by looks of this game it really has nothing special. Its a reskin of other similar games with nothing interesting for the player other than the story. It takes years to release and in the meantime other similar games are out, so why bother? Why swap?

Sadly this games brings too little too late and I don't see it go well. I just hope swtor will survive this games downfall.

Not wanting to start an heated argument here but isn't that what they say about SWTOR? How it's just WOW with a Star Wars skin? With good story but a Wow clone? I say let's wait and see if it's completely unoriginal or if at least tried something new in it's medium (SWTOR for all it's faults does have some amazing story, especially for an MMORPG), it could be just another boring grindy RNG shooter of course or it could have a fun gameplay.