Please upgrade your browser for the best possible experience.

Chrome Firefox Internet Explorer
×

Possible lightning/tk dps buffs coming around 5.9, 6.0

STAR WARS: The Old Republic > English > Classes > Sage / Sorcerer
Possible lightning/tk dps buffs coming around 5.9, 6.0

Equeliber's Avatar


Equeliber
05.18.2018 , 05:19 PM | #11
Comparing Thundering Blast to Heatseeker Missiles is a bit hard. On one hand, they both have a travel time, both are the hardest hitters of the spec. But first one is an autocrit, 2nd isn't.

If you look at the parses, you can see that average hit is higher for TB, average crit is higher for HM and highest hit is basically the same.

And the biggest hits for both of them come on the same timer - 1min cd for set bonus on merc and almost 1 min cd on Recklessness for Sorc.

If we put it simply - IF you crit with heatseeker, you do much more burst than sorc. But if you don't crit with it, Lightning will deliver more burst.

So overall, I'd say it is like this: Sorc is more consistent with it's burst but merc can be scarier depending on RNG.

And to everyone who keeps asking for lightning buffs - Lightning already is the best ranged Burst spec. If you buff it more for some reason, you need to buff Marksman and Arsenal as well, otherwise it would be unfair and just plain dumb.
Ael Veela, Sith Marauder Klorea, Sith Sorcerer Cinthie, Sith Assassin Lora Leigh, Sniper Darth Malgus

Gyronamics's Avatar


Gyronamics
05.18.2018 , 08:27 PM | #12
We need to go deeper.

The example has 10 HSM crits and 5 of those were the set bonus so RNG crits alone are 2k less than all crits (24k vs 26k average). The set bonus inflates the crit numbers.

The other unmentioned part is that Thundering Blast is not just "Thundering Blast" as read off a parser sheet, that's something of a lie.

Thundering Blast has 25% chance to do 25% bonus damage in a cloned damage hit (which also autocrits) called "Thundering Blast (Forked Darkness)" and that is not included in "Thundering Blast" numbers.

We've just seen in the examples that the maximum single hit from both is only 2k apart but Thundering Blast can on top of this chip in 25% extra from its clone proc.

It didn't actually proc on any of the biggest Thundering Blast hits in the examples but it could have.

I would say when taking into account the Forked Darkness proc that the minimum, average and maximum hit goes to... Thundering Blast over Heatseeker Missiles.

The example that could have, but didn't happen would be the best Thundering Blast hit of 27k if it had a Forked Darkness proc which would make that Thundering Blast worth 33k. The best set bonus autocrit from Heatseeker Missiles was 29k.

Boy that's awkward. Guess that means the myth is stone dead in every possible way?

Maybe the examples are not representative. The overall parses do seem fairly tryhard though, pushing close to 10k in sub par specs.

Found an example of it happening in the second parse on 2.5m for Lightning:

Code:
13:32:24.387 	@Valkae 	Operations Training Dummy 	Thundering Blast 	ApplyEffect : Damage (26349* internal ) <26349>
13:32:24.783 	@Valkae 	Operations Training Dummy 	Thundering Blast (Forked Darkness) 	ApplyEffect : Damage (6585* internal ) <6585>
Casual 32934 in full accuracy PVE gear with one Thundering Blast.
Hotwired

Niman, Tomb of Freedon Nadd, The Red Eclipse, Darth Malgus

2011 - The Immortals, The Lumberjacks, Nano, Not Good Enough, Disciples of Babylon, Salt Miners - 2018

meddani's Avatar


meddani
05.20.2018 , 01:19 PM | #13
Quote: Originally Posted by Gyronamics View Post
Snip
26k thundering blast? i can see that happen with adrenal + unlimited power + double relic procc ...can you link that parse `?

Gyronamics's Avatar


Gyronamics
05.20.2018 , 02:49 PM | #14
Well 3-4 posts have been deleted out of this thread so you can't see the information, calculations or numbers being talked about.

So I'll sum it up here and if needed I'll do some numbers again:

Thundering Blast hits harder than Heatseeker Missiles according to minimum, average and maximum damage.

*and saying otherwise as reason to buff Thundering Blast is extremely misguided.

However this is the site: http://parsely.io/parser/leaderboard

And either you choose Live or the previous patch and it's really hard to find a Lightning parse that doesn't have a 26/27k Thundering Blast in it.

That particular one was second on the 2.5m dummy on Live because the first didn't have any Forked Darkness procs on the big hits (which increase the damage of the Thundering Blast by 25%) and I needed an example to demonstrate.

You can even find 28k from last patch if you want: http://parsely.io/parser/view/359487/0. Depends how people have split their alacrity and crit plus damage variance.
Hotwired

Niman, Tomb of Freedon Nadd, The Red Eclipse, Darth Malgus

2011 - The Immortals, The Lumberjacks, Nano, Not Good Enough, Disciples of Babylon, Salt Miners - 2018

Romeugues's Avatar


Romeugues
05.21.2018 , 03:57 PM | #15
Well Arsenal was stupidly nerfed into the ground DPS wise (instead of DCDs.. bla bla bla) so comparing the biggest hitters between the two is a bit moot, neither of them burst that great. Also burst potential isn't just your biggest hitter, there's your "burst rotation" where you can do X damage in a certain amount of seconds (or gcds) by lining up your biggest hitters(i.e popping Recklessness, casting TB,LF and CL), like in PvP bursting down a player, simply hitting them for 25-30K isn't going to kill them, obviously, I think that's a better way of measuring how much burst potential a class has.

vXCozmoz's Avatar


vXCozmoz
05.22.2018 , 01:43 AM | #16
Quote: Originally Posted by Romeugues View Post
Well Arsenal was stupidly nerfed into the ground DPS wise (instead of DCDs.. bla bla bla) so comparing the biggest hitters between the two is a bit moot, neither of them burst that great. Also burst potential isn't just your biggest hitter, there's your "burst rotation" where you can do X damage in a certain amount of seconds (or gcds) by lining up your biggest hitters(i.e popping Recklessness, casting TB,LF and CL), like in PvP bursting down a player, simply hitting them for 25-30K isn't going to kill them, obviously, I think that's a better way of measuring how much burst potential a class has.
Agreed and well said. I made this thread mostly for the possible buffs to the class. For good or worse is up for debate of course. Seen this has more turned into checking the difference between 1 single skill vs the other, which was not my intention or main thought.

I also said the same thing in a different way in my other posts, some were removed for some reason, incl a few from that guy "Gyronamics". Like the X damage you can do with the class in a short time period was not that bad and so on. Coming from a returning player.

The general mindset of people is like this: Some only focus a class based on a target dummy (parsely) in pve, or where you can stand in 1 spot and mash buttons and move a few feet when some aoe or boss mechanic occur. Some only on pvp and usually it's only for ranked, and some for both. We all know in pvp there is no "real" rotation since so much can and will happen to you and your enemies. Sure you can have a standard one that you try pull off when ever possible.

After playing my beloved caster and tested things back & forth I can say from my POV that for PvE and PvP (regs) is more then viable and fun, which is the single most important thing when playing an mmo imho. I for one never got the idea playing X class/spec just because it happens to be OP right now. I will admit that for ranked the class struggles, in dps specs. I believe that's one reason we got that flat 10% DR buff (up form 5%) and they even stated "as our first step we do this".

I did not stop playing the game because sorcs/sages are not the best class for ranked in some current meta or when they were very strong. I had my other reasons . What I said here was not mean to offend anyone, but to speak my mind.

WayOfTheWarriorx's Avatar


WayOfTheWarriorx
05.22.2018 , 02:40 AM | #17
Quote: Originally Posted by vXCozmoz View Post
Agreed and well said. I made this thread mostly for the possible buffs to the class. For good or worse is up for debate of course. Seen this has more turned into checking the difference between 1 single skill vs the other, which was not my intention or main thought.

I also said the same thing in a different way in my other posts, some were removed for some reason, incl a few from that guy "Gyronamics". Like the X damage you can do with the class in a short time period was not that bad and so on. Coming from a returning player.

The general mindset of people is like this: Some only focus a class based on a target dummy (parsely) in pve, or where you can stand in 1 spot and mash buttons and move a few feet when some aoe or boss mechanic occur. Some only on pvp and usually it's only for ranked, and some for both. We all know in pvp there is no "real" rotation since so much can and will happen to you and your enemies. Sure you can have a standard one that you try pull off when ever possible.

After playing my beloved caster and tested things back & forth I can say from my POV that for PvE and PvP (regs) is more then viable and fun, which is the single most important thing when playing an mmo imho. I for one never got the idea playing X class/spec just because it happens to be OP right now. I will admit that for ranked the class struggles, in dps specs. I believe that's one reason we got that flat 10% DR buff (up form 5%) and they even stated "as our first step we do this".

I did not stop playing the game because sorcs/sages are not the best class for ranked in some current meta or when they were very strong. I had my other reasons . What I said here was not mean to offend anyone, but to speak my mind.
Absolutely, positively outstandingly said. Well done x 5

Gyronamics's Avatar


Gyronamics
05.22.2018 , 12:02 PM | #18
Quote: Originally Posted by Romeugues View Post
Well Arsenal was stupidly nerfed into the ground DPS wise (instead of DCDs.. bla bla bla) so comparing the biggest hitters between the two is a bit moot, neither of them burst that great. Also burst potential isn't just your biggest hitter, there's your "burst rotation" where you can do X damage in a certain amount of seconds (or gcds) by lining up your biggest hitters(i.e popping Recklessness, casting TB,LF and CL), like in PvP bursting down a player, simply hitting them for 25-30K isn't going to kill them, obviously, I think that's a better way of measuring how much burst potential a class has.
Yes, it was said but posts were deleted.

Merc Arsenal can for example stick together 4 abilities to hit in a GCD if they want: Explosive Dart, Tracer Missile (normal cast), Heatseeker Missiles, Rail Shot.

The days are long gone when you could go into a WZ with such low health and face such high hits that you could get comboed out by one player.

But that didn't stop complaints so everyones maximum hits got poisoned along with generic damage reduction, some more than others
Hotwired

Niman, Tomb of Freedon Nadd, The Red Eclipse, Darth Malgus

2011 - The Immortals, The Lumberjacks, Nano, Not Good Enough, Disciples of Babylon, Salt Miners - 2018