I know a lot of people run SM ops for comms, and a lot run them to gear up their toons. My jugg is still gearing up, and tonight we had a KP SM run.

Long story short, some guy in mostly campaign and rak rolled need on a columni mainhand weapon for SW when he was playing a healing sorc. Now, I can see needing on crap in FP , esp tionese garbage, to gear up your companions. But when you're clearly that geared already and just running for comms, is it really just allowed to screw someone like that?

When called out on it, he immediately drops group, won't trade, and whispers me some lame garbage about how he owes me one, as if I'd ever run an OP with that kind of person again. I won't post his name in the forums since the devs seem to dislike that, but I do have a couple of questions:

1) Is it inappropriate to repeatedly call the guy out in gen-chat and to let his guidies know what he did?

2) Assuming you think so, why is it permissible to gimp my progress in such a fashion? Please leave out any garbage about companions, since I cannot possibly think of any reason (or quest) that requires you to have a companion with columni mods. When I soloed the two H2 in the HK-51 quest my companion wasn't even in tionese.

"When called out on it, he immediately drops group, won't trade, and whispers me some lame garbage about how he owes me one."

Yeah, what he owes you is the mainhand. He probably stole that (stole is the right term I believe) for an alt or a companion (I'm guessing it was for Khem Val or maybe he has a Warrior/Knight alt). Either way, that was a jerk move on his part. I'd contact his guild leader and let them know before calling him out in general chat. Pressure from his buddies should do the trick.

Talking to his guild leader is a good first step. If they are all ******es, call them out in gen chat or the server threads (esp if they do their recruiting there). Screenshots are also good.

Just to clarify, I assume this is a pug/gf run, and that you are at full Tionese+. If you are undergeared (ie. greens implants/earpiece, or in recruit) or haven't read the fight guides, you are being carried and will receive less respect for loot. As an example, we had an idiot jugg show up to a SM GF op in greens and blues. No one really cared when his class loot was ninja'd. (I hope this wasn't you)

Rule of thumb. Wait for all players to greed, if all before you have done so - THEN ask if it's okay, if you want the purple crystal... or for a comp, if ANY of the group says no... greed like everyone else and move on.

Heck, I feel bad when I run greeds for gear I can't use - to the point I'll offer it away to groupies, if someone wants it... they get it.

Simple solutions :-

- Add ignore (100% never going to group with them via random again)

- Master looter.

All Bioware has to do is change how need/greed works.

If you have the right class that uses the item you are allowed to roll need, if not only the option greed/pass should be available.

But this has been discussed in hundreds of threads, I am sure Bioware has a plan in the works regarding players taking items they either can´t use themselves at all or sell for cash/gear up companions.

All Bioware has to do is change how need/greed works.

 

If you have the right class that uses the item you are allowed to roll need, if not only the option greed/pass should be available.

 

But this has been discussed in hundreds of threads, I am sure Bioware has a plan in the works regarding players taking items they either can´t use themselves at all or sell for cash/gear up companions.

Wouldn't stop the QQ'ing as the person with the right to roll Need would do so just for his companion or alt...

General Rule is Need if it's an upgrade for YOU, and roll Greed for companion or an alt.... I usually pass if I can't use it one way or another to let other people who want them for their companions to get it...

Wouldn't stop the QQ'ing as the person with the right to roll Need would do so just for his companion or alt...

This would only in that case apply to 2 advanced classes out of 16. A very acceptable situation until a more thorough solution can be made. I still stand by that changing the option to only be able to need if it something your character can use is the best solution. Greed can easily be used for every other item, and in special cases a simpel communication regarding the item can be the solution if someone wants it for a companion,

General Rule is Need if it's an upgrade for YOU, and roll Greed for companion or an alt.... I usually pass if I can't use it one way or another to let other people who want them for their companions to get it...

Yes, you and me understand that but I would say that the majority of the playerbase does not. Many other successful MMOs out there has implemented loot restriction to huge success without any complaints. It is time ToR does so aswell.

Only this evening I have seen: Scoundrel needing and taking aim items. A warrior that thought a epic willpowerbarrel was more suitable for his lightsaber, and finally a trooper that thought that strength helmet would look awesome on him. Everything taken by need option when other characters in the team could have used it with great benefit.

The ninjas all ended up on ignore ofcourse.

So basicly, we can all pretend that there is some kind of "general rule" out there but fact is that there is not. What Bioware needs to do is change this anarchy lootsystem into something innovative and creative, I am 100% certain it will make more happy players in the long run.

Simple solutions :-

- Master looter.

Rule number one is never use master looter in a PuG run.

Ever.

i dont see a problem abouth to reach my 6th lvl 50 toon when i join op grup i say im after such class loot so will need on it the way i see it i can bring my way over geared toon and just run ops without any problems or come with my low geared toon and contribute less to the op then i can with better geared toon but i ask before we start op if others are ok with it if not i drop before we start

And this is why being able to rip and pass bound mods in legacy gear is bad game design, as is being able to need on items that your current class cannot use.

Allowing people to run anything end-game content on character A, roll need on everything, then pass to their alts inevitably leads to more ninja looting, not to mention gearing alts too fast without ever doing any of the content on them.

Please note I'm not calling the quoted poster out on this for doing anything wrong as asking is always the best practice and this is how the game works today.

I just disagree with this model and would like to see Bioware figure out how to keep bound mods bound along with restricting need rolls to the player class which matches the loot such that most of this is no longer possible.

But when you're clearly that geared already and just running for comms, is it really just allowed to screw someone like that?

...

When called out on it, he immediately drops group, won't trade, and whispers me some lame garbage about how he owes me one, as if I'd ever run an OP with that kind of person again.

That guy is a total ******e.

Inform his guildmates, put him on ignor

And this is why being able to rip and pass bound mods in legacy gear is bad game design, as is being able to need on items that your current class cannot use.

 

Allowing people to run anything end-game content on character A, roll need on everything, then pass to their alts inevitably leads to more ninja looting, not to mention gearing alts too fast without ever doing any of the content on them.

 

Please note I'm not calling the quoted poster out on this for doing anything wrong as asking is always the best practice and this is how the game works today.

 

I just disagree with this model and would like to see Bioware figure out how to keep bound mods bound along with restricting need rolls to the player class which matches the loot such that most of this is no longer possible.

I like BoL because it allowed be to run a 49 WZ in half WH gear, made at least 4 people ragequit. But yeah, another example of how its broken.

I like BoL because it allowed be to run a 49 WZ in half WH gear, made at least 4 people ragequit. But yeah, another example of how its broken.

Why would that bother anyone?

I was wondering what is acceptable if I'm after gear for my offspec. I'm playing a juggernaut and just recently decided to do some tanking (so I don't have to wait ages for queues to pop) and since I only have DPS gear right now I would very much like to need on the warrior columi pieces, but since everyone can see that my current gear is above Columi this would probably seem like a dick move. I should just probably ask, but I'm already making a bad impression because I have no headset and didn't know the operation or something.

And I was wondering, what is the etiquette for needing on non-gear? I'm talking about speeder and crafting mats and the likes. I always pick greed if it's something I can use or want, but yesterday some guy in tionese kept on needing on the nice speeder and some crafting mats. Nobody else in the group said something about that, so I'm not sure. Though I put him on ignore after that. Maybe no one looked who picked what? Since there are a lot of people greeding and the chat window gets long and everything and almost no one there really needed the gear that dropped.

I was wondering what is acceptable if I'm after gear for my offspec. I'm playing a juggernaut and just recently decided to do some tanking (so I don't have to wait ages for queues to pop) and since I only have DPS gear right now I would very much like to need on the warrior columi pieces, but since everyone can see that my current gear is above Columi this would probably seem like a dick move. I should just probably ask, but I'm already making a bad impression because I have no headset and didn't know the operation or something.

 

And I was wondering, what is the etiquette for needing on non-gear? I'm talking about speeder and crafting mats and the likes. I always pick greed if it's something I can use or want, but yesterday some guy in tionese kept on needing on the nice speeder and some crafting mats. Nobody else in the group said something about that, so I'm not sure. Though I put him on ignore after that. Maybe no one looked who picked what? Since there are a lot of people greeding and the chat window gets long and everything and almost no one there really needed the gear that dropped.

As long as no one else needs it for their current toon, you have priority over someone who desires it for a companion or another unavailable toon.

Before I say to much needing for alts is wrong, but honestly who the f at this point needs on columi for alts. Rakata is ridiculously easy to get and most groups you get into for hm kp and ev or nim kp or ev just greed on everything cause they are doing comms runs and don't care about loot. So if you let them know in advance usually they let you need for alts cause the are super overgeared.

The funniest thing here is that he.needed columi for an alt.

i dont see a problem abouth to reach my 6th lvl 50 toon when i join op grup i say im after such class loot so will need on it the way i see it i can bring my way over geared toon and just run ops without any problems or come with my low geared toon and contribute less to the op then i can with better geared toon but i ask before we start op if others are ok with it if not i drop before we start

And this is why being able to rip and pass bound mods in legacy gear is bad game design, as is being able to need on items that your current class cannot use.

First Brutal is fine with the way he did it, he asked the group before the start.

Second Legacy is how you get geared healers and tanks to run SM Ops and HM FPs. Personally I wouldn't set foot in either outside of guild runs if not for the comms to gear alts. The comms do nothing for my main (a healer) since she is beyond BIS campaign/Black Hole level. Sure I could buy dread guard implants and ear, but I don't think the cost equals the benefit considering the difficulty of content. I run HM FPS, occasionally SM Ops in group finder (when people are spamming they need a healer) or guild run HM/NIM KP & EV. SM EC & TfB and HM EC for no other reason than black hole comms to buy gear to legacy to my other toons. I have two alts full 61 and above, Imp healer has never done a Ops (sister imp guild is far behind rep guild) and I have a Watchman that has only been in HM EV first two bosses twice and SM TfB last two bosses once. Also have a shadow that is full 61, but she got there on her own. I would love to do more on them on non-progressive group nights, but I usually get stuck on my healer as that is what the guild needs to get a run going. BioWare takes away legacy gear, it would be two less healers doing HMFP and one less healer entering GF when a healer is needed to get a group going for SM Ops. I would still do the guild runs though.

OP: yeah person was a jerk if he/she did not ask first. Personally it is so easy to gear a alt I pass on everything. I can easy gear a alt with campaign armoring, black hole mods and enhancements. Even barrels and hilts I just get 27 crafted or buy them on the GTN.

Rule number one is never use master looter in a PuG run.

 

Ever.

Why saves people from headaches like these.

I pass on all the gear in these places because i have so little room in my bags all the time i cant stand having to wait 2 hours to trade that cr*p in. But, if i join a SM ops run thru GF ill turn it on master looter 90%. Most of the time your group is like 3/4 geared and there is like 1 or 2 ppl running around with like 13khp. So switch it to masterlooter and make sure one of the more geared players doesn't ninja.

I witnessed first hand a couple of weeks ago 3 guild members in full DG gear take every single piece of loot from one of these runs. Meanwhile there is a poor Sorc (which damn near ever piece was inquisitor) with 14.3 hp got nothing. That's not cool in my book.

Also to the OP it was obviously needed for his companion because your not able to send hilts via legacy(yet). Which is even more BS cause honestly wth do you even use companions for besides crafting or going to sell crap in your bags.

i dont see a problem abouth to reach my 6th lvl 50 toon when i join op grup i say im after such class loot so will need on it the way i see it i can bring my way over geared toon and just run ops without any problems or come with my low geared toon and contribute less to the op then i can with better geared toon but i ask before we start op if others are ok with it if not i drop before we start

Except this was for a lightsaber, and there is no current way to even legacy transfer one of those.

Except this was for a lightsaber, and there is no current way to even legacy transfer one of those.

That does make a HUGE difference.

I was wondering what is acceptable if I'm after gear for my offspec. I'm playing a juggernaut and just recently decided to do some tanking (so I don't have to wait ages for queues to pop) and since I only have DPS gear right now I would very much like to need on the warrior columi pieces, but since everyone can see that my current gear is above Columi this would probably seem like a dick move. I should just probably ask, but I'm already making a bad impression because I have no headset and didn't know the operation or something.

Just ask before hand: "Can I need for tank-spec? I'll trade to any that need for main spec". Obviously the way I phrased that, if there is a lesser-geared DPS or tank warrior in the group, they will also be rolling need, and I'd expect you to trade your drops to them if you win them.

Or get yourself a tionese/columi shield for your offhand, and just go as a tank.

And I was wondering, what is the etiquette for needing on non-gear? I'm talking about speeder and crafting mats and the likes. I always pick greed if it's something I can use or want, but yesterday some guy in tionese kept on needing on the nice speeder and some crafting mats. Nobody else in the group said something about that, so I'm not sure. Though I put him on ignore after that. Maybe no one looked who picked what? Since there are a lot of people greeding and the chat window gets long and everything and almost no one there really needed the gear that dropped.

I say if you want a speeder to use, roll need. The exception is the Tirsa Elite, which vendors for 150k, so everybody rolls need on that all the time. For mats it depends on the group, so ask beforehand. Also, the only mats most people care about these days are molecular stabilizers, so if it wasn't that, I doubt anyone else would have noticed or cared. Most groups running ops for these use master looter and distribute after. In our runs, all mats are greed rolls, and this is announced at the start. If a PuG rolls need on mats, they are instantly booted from the group, no questions, no discussion.

I'll say this -- if the guy had asked , I'd have said "Hey, I really need that because I want to move up into better gear". If it had been ANY of the pieces I could buy with Col tokens I probably , honestly would have let it go. I can just get it from tokens which have zero other uses anyway.

But the mainhand is kind of important. Some guy said "just buy a 27 hilt", sorry,not everyone wants to blow that kind of cash or mats. At this point I'm saving for augments for my BH and WZ gear, augment kits, mods for the garbage that ends up in the stock gear, not to mention repair costs from people who can't listen to instructions.

I'll just keep grinding, but if I see anyone from this guy's guild, I'm dropping. If I see the guy, I'm dropping. That's one less tank for your FP and OP's due to this guy.

Why would that bother anyone?

Because if you are a level 50 in a 49 warzone with legacy'd WH mods, you will basically be walking around 2-shotting people (on top of having 17k hp). Unfortunately you can only do this once per character.