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Why do modern MMO's complicate gearing at endgame?

STAR WARS: The Old Republic > English > General Discussion
Why do modern MMO's complicate gearing at endgame?

Ferrety's Avatar


Ferrety
09.23.2019 , 02:35 AM | #1
The original commendation system was perfectly fine and worked great. If you weren't lucky to get loot in Flashpoints or Operations you at least were working towards a goal (not a random crate but an actual targeted reward). This was the same for PVP, it worked fine.

Developers these days seem to be under constant pressure to innovate and tinker with game systems regardless of how well they may or may not work.

If it ain't broke, don't fix it. World of Warcraft has the same damn problem...

I'm trying real hard to get my friends (who use to play back from 1.0-2.0 era) back into the game but explaining how the loot system works (and is going to work in 6.0) makes that very difficult!

<3

Thanks, just wanted to rant.
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Arutar's Avatar


Arutar
09.23.2019 , 04:25 AM | #2
I don't want to burst your bubble, but old school mmorgs were much more restrictive.

"Old school" gearing usually meant no commendations but fixed drop list by boss, so you needed to grind specific content over and over until you got "your" drop. There were also no things like "bolster", i.e. you needed gear grind for all content.

Only afterwards was gearing further and further trivialized. Now the pendulum swings back, which I personally don't mind.

Ferrety's Avatar


Ferrety
09.23.2019 , 05:06 AM | #3
Well to be fair I never mentioned 'old school mmo gearing', more specifically I was talking about the original loot system in this game.

I wholeheartedly prefer the classic drop system combined with a commendation/token system to what exists now though.
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Pirana's Avatar


Pirana
09.23.2019 , 05:16 AM | #4
For this game it's simple, lack of developers. It's easier to create a gearing system that extends that stick with the carrot on it then to create new content. Except their devolving of the gearing systems over the years has all but killed the game off, among other things. The Ossus Weekly is a perfect example of how bad RNG actually is. When you run that Weekly and well over fifty percent of the time, you're looting relics and implants, something's wrong.

Regarding other games, no idea. Too much caffeine?

The Journey Is Often Greater Than The Destination

HekaHeh's Avatar


HekaHeh
09.23.2019 , 05:41 AM | #5
Modern RNG lootbox gambling schemes are made up to maximise playtime (aka "games as a service") and trigger addictive collection behaviour (aka "thrill of the hunt") to milk the most money out of your playerbase with minimal effort in development.

1) Grind the loot into fine dust
2) Throw the dust into players face
3) Whatever randomly sticks may be of use, if not enough - rinse and repeat
4) ???
5) Profit

PS: I like the idea of horizontal gearing, I like the sets on PTS (even though most of the tweaking does not matter much) - I absolutely despise the horrendous RNG that's solely there to artificially lengthen the time required to gear up.

kirorx's Avatar


kirorx
09.23.2019 , 06:12 AM | #6
Speaking of the original loot system, remember the battle-master bags? That and all level pvp

TonyTricicolo's Avatar


TonyTricicolo
09.23.2019 , 06:54 AM | #7
Quote: Originally Posted by HekaHeh View Post
Modern RNG lootbox gambling schemes are made up to maximise playtime (aka "games as a service") and trigger addictive collection behaviour (aka "thrill of the hunt") to milk the most money out of your playerbase with minimal effort in development.

1) Grind the loot into fine dust
2) Throw the dust into players face
3) Whatever randomly sticks may be of use, if not enough - rinse and repeat
4) ???
5) Profit

PS: I like the idea of horizontal gearing, I like the sets on PTS (even though most of the tweaking does not matter much) - I absolutely despise the horrendous RNG that's solely there to artificially lengthen the time required to gear up.
Yep, plus devs know that players consume content at such a fast rate that it's hard to keep up. What takes months to create ends up only taking a few hours to complete. We're ravenous and they know it, so they throttle us with gear grind, decreased xp rate, and RNG. Players look at games and see enjoyment. Companies look at games and see only profit. It's nothing personal, it's business!
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Lhancelot's Avatar


Lhancelot
09.23.2019 , 07:34 AM | #8
Quote: Originally Posted by Ferrety View Post
If it ain't broke, don't fix it.
I have written this mantra for years now regarding SWTOR and the dev work they choose to do. They put out paltry content, and then spend their resources (both time and money) re-creating stuff that doesn't need to be remade.

  • Gearing systems that players never complained about? Gutted and changed into RNG loot box fiesta that created a mass exodus of the game.

  • Conquest system that hardly needed any changes? Gutted and changed to punish alts pushing tons of conquest players/guilds off the game.

  • Crafting system players never complained about? 6.0 changing crafting to make it punish solo crafting players and posed to reward large zerg guilds with mats they can farm easily.


Basically every change that would be met with disapproval and resentment has been added and updated to the game, making it less enjoyable and as a result less populated. These are just the facts.

The sabotage of this game seems so ridiculously structured you'd think it was purposefully done. Either they are trying to kill the game with awful game design choices, or they are 100% clueless and this is the result of a mismanagement nightmare.

What other explanations are there for the choices this studio has made over the years? Love to hear some white knights explain how any of these changes have made the game better.
TRUE
Quote: Originally Posted by DarthSpuds View Post
RNG is counterproductive because it massively increases player dissatisfaction.
FALSE
Quote: Originally Posted by olagatonjedi View Post
As I detailed in another thread, RNG give the players more control over their gearing.

JediQuaker's Avatar


JediQuaker
09.23.2019 , 08:25 AM | #9
For [various redacted words] sake! Yet another thread about gearing. Give it a rest, already! 🤬
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Lhancelot's Avatar


Lhancelot
09.23.2019 , 10:04 AM | #10
Quote: Originally Posted by JediQuaker View Post
For [various redacted words] sake! Yet another thread about gearing. Give it a rest, already! 🤬
Just to help you out a bit, forums are where people communicate to other players as well as the studio about whatever topics they feel like discussing or commenting on.

This is how the studio is reminded that their present game design is awful and it's not just a couple naysayers saying it.

If you find this frustrating, maybe consider this before you get worked up and emotional. I know other people's opinions can be frustrating to read, but it's part of the process of gaming forums.

I'd like to hear what your reasoning is to the OP's question, why do you think BW keeps complicating gearing when all that does is make it worse? How many more subs you think we can afford to lose with another disastrous update?
TRUE
Quote: Originally Posted by DarthSpuds View Post
RNG is counterproductive because it massively increases player dissatisfaction.
FALSE
Quote: Originally Posted by olagatonjedi View Post
As I detailed in another thread, RNG give the players more control over their gearing.