I know sorc heal is not unplayable but it´s no secret that the sorc tacticals and the new ability are not good.

Mercs got a good one for mobility and the best for group heal. Same with operatives.

The "One for all" is not good enough (it should always heal 20% more) and the other ones are not worth taking.

So please devs: give us better tacticals.

Please, I´m tired of being made fun of.

(And I don´t want to play a tech class in Star Wars - the game with the FORCE.)

at the low levels or when doing flashpoints, I've noticed my heals barely do anything as lightning sorc. Not including how fast it eats up my force bar when trying to spot heal or myself.

110k life in these vet flashpoints and my heals are barely doing 10%

at the low levels or when doing flashpoints, I've noticed my heals barely do anything as lightning sorc. Not including how fast it eats up my force bar when trying to spot heal or myself.

 

110k life in these vet flashpoints and my heals are barely doing 10%

I mean, that's perfectly reasonable and has always worked like this - Dark Heal is a very small heal, even in 5.10 I would have to spam it pretty hard to get even 50% of HP restored. And it burns through the Force HARD. If you want to offheal as a sorc DPS, you bubble the player, drop Resurgence on him and then carry on with your DPS, it's not worth spam-healing with Dark Heal at all. You are better off pushing out more DPS if it's a tight fight. At best, you just use the 2 I mentioned on cooldown if you want to help out for some reason.

Personally, I think I have pretty much never used Dark Heal as a sorc DPS in many months. But I also rarely play veteran fps and that's probably the only place where it's even remotely useful. Like, if you are in a situation where you have already used all other defensives (for personal heals you have an amazing Unnatural Preservation, anyway), and Dark Heal is the only option, it's going to be a wipe either way.

I seriously doubt anybody is making fun of you for playing sorc heal so that's some serious hyperbole. Healer balance is the best it's been in a long time. Each of them fills their intended role almost just right. Merc is the single target/burst, operative is the aoe, and sorc is the jack of all trades/utility. Whereas in 5.x sorc was pretty much the best at all three roles.

I agree sorc could use better tacticals but it would need to be done carefully or they'd go back to 5.x levels of being leagues ahead of the other two.

Whereas in 5.x sorc was pretty much the best at all three roles.

I agree sorc could use better tacticals but it would need to be done carefully or they'd go back to 5.x levels of being leagues ahead of the other two.

Sorry but have you played nim operations and pvp in 5.9 and 6.x?

Merc is now the best healer in nim and pvp. In 5.9 merc and sorc were even in operations and pvp.

Some even say oper was the best healer in pvp.

Now the balance is complety off. Go in nim or hc and see sorcs getting outhealed and dpsed by mercs.

In 5.9 sorc was best in fast burst, merc best in single target and good aoe and oper the best aoe.

Now merc has all of that.

And yes mercs will make fun of you, because its so damn easy.

Sorry but have you played nim operations and pvp in 5.9 and 6.x?

Please don't assume that someone disagreeing with you hasn't done whatever is being discussed. It's a very poor form of conducting a debate and will immediately cause the person to take you less seriously. And no I haven't done nim. Yes I have done plenty of ranked and unranked.

Merc is now the best healer in nim and pvp. In 5.9 merc and sorc were even in operations and pvp.

Some even say oper was the best healer in pvp.

I'm not disputing that mercs are the best overall healer right now. That I quite agree on.

As one who played all three in 5.x(haven't done much with my scoundrel healing in 6.0), I disagree on mercs and sorcs being even in both operations and pvp as well as ops being being best in pvp. The sheer ease needed to play a sorc at optimal level allowed for leniency in mistakes and their burst healing being quite strong at getting someone up quickly.

Now the balance is complety off. Go in nim or hc and see sorcs getting outhealed and dpsed by mercs.

In my opinion that is how it should be. Mercs are not as easy to play as sorcs nor do they have as much group utility. Perhaps sorcs should be doing more healing though, and I think buffing the revitalized mystic set to give back more force would go towards that as it would be less GCD's spent on managing force. Definitely not healing more than mercs are though.

And mercs aren't better than sorcs in pvp because of their healing. They're better because of their defensives. In this burst meta where sins and operatives are doing 30% of someone in full tank gear's health in the blink of an eye and like 50-60% to non-tanks, the forgiving nature of merc DCD's offers them greater survivability in the current situation where you have to counterplay near perfectly to avoid being killed swiftly. Should deception/concealment burst get toned down, I think the playing field will be more even.

And yes mercs will make fun of you, because its so damn easy.

I certainly haven't had this happen to me, but experiences do differ.

1. Please don't assume that someone disagreeing with you hasn't done whatever is being discussed.

 

2. I disagree on mercs and sorcs being even in both operations and pvp as well as ops being being best in pvp.

 

3. Mercs are not as easy to play as sorcs nor do they have as much group utility.

 

4. And mercs aren't better than sorcs in pvp because of their healing. They're better because of their defensives.

 

5. I certainly haven't had this happen to me, but experiences do differ.

1. I apologize, but the sentence that sorcs were op in 5.x is just not true. I´m tired to hear that.

Example: one (really good) oper is able to heal Mono hc alone - you´ll need 3 sorcs to do that. So is operative op?

2. Let me explain: I main sorc and my friend mains merc (for a long time). In 5.x we played ops together, on some bosses he healed a bit more on others I did. In the end - we were even. Same in pvp. So yeah sorc and merc were even in ops and pvp.

3. Mercs are the easiest healer right now as they don´t have to watch heat management anymore.

Acually they have always been the easiest healer because how straightforward they are. You are giving roaming mend to much credit. Yes it´s fast but it also doesn´t heal that much and is sometimes buggy.

4. Mercs and sorcs have both great defs for pvp - but mercs heal that much more. So sorc is one tier lower.

5. Happend 3 times already - some healers even switched to merc to have an edge in Dxun.

I hope that february brings change - if not I´ll switch or quit - I´m just tired of this.

The revitalized mystic set is ok. It could refund alot more force to be "the" healer set (Gathering storm is meta). The problem is the useless tacticals. I use "luck always changes" in messy fights because the other ones are so bad.

Sorcs were too strong for their entry point and that in 5.10. Half the problem is a situation which is far rarer these days for me as an operative/scoundrel heal main but noticeable now in spades across the board. Merc/mando heal spec needs to lose that tactical or have it's main power altered into something less god mode, it actively confuses me they denied sorc/sage healers the roaming mend tactical and put something this brokenly overpowered in the game.

They can't even begin to look at class balance for healers until that happens because Bodyguard/Combat Medic has no true energy management with that tactical and can switch into their ultra burst at will. It'll probably be easier to tell where things sit afterwards. The rule of thumb is if you can double class stack in a NiM Apex boss without a drawback, for ops/scoundrels, it's burst, for sorcs/sages, it's AoE. For mercs/commando healers, their current state overpowers what was once their weakness which was sustain/healing over time.

Anything like this is always going to overshadow other healing specs. I'm not saying they shouldn't give you guys the roaming mend tactical, because they should. I'm just saying it's hard to see what they need to do when one healer class is like that.

"6.1 changes: Corruption

Sustaining Darkness now heals for roughly 12% more"

Sorry thats not enough.

Thats 1 k more in 75er content when the bubble bursts. (Less in 70er content and when the target is healed.)

Give us the roaming mend+1 tactical please.

Also you nerfed Gathering Force Set - that was a good healer set. Now please buff the mystic set bonus.

They could create a new tactical item that makes Revivification spread Resurgence on all affected targets. HoT-Spreading could be the new thing to make Sorcs viable again.

Um, firstly operative/scoundrel is your HoT class and it doesn't even have HoT spreading (nanotech is an AoE bounce HoT heal) and secondly, your class is viable- that's asking to be broken.

My opinion on what should be done with sorcerer sets and tacticals.Because now if one set gets nerfed all specs suffer. (Gathering storm is also a healer set.)

1. Sets

- Delete "Empowered Restorer" and create a new set just for the madness spec.

- Make "Gathering Storm" just for lightning.

- Buff the 6 pcs bonus of "Revitalized Mystic" - now it´s not worth it.

I don´t know if anyone uses "Endless Offensive". So leave it or change it according to you data.

2. Volt rush:

It needs to be reworked - I don´t know anyone who uses it.

3. Tacticals:

Delete "A Healing Hand", "All for One" and "Storm’s Succor". Or rework them.

I´d prefer 3 useful tacticals that actually change our gameplay. Like the ones that mercenery and operative got.

Thank you.

To me it honestly seems like they don't know what to do with the sorc healer, like we got 2 diff tacts that are just the oppiste of eachother in the healing doughnut ones (one for all and all for one) but don't know what else to give us.

To me i would love to see a tact that while yes it is for the doughnut would make it that ie spreads our resurgeance to everyone in it giving us a decent AoE but also incentivise us to use it more since i rarely if ever use it since everyone just runs away from it and it's more useful to just get more force then to slam it down.

I would love if they changed the healers tacticals (none of them is really usefull, so they can go all out... it can be hardly worse than what we have now). I mean... even in nim raids I often use just generic tactical instead of sorcerer one, as they are lacking. Now on my other classes that I play (jugg tank, veng jugg, deception sin) the tacticals are actually nice and do change the gameplay - skills suddenly have different priority, rotation can change...

Some ideas that are probably not superhard to code, but would result in tacticals that are better than current ones:

- Static barrier absorbs 25% more damage (it is after all sorcerer healer's signature skill, so there should be a tactical to make it better)

- Full cast of Innervate removes Deionized debuff on target (so we can place a Static barrier on that person immediately after)

- Dark Infusion can be cast while moving

I am sure there could be better ones (I would love to see something with Affliction resulting in better heals or force management), but even those examples above would all change the gameplay - whether the Static Barrier would have more priority with first tactical, or the ability to protect one target (usually tank) that takes lot of damage by second tactical, or completely changing priority of Dark Infusion with third tactical (as in nim raids I don't always have 1.7 sec to stand still to get off the cast). They should also be rather easy to implement, as there are already some similar tacticals.

- Static barrier absorbs 25% more damage (it is after all sorcerer healer's signature skill, so there should be a tactical to make it better)

- Dark Infusion can be cast while moving.

I think they won´t buff static barrier because dps could use it too. But the tactical could buff sustaining darkness for like 50 % though. When it explodes = more healing and it could only used by healers.

Dark infusion should be buffed by 20 %. Casting while running would be nice too but a buff is better.

We lack single target heal.

I still hope we get roaming mend + 1 or something that helps with force management.

I'm going to second this and third it. I have a Sage healer, and I have screen shots of my Sage healing the amts very close to what it does now, but back in 3.x

Now, the problem with that is simple. 2k or 3k heals (or even 11k or 20k) doesn't do much to heal a tank that's got 257k health. Do the math here, Bioware. If health has gone up X amount, the total HPS of any heal class has to have gone up on average by the same X amount, or heals are falling behind.

right now, based on health stats, heals are WAY behind.

It's not fun anymore. Scoundrel does a little better, but doesn't have the burst of Sage.

Every time you guys "balance" classes, you nerf people. How about looking at the overall and seeing if, compared to 5 years ago, some classes are simply not keeping up. Sage feels really, really weak. That makes it not worth playing. Mty main since launch is a sage heals, but I have taken to playing my dps and learning to tank instead.

It's time you looked at increases in the health pool of those we are healing (and that goes for all classes) and looking at whether or not any healers are able to keep up. Some of the hits our dps and tanks are taking are for nearly 100k. But there's not a healer in this game that can keep up with that kind of incoming damage, making us particularly ineffective.

I would love to see the numbers, and how much damage we Used to heal, compared with how much we are now, in consideration of total of the health pools and incoming damage we see now. I think you'll find you've nerfed all heal classes too far.

It's time to walk this back.

I'm going to reply to myself, and everyone else. I do not think the problem here should be addressed using gear. I believe the problem of heals not keeping up with the considerable increase in the amount of health and damage we are asked to heal, is a problem of the base stats healers have.

You've made each heal too expensive, you've made energy/force management more difficult, and on top of that, the amt per heal is not balanced with the increased amt we NEED to heal. this isn't a gear issue, gear sets do need to be considered AFTER the base heal stats and energy management issues are addressed.

Look first to the real problem, you've nerfed the classes too hard, too often, and forgotten that we have an ever-increasing burden that has not been addressed. I don't need sage heals to go back to 3.0. But we do need things changed.

Take , for instance, one thing. Take Revification/Vindicate back off the GCD, as it used to be. Now we are having to sacrifice a GCD that we need for healing, to make sure we can make the next cast. This is not the way it's always been, and it's just plain stupid. IMHO. Simple change, big lifestyle fix. Stop charging more and more for less and less.

Then update/fix the gear. You have to fix the underlying issue first. When our heals and our ability to heal is commensurate with the growth in total health pools and incoming damage, then you can do whatever you like. Until then, you are missing the entire picture. This goes for EVERY HEALER IN THE GAME. Not just Sage/sorc.

You also need to fix broken content like Walker fights and turret fights. Nobody in their right mind can heal through those. It took 2 heal spec and one tank (the dps got launched from the platform) on the Battle of Rishi last boss... because of unbalanced Damage output on Walkers.

Most importantly, I'd love it if BIOWARE would even READ these notes! I have my doubts that they do. I hope I'm wrong. But please get back to basics, to math, to logic, and look at this from a clinical, non-emotional point of view. Do the numbers make sense? I don't care who cries in Pve or Pvp... DO THE NUMBERS MAKE SENSE?

I'm going to reply to myself, and everyone else. I do not think the problem here should be addressed using gear. I believe the problem of heals not keeping up with the considerable increase in the amount of health and damage we are asked to heal, is a problem of the base stats healers have.

They nerfed healing because it was too strong in 5.x.

The tacticals were meant to keep healing at a balanced level.

BUT sorcerers got the worst tacticals so they are now the weakest class.

Operatives got good tacticals maybe a bit too strong but almost balanced.

Mercenarys are way too strong now. 2 Mercs in operations are the meta.

So yes they had to nerf healing but there is no balance now.

I think they won´t buff static barrier because dps could use it too. But the tactical could buff sustaining darkness for like 50 % though. When it explodes = more healing and it could only used by healers.

 

Dark infusion should be buffed by 20 %. Casting while running would be nice too but a buff is better.

We lack single target heal.

 

I still hope we get roaming mend + 1 or something that helps with force management.

Yeah, they would have to make sure the tactical is usable only on Corruption... but thinking about it... do you think DPS sorcs would actually use it instead of, lets say, Stormwatch? The trade-off would be rather noticeable dps decrease for a little survivability increase, and I would be fine with that. It would also delay the blinding flash from utility when static barrier expires, so even in pvp it would make this less useful... But sustaining darkness buff would be fine too. Anything that buffs our bubbles, because with each patch the bubble is less and less effective than before.

Anything for Dark Infusion, but 20% would not make me want to run that tactical. I raid almost exclusively nim opses (and often in sorc-sorc healing duo, say no to mercs!) and for me the cast while moving would be more useful. The cast time is like 1.72 seconds and there are very few times when I can be 100% sure I can get the heal out without anything happening that would force me to move (out of circles, into circles/shield, out of cone...) as interrupting the cast means I wasted a GCD. A tactical that would do both would be awesome though, I would certainly be able to use it more, but then it would probably also affect my Force management... but yeah, it would be a gameplay defining item.

For a single target heal I had in mind the second tactical, where Innervate would remove Deionized debuff - not sure how usable would that be in pvp as I do not do that (tried once in 6.0, looked at numbers and bowed out), but for places like Styrak burn phase where you need to keep your tank alive at all costs while taking extreme damage from boss, you could make sure he will have the bubble each - or almost each - hit, absorbing some of the damage and leaving less health lost, so you would not even need that much healing...

Roaming mend to 5 targets would be nice, if uninspired, as there just is nothing better anyway. I am not sure if One for All and All for One work as they should, by the way, as the numbers just do not add up when using them. I mean the concept is not bad, but they just... I will have to test them again, as it seemed they only took one target in account? Something was definitely off with them, so maybe those 2 need to be fixed rather than scraped.

For force management, something like Affliction costs no force and each tick of Affliction (I think there are 6 of them) restores 5 Force - something along the way of stealing the Force essence from the target. As game mechanic, it would make the sorcerer keep up the Affliction on target and refresh it every 18s if possible (sometimes it is not, due to mechanics that might require you to focus on heavy healing in high dtps phase like in DP council burn, or when you need to cleanse debuffs like in Cartel Warlords or again DP council with Death marks). The healers also have low accuracy, so some of the ticks could get resisted (and probably give 0 Force then). It would not replace Consuming darkness, the ticks would not give back enough, but it should be more of a buff to sustained force regeneration over time, so you might need to use Consuming Darkness less often. It would also mean that this would not be useful against adds, as they would not live long enough to net you much Force, but only against high hp targets like bosses that would survive long enough to get ideally all 6 ticks of Affliction on them.

I mean, we could probably go on and think up so many more interesting tacticals.. but that would probably take too much time to implement, so right now I would take anything - even a generic tactical that gives 5% more healing done would be better than what sorcs have now

As for healing in general - it was too strong in 5.8/5.9 and the nerf was warranted. However they should have made sure that all 3 healing classes have same healing output, which is not the case right now. Speaking in 5.x terms, if the target dps was lets say 10k and hps also 10k for single target, maybe they wanted to make it 9k hps, so the healer would not be able to indefinitely negate the dps with braindead healing. It is fine, we have tools for that (stuns, kicks, bubble...). However in 6.0 terms it means that since health and dps have doubled, we also need the heals be on par with the change. If a dps can sustain 22-23k dps rotation, we need to be able to sustain lets say 20k single target hps. If there are classes that can burst hit for 30% of health bar and their other hits also do lets say 10% of health bar damage, we cannot really heal people with Revivification that barely heals 1% of health bar per second - no tactical is going to help with it. If my strongest heal barely heal 10-15% of health bar, then I can keep up with sustained damage from one dps - but I am not able to heal bursts. If one person is focused and gets 2 big hits that bring the person down to 50%, I could not bring the person up again in a timely matter. So I stay out of PvP, in 8 man opses it is not so noticeable and sorc can keep up (but can not carry as in 5.x era) even with low aoe healing. In 16m opses however... you want mercs or ops, I mean, one or at worst two sorcs are ok for keeping bubbles on tank and focus healing, but for aoe heals the revivification is too little and roaming mend can be used only so often.

All in all, the issue I have is not that sorc is no longer viable - it is. It is not the best, but it does not matter much to me. What I do mind is that other classes either got a new ability that they can actually use (voltaic rush is not as useful as the juggernaut new buff ability, which is great for both dps and tank spec) or a tactical that really changed the way they play. Corruption sorc has none of that. We still play the same as before, only with lower numbers. There is nothing new or exciting, so I do understand that people are disappointed and switch to mercs (saw this in guild too often recently) or just completely change role and go dps or tank. I hope that the announced - but not yet revealed - changes to heal classes on PTS will help with the numbers part a bit, but I am afraid that the current lackluster tacticals and voltaic rush will not make people want to play sorcerer, when they can see other classes have more variety.

Um, firstly operative/scoundrel is your HoT class and it doesn't even have HoT spreading (nanotech is an AoE bounce HoT heal) and secondly, your class is viable- that's asking to be broken.

Spreading Resurgence through Healing Donut would not make the class broken but bring it in line with Mercs and Ops. The HPS gain would be about the same as the Merc's gain from Supercharged Burst (but even without Merc's "Who needs Energy Management" tool).

Honestly i have no idea what they are doing with the sorcs lately.

They are going to be nerfing our DPS by alot with the 6.1 change which i can only guess was because of PvP not to mention out survivabilty, so not only are we going to be the weakest healers in the game but now we are getting kneecapped on our dps as well.

This honestly sucks, i love the sorc because i love the animations on them, their sass whenever they talk to people and just about everything about them but this is well and truely becoming a joke at this point, i got 1 of each healer up and it is so obvious to anyone that plays the game that the sorc got the short end of the stick again and now they are coming to make it even shorter with 6.1.

Will i continue to play mine, honestly i have no clue i'm honestly thinking of just canceling my sub at this point the devs clearly have no idea what they are doing they brought out a new system but again didn't full test it or think things through just went with what they thought was cool and interesting but ran outta time when they made the healing sorc tacts and sets because anyone that has ever played one can tell they are not only boring but don't really help alot since everyone has just gone the gathering storm like how the mercs just go consintrated fire.

Honestly i'm starting to think they need to ether remake all the sorc tacticals to bring them up to snuff or just rework the whole class at this point since we are ALWAYS getting nerfed and abused, no one wants a sorc for anything other then PvP and even then since people have seen the 6.1 patchnotes i've noticed a few teams have ether just flat out started refusing to run them since they have to get used to not having them anymore or people are just spaming them like crazy now to try and get their points in early.

Something needs to happen before this class just gets forgotten about i love this class i honestly think it is the move visually gorgeous class i have ever played in a mmo with lightning being a key part of it but looks can only get you so far you need to beable to do your part and the fact that we are getting excluded from content already and we are getting a nerf instead of a buff really shows just how much bioware thinks of us doesn't it.

please do nothing with the sorc heal as it works just fine....

maybe give them another tactical like the roaming mend + 1

but most sorcs are just whiny primadonas, who cant slam their head against the keyboard anymore, and kill stuff with that.

the one thing which confuses me the most is, sorcs complaining of beinng outhealed by the other classes in aoe healing....

this has allways been the case so nothing new here... sorc is a single target healer and it really shines in that role...

sorcs complaining of beinng outhealed by the other classes in aoe healing....

Good sorcs don´t complain about aoe healing. We know we are bad at it Also the "One for All" is really good.

But what angers me is that we have no other useful tactical while merc got the best one in the game.

I can´t spam the healing donut because it messes up the force management.

So what tactical do I use when i can´t use the donut? Yeah, there is none.

reliquiary of time it is!

at least in lvl 75 content

Good sorcs don´t complain about aoe healing. We know we are bad at it Also the "One for All" is really good.

But what angers me is that we have no other useful tactical while merc got the best one in the game.

 

I can´t spam the healing donut because it messes up the force management.

So what tactical do I use when i can´t use the donut? Yeah, there is none.

If its no complaining about aoe heal, what is it then? you are still the best single target heal spec... so why sooooooooooooo whiny?