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Inflation


fabsus's Avatar


fabsus
08.27.2019 , 01:49 AM | #11
i think this is a horrible idea.

taking aways players stuff will cause a hugh loss in trust towards bioware
and many players would leave the game.

if you are talking with players with less money, you will see that they
are having filled collections, because they spend their credits on cosmetics.
so if we do that with credits, we also should take away 90% of all collection stuff.

and when you are talking to players with less credits, you mostly will hear that they
bought tons of cosmetics and stuff you don't need in the game. so it was their decision
to use the money in a different way, not safe it and use them for profit investments.

fighting inflation works with stuff like the quest on dantooine. 150 mill for an achievement
and a silly item, letting you glow golden. but guess! who also paid the 150mill? sure. the
people whining about credits.

what they really should do is taking away the exploit goodies.
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Batwer's Avatar


Batwer
08.27.2019 , 05:16 AM | #12
Punishing people who have credited their credits in a decent manner is unfair.

Events like Nar Shadaa Nigthlife pull many credits out of the game. More such events, but with better stuff. But higher prices.
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ChoppedSuey's Avatar


ChoppedSuey
08.27.2019 , 08:56 AM | #13
Quote: Originally Posted by Batwer View Post
Punishing people who have credited their credits in a decent manner is unfair.

Events like Nar Shadaa Nigthlife pull many credits out of the game. More such events, but with better stuff. But higher prices.
I am assuming all current players have accrued their credits in a legit way. It would be unfair only if it didn't happen to EVERYONE...and it should happen to everyone. It's also, not a punishment but I am less than surprised that people feel that it is. Nightlife pulls credits out of the game, sure. However, it's not enough to even notice a price difference on the GTN while the event is going on. If it pulled as many credits out of this game that need to come out, you would see prices drop. It's smoke and mirrors.

Sigh. If you take away 90% of players credits by dropping a decimal point, then each credit everyone owns is now worth 9 times more than it was. Nobody is losing ANYTHING except an imaginary number. I'm not saying imaginary because this is a video game. I am saying it's imaginary because the value of each inflated credit is less than the value of a credit in a game where this is implemented.

The benefits to this would be especially noticeable for the newer players. Currently, they level up and have less than a million credits and look at GTN prices and are likely overwhelmed a bit. Those credits for new players would now be worth more than they are currently and the health (population even) of the game is likely to be in a better state. Well...that's actually conjecture...but I don't think I'm too far off base.
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PiiTarr's Avatar


PiiTarr
08.27.2019 , 12:06 PM | #14
Count me among the players who would quit the game if this idea were implemented. I spent hours of playtime crafting and listing items on the GTN specifically to earn credits. It has taken me over 5 years to earn the credits I currently have and you want to simply remove 90% of them because you think it will somehow improve the game's economy? What are your projections for how long it would take before prices started to rise again... a month, two months, six months, a year? What do you think would happen to the GTN the moment this was announced? If the greed motivation you ascribe is so prevalent, isn't it possible that players would pull all their listings from the GTN and wait to re-list after the credit reduction took place, since they'd know they were about to lose 90% of their selling price? You also make the claim that this is fair because it would affect everyone, but those who engaged in heavy buying would be affected much less than the sellers, because unlike the sellers, they'd still have everything they purchased, whereas the sellers would lose 90% of their gains from those sales. How is that fair?

Void_Singer's Avatar


Void_Singer
08.27.2019 , 12:38 PM | #15
wouldn't work the way you think it would anyways.... it would immediately rebalance because of heroics and drop rate rarity. a planets worth of heroics is worth a half mil credits, and drop rates control availability of rare mats...

what would happen is that you'd see GTN slow to a crawl for a few weeks, and more direct trading (which by the way is a sign of economy failure) along with a brief reset of prices that raapidly rise back to previous levels (and the truly "rich" in game will take advantage of that to become even more entrenched)


the real problem is rewards and drop rate scaling.... they're a joke while leveling, and in demand crafts have horrible material drop rates (both too low AND too high in some cases), and are frequently content locked (VotMG is the worst for it).
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ChoppedSuey's Avatar


ChoppedSuey
08.27.2019 , 12:38 PM | #16
Quote: Originally Posted by PiiTarr View Post
Count me among the players who would quit the game if this idea were implemented. I spent hours of playtime crafting and listing items on the GTN specifically to earn credits. It has taken me over 5 years to earn the credits I currently have and you want to simply remove 90% of them because you think it will somehow improve the game's economy? What are your projections for how long it would take before prices started to rise again... a month, two months, six months, a year? What do you think would happen to the GTN the moment this was announced? If the greed motivation you ascribe is so prevalent, isn't it possible that players would pull all their listings from the GTN and wait to re-list after the credit reduction took place, since they'd know they were about to lose 90% of their selling price? You also make the claim that this is fair because it would affect everyone, but those who engaged in heavy buying would be affected much less than the sellers, because unlike the sellers, they'd still have everything they purchased, whereas the sellers would lose 90% of their gains from those sales. How is that fair?
Well, my projections of longevity are based solely upon how efficient BioWare is at quashing these things (duping/exploiting) in the first place...of which they haven't done a stellar job in the past, so not long unless changes occur.

What would happen to the GTN either nothing or everyone would pull their auctions until the change. It wouldn't matter. The items listed for 100 million credits wouldn't get bought and the auctions would expire.

I'm not too sure what you mean by the "greed motivation". I'm simply saying that exploiting and duping has inflated the value of credits. I do remember saying that I expected push back on this due to peoples' greed. TBH, I can't be arsed with going back and reading what I wrote.

As far as buyers vs. sellers...well let's say the "buyers" sold a ton of stuff they had. Maybe they earned a billion credits today. Well then when this hypothetical change would occur then they would have 100 million credits. The costs would go down on everything on the GTN. If you are a seller, it's the same scenario...even though you have 90% less credits, the cost of EACH CREDIT will rise.

I fail to see how that would hurt anyone, as I have tried to explain, the value of each single credit has been inflated. By taking away a decimal point, you are deflating the entire economy and the value of each single credit skyrockets. Things on the GTN being sold for 100 million credits, will suddenly be sold for no more than 10 million credits. Who is losing out here?

I feel like these are pretty easy concepts to grasp. Maybe I fail at explaining things...

Feel free to agree with me or not...sometimes I don't even agree with myself. However, I've yet to see any semblance a rational argument of why this would be bad.
chopped suˇey

ChoppedSuey's Avatar


ChoppedSuey
08.27.2019 , 12:50 PM | #17
Quote: Originally Posted by Void_Singer View Post
wouldn't work the way you think it would anyways.... it would immediately rebalance because of heroics and drop rate rarity. a planets worth of heroics is worth a half mil credits, and drop rates control availability of rare mats...

what would happen is that you'd see GTN slow to a crawl for a few weeks, and more direct trading (which by the way is a sign of economy failure) along with a brief reset of prices that raapidly rise back to previous levels (and the truly "rich" in game will take advantage of that to become even more entrenched)


the real problem is rewards and drop rate scaling.... they're a joke while leveling, and in demand crafts have horrible material drop rates (both too low AND too high in some cases), and are frequently content locked (VotMG is the worst for it).
I didn't see this till after my last post, so I rescind that last part about not seeing a decent rebuttal.

My argument is not against heroics or anything like that. It's not unusual for a player to make a million a day on heroics. The economy will always inflate at a certain rate in this game, but there has been some dupes and exploits in the past that I think are far more severe than a lot of players realize, which has thrown everything out of whack at a much faster pace than it should have happened.
chopped suˇey

PiiTarr's Avatar


PiiTarr
08.27.2019 , 12:56 PM | #18
Quote: Originally Posted by ChoppedSuey View Post
Well, my projections of longevity are based solely upon how efficient BioWare is at quashing these things (duping/exploiting) in the first place...of which they haven't done a stellar job in the past, so not long unless changes occur.

What would happen to the GTN either nothing or everyone would pull their auctions until the change. It wouldn't matter. The items listed for 100 million credits wouldn't get bought and the auctions would expire.

I'm not too sure what you mean by the "greed motivation". I'm simply saying that exploiting and duping has inflated the value of credits. I do remember saying that I expected push back on this due to peoples' greed. TBH, I can't be arsed with going back and reading what I wrote.

As far as buyers vs. sellers...well let's say the "buyers" sold a ton of stuff they had. Maybe they earned a billion credits today. Well then when this hypothetical change would occur then they would have 100 million credits. The costs would go down on everything on the GTN. If you are a seller, it's the same scenario...even though you have 90% less credits, the cost of EACH CREDIT will rise.

I fail to see how that would hurt anyone, as I have tried to explain, the value of each single credit has been inflated. By taking away a decimal point, you are deflating the entire economy and the value of each single credit skyrockets. Things on the GTN being sold for 100 million credits, will suddenly be sold for no more than 10 million credits. Who is losing out here?

I feel like these are pretty easy concepts to grasp. Maybe I fail at explaining things...

Feel free to agree with me or not...sometimes I don't even agree with myself. However, I've yet to see any semblance a rational argument of why this would be bad.
We just had an involuntary unlisting of all items on the GTN. As soon as it was over, things were posted again at much higher prices than before. Multiple items I'd been watching for weeks that had come down into the single digits of millions were re-listed for 10s of millions. That same thing would happen if people pulled listings.

When you cited "selfish desires" I could only assume you meant "greed." Was there some other motivation to which you were referring?

So my 1 billion credits becomes 100 million and someone's Million credits becomes 100 thousand. It would take them about an hour of play to recoup their loss. It would take me years to recoup mine. Please explain to me how that is fair.

Toraak's Avatar


Toraak
08.27.2019 , 01:52 PM | #19
Quote: Originally Posted by PiiTarr View Post
We just had an involuntary unlisting of all items on the GTN. As soon as it was over, things were posted again at much higher prices than before. Multiple items I'd been watching for weeks that had come down into the single digits of millions were re-listed for 10s of millions. That same thing would happen if people pulled listings.

When you cited "selfish desires" I could only assume you meant "greed." Was there some other motivation to which you were referring?

So my 1 billion credits becomes 100 million and someone's Million credits becomes 100 thousand. It would take them about an hour of play to recoup their loss. It would take me years to recoup mine. Please explain to me how that is fair.
It isn't fair, I'm beginning to think that this is a troll suggestion, since all of us know how easy it is to get credits now. GTN prices wouldn't change at all, the only thing that would is massive amounts of credits would be stolen from the game. The GTN prices would stay the same simply because Credits through heroics/dailies and other game activities can be aquired so quickly.

Even if this absurd suggestion went through, all of my GTN prices would stay the same.
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ChoppedSuey's Avatar


ChoppedSuey
08.27.2019 , 02:25 PM | #20
Quote: Originally Posted by Toraak View Post
It isn't fair, I'm beginning to think that this is a troll suggestion, since all of us know how easy it is to get credits now. GTN prices wouldn't change at all, the only thing that would is massive amounts of credits would be stolen from the game. The GTN prices would stay the same simply because Credits through heroics/dailies and other game activities can be aquired so quickly.

Even if this absurd suggestion went through, all of my GTN prices would stay the same.
You could absolutely do whatever you wanted to do. I don't know what you sell, so maybe what you do sell is already low enough that it wouldn't affect you.

Believe you me, if 90% of players credits went bye-bye, GTN costs would reduce 90% roughly. Maybe more so on the current high value 100 mill plus items. Things like low grade mats and item modifications wouldn't be affected too much I wouldn't think...I could be wrong.

You've said it isn't fair a couple times now if I remember correctly, why isn't it fair? I feel like your not getting what I'm trying to say. At least tell me that you understand that if you wipe out 90% of all player credits, the value of each credit will be worth significantly more than it currently is. If your 1 billion becomes 100 million and so does everyone else's...then your 100 million can purchase the same amount of items that your 1 billion previously could purchase. There will be some fluctuations to that of course and I'm speaking generally. If you understand that, how could you say it's not fair?

TBH with everyone who disagrees with me, which is fine, this will NEVER get implemented anyways. Doesn't mean it is a bad idea.
chopped suˇey