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GSF Discussion: Friction Points

STAR WARS: The Old Republic > English > Galactic Starfighter
GSF Discussion: Friction Points
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stu_ungar's Avatar

07.07.2017 , 03:42 AM | #111
Quote: Originally Posted by Verain View Post
The final one of those is caused by lag. It's not out of all possibilities that someone is lagging as a way to be harder to hit, but with practice you will find that lagging pilots have several weaknesses, including the fact that the server will sometimes "hold" them in a position that makes them quite vulnerable to weapon fire. I'm almost positive that deliberate uses of lag are very very rare.
Ships skipping around IS NOT caused by lag, it is caused by speedhack tool. If you deny that, it is you who doesn't know what you're talking about.

Lagged ships would follow some imaginary trajectory not change it randomly while still being able to interact with objective/other players. Either you're lagging so you can't get your position to server and can't get other players position back either, or you're not lagging at all. You can't regularly benefit from lagging.

Speedhacking is finally being quenched down in PVP and hopefully it would be so with GSF too.

Nyla's Avatar

07.07.2017 , 05:03 AM | #112
I still play a lot, here's my thoughts

Is the learning curve too steep to get into?

It's hard without reading guides to understand many things.
The tutorial should be mandatory for players without experience AND improved a lot.
Many starters don't know they can choose spawn points or they have a booster and how to use it.
How many times did I saw starters wanting to go to a satellite but starting from the opposite spawn point and flying there without booster.

Starters got not idea which ship to use, which to buy, which to upgrade with what and for what purpose...

Is ship balance preventing you from playing?

Not me, there's some balance issues with some ships being better/worse than others. My opinions about thoses are quite similar to what many already said.

The main problem with balance is role stacking. Stacking bombers under satellites or in protected area in TDM, stacking gunships in TDM...

Are you not playing because you feel GSF needs something new to bring you back in?

I'm playing atm but I took breaks before for the lack of new mode/maps in GSF and ground PvP. Without something new, my next break is going to be sooner than later.

Matchmaking issues?

Imo, it's the #1 problem for players (new ones in particular). Not sure how you can solve it without huge increase in people playing GSF...
Between a newbie and an experienced player, the difference is huge, even more so jf the vet has a maxed ship or close to.
But it's not only a problem of maxed ship vs starter ship, it's also for a big part a problem of experience and of understanding of the mechanics of GSF gameplay.
I'm an altoholic and I play GSF on most of my characters. Even with non-upgraded starter ships, vets like me can do a lot more than complete newbies.
Again, as a reminder about the learning curve, many newbies don't know how to use their boosters, how to handle energy management, when they are in firing range, how to shoot missiles, what the starter ships can and can't do...which cause them a lot of problems even against vets in starter ships.

The fact that GSF is character based and not Legacy?

I have no problem with that but many people probably do, they don't want to have to regrind requisition to get ships and upgrades.
Please don't force GSF to be Legacy wide, I can understand why some want it but please let it be a choice.
The same legacy wide armors/weapons let people skip the grind, it also lets people do the grind if they want to.
Let me choose for each of my characters if I want to use stuff I earned through Legacy characters or to start from scratch.

It needs a way to remove CXP farmers (like on ground PvP).
Premades should fight against premades or people willing to go against premades (default option off)
A PvE aspect would make more people into it and would help getting some experience.
Whatever changes you make, don't dumb what's existing. Instead makes it easier for players to understand what's going on, what's important.

graouly's Avatar

07.07.2017 , 06:23 AM | #113
Thanks for this thread: GSF really needs some new stuffs.
It's a great part of the game and it's nice to see you pay attention to GSF (at least )

Is the learning curve too steep to get into?

Learning curve is ok for me: I don't like easy way (= old school gamer).
Victory without risk means triumph without glory.

Is ship balance preventing you from playing?

As I said in the balance thread, I think bombers kill the fun in Satellite Maps (please decrease their durability or the damage of the mines).

Are you not playing because you feel GSF needs something new to bring you back in?

I'm not playing to GSF cause I can't! There are not enough people in my server (Battle Meditation) => please merge the server with same language!
And I think GSF needs new stuff like:
- new maps!
- new goals like, for instance, protect a mothership or a military base while the other team has to destroy it
- pve content (with same goals as above)

FlameYOL's Avatar

07.07.2017 , 06:26 AM | #114
I think if GSF was legacy-wide it would help, mostly because having to play that 1 character for GSF probably turns people off of it, I mainly play in 1 character only but a lot of my friends play in multiple alts and that would help a great deal to make GSF more alt-friendly.
A man can have anything...If he's willing to sacrifice everything

Darthural's Avatar

07.07.2017 , 06:57 AM | #115
Nice to see the threats

Is the learning curve too steep to get into?

For most ones yes, because a sufficient training area is missing and a reason to do.

We need one area, where you can practice shooting on moving drones. The Drones should have different speed, amour, evasion and flying profiles (up to nightmare).

The second area is to practice controls. Maybe someone remind X-Wing Alliance. In that game (I loved it) you had several ring courses. By time you learned how to fly.

And a third area, where you can spend time as long as you want to adjust controls to your needs and test component combinations.

Adding these three areas will be not enough. I suggest an weekly training quest and new achievements.

In addition you can think of some kind of leader board, where the best times and scores are shown. And what about some ranked gsf while racing on ring courses with buffs and debuffs provided by Cerzka Corporation and sponsored by Giradda the Hutt.

Crazy Idea: What about Huttball in Space

josephxp's Avatar

07.07.2017 , 07:27 AM | #116
Quote: Originally Posted by LonelyWookiee View Post
- The only time I've ever seen hacking in this game has been in GSF matches. I PVP almost every day and I don't think I've ever seen anything there but I've seen ships use there evade ability twice back to back, missiles that fire instantly, and ships move in peculiar ways skipping around and preventing target locks.
If you think there is hacking you probably don't know what your talking about.

-If you didn't see who killed you they could have dampening sensors and you can even see them yet
-If you are being 1 shot chances are the gunship got a critical hit or has Blaster Overcharge mod in TDM
-Cluster missiles have very shot lock on time, rocket pods fire instantly
-Ship mobility can prevent target locks by running behind an astriod or straight up avoiding line of sight or taking a turn you cant keep up with because your arc of fire is small (eg. proton torpedoes have a small firing arc)
-Also ship engine moves that can make you go at a verticale or horizontal angle to evade, low cool down times like power dive which is a 90 degree vertical evade with 5 second cool down and low engine cost when maxed. retro thrusters etc. list goes on and on.
-Some scouts can have 2 evade abilities, distortion field when maxed one of the options is target lock break, as well as having an engine evade like barrel role or retro thrusters. Scouts also may have lightweight armor increasing evasion chances.

Literally there is a reason that i can explain to you what you think is hacking but really isn't at all and an even longer list of more details i can go into.
Give Us New GSF Maps
Tachyon(s)/Alpha Triage(pub)/Void(imp) from Ebon Hawk
7 days of free subscription and character transfer for subs and returners

josephxp's Avatar

07.07.2017 , 07:35 AM | #117
Quote: Originally Posted by Verain View Post
It's a long running joke that you aren't really doing great until someone logs over and calls you a hacker. Many pilots have had tickets opened on them- accusations of hacking are a very common refrain.
I know that all to well, especially getting 42 kills in a team death match on a gunship, 3 ships kept charging right at me the entire match head on, no arcing angle to avoid my railguns. People said i must have been cheating but in reality it was the sheer stupidity/insanity of charging at a gunship head on in a scout not using an evade boost or going at an arcing angle.

Then there are times when you push over 100k damage mark, or when your on a clarion/imperium going around healing people like crazy and power diving ever so often avoiding fire. getting criticals off a proton torpedo (crew abilites) and people saying thats OP, having my protons lock past 10,000m (because of tier 5 ability for 15% range increase), protons going to fast (missle speed increase 100% ability). the list of accusations go on and on.

Or simply getting lucky with evasion and crit chances because of your crew and abilities i mean using someone like pierce to boost crit chance even further with targeting telm. with burst lasers on a scout beautiful
Give Us New GSF Maps
Tachyon(s)/Alpha Triage(pub)/Void(imp) from Ebon Hawk
7 days of free subscription and character transfer for subs and returners

BattleAxMaeve's Avatar

07.07.2017 , 07:37 AM | #118
The learning curve is not only steep, it is downright punishing.

The tutorial is useful in learning how to avoid objects. But stationary targets aren't at all the same as the moving ones in a match.

So, you go out there in a flimsy, underequipped ship to try to hit targets which are entirely different from the few you practiced on--and which strike back. You are fighting players who live and breathe GSF.

Not only will you lose (which is OK in my book), but you bring down your team (which is decidedly not OK). There is a lot to learn, and the entire experience is discouraging and bewildering.

I periodically try GSF for weeks at a time, then give up. I really hate damaging my own team and, until I get the knack of even the simplest maneuvers, my presence is a handicap, not a help.

In Guild chat, the inability to master the elementary fly-and-shoot aspects of GSF are always cited as the reason for not participating. A serious effort to make a truly effective tutorial would do much to turn participation around. People want to be able to enjoy it, but they can't if they can't manage the essentials.

Perhaps a series of tutorials could double as space-mission quests? I know that this sort of solo content isn't what you've been concentrating on building up, but my guess would be that mastering these mini-practice-quests would lure a good few players into the GSF arena.

I know that the Zakuul Eternal Championship did much to encourage me to try my hand at ops and more advanced FPs. Something similar would be very useful to GSF.

I do want to compliment those GSF enthusiasts who have taken my ineptitude with grace or, at the very least, silence.

justik-forn's Avatar

07.07.2017 , 07:56 AM | #119
I read through the entire thread. Most of the feedback is naturally from GSF players and I'm sure will be of great value in improving the experience. Since it looks like you are trying to expand the GSF playerbase, I will give you my two cents as a non GSF player. But I can only respond to the first question: Is the learning curve too steep? Yes. So yes.

When it first came out, I was looking forward to trying GSF based on the hype pre-release. I didn't get past the tutorial. I tried the tutorial again a few times but never felt comfortable trying a match. Last summer I was determined to finish DvL so I played GSF. I did the tutorial again but still had no clue. I did the matches I needed and my experience has been described in this thread many times. I didn't mind dying over and over again because I fully expected it and I just needed the DvL achievements. And yes, even though I was only doing it for DvL I did try to actually play the matches, but to no avail. I was even more confused at the end of them than before I started. I don't PVP either, but at least in the few matches I've done (mainly for DvL) I actually understood (at least some of) what was going on around me. Not so in GSF. It's not so much that there is a learning curve of being new and needing to practice to figure it out, it's the feeling that there is no hope of ever figuring it out. There's no chance to do anything in a match and the tutorial is completely incomprehensible.

It's not fun.

If changes are made I will definitely try it again.
"You got it." - Carth Onasi

MakArdross's Avatar

07.07.2017 , 08:01 AM | #120
Please make Ships legacy bound. I only do GSF on 1 toon out of the 12 level 70s I rotate through. I do not want to grind up a new squadron of ships on each toon as this takes too long and GSF does not pop enough to facilitate this. Also I have over 5000 fleet comms and literally already own everything that is worth owning that can be purchased with fleet comms. There is honestly not enough incentive to que GSF as you'll be in que longer. If you que For both GSF and Warzones you'll majority of the time get a ground Warzone pop first Andy of the GSF does pop your probably already on a ground Warzone