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A Summary of Increased Repair Cost Problems (for BW/EA)


Daemonson

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and back when it was changed originally they stated they were dropping that exact cost off because it was too high.

most likely a new guy fixed what he perceived as an error without looking into the past patch notes on the subject.

 

 

from the 1.2 patch notes

 

Modifiable items now have repair costs based on the level of their base modification.

 

Again from the 1.7 patch notes:

 

From the patch notes:

 

"Item sell values and item repair costs now reflect the value of the items and any enhancements attached to them. Previously, items were incorrectly being valued without their enhancements."

 

Sounds like a bug to me.

 

After 1.2 the repair cost was supposed to be based on item mod levels, but it was actually being calculated WITHOUT the enhancements. According to the patch notes, this patch fixed that bug and now repair costs should be in line with what patch 1.2 intended.

 

Also remember that most people now have their gear augmented with level 22 augments. Is it possible that prior to 1.7, the game was not taking into account augments when calculating repair costs and is now doing so? If a person has every slot augmented with a purple level 22 augment, that could be a hefty chunk of credits.

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You claim that people who are now paying what others have been paying all along are paying 10x what they were before. The logical corollary is that these people were paying 10x less than what everyone else was at the time.

 

As I have yet to see evidence of change to repair costs for lower level characters, I refute at least a portion of your question. End Game gear, its unreasonable to expect people to pay different repair prices based on whether or not they wear social gear.

 

The logical corollary is that everyone could have been paying up to 10x less than they are now, depending on the type of gear they used.

 

People using a lot of orange / moddable gear are now paying up to 10x more than they were before. That is the problem.

 

Why should people who wear social gear be heavily penalized in repair costs? How is THAT good for the game?

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Why is the solution to raise repair costs for everyone rather than lowering it to the same level for everyone?

 

Alternatively, a solution to this thing is to have trash mobs in all of the ops drop credits like they do in Asation. My raid team cleared TFB last night for the first time last night and despite being in full BH and some 27s, and wiping on the Terror a few times while learning the mechanics, the credits dropped, stuff bioanalyzed, stabilizers, etc more than paid for the repair costs. The problem is where trash doesnt drop anything at all. Of course, I dont think Bioware would consider this because this repair cost issue seems very much to be intentional in order to drain credits from the game economy.

 

To make this absolutely clear, repair costs have not be raised for everyone, though you raise an interesting point about repair costs. The system would need to be redesigned, because it is currently scaling and there would need to be a baseline number that everyone paid if you simply brought the price down(since the people receiving a discount were not all receiving the same level of discount), but I don't personally think there's anything wrong with simply reducing repair costs overall or doing away with them altogether. The arguments I have heard in favor of the existence of repair costs usually has to do with getting people to be serious about end game PvE or something, but that's not something I particularly care about.

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This affects new players. I have a 29 Shadow (tank) in orange gear. In that orange gear, I have level-appropriate armoring, mods, and enhancements. One death cost me a few hundred before the patch . Now it costs me almost 9,000. Tell me, what player who just started the game and has ONE level 29 character can afford 9,000 per death? They can certainly get the gear by doing the heroic planetary quests and flash points...

Uhmm, I have characters in the mid- to late 20's with over 100,000 credits and that's not by farming, but by playing through the content "normally". Quite frankly, if someone is dying so much that even 9,000 credits is a problem, then they are definitely doing something wrong - I pretty much solo all leveling content and have only died 2-3 times on a couple of characters and none at all on others - with toons up to level 41 at this point.

 

Normally I'd reiterate my request for you to answer my question before I answer yours...

 

I've never seen any reports of players paying 10x what others do for repairing the same level gear with the same level of damage, so I don't really buy your point?

 

Now please answer my question. Why is this change good for the game? Please keep in mind that it affects all players at all levels; don't just limit your answer to a specific, small subset of the players, please.

 

Because gear repair costs are a credit sink (aka gold sink), it is used to take money out of the economy to keep the economy balanced. Now, I am not one to debate the actual validity of an in-game economy, but when something is not working as intended, it needs to be fixed.

 

"bug" or not....when it is in palce that long for so long...it becomes a "feature".

 

So any and all bugs that have been in the game for a while no longer need fixing because they are now features and working as intended?

 

BJ

Edited by BJWyler
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Again from the 1.7 patch notes:

 

 

 

After 1.2 the repair cost was supposed to be based on item mod levels, but it was actually being calculated WITHOUT the enhancements. According to the patch notes, this patch fixed that bug and now repair costs should be in line with what patch 1.2 intended.

 

Also remember that most people now have their gear augmented with level 22 augments. Is it possible that prior to 1.7, the game was not taking into account augments when calculating repair costs and is now doing so? If a person has every slot augmented with a purple level 22 augment, that could be a hefty chunk of credits.

 

It was a change they made on purpose, before 1.2 repairs were calculated like they are now. It's a new guy that thought it was a mistake and tried to be helpful and fix it.

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Let's compare apples to apples, please?

 

What is your sniper's gear? Which are his orange, modded pieces? What level mods do you have in them?

 

On my Shadow, I have orange gear in every slot down the right side plus weapon, offhand, and bracers. Every trinket in every piece requires level 25-29 to equip. No pieces have augment slots or, obviously, augments.

 

If your Sniper is not similarly equipped with 8 orange, moddable pieces of gear with level-appropriate items in every slot, your test is interesting but insufficient to call BS on my experiences.

 

Headpiece, armor, gloves, boots, mainhand, offhand are oranges. Everything ranges from 30-36 for those, closer to 36 on average. No relics, and the rest of the gear likewise being 30-36 range. Was your one death a legitimate test repair, or was it just "One time I noticed after playing a while I had 9k in repair costs"? If you actually get 9k off of one death, there is a legitimate bug unrelated to the intentional change(which I and many other PvErs I know saw reflected by a 30% or less increase in repair price for oranges related to enhancements, and out of box repair costs being the same).

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As the leader of my guild

 

I say, run dailies, open a guild bank, deposit credits, help guild out.

 

But then again, I trust my guild

 

and a few thousand more credits isn't hurting my wallet.

 

 

Does no one realize this was a bug that has now been fixed?

 

I'm the raid leader of my guild, and we are a casual guild who runs and enjoys ops. We have no playtime restrictions, and due to my work, school and family activities I have about 10 hours a week to play. Of those 10 hours I spend 7 or so of them either actively raiding, herding the cats prior, or doing admin tasks/etc after. I have just enough time to run SectionX and BH once a week on 2 chars at most. Many of my guildmates have similar schedules which does not alot enough time to do all the dailies required to not slowly go broke without sacrificing family time/school or sleep with the new repair costs.

Family will not be sacrificed for a game, so that's out. Either will what little chances I get to sleep. And I'm not dropping out of school and forgoing getting my MBA. So more dailies is out of the question. And I'm not going to have us open up further guild bank repairs and expect those who have more time to go do tons of dailies to help fund the repair bills of others, that is not fair to them and I won't exploit my friends like that.

So we can a) stop raiding (noone in the guild wants to do that)

b) cut back on raiding and instead of raiding 1 or our raid nights we run dailies as a group to earn $$ (noone wants that either)

c) we break down all the loot we get for mats and sell the mats to cover our repairs (noone wants that because then we don't gear up, so we can't progress)

 

And yes, I'm fully aware they say it was a bug that they fixed...but then I would ask them these questions...

a) Why was it not announced prior that it was not working as intended to give us warning that they would be going up?

b) Why did they go up so much? My campaign/DG level main's repair costs went from about 4k per death to close to 11k, that's almost 3x as much.

c) Why did it take so long for them to fix? Repair costs have been at this level for 6+ months.

d) How do we know it is actually functioning as intended now?

 

It's been over 2 days now and they have said NOTHING on the subject in spite of an avalanche of negative feedback. The longer it stays like this and the longer they ignore all the feedback and say nothing the madder people are going to get and the more likely they are to vote with their wallets and leave. I've got 3 jobs already (work, school and family), leaving repairs at current levels will make me and many others consider ToR a job because we can't do what we want without an EXCESSIVE amount of busy work, and as soon as our leasure activity turns into a job, we find a new leasure activity.

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2. Progression takes a hit.

Guilds will be less willing to wipe over and over again on bosses because of this. If a group wipes 20-30 times on a boss they can't kill it could cost nearly a million credits per player.

 

Uhh, no.

 

Real progression guilds will not let repairs bills stop them. 20-30 wipes? Try 100+ for some Nightmare Mode bosses. This is what farming/off-season is for. Run some dailies, stock up the guild bank between raids, and then use those tens of millions for when you spend 4 hours just wiping day after day.

 

Plus, many progression raiders don't sport low level orange shells and have been paying top dollar for repairs.

Edited by Jinxblog
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GM here as well, and it is not an issue for us. Essentially, the guild bank is available for repairs but everyone has a cap on how much they can use in repairs per week. That coupled with players diligently contributing to the bank on a weekly basis makes the repair costs a mild annoyance nothing more.

 

So... essentially, the guild and players are dividing up the hit and it isn't a huge deal at the moment.

 

Ops are running as scheduled.

 

So I take it that your guild bank has 3+ million credits in funds to spend every week to pay for progression repairs? That is assuming that you only have 2 8-man progression groups and cap repairs at 200k per player per week. That should cover about 1/2 of the repair cost for 8-10 wipes at the new premium rates. If you do, congratulations. However I am sure that most guilds cannot fund that rate of repair costs for very long.

Edited by TheSkate
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Repair bills have also skyrocketed for people under 50. It's gone up dramatically across the board. If it remains it will end up being a pretty big deterrent for FTP players moving into a sub or even sticking with the game.

 

At what level are you guys seeing these skyrocketing prices? My level 36 sniper dies, 1k in repair costs. My level 11 assassin dies, less than 60 credits in repair costs.

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The logical corollary is that everyone could have been paying up to 10x less than they are now, depending on the type of gear they used.

 

People using a lot of orange / moddable gear are now paying up to 10x more than they were before. That is the problem.

 

Why should people who wear social gear be heavily penalized in repair costs? How is THAT good for the game?

 

Why should people who wear social gear be heavily rewarded in repair costs? How is THAT good for the game?

 

How is it good to reward either the player who wears social gear, or the player who wears the "out of the box" gear? All players should have to pay the same costs to repair based on level of item, and now they are. Just because you would prefer not have your costs raised to equality doesn't make it unfair.

 

You can say you are being penalized for wearing social gear, but it's just as true that the person wearing the "out of the box" gear is no longer being penalized.

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Uhmm, I have characters in the mid- to late 20's with over 100,000 credits and that's not by farming, but by playing through the content "normally".

BJ

I call that nonsense. Even if that were the case (and I'm a fairly experienced player who rarely died up to Lv 40) skill, ability and rep costs rise unpropotionally as you go along. I made maybe 30.000 credits between the levels 20-45 (after deducting my costs) and I'm usually one among the 'richest' among my group of friends. I had to lend people credits so they could buy their skill updates. That's never ever happened to me before.

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Uhh, no.

 

Real progression guilds will not let repairs bills stop them. 20-30 wipes? Try 100+ for some Nightmare Mode bosses. This is what farming/off-season is for. Run some dailies, stock up the guild bank between raids, and then use those tens of millions for when you spend 4 hours just wiping day after day.

 

Plus, many progression raiders don't sport low level orange shells and have been paying top dollar for repairs.

 

 

You have tens of millions?

 

Share :p

 

we have 2 guilds, one imp one pub and keep about a million in each side.

we just don't have time to throw away like some people do.

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I made maybe 30.000 credits between the levels 20-45 (after deducting my costs) and I'm usually one among the 'richest' among my group of friends. I had to lend people credits so they could buy their skill updates. That's never ever happened to me before.

 

ಠ_ಠ

 

i don't even believe you

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I call that nonsense. Even if that were the case (and I'm a fairly experienced player who rarely died up to Lv 40) skill, ability and rep costs rise unpropotionally as you go along. I made maybe 30.000 credits between the levels 20-45 (after deducting my costs) and I'm usually one among the 'richest' among my group of friends. I had to lend people credits so they could buy their skill updates. That's never ever happened to me before.

 

Interesting. In my recent experience, I now net about 1 million credits over all expenses while leveling an alt to 50(I put in 500k at start and end up with 1.5 mill by the end) without using the GTN and while leveling crew skills, whereas when I first hit 50 I was broke. I'm usually in the habit of finishing just about every mission available though. I attribute this to reduced skill training costs from launch.

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I think the real point is, no one likes to pay more for things. This has been the way it was for a year, people have gotten used to it and theer is no legitimate reason to suddenly fix this "bug".

 

Does anyone truely want to ever pay more for the same thing? In a game or in real life?

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You have tens of millions?

 

Share :p

 

we have 2 guilds, one imp one pub and keep about a million in each side.

we just don't have time to throw away like some people do.

 

Should've seen my first GM. He had 17 million off farming dailies before 1.2 hit. The richest guy in our guild around the time had over 100 mil, though IIRC he was one of those GTN tycoons.

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I call that nonsense. Even if that were the case (and I'm a fairly experienced player who rarely died up to Lv 40) skill, ability and rep costs rise unpropotionally as you go along. I made maybe 30.000 credits between the levels 20-45 (after deducting my costs) and I'm usually one among the 'richest' among my group of friends. I had to lend people credits so they could buy their skill updates. That's never ever happened to me before.

 

My first toon, I had 1.3 million by the time I made level 50 and purchased my new talents, speeder and crafting schematics.

 

That said, these repair cost changes are garbage.

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Uhh, no.

 

Real progression guilds will not let repairs bills stop them. 20-30 wipes? Try 100+ for some Nightmare Mode bosses. This is what farming/off-season is for. Run some dailies, stock up the guild bank between raids, and then use those tens of millions for when you spend 4 hours just wiping day after day.

 

Plus, many progression raiders don't sport low level orange shells and have been paying top dollar for repairs.

 

This is a poor reason.

 

I am a member of a "Real progression guild" we have not and will not let repair costs stop us. What I am refering to is guilds that are more casual, but still push progression. These guilds will wipe many times on a boss and will not have the credits to keep paying for wipes. They have lives outside the game and do not want to take time away from that to grind boring dailies.

 

I am not arguing for hardcore progression raiders. I am arguing for the more casual family/fun oriented guilds who want to progress and get the gear, but will be punished for doing so now.

 

Also, for the people like you saying that people using full 61/63 shells before now and paid the full prices, this is a complete lie. I have been geared on my main in 61 level shells. The only shells that are not 61+ level are my belt and bracers. Everything else was full campaign/bh and before now, I was paying 3-4k a wipe and 30kish when repairing my gear at yellow. I now pay 10k a wipe and 100kish for repairing at yellow. The shells you were using before had no effect on repair costs, everybody in my guild had about the same prices, and they all skyrocketed with this latest patch.

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And yet it's true.

 

i call 100% BS, there is no possible way, unless you are dieing a LOT, OR you buy **** off the gtn

 

Through all expenses commonly leveling a full toon to 50 you should get around 1 mil extra credits, your claim of getting 30k in the span of 25 levels is COMPLETELY wrong

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Should've seen my first GM. He had 17 million off farming dailies before 1.2 hit. The richest guy in our guild around the time had over 100 mil, though IIRC he was one of those GTN tycoons.

 

Honestly if I had tons of time to play I could make that kind of money. Most i've ever had on any one toon was 3.5 mill

richest member of our guild has around ten mil right now.

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a) stop raiding (noone in the guild wants to do that)

b) cut back on raiding and instead of raiding 1 or our raid nights we run dailies as a group to earn $$ (noone wants that either)

c) we break down all the loot we get for mats and sell the mats to cover our repairs (noone wants that because then we don't gear up, so we can't progress)

 

 

So, let me get this straight. You and your guild know that there are ways you can handle the increased cost for repairs, but are unwilling to make the changes needed, so it's up to BW/EA to lower the costs, even if it was a legitimate bug fix?

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