So i wanted to ask... i recently started a Sith alt just to see what the Sith Inquisitor quest line was like versus the consular one in the starting area and i noticed something. The mirror ability inquisitor's get to "Project" is called "Shock. Now i PvP on my 50 Jedi Shadow often enough to have had people Force Cloak out of my "Project" since it has a cast animation in the sense you have to lift and throw the rock before it does damage... well my question is... why does "Shock" instantly do damage and can not be vanished while our "Project" can just sit there up in the air and become useless...

Note: I am rank 55 in PvP right now, full champion gear, and generally destroy the Jedi Shadow counterpart... and most Imperials for that matter. Only classes that give me problems is a well played Sith Marauder.

So i would like to know if anyone else has notice the Project damage delay compared to shock... Jedi Consular obviously does more than fine in PvP/PvE just wanted to know the communities thoughts.

It's annoying, but Project with Upheavel proc and a Force breach/Melee crit can do some heavy burst. Don't think Inquis's can do this because shock activates the GCD, even if they get their proc on it, they still have 1.5 sec before they can attack again. Consulars project takes almost the duration or near the amount of GCD so that Project/upheaveal proc and forcebreach/melee crit and come simultaneous.

But it is annoying when any class that can vanish/invis my rock just floats in midair. It should still hit, just don't break the stealth if it doesn't kill them like it does in WoW, where vanish doesn't break for a couple seconds.

My understanding of this is that the animation doesn't have any bearing on when the damage actually gets done. The damage is subtracted instantly, and you can see this by carefully watching their health bar when you activate Project. It's just that the number doesn't pop up until the animation goes through.

In general, you have to keep in mind that there's a difference between the actual timing of an attack and the animation that represents it. In the case of Project and the whole stealthing thing, the people are actually stealthing after the damage is dealt, but before the animation goes through; that's why it looks like they're escaping the ability, when in actuality they are not.

I could be wrong since I haven't tested this vigorously myself. I would welcome video evidence either way. I am positive, however, that the above is the intended behavior, even if it's not how it actually plays out.

My understanding of this is that the animation doesn't have any bearing on when the damage actually gets done. The damage is subtracted instantly, and you can see this by carefully watching their health bar when you activate Project. It's just that the number doesn't pop up until the animation goes through.

 

In general, you have to keep in mind that there's a difference between the actual timing of an attack and the animation that represents it. In the case of Project and the whole stealthing thing, the people are actually stealthing after the damage is dealt, but before the animation goes through; that's why it looks like they're escaping the ability, when in actuality they are not.

 

I could be wrong since I haven't tested this vigorously myself. I would welcome video evidence either way. I am positive, however, that the above is the intended behavior, even if it's not how it actually plays out.

actually from what i've witnessed, the damage isn't actually shown until the first rock hits. that's why everyone says this delay could be a blessing in disguise cause you can combine this with another instant to make a bigger burst appear to panic the enemy.

the only exception to this is that if the damage is enough to kill said enemy or npc, the enemy or npc will be dead and cease moving (but won't die die) until the animation finishes.

altho if the damage is enough to kill said person, will it still stop a cap even though they "died?" i don't know just yet.

it isn't also just project, try stopping an enemy with part of a second left with telekinetic throw and you'll also fail... that animation/damage is also not instant compared to sith's lightning, altho it's a helluva lot faster than project.

This post by Georg Zoeller seems like it may hold some hope for this issue:

The Trooper's mortar volley is an animation issue not related to the technical fixes mentioned in this thread. It is however being worked on (take this as a confirmation that we are not satisfied with how the ability reacts to player input and that we intend to fix it).

 

Please understand if I'm not going to discuss more individual ability concerns in this thread to avoid derailing the topic at this point.

 

Since I see some demaind for it, I will see if I can get you guys an update on individual ability animation concerns (both balance and gameplay) in the future. You should see a number of non animation concerns with faction ability fixed in an upcoming patch on PTS.

 

-- Georg

I know project can do some good dmg, but unfortunately, I have an issue I run into. Let's say someone is planting a bomb on a door in pvp, with only a second left to interrupt, i throw out project, but due to the animation, he plants and my team loses. Lame?

You shouldn't be using Project like that in such a tight spot. I would of used mind snap - or my stun or Low slash - either of these will stop the enemy in their tracks and stun them for a few secs, then you should follow in with either project if you want, or better still pop off a crit surge, X2 Clairvoyant Strike and then use a stealth strike on him, slow time, force breach - if below 30% finish him off with spinning strike. This is roughly what you could do.. Of course the above is true for Infiltrators mostly.

You shouldn't be using Project like that in such a tight spot. I would of used mind snap - or my stun or Low slash - either of these will stop the enemy in their tracks and stun them for a few secs, then you should follow in with either project if you want, or better still pop off a crit surge, X2 Clairvoyant Strike and then use a stealth strike on him, slow time, force breach - if below 30% finish him off with spinning strike. This is roughly what you could do.. Of course the above is true for Infiltrators mostly.

Wrong on many levels.

Think most of this is out of topic...

The issue is rather simple:

Assassin and Shadow are mirrors, so their skills got to be identical.

Project = damage 1.5s after being triggered.

Shock = damage instantly as it is triggered.

Period.

No need to talk forever about this. Currently it's not properly mirrored, that's it.

And issus about mirror favoring the imperials are a factor (small but still) to the faction imbalance.

My understanding of this is that the animation doesn't have any bearing on when the damage actually gets done. The damage is subtracted instantly, and you can see this by carefully watching their health bar when you activate Project.

Not true. Easy test? Try interrupting a cap in WZ with Project and then try with Shock. The post above mine is correct.

Btw, after reading too many "Sorc can do this, Sage is gimped" bla bla threads I decided to roll a Sorc myself and see first hand.

What I can tell you now, as lvl 7 Sorc (and valor 41 seer 31/8/2) is that I've already found 2 differences in skills: the forementioned shock vs. project and force wave vs. overload knockback distance: overload knockback is longer by at least 2 meters.

Before posting any findings here, I first want to level the sorc to 50 to make sure I mirror my sage perfectly. Then you can expect video comparisons of all skills etc. My motive is mirror class balance, not forum QQ

Peace

and REPS, log on to Ilum ffs so we can give the imps a lil of their own medicine

My understanding of this is that the animation doesn't have any bearing on when the damage actually gets done. The damage is subtracted instantly, and you can see this by carefully watching their health bar when you activate Project. It's just that the number doesn't pop up until the animation goes through.

 

incorrect.

the damage is done when the rock hits the target.

Sith Assassin: Shock = Damage instantly.

Republic Shadow: Project = Damage after 1.5s.

They are supposed to be mirrors, they are not.

Bounty Hunter: Death from above = Damage instantly.

Commando: Mortar Volley = Damage starts after 1.5s.

They are supposed to be mirrors, they are not.

The imbalance between the two factions is a major issue in SWTOR.

The issues regarding wrong mirrors giving the advantage for imperials is one of the factors of influence for this population imbalance.

Even if this is a minor factor, IT HAS TO BE FIXED.

Please spread.

Thanks for reading.