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Please remove bolster from ranked warzones!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

STAR WARS: The Old Republic > English > PvP
Please remove bolster from ranked warzones!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Pellerinen's Avatar


Pellerinen
01.01.2018 , 06:37 AM | #31
Quote: Originally Posted by Rafiknoll View Post
This hover function is stupid because it makes an average of your gear. That means a stupid tank who has full 248 will have 248 rating, but my tank who has lethal mods 54B on all 9 pieces (because they have much more Endu and replace defense with power) will show that I have 247 rating, and I am in all stats superior to the 248 guy.
So lets say a guy has full 230 gear but 2 wind relics (rating: 50), the average would be (230x12 + 50x2)/14 = 204.2, and you would claim the guy has 204 gear, too low. Let's try something higher...
Let's say you have full 248 but 2 wind relics, the average would be (248x12 + 50x2)/14 = 219.7, so this is the 220 you saw. So you didn't lose to a 220-geared-man, you lost to a 248-geared-with-the-bugged-relics man, who would, according to all posts except for yours, deal about the same damage if he had 248 relics.
Yeah, I can see why people in full 248 gear would switch to rating 50 relics for no reason whatsoever, and how this is all about skill. This can't possibly be about someone finding out a way to gain a good edge in pvp, and using that to boost their rating, grab some quick mats, etc, it has to be about unskilled players loosing to skilled players, and how gear doesn't matter. After all, until this happens to you, it doesn't exist and everyone suffering from meetings with these people are just hopelessly bad at pvp. Even if they had decent ratings before loosing constantly to these exploiters... all lies. Git gud, whiners.

Pellerinen's Avatar


Pellerinen
01.01.2018 , 06:47 AM | #32
Quote: Originally Posted by funnypat View Post
If you're still believing that bolster makes your stuff actually better than 248 stuff then you're lying to yourself, there is no such exploit that would give you that huge of an advantage, as said earlier, windrelics give you slightly more HP, which is weird but nothing more than that.

The advantage you get is if anything absolutely minor - as been said earlier 3 - 5k more HP... that's like 1 autoattack, if you make a whole case out of it saying that those people kill you in 3 sec... well then that same somebody would kill you in 248 stuff in 2 sec...

The only thing that isn't bolstered correctly are relics and as far as I know only the wind relics - but please enlighten us what exactly is that bug you're talking about? If you'd tell us that somebody with green stuff suddenly has 9000 mastery and 5000 crit... yeah that's a bug where I would understand your concern, but this isn't the case, in fact you have overall less crit, less mastery and less alacrity if you rely on bolster instead of BIS.

Yeah you have 5k hp more, but you only see this if that person has otherwise complete 248 stuff (slightly above 130k hp) or optimized 246 stuff (probably 150k health) because the variety you have in mods and enhancements that are crafted is far greater than the "basic" 248s - and 2 lvl in mods isn't that big of a difference, you can squeeze out some pretty good stats there...

But it's always easier to shout "bug" and "unfair" instead of doing proper research :P
Well, the people I've reported so far...one sentinel had 217 average gear rating, having 148k health, and the rest I couldn't see as he queued from what I can only suppose was his guild ship as I couldn't find him on fleet for an inspection. The match lasted under a minute, hence no one got any CXP for it, and this person did 603k damage or something like that while everyone else did around 200-300k.. Now, I suppose this could be all from AOE...

Now, if you've ever stumbled on earlier gear exploits, such as the XP gear and the earlier method of using lvl 50 armorings and some lvl 50 mods, enhancements etc to get the maximum effect from the bolster before it stops boosting you, you could also gain a similar amount of extra health and power, while having overall lower secondary stats... But hey, what do I know? There is no such exploit, and never has been before... I'm just bad at pvp. And people would never cheat in pvp, that's unheard of. Perish the thought. Git gud, bad players...

Rafiknoll's Avatar


Rafiknoll
01.01.2018 , 06:55 AM | #33
Quote: Originally Posted by Pellerinen View Post
Yeah, I can see why people in full 248 gear would switch to rating 50 relics for no reason whatsoever, and how this is all about skill. This can't possibly be about someone finding out a way to gain a good edge in pvp, and using that to boost their rating, grab some quick mats, etc, it has to be about unskilled players loosing to skilled players, and how gear doesn't matter. After all, until this happens to you, it doesn't exist and everyone suffering from meetings with these people are just hopelessly bad at pvp. Even if they had decent ratings before loosing constantly to these exploiters... all lies. Git gud, whiners.
I never said you lose because you are bad, I said that you were never defeated by a guy using actual rating 220 gear, but the 220 guy you are referring to had full 248 and the relics you complain about. That indeed means that the wind relics are considered as good or better than 248 gear, in that specific player's opinion. As I have proved to you with 7yo math, if the guy would have 230 gear and your broken relics you would see 204 rating, so unless you no longer think these people use the relics, it means the people you saw used gear very close to full 248, and the relics are the only difference. So indeed, the relics are broken and are approx equal to 248 relics (except for their proc being totally insignificant) but there is no way to prove and no reason to think that additional items are broken without further information.

Rafiknoll's Avatar


Rafiknoll
01.01.2018 , 07:03 AM | #34
Quote: Originally Posted by Pellerinen View Post
Well, the people I've reported so far...one sentinel had 217 average gear rating, having 148k health, and the rest I couldn't see as he queued from what I can only suppose was his guild ship as I couldn't find him on fleet for an inspection. The match lasted under a minute, hence no one got any CXP for it, and this person did 603k damage or something like that while everyone else did around 200-300k.. Now, I suppose this could be all from AOE...
In many ranked matches that I play with people I know, someone sometimes doubles or triples the dmg of the other while the other deals damage approximately as my non-skank tank. That is simply due to the other dps being more taunted/stunned/focused and the healer and tank being uncompetitive. If you speak of NWZ matches with more than 2 dps, than a reason for 1 to be far better than others would be because others are simply less good, or dying sooner, or being stupidly kited. You say he has 217 gear so assuming he had the wind relics, the rest of his gear was 242+ at least (closer to 246) if he used the mods and enhancements with the extra HP version then it is simple to understand how he got 148k. That's all there is to it. Next time check the DPS done, rather than total dmg (hover on chart), if DPS is greater than 20k, this is indeed odd, but dealing 10k against people who don't avoid well and let you aoe is not that hard, I dealt 9.4k with a tank!

supertimtaf's Avatar


supertimtaf
01.01.2018 , 07:44 AM | #35
https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachmen...gm63l6j401.png

The screen isn't from me, and is taken from reddit, I believe it was posted like a month ago.
Yeah, it's indeed 10k mastery you see on that guy, as well as those other stats.
Sure, it's way overboard in comparison of what you actually see often, but it's still possible. As an example, here is something I took on a yavin warzone, you can see very well that it isn't just a health upgrade.

Here

Yeah, it does give more stats, yeah it needs a fix.
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funnypat's Avatar


funnypat
01.01.2018 , 08:25 AM | #36
Something fishy about the first one, you can't have 246 armor rating with empty shells, they do get bolstered but very weirdly and nothing beyond the normal stats (I just tried, queue for wz and do it yourself if you don't believe it).

The second one is within normal stats, crit and alacrity are rather low so there is enough room for mastery and more endurance.

you can use Lethal mod 54b which gives 46 endurance more than the 248 mods
and Efficient enhancement which gives 37 endurance more

(37*7)+(9*46) = 673*1.05 (Endurance buff) = 706.65 more endurance than with 248 stuff, which would put me on my operative to 9545.65 Endurance (8839 with 248 stuff) -> that's without relics, with them that would be another 216 Endurance more so I'd be close to 10k as well.

so my average gear level would be lower than 220 as well if I'd use the relics, probably 218 or so.
Ræly (Operative - Star Forge)
Cæly (Scoundrel - Star Forge)

Pellerinen's Avatar


Pellerinen
01.01.2018 , 10:20 AM | #37
Quote: Originally Posted by Rafiknoll View Post
I never said you lose because you are bad, I said that you were never defeated by a guy using actual rating 220 gear, but the 220 guy you are referring to had full 248 and the relics you complain about. That indeed means that the wind relics are considered as good or better than 248 gear, in that specific player's opinion. As I have proved to you with 7yo math, if the guy would have 230 gear and your broken relics you would see 204 rating, so unless you no longer think these people use the relics, it means the people you saw used gear very close to full 248, and the relics are the only difference. So indeed, the relics are broken and are approx equal to 248 relics (except for their proc being totally insignificant) but there is no way to prove and no reason to think that additional items are broken without further information.
I didn't know you take care of the investigations of inappropriate player behaviour for Bioware. You've proven that it can't be just the relics, bravo...but... I don't see how the rest is relevant, really. I find their behavior suspicious, and I feel I should report on it. I'm not really interested in what YOU think about it, or how YOU feel it's totally alright for them to do that, since YOU really aren't any kind of an authority in the matter. But I do suggest that the easiest solution to every kind of bolster exploit is to remove the bolster from ranked... I believe you are against this because...reasons regarding maths and it makes it more interesting when people show up in "broken" gear? Am I correct? Or do we actually agree about this?

yellow_'s Avatar


yellow_
01.01.2018 , 10:54 AM | #38
Quote: Originally Posted by supertimtaf View Post
https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachmen...gm63l6j401.png

The screen isn't from me, and is taken from reddit, I believe it was posted like a month ago.
Yeah, it's indeed 10k mastery you see on that guy, as well as those other stats.
Sure, it's way overboard in comparison of what you actually see often, but it's still possible. As an example, here is something I took on a yavin warzone, you can see very well that it isn't just a health upgrade.

Here

Yeah, it does give more stats, yeah it needs a fix.
There's more than just bolster relics going on in that first screenshot. A couple of us tried to figure out what was going on there but never figured it out and the scoundrel in question claimed to not know how it happened.

The second screenshot is what normally happens with those relics with mastery augs as well.

Bolster relics are roughly equivalent to 248 relics. It's clearly unintended but they aren't super powering anyone as some posts in this thread might imply. In fact, their main value is just that you can get a couple 248ish tier pieces off the GTN for 50K while you work on other slots.

Seterade's Avatar


Seterade
01.01.2018 , 01:39 PM | #39
Wait wait wait...... Are you actually trying to make pvp gear based? dude the destruction of expertise cost them so many subs they had to publicly ask for advice on what to do right.

Aaroneus's Avatar


Aaroneus
01.01.2018 , 03:52 PM | #40
they should just remove gear from pvp all together