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Update on Sentinel and Marauder

STAR WARS: The Old Republic > English > Classes > Sentinel / Marauder
Update on Sentinel and Marauder
First BioWare Post First BioWare Post

DynamiCtagez's Avatar

04.06.2015 , 09:48 AM | #21
Quote: Originally Posted by Zeldoon View Post
Sweet, balancing the class based on our ranked leaderboards. Take into account the handful of people with single digit wins in our top 50 into your formula for class balance.
Yep. Or probably the data from all seasons combined...

KaiserTNT's Avatar

04.06.2015 , 09:48 AM | #22
Quote: Originally Posted by waterboytkd View Post
I'm a bit floored. There was no mention on how a large chunk of the watchman/anni community dislikes the current playstyle. No comment on Predation. Those are probably the two biggest issues Sent/Mara players talk about, yet instead we get "You're doing fine in Arenas, so..."

I'm disappointed because this isn't communication (even if you think Watchman/Anni rotation should remain the same, or that Predation shouldn't be changed, you could explain why). It's just a brush off.
Reverting Anni to pre-3.0 is definitely tops on my wish list, but my takeaway from the OP is that it ain't happening -- they are happy with how the class currently plays, and don't want to expend resources making it fun again. I have no idea why they felt the need to take a fun spec and trash it in the name of "progress ", but that's the reality. My Mara used to be my main for NiM, but at this point he's sitting the bench in favor of my Sniper, and I have no desire to change that as things stand.
Syrgeas (Mara) Hypacia (Sin Tank) Zenoviya(Sin Tank)
Aelyn (Merc) Koenyg(Sniper)Xacson(Op Heals)

mcpark's Avatar

04.06.2015 , 09:49 AM | #23
look they know what they're doing look at how full them pvp servers are.

Nepthen's Avatar

04.06.2015 , 09:51 AM | #24
Speaking PvE only here....

Based off this post, it looks like Watchman/Annihilation rotations aren't being adjusted, which I am fine with. Adding additional self heals for us will help a tiny bit (we'll see how much they're truly adjusted soon I guess) but there is still no answer for lack of up-time on the majority of bosses in this tier. At least in operations, up-time is by far the more serious issue with Sentinels, in my opinion.

Right now, it looks like my Sentinel remains a Story Mode only character and I'll just stick with my Commando for the HM tier.
Nepthen Kesslyte
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Bugattiboy's Avatar

04.06.2015 , 09:57 AM | #25
When will you get it EA?! We Watchmans, for the most part, don't take issue with the damage output. What we take issue with is how the class plays. You took a fun discipline's playstyle/rotation that no one had ever complained about and threw it to the wolves for NO GOOD REASON.

This is final straw. There is no more hope. I'm never playing Sentinel again. Not until they get their head out of their ***, but considering EA signs their cheques, that's an impossibility.

Now I have serious, honest, question for you Eric and the entire SWTOR team. Do you actually play your own damn game? Or are you guys just armchair developers?

Quote: Originally Posted by Emperor-Norton View Post
Is there any likelihood of changes to improve quality of life for Watchman/Annihilation? Especially in terms of making it's rotation and playstyle closer to the more popular version of shorter duration dots and the Cauterize cooldown reset mechanic?
I doubt it. Eric just said Watchman is meeting its intended target. And from EA's perspective, if it's meeting its intended target, why change anything?

JSitruc's Avatar

04.06.2015 , 10:00 AM | #26
well than.. looks like my sent will no longer be needed for my progression raid group. they need better up time on bosses and that doesnt look like it will be changing.

been here since launch with sent/mara as my main, switched 2 weeks ago to commando.
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J_McSkill's Avatar

04.06.2015 , 10:10 AM | #27
Come on guys, they need to focus their attention on the class that really needs help, Assassins.

Please buff Assassins!
Swat - Vanguard Nerph - Champion of the Scoundrels
Pulp - Sentinel Tackle - Eternal Guardian on Fire

- The Crushers -

Kaos_KidSWTOR's Avatar

04.06.2015 , 10:12 AM | #28
Quote: Originally Posted by EricMusco View Post
Hey folks,

I know that some of you have been waiting for a status update on Maras/Sents, especially for PvP. Here is some info from the Combat team.


Hello everyone,

We would like to take this opportunity to discuss Marauders/Sentinels and their present state in the game. To do so, we wish to start by outlining the rotational design philosophies of the three Marauder/Sentinel rotations.

Carnage/Combat: Low Rotation Difficulty, Moderate Burst and Moderate Sustained Damage
Annihilation/Watchman: High Rotation Difficulty, High Sustained and Low Burst Damage
Fury/Concentration: Moderate Rotation Difficulty, High Burst and Low Sustained Damage

Marauder/Sentinel PvP Viability:
As it presently stands, Carnage/Combat and Annihilation/Watchman are performing well in Solo Ranked and Group Ranked PvP, respectively. We target a 50% win rate for each Discipline in PvP, and Carnage/Combat and Annihilation/Watchman are slightly above this ideal win rate. Carnage/Combat is the seventh most effective Discipline (out of 24 Imperial/Republic total Disciplines) with a win rate that is right on target. Annihilation/Watchman is ranked seventh in Solo Ranked PvP (out of 24 Imperial/Republic total Disciplines) with a win rate that is equally on target. Additionally, Carnage/Combat is currently in one of the top 5 Group Ranked PvP class compositions, and this composition has an 82.6% win rate. While win rates are not the sole variable that we balance PvP performance from, these numbers provide evidence of Carnage/Combat and Annihilation/Watchman viability in broad PvP scenarios.

Fury/Concentration is in the lower half of the PvP spectrum. Like other classes that are underperforming, this is, and shall continue to be, addressed in upcoming class balance updates.

While we plan to adjust Marauders/Sentinels in future updates, we do not expect to see any Marauder/Sentinel Disciplines receiving significant damage output increases. Each of the Disciplines is presently performing at our desired DPS markers, and we plan to focus on Utility in the future. Specifically, mobility and self-healing improvements are currently being tested. Well keep you up to date on changes in the coming weeks.

It should be noted that PvP success is continually changing as updates reach live and the community learns new strategies with their classes.
Looking forward, we will continue to incrementally improve the status of Marauder/Sentinel Disciplines that are not performing to satisfaction. This is the perspective that we hold for all Disciplines across all classes.

We will continue to collect constructive feedback from the threads, concerning all classes, and apply improvements through our continual class balancing updates.

-The SWTOR Combat Team
Watchman/Annihilation and Carnage/Combat are NOT performing comparably in Solo Ranked and Group Ranked to other Melee DPS classes like Sins, PT's, and Juggernauts... Your the ones with the ratings stats, look at Ratings...

If you want, i'll pull the top for both Solo and Group Ranked of each of those classes

Solo: Mara: 1884 Sin: 2907! PT: 2865 Jugg: 2158.

Group: Mara: 1751 Sin: 1963 PT: 2062 Jugg: 1887.

The only class doing worse than Marauders is Group Ranked Merc and Solo Ranked Sniper. That's un-acceptable. Each class should be able to pull comparable Ranked numbers in both Group AND Solo! I think that you guys at Bioware need to start listening to the community more. Actually, scratch that HIRE some of these people in the community to work on your dev team! Have members of the community get paid to work for you to help balance the classes and be liaisons between the Dev Team and the community, have 2 members per class, or 24 people, one for PvP and one for PvE. This would be the best approach, because the PvP dev for one class can talk with the PvE dev for the same class on how to balance best for both sides of the coin, PvP and PvE.

Currently, Marauders are doing poorly in both PvE and PvP. This is due to several factors.

1. Other classes have several immunities that Marauders do not have access to, such as but not limited to, A second Croud Control Breaker, A root breaker that is NOT their Threat Dropper, Immunity from Croud Control for some period of time, A Purge, A cooldown reset for their main mobility skill (Force Charge/Force Leap in this case)

2. Other classes are able to out damage Marauders. This is simple, increase Marauder DPS.

3. Marauders are not Mobile enough. If we could Channel Ravage and move, this would help with mobility, along with several other already stated buffs.

4. Other factors I cannot think of.

Thanks for reading this wall of text and Good Hunting,

Mant'ax Starbound

MasterFeign's Avatar

04.06.2015 , 10:12 AM | #29
Funny, I always figured it would have been that carnage was slightly more difficult than fury, you know, due to the whole, gore mechanic and difficulty to staying on the opponent.

The metrics for the dev's outcome, does seem a little strange though, as others have mentioned. I mean, maybe if it's more prudent to balance sents/maras in regards to regs, then maybe it should be done that way.

But if say the sample size of maras are 200, where as there might be 900 hatred sins... well, you can't really balance around that.

cs_zoltan's Avatar

04.06.2015 , 10:12 AM | #30
Quote: Originally Posted by DynamiCtagez View Post
In all seriousness, if you think Marauders/Sentinels are performing well, you have literally no clue at all.
I think the difference between the highest rated Marauder (1884) and the highest rated of the other classes (especially Sin with 2907) should give you a SLIGHT (just VERY slight) hint how ridiculously wrong you are if you think you achieved anything close to balance.
Do you know the difference between overperfoming, underperforming and performing on target?
The ability to speak does not make you intelligent. Now get out of here.

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