Is it really too much to ask? Really?

Mythic doesn't exist anymore, mate...it's "new Mythic" now, the company that destroyed pvp in two "AAA" mmos (Swtor AAA, rofl...but nm).

Is it really too much to ask? Really?

It is. See, in DaOC if you traded a kill or a relic you got banned. No ifs, ands, or butts.

In this game it is perfectly legit or so it would appear. People group up, coordinate, or do it solo. They login to the other faction, run a level 10 or 11 out there to spy or coordinate, and again make it easy to complete. Call people on it or ask them to play accordingly and the insults start and logging is really the only solution other than leaving the zone. How or why Bioware would even level a lvl 10 out there is a whole issue all into its own but this is why what you ask for isn't going to happen.

Face it - pvp in that sense is dead. It died after Shrouded Isle expansion and the birth of WoW. Besides, would you cater to the 1% or the 99%?

You do the math.

It is. See, in DaOC if you traded a kill or a relic you got banned. No ifs, ands, or butts.

 

In this game it is perfectly legit or so it would appear. People group up, coordinate, or do it solo. They login to the other faction, run a level 10 or 11 out there to spy or coordinate, and again make it easy to complete. Call people on it or ask them to play accordingly and the insults start and logging is really the only solution other than leaving the zone. How or why Bioware would even level a lvl 10 out there is a whole issue all into its own but this is why what you ask for isn't going to happen.

 

Face it - pvp in that sense is dead. It died after Shrouded Isle expansion and the birth of WoW. Besides, would you cater to the 1% or the 99%?

 

You do the math.

But the 99% don't even know about real pvp. If they got the chance to experience it, maybe they would drop the "grind for epic gear and call it pvp" thing that WoW introduced?

But the 99% don't even know about real pvp. If they got the chance to experience it, maybe they would drop the "grind for epic gear and call it pvp" thing that WoW introduced?

Maybe. I really don't know so no argument from me.

Notice I didn't even mention the population issue I'm on the republic side of the house. Those that try to roam and complete stuff can maybe pull together 10 to 15 at best during peak hours. Last night (Monday) was a bit different due to people rushing to complete their weekly - maybe 30 at best is what I saw yet our Ops group fielded 17 at its peak.

Imperials that meet us brought at least 25 if not more. 17 vs. 25? Yeah, I'll sign up for that Molly Whoppin Might as well strap a matress to my back.

Population imbalance is huge. Client side performance is huge. It amazes me to this day that a game that dates back to 2001 could support 300+ people with reasonable performance during a relic seige yet this client struggles with 10

DaOC died for many different reasons. The main one being they tried to include PvE content to a PvP based game. You play WoW at all? See their class and gear balance issues? They didn't invent that oddly enough. Mythic had many of the same issues when they introduced Master Levels and artifacts during the Trials of Atlantis expansion pack.

If you come from WoW chances are you are part of the gotta have it now generation rather than work for anything. It is like loot needs to drop from the sky like skittles. I saw it with Aion when people complained about the drop rates. People would run instances and only see a blue crafting piece and nothing else. Yet WoW caters to dropping the world if you kill it.

And if you can't kill it, or only those who actually try, they nerf it to hell and back so everyone can. Not saying it is right or wrong, but there isn't any sense of accomplishment. Try as hard as they do to negate the statistics people put forth the data shows their raid look for group is clearing content on normal mode faster than that of normal progression. Heroics? Only the guilds dedicated and usually 10 man. 25's are gone...people already see that is more difficult on so many fronts it isn't funny.

Bad - please. You on Dragon Tear? Let's hook up and I'll show you bad. You can bring your sorc or your bounty hunter too because lightning and missiles are challenging, right?

I want DAOC with light sabers and pew pew! Is it really too much to ask? Really?

**** YES! This^ Do it now!

Heh, you got one fish =)

My post has nothing to do with the complaints prevalent here lately about class balance, pvp gear, etc.

My post is about "PvP for a reason". The meta-game to PvP if you will.

DAOC had it. Shadowbane had it. Eve has it, although the PvP itself is very different there (and personally unpalatable to me).

Unfortunately, it died with WoW and it's BGs, Arenas, and welfare epics. The current crowd of players who were exposed to pvp for the first time in the past couple of years won't grok the concept.

Heh, you got one fish =)

 

I'm not a fish But yeah - I feed the troll.

I'm not a fish But yeah - I feed the troll.

/grin

There are some things they could do pretty quick that would resolve a lot of this. I posted a few in the suggestion area in General.

1. Lock down Ilum to lvl 48 - 50 only. I'd vote for 50 due to the gear that drops but I understand once you complete your class quests it gives you a few out there. Then there are the dailies.

2. Assign a valor cap per player and level. This is more for world pvp than it is for a warzone. Example - lvl 50 is worth 1,000 valor. Solo kill nets the full 1,000. If a group of 4 are together or within a pre-defined range and that level 50 is killed, then the 1,000 valor is divided per group member and each would get 250. This allows those classes who can't tap the mob such as a healer who seems / appears to be getting the short end of the valor stick in Ilum.

It also helps those who play casually and could min/max their valor at their own pace yet fair across the board to all. Ops may get more kills at a faster rate but the valor pace is shared vs. that of solo play (main gate camping as a shealth anyone? Darkness Falls?).

3. Add diminishing returns on the same kill. Again, world pvp and Ilum focused. Putting a diminishing return on a kill would go a long way to reduce the win / kill trading that is going on out in Ilum. "IF" Bioware has some of the Mythic employees which we hear about then they are aware of this and would know how to do it....it isn't hard and would go a long ways I think.

4. Add a weekly lader and/or ranking system per class, per realm, guild, etc. This is tied to boasting and rewards other than shiny options.

I honestly think all the DoAC people are looking at the game through rose colored glasses. As with the first MMO i fell in love with i compare all things to it, but it doesn't mean it was better its just far more memorable because it was your first.

For me Everquest will always have the best PvE in any game, because i was in the uber guild that cleared the content the fastest always at the top but my experience in that game was much different then most. I think you will find the same with whatever game you came from and loved so much.

That being said they made some design choices possibly based on WoW, something they didnt expect or maybe didn't realize if you put PvP in a game players will find a way to kill each other regardless of rewards or gear.

Lastly everyone here assumes the design team has full control over the features in the game and how they are implemented, which simply isnt true in modern MMO's the brand team, the parent company, all have their fingers in the process which results in a less pure product.

Is it really too much to ask? Really?

http://www.dominusthegame.com/

I honestly think all the DoAC people are looking at the game through rose colored glasses. As with the first MMO i fell in love with i compare all things to it, but it doesn't mean it was better its just far more memorable because it was your first.

 

For me Everquest will always have the best PvE in any game, because i was in the uber guild that cleared the content the fastest always at the top but my experience in that game was much different then most. I think you will find the same with whatever game you came from and loved so much.

Might apply for some, but certainly not in my case.

I've been playing "MMOs" since the early text based MUD days...ran one, in fact. Played Ultima, Meridian 59, EQ1, etc...

Shadowbane was my first really great experience with a true PvP MMO. They got the core idea right...unfortunately, their implementation sucked worse than any other game I've ever seen. The game was buggy as hell, and it killed the population.

DAOC was second best in my book...again long after my "first game".

There are rose colored glasses involved...in that you're right. The memories imbued by that kind of epic PvP "for a reason" are everlasting and cherished.

Comparatively, queueing for WZs is...not.

I honestly think all the DoAC people are looking at the game through rose colored glasses. As with the first MMO i fell in love with i compare all things to it, but it doesn't mean it was better its just far more memorable because it was your first.

 

For me Everquest will always have the best PvE in any game, because i was in the uber guild that cleared the content the fastest always at the top but my experience in that game was much different then most. I think you will find the same with whatever game you came from and loved so much.

 

That being said they made some design choices possibly based on WoW, something they didnt expect or maybe didn't realize if you put PvP in a game players will find a way to kill each other regardless of rewards or gear.

 

Lastly everyone here assumes the design team has full control over the features in the game and how they are implemented, which simply isnt true in modern MMO's the brand team, the parent company, all have their fingers in the process which results in a less pure product.

No, you don't get it. DAoC had the best pvp system and will not be beaten until it's plain copied straight off. it has nothing to do with if it was people's first game or not, they just did almost everything right pvp-wise...that's how a game should be. Separate the PVPers from the PvEers and let the PvErs get the gear for the PvPers who in all honesty only wants to pvp for the fun of pvping.

But .... yeah WoW completely totally ****ed up the mmo market, BGs, Arenas, Ladders, Gear dependant crap systems is not how pvp should work, never has and it will never be good pvp with it. Problem is like it has been stated before, that 95% or so think that WoW PvP is PvP when it's so far far far from how PvP should actually be.

And i've played plenty of games before daoc and after daoc, and they ALL fail pvp after WoW ****ed the mmo's up for the very same reasons. 2 faction, geared based PvP instead of 100% skill based pvp in a separated open world zone!

http://www.dominusthegame.com/

Okay, that raised an eyebrow. That has real possibilities.

No, you don't get it. DAoC had the best pvp system and will not be beaten until it's plain copied straight off. it has nothing to do with if it was people's first game or not, they just did almost everything right pvp-wise...that's how a game should be. Separate the PVPers from the PvEers and let the PvErs get the gear for the PvPers who in all honesty only wants to pvp for the fun of pvping.

 

But .... yeah WoW completely totally ****ed up the mmo market, BGs, Arenas, Ladders, Gear dependant crap systems is not how pvp should work, never has and it will never be good pvp with it. Problem is like it has been stated before, that 95% or so think that WoW PvP is PvP when it's so far far far from how PvP should actually be.

 

And i've played plenty of games before daoc and after daoc, and they ALL fail pvp after WoW ****ed the mmo's up for the very same reasons. 2 faction, geared based PvP instead of 100% skill based pvp in a separated open world zone!

Hears the thing you dont understand is maybe for you DoAC pvp was awesome, for others maybe not, but regardless of that you cannot carbon copy what i am lead to believe was a perfect storm. You had good population balance, good player base with little to no exploiting, with a system that worked, being released at the ideal time for it to flourish.

Its just not going to happen.

As for the poster above i didnt say the first game you played its the first game you fell in love with, i played MUDS, UO, EQ, DOAC, AO, and pretty much every other mmo to date but fell in love with EQ and nothing will compare to the stories and memories i have from it.

http://www.dominusthegame.com/

Looks to be excellent indeed. I have been looking at it for a while now.

Difference between DaoC and SWTOR:

Daoc- PVP Based

SWTOR-RPG Based

Thats it folks, SWTOR is like Diablo2 (on a massive scale), where all you have to do is the story, leveling to 99 and get gear. You have no pvp other than duels there.

Enjoy SWTOR for what it is (KOTOR 3 Multiplayer) and not a PvP field, while you wait for greener grass

DAoC had a few simple things in it that dev teams amazingly fail to implement time and time again.

1. 3 factions - these balance each other out as when one becomes too powerful the weaker two would often have to work together(more like try to avoid confronting each other) to accomplish world pvp tasks/goals.

2. Open World PvP fortifications & objectives. Why is it so hard to give defensible positions to fight over? Capture a fortification of some sort and defend it, get points for defending or attacking it, make PvP FUN and not just 'kill 50x this guy to get a grab bag'.

3. A fun crafting system(not as good as SWG but was still pretty epic) that outshines SWTOR's afterthought crafting system.

To no fault of their own, these devs were hired to create a pve game but most players crave a combo of pve, crafting AND pvp. This game only offers quality in the PvE category.