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Post-Onslaught: The Way Forward. Solo, Crafting, PvP need love.

STAR WARS: The Old Republic > English > General Discussion
Post-Onslaught: The Way Forward. Solo, Crafting, PvP need love.

ZionHalcyon's Avatar


ZionHalcyon
11.14.2019 , 09:57 AM | #1
So, for anyone following the forums, they know I've been active on them, and have been offering counterpoints to the doom-criers who claim the game is dying, the expansion is horrible, etc. What its led me to figure out is that there is a disconnect for the game depending on your interests. The servers, such as they are now, are more full than they have been in a while, and more active, for certain types of content. However it has been a ghost town for others.

Now often, people get into tribal camps over content, but I think the game is in a place now where all play-types can be catered to; the issue is that it can't be catered to in all content, which is different from previous BioWare effort that would focus on an all or nothing approach in one area or another ultimately. Case in point, 5.0 era was the era of the solo player, and with 6.0 ushering grouping back into the game, its a jolt for the people here (not so much for returning players who left because group play got ignored).

However, I am suggesting here a different approach than the tribal one. Rather than make excuses why it can't happen, let's focus on what can and needs to change. I do think, after taking a step back, that PvP, Solo play and crafting need a lot of love right now to get them to a point where it feels as fun and rewarding as other types of gameplay. The whole "Play your way" mantra for Onslaught I think set BioWare up for failure - I do see what they were getting at to a point, but at this point, their idea of "play your way" was much more myopic compared to player expectations, which BioWare themselves perpetuated, albeit I believe this was not an instance of malicious "BioWare Lying", but rather one of an inadvertent communication disconnect and a failure to manage player expectations.

However, with the systems they put in place in Onslaught, I think it is actually EASIER to fix the issue now, and actually live up to what the players believed would happen, while still remaining within the confines of what the developers hope to accomplish with the game.


A breakdown of the 6.0 major issues I see that get in the way of this:


CRAFTING:

Crafting is a hot mess right now. Its cool that Keith is addressing this by reducing resource costs, but more needs to be done. I think, given that crafting in SWTOR was always perfunctory anyway and no subcomponents you make actually change the overall quality of what you put out, crafting needs to go the other way. SWG this is NOT. I would suggest they streamline crafting by removing all subcomponent requirements and going with straight resources, with perhaps the sole exception of gold tier crafted items. Gear is abundant enough now that having crafters flood the market with lower tier gear isn't going to kill any potential progress people are making. It may help them to gear faster, but with the amplifier system, even people who are fully geared "aren't done".

To compensate people who have subcomponents that get removed from the game, have it so that all obsolete subcomponents will refund the exact resources it took to make it.

Beyond that, I don't think I can suggest much more for crafting other than if people want a deeper system, it may take a complete overhaul of the entire system, which is beyond the scope of this post and the territory of expansions. Not that such an overhaul wouldn't be welcome for crafting-lovers, but lets face it - hard core crafters aren't playing this game anyway (by those I mean the crafters who love deep, compelling crafting systems).


PvP:

I will admit, I don't PvP a ton. However, post Onslaught, I have done it a few times for the daily and weekly missions for non-ranked, and my opinion is this: Gearing is WAY too slow, and too often, the PvP boxes gifted things well below my current iLevel. Now maybe it was just me, but it seemed like later, I was getting a PvP Box for every 2-3 matches I played, which actually feels about right how it should, so I think that if the boxes could be fixed to produce gear the way the other gearboxes do for Flashpoints and Operations, it would work much better. I would also increase the amount of gear given in PvP boxes for the Daily and weekly rewards - when you consider the amount of upgrades a player can get by running MM Flashpoints compared to PvP, there needs to be an equalizer without PvP becoming a faster way to get gear and thus preferred, and I think that way is with the daily and weekly missions which because of their nature can be planned for, and thus easier to statically set with what gear they get. I think this is crucial for PvP to feel like they fit in the current system.


Solo Play:

Solo players are feeling jilted because of the way the gearing system essentially ignores them in favor of PvP and Group play. MOST of the "hate" on the forums comes from solo players, with PvP coming in second but to a lesser extent. The thing is, while the whole game cannot be solo, I think there are already things in place to help solo players gear, if the dev team is willing to do it.

It should come in 3 different areas:

Area 1: Daily Missions

To a lesser extent, you can get gear from the Onderon Daily and Weekly, but it isn't enough. What I should say is, it isn't enough being just ONDERON. The dev team needs to revisit ALL the places where players can pick up Dailies (and their associated Weeklies), and give them the same treatment. For the weeklies as well, I would have added to the gear crate 1 guaranteed set bonus armor shell, selected from non-pvp 4 piece set bonus armor, with a rare chance a 6 piece set bonus armor drops. Because this is for solo play, I would say Daily missions should in the end only go up through green and blue tiers - Solo players generally don't need more than that unless they are taking on harder challenges (of which, more on that later). As an exception, I would have the Planet Dailies (complete x amount of dailies per day) grant 1 purple piece of armor once the user is high enough Irating, and weeklies grant 2 -3 pieces. The reason for solo players doing dailies beyond once they are geared would be for the set bonus shells and tacticals.

Area 2: Heroics

Heroics need a pass, badly. I get we get the Alliance crates at high levels. I am asking that the gear system be added to it. For heroics, in those Alliance crates, it should only cover up through purple tier. I would also suggest something - Heroic Planet Weekly Missions. As in a Weekly mission that rewards you tech fragments and gear for clearing all the heroics on the planet. Voss already has one like this. Attached to the weekly would be more tech frags and a gear crate that would help solo players keep pace with group players. The more heroics on a planet, the more tech frags you get, and the more gear pieces you get from the planetary crate. So Korriban might be very small, but Voss or even Korriban and Makeb would have higher amounts of techfrags and more gear because they have more heroics on them. The weeklies would also have a guaranteed 4 piece shell set bonus armor, with a rare (but greater than the Daily weekly mission from area 1) chance to get a 6 piece set bonus.

Area 3: The Eternal Championship

The Eternal Championship is essentially Operations for solo players. This should be the only way other than crafting for Solo players to get gold tier gear. However, I do not think that someone should be required to clear it for gear. Instead, since it is a set of 10 rounds, a player at the level where they are ready for gold tier gear should get gear on an increasingly sliding scale for each round completed - the more rounds you clear, the more gear you get for clearing each round. This should also be where solo players have the best shot to get 6 item set bonus armor, and class specific tacticals.

To further the fun for solo players, I would in a future update, create a new set of 10 challenges (and eventually another set of 10), so that there were 30 total challenges, 3 at each round level. Then randomize what the player gets. This will add a level of fun back for the solo players.

Once these changes are made, I would also have a terminal on fleet, the player starship (new legacy reward), and Odessen where players and instant travel to and from. Perhaps added to the Daily planet terminals in fleet (maybe it already is? I haven't used those terminals in a long time).

Bonus Area: Operations

Yeah, I know, not something I mentioned prior, but since we are talking, right now, there is little incentive to do Operations because you can get everything in MM Flashpoints. I would change this and make it so that EVERY boss in an operation has a chance to drop all tacticals and set pieces, and make the final Operations boss drop 1 guaranteed tactical and set piece. It's the highest tier of play in the game, and should be set up as such.



Anyway, those are my thoughts. I think the framework to make more people happy is in there, and actually closer than ever before thanks to the gear changes. But it needs to be applied properly, and right now, the areas that have been neglected really stand out.

If we really want to get to "play your way", it would be nice to see the above areas looked at. I say this as someone VERY satisfied overall with group play right now. Other people need that same love.

Hope this makes it to the right dev eyes and ears....

Kawiki's Avatar


Kawiki
11.14.2019 , 10:29 AM | #2
As a solo player and full (almost optimized) 306 I love the new gearing system but some tweaks are needed. Mainly, the drops should always be based on your iLevel regardless of content. There is no reason whatsoever to restrict gear in any manner. It's senseless to do so. Full disclosure, I can solo nearly all veteran FPs so your mileage may vary.

Crafting - Yep it's a mess. But you can still make scads of credits on it.

PvP - I like the fact you only get a box for a win. But again, when you get drops below your iLevel it is simply retarded.

Dailies/Weeklies. A box should be added to the weekly quests. There is a box drop from chapters, I don't see a reason to restrict it. Same with heroics, add a weekly reward per planet. Give incentive to run them. I have not run a single heroic since 6.0 dropped.

I have some other notes but have to run now. But it's the first time since very early in the game I'm actually considering sticking with the game for a while and not just running the new content and move on.

DuchessKristania's Avatar


DuchessKristania
11.14.2019 , 10:31 AM | #3
I agree with a lot of what you're saying. While I might change some of the details in your post, I completely agree with the spirit of it. For one thing, we need to get over the "them against us"mentality between player styles. All the types of game play need to be present and nurtured to maintain the health of the game. The updates and content need to be well-rounded. One player group alone is not enough to keep the game going. We need to back each other up, and think beyond our individual sandboxes.
#SaveSWTOR

♥Death Should Never Silence Love♥

Lhancelot's Avatar


Lhancelot
11.14.2019 , 10:36 AM | #4
Quote: Originally Posted by DuchessKristania View Post
For one thing, we need to get over the "them against us"mentality between player styles.
Always is the case. We always have those who dislike a certain ingame activity, so when the activities they enjoy get changed for the worst (in their opinion) they instantly blame the activity they dislike most for the changes.

This is a shortsighted mentality but lots of people do this on SWTOR as well as any other MMO for that matter that has PVE and PVP, oh and Storymode when talking about SWTOR. I even see story-mode players blame PVP and PVE for their lack of story.

To OP, yes PVP could use some serious improvements especially regarding tech frags awarded for PVP, and crafting is just a dumpster fire.
TRUE
Quote: Originally Posted by DarthSpuds View Post
RNG is counterproductive because it massively increases player dissatisfaction.
FALSE
Quote: Originally Posted by olagatonjedi View Post
As I detailed in another thread, RNG give the players more control over their gearing.

_NovaBlast_'s Avatar


_NovaBlast_
11.14.2019 , 10:38 AM | #5
Constructive criticism ..if you want to start another flame war..that's up to you also disclaimer i'm not pointing out every flaw since there are too many i disagree with .

Quote: Originally Posted by DuchessKristania View Post
I agree with a lot of what you're saying. While I might change some of the details in your post, I completely agree with the spirit of it. For one thing, we need to get over the "them against us"mentality between player styles. All the types of game play need to be present and nurtured to maintain the health of the game. The updates and content need to be well-rounded. One player group alone is not enough to keep the game going. We need to back each other up, and think beyond our individual sandboxes.
^^^^This is good ^^^^

First of all ...Desipe what you may this I do give you when credit due. This was a good attempt ..however due to your group bias I dont think it came out as well as you perceive it did.

1. in several places you are still drawing conclusions regarding why x happened, ( i saw this so this is fact" ) form your own expierance which is resulting in confirmation bias and also affected by your bias as as a part of the "group = real MMO" mentality and it is affecting what could have been a well intended piece comes out as covertly still trying to forward your agenda that "group play can save mmo"

2 . You are still appearing be an elitist and discriminatory towards one play style

Quote:
I would say Daily missions should in the end only go up through green and blue tiers
2a. It doesn't matter if the "need" it some people like to be overpowered .
2b There is nothing wrong with everything being easy or being soloable

IT DOES NOT stop people from choosing to group to do "hardmode stuff " for fun. As I explained below if someone choose not to group because they can get stuff on easy mode ...then that proves they are not grouping for enjoyment but for better look and you can't blame "everything soloable" on people CHOOSING not to group because they can get stuff on easy mode .

All of the above and below link is also link why you should not start a "group against solo players" for other who haven't seen it group play has be statically reported from other games to be the vast minority of the player base

group oriented ques and raids are generally the vast minority of a player base mmo that have reported such statistics.

http://www.swtor.com/community/showthread.php?t=750289


My opinion of a possible solution on how to make EVERYONE happy without EXCLUDING or discriminating against any playstyle or difficulty choice].

1. There should be NO BONUS or INCENTIVES to do ANY specific activity for any reason that way no one is
pseudo forced though FOMO or "Carrot" .. ohh i have go do this "specific this" so i can get that "specific this" or this pays out that ..so i don't like that but i want the thing so i'm going to do it anyways.

As I explained below if they changed and streamlined the loot system to no matter what activity or difficulty you did you still got the same " payout" and stopped capping how powerful people and boosting world mobs so can be ...so people can be as overpowered as they want ( pvp would probably need adjustment for balance reasons i don't know how pvp works now as i don't do that) if that is how they have fun

So there is literally no difference what you do in game if you want to OPS all day, PVP all day Starfighter, Dallies , Questing Heroics... whatever you find the most enjoyable ....you will not " lose out" at the end of the day ... then EVERYONE can do what they enjoy and no one loses and everyone ends up with the "best loot" regardless if they statistically need it for their play style.

IMO the way to fix the game is to give companion back item stats / boost them considerably while nerfing wold mos/boss ingneral. Easy mod will be happy and there are many various ways to improve the difficulty though stats armor abilities etc manipulation. for hardcore people

However crafting is another issue ... I don't know how to make or what crafting needs to be enjoyable undertis system All my toon have have some sort of crafting closed to 500-600 on them ...but i have found crafting so useless in the past do to better gear elsewhere i just level it and it sits unused.

I explained my reasoning below regarding grouping

Quote:
Logically Risk / reward effort /reward should not be a factor in a "play your own way system"

If someone finds their primary source of "fun" in content that takes "strategy" "knowing how to play " knowing mechanics" and 60 min of smashing buttons to clear one piece of content

.... why are they any better or deserve "better rewards" than people who don't??

The Motivation should NOT be "better loot" the PRIMARY reason they should be doing is because they enjoy doing it because that is the way they "Choose to play"

Level sync defeats the whole purpose of gear because you can never be "overpowered" anymore and raising difficulty content in a broad you are basically saying..." your fun is wrong if you don't like "challenge and want reward without "effort and "risk"

Why are you discriminating against someone who like to feel like they are a powerful unstoppable hero and can clear a veteran FP just solo with their companion smashing everything into oblivion without out every mob taking 5 min or the flash points IN STORY MODE taking 30 min or more to complete.

and here

Quote:
INB4 REEEE harder group content deserves better loot because effort /risk reward etc

harder content and raids are niche and the PRIMARY you should be doing such content because you enjoy it ..not because there is better loot... if you don't dont hard content because it "pays" the same as easy content ..then you are proving my point ...you are not doing it for "fun and challenge " you are doing it for better loot.

Ib4 REEEE "group ques would die if everything could be done easy /solo"

1. that statement itself proves my point completely .. like harder content it would simply show what people are doing for other reason than "enjoyment"

2. if you want to do such que instead of forcing people to do it for reason other than enjoyment ..the onus should be on the players to put the work in to find other player who have the same interests and not really on a que in the first place

Giving everyone choice to play how , the content and the difficulty they choose nd paying everyone the same it's the right choice for SWTOR because it does not EXCLUDE ANYONE...literally EVERYONE WINS.

Its a concept that seems to be very hard to understand with he REAL MMO MEANS GROUP mentality.
<3 Kira is back <3 YAY !!! ...for 2 min.... and then ..no interaction
Quote: Originally Posted by Nefla View Post
If you're playing a BioWare game for something other than story and characters then you're doing it wrong.
UNSUBBED https://ibb.co/sVsmNyp

DuchessKristania's Avatar


DuchessKristania
11.14.2019 , 10:48 AM | #6
Quote: Originally Posted by Lhancelot View Post
Always is the case. We always have those who dislike a certain ingame activity, so when the activities they enjoy get changed for the worst (in their opinion) they instantly blame the activity they dislike most for the changes.

This is a shortsighted mentality but lots of people do this on SWTOR as well as any other MMO for that matter that has PVE and PVP, oh and Storymode when talking about SWTOR. I even see story-mode players blame PVP and PVE for their lack of story.

To OP, yes PVP could use some serious improvements especially regarding tech frags awarded for PVP, and crafting is just a dumpster fire.
Oh yes! It's always the other guy's fault, lol. To be honest, it's probably far more of an issue in the forums than it is in the actual game. I mean you get the odd conversations in chat where people start going at it, but I tend to think most people actually play the game when logged in, lol.
#SaveSWTOR

♥Death Should Never Silence Love♥

OlBuzzard's Avatar


OlBuzzard
11.14.2019 , 11:06 AM | #7
Quote: Originally Posted by DuchessKristania View Post
I agree with a lot of what you're saying. While I might change some of the details in your post, I completely agree with the spirit of it. For one thing, we need to get over the "them against us"mentality between player styles. All the types of game play need to be present and nurtured to maintain the health of the game. The updates and content need to be well-rounded. One player group alone is not enough to keep the game going. We need to back each other up, and think beyond our individual sandboxes.
TYVM... I've said this repeatedly... (and a few others as well).

In another thread I have suggested a means of which we can keep difficulty levels available even for the more challenging styles of players.

I still believe that aggressively continuing to expand a system where multiple styles of players are welcomed and encouraged to play at a level that is rewarding not just in "items received in game" but to a personal level as well benefits everyone... ESPECIALLY the development team !

Best Regards
Ol Buzzard
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OlBuzzard's Avatar


OlBuzzard
11.14.2019 , 11:09 AM | #8
Quote: Originally Posted by ZionHalcyon View Post
So, for anyone following the forums, they know I've been active on them, and have been offering counterpoints to the doom-criers who claim the game is dying, the expansion is horrible, etc. What its led me to figure out is that there is a disconnect for the game depending on your interests. The servers, such as they are now, are more full than they have been in a while, and more active, for certain types of content. However it has been a ghost town for others.

Now often, people get into tribal camps over content, but I think the game is in a place now where all play-types can be catered to; the issue is that it can't be catered to in all content, which is different from previous BioWare effort that would focus on an all or nothing approach in one area or another ultimately. Case in point, 5.0 era was the era of the solo player, and with 6.0 ushering grouping back into the game, its a jolt for the people here (not so much for returning players who left because group play got ignored).

However, I am suggesting here a different approach than the tribal one. Rather than make excuses why it can't happen, let's focus on what can and needs to change. I do think, after taking a step back, that PvP, Solo play and crafting need a lot of love right now to get them to a point where it feels as fun and rewarding as other types of gameplay. The whole "Play your way" mantra for Onslaught I think set BioWare up for failure - I do see what they were getting at to a point, but at this point, their idea of "play your way" was much more myopic compared to player expectations, which BioWare themselves perpetuated, albeit I believe this was not an instance of malicious "BioWare Lying", but rather one of an inadvertent communication disconnect and a failure to manage player expectations.

However, with the systems they put in place in Onslaught, I think it is actually EASIER to fix the issue now, and actually live up to what the players believed would happen, while still remaining within the confines of what the developers hope to accomplish with the game.


A breakdown of the 6.0 major issues I see that get in the way of this:


CRAFTING:

Crafting is a hot mess right now. Its cool that Keith is addressing this by reducing resource costs, but more needs to be done. I think, given that crafting in SWTOR was always perfunctory anyway and no subcomponents you make actually change the overall quality of what you put out, crafting needs to go the other way. SWG this is NOT. I would suggest they streamline crafting by removing all subcomponent requirements and going with straight resources, with perhaps the sole exception of gold tier crafted items. Gear is abundant enough now that having crafters flood the market with lower tier gear isn't going to kill any potential progress people are making. It may help them to gear faster, but with the amplifier system, even people who are fully geared "aren't done".

To compensate people who have subcomponents that get removed from the game, have it so that all obsolete subcomponents will refund the exact resources it took to make it.

Beyond that, I don't think I can suggest much more for crafting other than if people want a deeper system, it may take a complete overhaul of the entire system, which is beyond the scope of this post and the territory of expansions. Not that such an overhaul wouldn't be welcome for crafting-lovers, but lets face it - hard core crafters aren't playing this game anyway (by those I mean the crafters who love deep, compelling crafting systems).


PvP:

I will admit, I don't PvP a ton. However, post Onslaught, I have done it a few times for the daily and weekly missions for non-ranked, and my opinion is this: Gearing is WAY too slow, and too often, the PvP boxes gifted things well below my current iLevel. Now maybe it was just me, but it seemed like later, I was getting a PvP Box for every 2-3 matches I played, which actually feels about right how it should, so I think that if the boxes could be fixed to produce gear the way the other gearboxes do for Flashpoints and Operations, it would work much better. I would also increase the amount of gear given in PvP boxes for the Daily and weekly rewards - when you consider the amount of upgrades a player can get by running MM Flashpoints compared to PvP, there needs to be an equalizer without PvP becoming a faster way to get gear and thus preferred, and I think that way is with the daily and weekly missions which because of their nature can be planned for, and thus easier to statically set with what gear they get. I think this is crucial for PvP to feel like they fit in the current system.


Solo Play:

Solo players are feeling jilted because of the way the gearing system essentially ignores them in favor of PvP and Group play. MOST of the "hate" on the forums comes from solo players, with PvP coming in second but to a lesser extent. The thing is, while the whole game cannot be solo, I think there are already things in place to help solo players gear, if the dev team is willing to do it.

It should come in 3 different areas:

Area 1: Daily Missions

To a lesser extent, you can get gear from the Onderon Daily and Weekly, but it isn't enough. What I should say is, it isn't enough being just ONDERON. The dev team needs to revisit ALL the places where players can pick up Dailies (and their associated Weeklies), and give them the same treatment. For the weeklies as well, I would have added to the gear crate 1 guaranteed set bonus armor shell, selected from non-pvp 4 piece set bonus armor, with a rare chance a 6 piece set bonus armor drops. Because this is for solo play, I would say Daily missions should in the end only go up through green and blue tiers - Solo players generally don't need more than that unless they are taking on harder challenges (of which, more on that later). As an exception, I would have the Planet Dailies (complete x amount of dailies per day) grant 1 purple piece of armor once the user is high enough Irating, and weeklies grant 2 -3 pieces. The reason for solo players doing dailies beyond once they are geared would be for the set bonus shells and tacticals.

Area 2: Heroics

Heroics need a pass, badly. I get we get the Alliance crates at high levels. I am asking that the gear system be added to it. For heroics, in those Alliance crates, it should only cover up through purple tier. I would also suggest something - Heroic Planet Weekly Missions. As in a Weekly mission that rewards you tech fragments and gear for clearing all the heroics on the planet. Voss already has one like this. Attached to the weekly would be more tech frags and a gear crate that would help solo players keep pace with group players. The more heroics on a planet, the more tech frags you get, and the more gear pieces you get from the planetary crate. So Korriban might be very small, but Voss or even Korriban and Makeb would have higher amounts of techfrags and more gear because they have more heroics on them. The weeklies would also have a guaranteed 4 piece shell set bonus armor, with a rare (but greater than the Daily weekly mission from area 1) chance to get a 6 piece set bonus.

Area 3: The Eternal Championship

The Eternal Championship is essentially Operations for solo players. This should be the only way other than crafting for Solo players to get gold tier gear. However, I do not think that someone should be required to clear it for gear. Instead, since it is a set of 10 rounds, a player at the level where they are ready for gold tier gear should get gear on an increasingly sliding scale for each round completed - the more rounds you clear, the more gear you get for clearing each round. This should also be where solo players have the best shot to get 6 item set bonus armor, and class specific tacticals.

To further the fun for solo players, I would in a future update, create a new set of 10 challenges (and eventually another set of 10), so that there were 30 total challenges, 3 at each round level. Then randomize what the player gets. This will add a level of fun back for the solo players.

Once these changes are made, I would also have a terminal on fleet, the player starship (new legacy reward), and Odessen where players and instant travel to and from. Perhaps added to the Daily planet terminals in fleet (maybe it already is? I haven't used those terminals in a long time).

Bonus Area: Operations

Yeah, I know, not something I mentioned prior, but since we are talking, right now, there is little incentive to do Operations because you can get everything in MM Flashpoints. I would change this and make it so that EVERY boss in an operation has a chance to drop all tacticals and set pieces, and make the final Operations boss drop 1 guaranteed tactical and set piece. It's the highest tier of play in the game, and should be set up as such.



Anyway, those are my thoughts. I think the framework to make more people happy is in there, and actually closer than ever before thanks to the gear changes. But it needs to be applied properly, and right now, the areas that have been neglected really stand out.

If we really want to get to "play your way", it would be nice to see the above areas looked at. I say this as someone VERY satisfied overall with group play right now. Other people need that same love.

Hope this makes it to the right dev eyes and ears....
Better !! MUCH better !

Add this to what I've recommended ! And between the two you have a solid foundation !
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VarnieTsk's Avatar


VarnieTsk
11.14.2019 , 11:58 AM | #9
One thing I'm seeing is a continuing assumption that *all* players, whatever their playstyle, want or even give a fig for ops, dailies, gearing, FPs, adrenaline surges, constant combat, min-maxing, challenges, end-game, and so on. I'm also seeing a distinct lack of attention to the newbies, who imo are what you really want to attract to this game rather than assuming everyone wants to blast through all the lower content without even seeing it in order to reach end-game as quickly as possible. Personally I'm one who doesn't. So naturally my opinion on all this is going to lean heavily towards story and "flower sniffing" playstyle, and playing *My* way.

I can tell you that having returned to this game expressly for the story and solo play, I really don't give a fat, flying, flip for the end game stuff and the consequential ramping up of difficulty that seeps into the lower levels as well. If I want a challenging, non-stop adrenaline rush I'll play PUBG. When I want a relaxing, story driven roleplaying experience, I'll play a story driven, roleplaying game, put on my headphones, light some incense, and try to lose myself in the story with me as the hero (or villain depending on my mood, lol).

And having been away as long as I was (I left before the first expansion), I am in a position to see this game from a newbie's perspective. It's very disconcerting to immediately be handed a bunch of xp boosters at every turn. The levels are flying by so fast that without using a single one, I am still over level for the entire game beyond the starter planet, which in turn makes my character gimped with the reduced endurance. Took me forever to figure out what the heck was going on there.

So, the new person is going along thinking they're doing good, gaining levels, having fun, upgrading equipment with mods, etc. and all of a sudden BAM, run into brick walls while doing nothing more than their class story. The difficulty starts ramping up at a steep rate. And you start getting your backside handed to you every time you turn around, as well as near constant combat just to move a little closer to your objective. Not everyone appreciates that.

In addition to that, there are places where you're completely blocked by uber elite mobs, totally out of place in the progression of the story, blocking the way to continuing without having to do some major internet sleuthing to figure out what the hell just happened. Talk about immersion breaking. Jeez.

The first time I hit that was on Tatooine where one republic quest points the way through imperial territory. Come to find out, after internet sleuthing, there is an obscure tunnel that gets you through. Great, thanks!!! Another one is on Hoth where the pointer points you through imperial territory on the south of the map which, after sleuthing, turns out to be a major, years-old, bug that is still obviously not fixed where the pointer is in the wrong place and the actual entrance is to the far north in another area entirely. Now maybe this is no big deal to those who have known about this for years and just skip on through, but for a new player it is almost enough to cause a rage-quit.

So, to repeat myself, attention needs to be given to the new player experience so as to attract (and keep) new people. And attention needs to be given to the casual, solo, flower sniffing types. The Star Wars fans who are not necessarily gamers at all, much less power gamers.

Catering to the end-game, and the power game, and all the loyal players who have been here all along is great as long as it's not at the expense of the low levels and as long as the power-creep doesn't trickle down into the lower levels. Then again, if they are content with the current player numbers and not concerned with an influx of new blood and wish to continue balancing everything around the end game, then I guess they're on the right path and my concerns are of no consequence.

Personally I doubt I will ever play beyond the original story content. Not only does it not interest me, but it's already starting to become a slog to continue with all the elites I have to fight through now just to do my story. Time to start a new character in a different class and enjoy the lowby stuff again. If I wanted that kind of challenge on a daily basis I'd be doing FPs and OPs and stuff or maybe even PvP.

And just as a disclaimer before anyone "advises' me to L2P. I started playing mmos on the first day that Ultima Online hit the internet in 1997 and have played many, many others all these years. I've been playing mmos probably longer than a lot here have been alive. Just because I choose not to be a spread-sheet warrior in a roleplaying game doesn't mean I don't know how. I don't need to L2P. I need (or I should say *want*) to find a game that isn't balancing the game around the end game, leaving newbies to flounder, and assuming that everyone wants a non-stop, exciting, adrenaline laced, difficult combat experience. Like I said, there's PUBG for that.

ZionHalcyon's Avatar


ZionHalcyon
11.14.2019 , 12:30 PM | #10
Quote: Originally Posted by Lhancelot View Post
Always is the case. We always have those who dislike a certain ingame activity, so when the activities they enjoy get changed for the worst (in their opinion) they instantly blame the activity they dislike most for the changes.

This is a shortsighted mentality but lots of people do this on SWTOR as well as any other MMO for that matter that has PVE and PVP, oh and Storymode when talking about SWTOR. I even see story-mode players blame PVP and PVE for their lack of story.

To OP, yes PVP could use some serious improvements especially regarding tech frags awarded for PVP, and crafting is just a dumpster fire.
To be fair, BioWare has helped foster the tribalism in the past due to a lack of communication and community management.

Looking at Onslaught, the lead in, and beyond - it gives me some hope that we might be in a spot to change that. And also, ironically, the gearing system a few people claim to hate actually is set up in a way to best service all these different play styles, so its the very RNG loot system that makes having this conversation possible. And honestly, as someone who has taken their time doing all sorts of content to get a character to 306, it is not as bad as everyone says overall - but it has to be properly implemented. I get the feeling it was for group play, but for the areas I mentioned, it was completely overlooked.

I'm hoping they see this and grant some love to the PvP and Solo players. There's more than enough to go around.