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Petition to Rectify Class Balance! (PVE and PVP)

STAR WARS: The Old Republic > English > Classes > Roles
Petition to Rectify Class Balance! (PVE and PVP)

GrandLordMenace's Avatar


GrandLordMenace
11.14.2015 , 12:16 PM | #1
Now that 4.0 has been out for a while, I'd like to address a few concerns I've noticed.

It seems that the community has taken the time to experience the new update, and a few things have become apparent: Class Balance is a mess.

AP PTs are getting more and more and MORE powerful, in PVP and PVE, and while we don't have metrics yet for PVP due to the ranked season not starting yet, we can only examine the facts: Super crit is very strong for PTs with Explosive Fuel, and they do very high damage, especially for a single target burst spec.

In general, the PVP TTK is too short and a total mess, due to the return to a prevalence of burst due to the singular fact that AP PTs are becoming more FOTM than they already were. It's a well known fact that Sorcerer heals are strong, as well as their damage cousins, but why aren't we hearing about Sorc DPS anymore? Only healers? Because currently, PTs can match or at least get extremely close to Sorcerer Damage, but with pure single target and burst. This is broken. When the overpowered AOE sustained spec gets matched in pure damage by the Single Target Burst spec, we have a massive balance problem.

For PVE, the problems are a little more manifold. From what I understand, there are a few classes that took under the table coefficient nerfs, that were never mentioned in the patch notes, but even a cursory examination of logs evidently shows. Pyrotech Powertechs, Vengeance Juggernauts, Concealment Operatives, Fury Mara / Rage Jugg, and Innovative Ordinance Mercenaries have literally been gutpunched and castrated in damage. All of these specializations, were nerfed significantly and brutally with talent nerfs, direct ability nerfs, and critical chance nerfs, while AP PT, the current PVE AND PVP top dog, has not seen any nerfs, only the new talent, and they were already strong to begin with in 3.0.

So my question is:

Bioware. What were you thinking? Outside of PVP sorc, realistically the class balance in 3.0 was FINE. You had some outliers, but the outliers made sense. IO was more difficult to learn, so it yielded higher damage. Was it PVE FOTM? Heck yeah, but it was not the end all be all, because it had weaknesses. AP PT has literally no weakness that matters. It does high dummy numbers, can translate perfectly to bosses, has 0 mobility weaknesses, and has good passive damage reduction and passable cooldowns, AND GAINS DAMAGE on several bosses. The only real weakness is a lack of AOE, but who cares how much AOE you do when you can global 2 targets in succession?

SO: I'd like to discuss solutions.

We know that even with the current state of PT, the Damage Checks in Nightmare are very competitive. We also know that PVP TTK is too short.

Solution: Make the PVP healing trauma debuff a tad stronger, part of the current PVP TTK problem is an overreliance on healers for increasing or decreasing the TTK, which is important, but moving a tad away from that can't hurt.

Increase the damage reduction that expertise affords significantly. This is to continue the emphasis shift slightly from healing into mitigation.

Then, undo several, if not all of the coefficient nerfs that were done underhandedly in 4.0, or have theorycrafters gain access to the coefficients, and be allowed to extrapolate potential damage numbers based on the raw data we have now.
Rydarus Veneris the Revanchist, Beater #fedaracarrychist
Vigilance Guardian guide on Dulfy! Like my guide? Support my Referral Link!
Last Guardian DPS because dead game

Alec_Fortescue's Avatar


Alec_Fortescue
11.14.2015 , 01:38 PM | #2
Petitions are against forum rules!

/signed nevertheless. I am annoyed with the state of Guardians and being pve underdogs for years and giving love to same classes over and over the years!

Unnerf Guardians =[

Sevarn's Avatar


Sevarn
11.14.2015 , 02:11 PM | #3
Well said

/signed
Khruger Guardian TOFN

CRYPTfromLA's Avatar


CRYPTfromLA
11.14.2015 , 02:22 PM | #4
Unnerf Vengeance Juggs
as was said to me, Pve content for jugg is closed

/signed

dwiekopy's Avatar


dwiekopy
11.14.2015 , 02:26 PM | #5
unnerf scrapper/concealment
FIX AOE!!!
/signed

MBloomberg's Avatar


MBloomberg
11.14.2015 , 03:49 PM | #6
Just like it says, we need more balance, the nim dps checks in some ops are incredibly ridiculous and if you don't bring a class like PT or Sniper you barely have a chance of beating the checks

A gap of 900-1k dps between the highest parsers (engineering) and lowest (jugg/guards) is pathetic

/signed
Maalacharizard The Guardian/Juggernaut Revanchist
10/10 HM Tos/Rav
<The Last Dark Reapers>

AndoEyrune's Avatar


AndoEyrune
11.14.2015 , 03:53 PM | #7
I miss having my veng jugg be good

/signed
Vendrine <LØS>

"I'm Done"
-Kytera 2016 (RIP)

Lodinn's Avatar


Lodinn
11.14.2015 , 04:52 PM | #8
Solution: Just tune numbers, don't *********** try to balance classes by changing abilities. To cut 2% damage output you don't have to revamp the whole ability tree, all you need is... Tadaaa! Multiply every single number on ability by 0.98.

To refine it bit better take some parses on dummy and a boss, find the split between abilities shared by many specs and spec-specific ones, solve some simple system of linear (!) equations and obtain the same. Not a rocket science, exactly.

Oh, and revert my mara movement to pre-4.0 state pleeeease.

/signed.

P.s. A friend of mine raided at top lvl on vengeance jugg the whole 3.0 and still rolling it now, says it feels good. If to take AP PT out of the picture it becomes way less ridiculous but it may be just a matter of contrast/dynamic range.
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Sneitha | Ton'itra | Lodinn | Flèchette | Tiponi |
Pls'taunt | Gjalla/This'is'madness | Guédé | Cornifer
TRE pugging all the way [IMP]

GrandLordMenace's Avatar


GrandLordMenace
11.14.2015 , 04:58 PM | #9
Quote: Originally Posted by Lodinn View Post
Solution: Just tune numbers, don't *********** try to balance classes by changing abilities. To cut 2% damage output you don't have to revamp the whole ability tree, all you need is... Tadaaa! Multiply every single number on ability by 0.98.

To refine it bit better take some parses on dummy and a boss, find the split between abilities shared by many specs and spec-specific ones, solve some simple system of linear (!) equations and obtain the same. Not a rocket science, exactly.

Oh, and revert my mara movement to pre-4.0 state pleeeease.

/signed.

P.s. A friend of mine raided at top lvl on vengeance jugg the whole 3.0 and still rolling it now, says it feels good. If to take AP PT out of the picture it becomes way less ridiculous but it may be just a matter of contrast/dynamic range.
I don't know any of the Jugg Revanchists that are satisfied with the current status quo, if they exist, please tell them to PM me.
Rydarus Veneris the Revanchist, Beater #fedaracarrychist
Vigilance Guardian guide on Dulfy! Like my guide? Support my Referral Link!
Last Guardian DPS because dead game

Arkhonos's Avatar


Arkhonos
11.14.2015 , 05:27 PM | #10
I agree with this post.
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