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Guardian/Juggernaut Vigilance/Vengeance Guide (3.0+) by Vesev and AndrewPast

STAR WARS: The Old Republic > English > Classes > Guardian / Juggernaut
Guardian/Juggernaut Vigilance/Vengeance Guide (3.0+) by Vesev and AndrewPast

wadecounty's Avatar


wadecounty
01.09.2015 , 12:04 PM | #121
Quote: Originally Posted by veSev View Post
Sounds similar to my Opener. I occasionally see the 1st two hits of MS hit for 10k+, but then looking in my log they hit between 3k-5k. I really should make a video of this because I'm not entirely sure what causes it other than the timing of my adrenal.

Btw, anyone else on Torque notice that the fire double spawns in HM? Finally got past Bulo after about 3 hrs worth of pulls last night, but hit a wall with Torque and tanks/myself working out how to effectively stack the fire.
From what I've seen it appears the fire spawns on tanks and melee DPS, I just move as it spawns personally. That fight is kind of a joke for healers anyways from what they've told me, literally the only time they have to worry slightly is when fire goes up. What I'm curious is, what does your raid group have you do for that fight?

We were running with a Sniper, Merc and Sorc... at first they had me on adds, but it was a bit rough for me, Sniper/Sorc were aoeing the walls and Merc was sitting on boss basically. I'd be at around 3100-3500 on those pulls, Sniper/Sorc 3800-4k, Merc 3500... then we did me on boss, Sniper on adds and Merc/Sorc on aoe duty, I'd be 3800-4k, Sniper 3100-3500, and Merc/Sorc at 3k/3.8-4k respectively. Merc was underperforming (normally one of our main healers) so we shuffled in a Sin, but it was late and we were getting sloppy so only did a couple more pulls and stopped, haven't gone back yet this week.

I dunno why, but it seems like I almost handled add duty better than our sniper. I'm guessing its cause of how easy it is to spread aoe with Vengeful Slam, I also picked up extra damage on shoots lasers with taunt/reflect whenever possible. Its a pain dealing with the fire droids, but if you're careful its not too bad. We probably would've had it downed but overall DPS was too low (like I said, merc is normally our healer and doesn't DPS often).
Kandel - Juggernaut Lef - Guardian
Nyeetra - Assassin Milarra - Sage
Lendros - Mercenary Jakor - Vanguard
Iseline - Operative Lysandere - Gunslinger

veSev's Avatar


veSev
01.09.2015 , 12:22 PM | #122
Quote: Originally Posted by wadecounty View Post
From what I've seen it appears the fire spawns on tanks and melee DPS, I just move as it spawns personally. What I'm curious is, what does your raid group have you do for that fight?

We were running with a Sniper, Merc and Sorc... at first they had me on adds, but it was a bit rough for me, Sniper/Sorc were aoeing the walls and Merc was sitting on boss basically. I'd be at around 3100-3500 on those pulls, Sniper/Sorc 3800-4k, Merc 3500... then we did me on boss, Sniper on adds and Merc/Sorc on aoe duty, I'd be 3800-4k, Sniper 3100-3500, and Merc/Sorc at 3k/3.8-4k respectively. Merc was underperforming (normally one of our main healers) so we shuffled in a Sin, but it was late and we were getting sloppy so only did a couple more pulls and stopped, haven't gone back yet this week.

I dunno why, but it seems like I almost handled add duty better than our sniper. I'm guessing its cause of how easy it is to spread aoe with Vengeful Slam, I also picked up extra damage on shoots lasers with taunt/reflect whenever possible. Its a pain dealing with the fire droids, but if you're careful its not too bad. We probably would've had it downed but overall DPS was too low (like I said, merc is normally our healer and doesn't DPS often).
Considering we got 5 pulls in before most headed off for the night, we had people doing specific roles, but nothing is set in stone as of yet. For the moment, I am on boss and blocking/killing Shoots Lazer. We were running the same comp, Gunslinger, Mando and Sage. We had the Sage and Gunslinger on Turrets, since Quake+SGF is pretty solid AOE wise with the utility buff, and the Mando was on Fire Device adds.

The last pull it seemed to be working well. We got through 2 fixes, but then the double fire got one of the tanks and it spiraled from there. We got decent rotation of consoles going the last pull I was able to AOE some of the turrets. My DPS was decent sitting around 3.8K+, but the pulls werent long enough to say I could sustain that yet. As of now, I think our biggest issue in the fight is overcoming the wall of fire.

Personally, idk why BW decided to penalize mdps/tanks so much in this fight. I'd like to see 1 fire puddle per person instead. Would force everyone to move instead of 3/8 people in the group. I know mdps have it tougher this tier than before, but this mechanic seems a bit too specific to us. It's doable, but going to be a pain the entire time.
The Vezev Legacy

Twitch: https://www.twitch.tv/ivezev | Twitter: https://twitter.com/Vezev

wadecounty's Avatar


wadecounty
01.09.2015 , 12:30 PM | #123
Yeah this fight specifically is kind of a joke as ranged DPS, makes no sense. I do like your raids split of you on shoots lasers and ranged on fire devices, I dunno why the hell we didn't do that, I hate having to kill those things, have to be so careful. Once your tanks get used to it though you'll find its a pretty easy fight other than it being a tight DPS check. One thing I told our tanks, when fire comes, don't just move til you're safe, keep moving til you're way the hell out of the fire, so I have room to safely leap in and DPS as well, that helped a bit.
Kandel - Juggernaut Lef - Guardian
Nyeetra - Assassin Milarra - Sage
Lendros - Mercenary Jakor - Vanguard
Iseline - Operative Lysandere - Gunslinger

darth_psychose's Avatar


darth_psychose
01.09.2015 , 03:37 PM | #124
Quote: Originally Posted by veSev View Post
Sounds similar to my Opener. I occasionally see the 1st two hits of MS hit for 10k+, but then looking in my log they hit between 3k-5k. I really should make a video of this because I'm not entirely sure what causes it other than the timing of my adrenal.
oh, never happen to me 1st and 2nd dmg hit normal dmg or normal crit dmg but the third just didn't exist.

Quote: Originally Posted by veSev View Post
Btw, anyone else on Torque notice that the fire double spawns in HM? Finally got past Bulo after about 3 hrs worth of pulls last night, but hit a wall with Torque and tanks/myself working out how to effectively stack the fire.
i didn't notice that, from what i saw there 4 consecutively fire spawn on melee and tanks. Btw, quite easy to avoid. So great when your are alone to depop small turrets with saber reflect + vigilant thrust
Kala - <Rash> - Discord : Kala#9344

veSev's Avatar


veSev
01.09.2015 , 04:54 PM | #125
Quote: Originally Posted by darth_psychose View Post
oh, never happen to me 1st and 2nd dmg hit normal dmg or normal crit dmg but the third just didn't exist.

i didn't notice that, from what i saw there 4 consecutively fire spawn on melee and tanks. Btw, quite easy to avoid. So great when your are alone to depop small turrets with saber reflect + vigilant thrust
Yeah, I will make a video of it next time I sit down and parse because it's fairly common for me. But you maybe correct, through 5 pulls, I saw it double spawn on me a few times and our tanks died a few times from having a fire spawn, then the knockback into another fire on the opposite side of the room. But it would seem that the fire may be Saber Reflect-able. At least that is what one of our tanks experienced last night (ran 2 guardian tanks). Will try next time we raid.
The Vezev Legacy

Twitch: https://www.twitch.tv/ivezev | Twitter: https://twitter.com/Vezev

darth_psychose's Avatar


darth_psychose
01.10.2015 , 08:58 AM | #126
this afternoon i was tryin alacrity just for test. I don't know if the following parse is due (at x%) to this alacrity but i share this to you. (shame on me 95% crit on blade storm ;p)

parse
stuff

192 (4pc + 2pc 186) + 2aug alacrity/1enhanc alac + 2augsurge
Kala - <Rash> - Discord : Kala#9344

Manweth's Avatar


Manweth
01.10.2015 , 11:55 AM | #127
My two cents on Torque, whom I killed last night as the only melee in grp & top dps, with a top spec TK sage on the field as well.


Double fire spawns, but it's on a timer that is easy to tell. I got used to it,avoiding all but a few first ticks.

Shoots Lasers is completely my responsibility, and as it usually spawns near boss, constant stream of DoTs on boss is applied onto it, the turrets nearby ( as tanks prefer one side to avoid the stupid bug with the Fix4U) and Dangerous Fire Devices. Sheer amount of AOE damage aside, the DoT spread of Vİgilant Thrust / Vengeful Slam in that fight is NUMERO UNO. Ours is instant application, no waiting or explosion needed, possibly the BEST and most probably the only choice as a melee dps in that fight.

In instants where I was boxed in by fires and devices, GUardian Leap to healers or our sage worked like a charm.

While killing Shoots Lasers, turrets would lock on and whittle away my HP en masse. Reflect should be KEPT for that instant. It ALSO reflects the Lasers' big laser hit onto itself, effectively killing it most of the time.

Pretty much spam the Challenging call. Damage reduced from that, according to one of my healers, was in the range of 100k total, which allowed them some breathing room as tanks were pummeled by Torque.

Pair up with a TK sage if you can. AOE damage increase applied on an AOE skill ( TK wave) make them superb choices for the fight and they augment your direct AOE as well. Vigilant Thrust is one of the strongest instant AOEs in the game, and it shows.

And learn to dance. I had an epic music track running in the background, coz hell, I danced like Fred Astaire in the gosh darn kill run.
Manw, Former Vigilance Player and Guardian Advocate.
Former Raider. Eternal Revan Fanboy.
Nothing else matters at this point.

Joran-Koon's Avatar


Joran-Koon
01.10.2015 , 03:52 PM | #128
Quote: Originally Posted by Manweth View Post
My two cents on Torque, whom I killed last night as the only melee in grp & top dps, with a top spec TK sage on the field as well
lol the most unnecessary thing of your entire post. Cool story.

Vesev, I do still owe you a talk ops wise, if you're free today or sometime randomly in the next few days we can have an erp session. your group comp is actually very strong for that fight.
Kalizo
Failure
Twitch

Manweth's Avatar


Manweth
01.10.2015 , 04:24 PM | #129
Quote: Originally Posted by Joran-Koon View Post
lol the most unnecessary thing of your entire post. Cool story.

Vesev, I do still owe you a talk ops wise, if you're free today or sometime randomly in the next few days we can have an erp session. your group comp is actually very strong for that fight.
Why unnecessary? I gotta say, with all the AOEs, some tries he was pulling 5k numbers, he didn't get it on kill, but a TK sage is a fearsome weapon in that fight.
Manw, Former Vigilance Player and Guardian Advocate.
Former Raider. Eternal Revan Fanboy.
Nothing else matters at this point.

wadecounty's Avatar


wadecounty
01.11.2015 , 08:20 AM | #130
Torque is a hilarious fight on HM if you're the only Jugg/Guardian in the group. Same group comp as I listed earlier (PT tank/Sin tank if I forgot to mention that), here's my log from our kill.

http://torparse.com/view.php?tid=538...ed002590d9d1b8

Highest % of damage: Saber Reflect

Also I can 100% confirm it does reflect the damage from the floor vents (it shows up in the logs as being reflected back towards Torque). I think if you are the only Jugg/Guardian in this fight, its a really nice fight for us, as Saber Reflect has about the same cooldown as the tamper deterrent devices, and a shoots lasers (along with floor vents) also spawns at that time, with proper positioning you can be reflecting all the tamper devices, shoots lasers, and floor vents for 5 seconds. With added melee though, and others that can Saber Reflect, our usefulness on that fight diminishes.

Oh I do want to add, another thought, if you have a tank Jugg that is holding reflect for the tamper devices, you can instead hold yours for floor vents when you get trapped and want to move somewhere (take no damage), or for picking up shoots lasers in between tamper devices and reflecting their damage. So yeah, it would still be a great ability with a Jugg tank in your group, you just wouldn't get to pad your numbers as much.
Kandel - Juggernaut Lef - Guardian
Nyeetra - Assassin Milarra - Sage
Lendros - Mercenary Jakor - Vanguard
Iseline - Operative Lysandere - Gunslinger