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Petition to Rectify Class Balance! (PVE and PVP)

STAR WARS: The Old Republic > English > Classes > Roles
Petition to Rectify Class Balance! (PVE and PVP)

xxSHOONYxx's Avatar


xxSHOONYxx
11.14.2015 , 05:55 PM | #11
Quote: Originally Posted by GrandLordMenace View Post
I don't know any of the Jugg Revanchists that are satisfied with the current status quo, if they exist, please tell them to PM me.
I'll tell Alvas to
Taunted for her pleasure
I have like 28 dps characters

GhOsTPrOz's Avatar


GhOsTPrOz
11.14.2015 , 06:43 PM | #12
Quote: Originally Posted by MBloomberg View Post
Just like it says, we need more balance, the nim dps checks in some ops are incredibly ridiculous and if you don't bring a class like PT or Sniper you barely have a chance of beating the checks

A gap of 900-1k dps between the highest parsers (engineering) and lowest (jugg/guards) is pathetic

/signed
Just pointing this out the current lowest parsing spec in the world is Plasmatech with a 6.3
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GrandLordMenace's Avatar


GrandLordMenace
11.14.2015 , 06:54 PM | #13
Quote: Originally Posted by xxSHOONYxx View Post
I'll tell Alvas to
Hey if he's satisfied with jugg DPS as it currently stands then he can raid with it as his only main
Rydarus Veneris the Revanchist, Beater #fedaracarrychist
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GrandLordMenace's Avatar


GrandLordMenace
11.14.2015 , 06:55 PM | #14
Quote: Originally Posted by GhOsTPrOz View Post
Just pointing this out the current lowest parsing spec in the world is Plasmatech with a 6.3
You have AP. Guardians don't have a single raid viable spec. Concealment is literally the most played spec for the class and has no AOE and is absolutely useless right now. Pyro is a problem, just as Vig and Conc are, and if Bioware wasn't stupid and just kept the coefficients same as they were in 3.0, we wouldn't be having problems.
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Last Guardian DPS because dead game

dolfinator's Avatar


dolfinator
11.14.2015 , 10:25 PM | #15
/signed
Lightening sorcs/TK sages also took a huge ninja nerf (-20% crit damage to the baseline skills) and they were already nerfed to hell even before that. Before 4.0 was released the dps balance was in the best state it had ever been. The patch notes for 4.0 said that the only dps changes for all classes would be a slight passive dps increase in the range of a few percent. If that was indeed the case, then the classes would still be well balanced, like before the expansion. Instead we see inexplicable ninja nerfs that made the dps balance the worst it's been in years. It's like all the hard balancing work that was done in the last year was thrown out for no obvious reason. My main (Scrapper Scoundrel) feels almost useless right now.

TBH I'd be happy if BW just removes all the ninja nerfs that came with the expansion but were not mentioned in the patch notes. While I don't think that would fix everything, it would be a great start and would undo most of the damage that KOTFE did to balance for no apparent reason.

ViceroySaber's Avatar


ViceroySaber
11.14.2015 , 11:23 PM | #16
Quote: Originally Posted by GrandLordMenace View Post
Y Concealment is literally the most played spec for the class and has no AOE and is absolutely useless right now.
Concealment has never had good AOE, but at least pre-4.0 it was a strong single target spec.

I've had a raid leader tell me to take the 25% damage utility for Carbine Burst in fights like Torque. I hope that one day, Concealment AOE might be such that this might actually be a viable suggestion and not completely ridiculous.
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xeqtoRDoom's Avatar


xeqtoRDoom
11.15.2015 , 03:31 AM | #17
Always loved my Juggernaut/Guardian but never got to play it in 3.0 since my Vanguard was required for Revan kill, had to pull 800k on a Core since my team was slacking and I could never do that as a Guardian . After couple of Revan kills on VG I've switched to my Guardian and I loved it. It was obvious from the start it was weaker then VG but I still loved it.

Since 4.0 started I decided to switch to my Guardian and I am not a bad Guardian, currently hold #1 parse in the world and my VG is also amazing :P. Anyway felt Guardians are pretty mediocre/weak in HMs and HMs are super easy. Tried only 1 boss in NiM and that was SnVs 1st boss, did really fine on him with pulling 6.6k dps but thats mostly cuz of the adds and we have probably the best AoE in the game. Then we decided to drop NiMs since there was no point in them, they don't drop 224 gear but 2x220, awesome isn't it, thx Bioware.

Then I started to gear my VG in 220 as a 2nd toon and even with bad gear I was pulling a lot higher DPS then my Guardian. Then it hit me, wow Guardians are not mediocre they are just bad. Our single target DPS is laughable and we have low burst only good thing about Guardians is their AoE damage to kill trash faster and wipe more on bosses . On bosses with lots of Adds we can pull respectable numbers but on single target bosses we are just a laughing stock. I can see us failing on a lot of NiM bosses like Operatives ( and thats my 3rd class ).

Vg Tactics is just broken atm, insane on demand burst + high sustained dmg and good AoE.

Need to see other NIM bosses on Guardian and Operative to see how they play but you can't deny we are miles behind other classes.

/signed

Tintfax's Avatar


Tintfax
11.15.2015 , 04:17 AM | #18
/signed, signed and signed

The class balance is the worst i have seen, since i play this game. I can't believe that this mess has gone live.

GrandLordMenace's Avatar


GrandLordMenace
11.15.2015 , 04:18 AM | #19
Quote: Originally Posted by xeqtoRDoom View Post
Always loved my Juggernaut/Guardian but never got to play it in 3.0 since my Vanguard was required for Revan kill, had to pull 800k on a Core since my team was slacking and I could never do that as a Guardian . After couple of Revan kills on VG I've switched to my Guardian and I loved it. It was obvious from the start it was weaker then VG but I still loved it.

Since 4.0 started I decided to switch to my Guardian and I am not a bad Guardian, currently hold #1 parse in the world and my VG is also amazing :P. Anyway felt Guardians are pretty mediocre/weak in HMs and HMs are super easy. Tried only 1 boss in NiM and that was SnVs 1st boss, did really fine on him with pulling 6.6k dps but thats mostly cuz of the adds and we have probably the best AoE in the game. Then we decided to drop NiMs since there was no point in them, they don't drop 224 gear but 2x220, awesome isn't it, thx Bioware.

Then I started to gear my VG in 220 as a 2nd toon and even with bad gear I was pulling a lot higher DPS then my Guardian. Then it hit me, wow Guardians are not mediocre they are just bad. Our single target DPS is laughable and we have low burst only good thing about Guardians is their AoE damage to kill trash faster and wipe more on bosses . On bosses with lots of Adds we can pull respectable numbers but on single target bosses we are just a laughing stock. I can see us failing on a lot of NiM bosses like Operatives ( and thats my 3rd class ).

Vg Tactics is just broken atm, insane on demand burst + high sustained dmg and good AoE.

Need to see other NIM bosses on Guardian and Operative to see how they play but you can't deny we are miles behind other classes.

/signed
I'll be back to top eventually once I get time to parse, but nice to see someone else competing

And yeah, your thought process was basically mine, there's no reason to bring a guardian if they are literally what focus sentinels were in the earlier tiers, only we have no burst aoe.
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Lodinn's Avatar


Lodinn
11.15.2015 , 04:55 AM | #20
Quote: Originally Posted by dolfinator View Post
Before 4.0 was released the dps balance was in the best state it had ever been.
Last I've heard it was in the best state pre-3.0.
Are you going to claim it was JUST PERFECT before BW made a lot of changes?
But you have a point. Any major changes implemented are a huge wth for the "balance".

And about juggs/guardians - well, it doesn't exactly render you completely unviable, it's just bringing any melee but AP PT is pointless number-wise. Moreover, AP PT beat ranged on most fights anyway and if not for hard on melees mechanics and lack of AOE people would just stack 4x PT or even 5x PT, all dps, and bring stuff so fast they can rotate defensives and play tanks.

Jugg isn't that weak if you compare it to mara. Sure, now anni has very decent numbers but you get more burst, intrinsic aoe and whatnot. I won't say juggs are weak. Sorcs are, with reduced mobility and low survivability (don't start that stuff about good sorcs and bad sorcs, sniper simply can survive more ESPECIALLY if holding aggro when tank is dead or something like that). Operatives are. Assassins seem to still be worse than juggs. So, like you said, juggs are mediocre. I've met "no mara" attitude a lot in 3.* cycle, while juggs were considered superior to them. Now it's the opposite i guess, but still FOTMers will be like "y u no bring pt/sniper/arsenal merc?".

If you're not going for hardcore raiding, which doesn't seem to be a case now for there are no new bosses, you can still bring even a conceal oper and hae fun, but no one says you're going to be any effective.

A friend of mine said conceal opers are like dogs humping your leg now, they won't hurt you but are very annoying. Can't deny that
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