Ah this thread is old , rly , they are a joke now , leave the poor cubs alone , i for one literally ignore them most of the time if they are not the only target or the healer.

 

Dealing with the troopers/bh is a much bigger pain in my neck lol.

9 more days, then this is all over.. stun lock.. solo healer vs 7 man team.. really just over it.

 

Way to necro a pointless thread.

Ah this thread is old , rly , they are a joke now , leave the poor cubs alone , i for one literally ignore them most of the time if they are not the only target or the healer.

 

Dealing with the troopers/bh is a much bigger pain in my neck lol.

 

Which is pretty much what everyone wanted. And stack on the surge nerf incoming, which hits an opening burst class the hardest obviously, and well, nice job eliminating a class from pvp. Its nice to look back at all the people crying sometimes in the aftermath and see who was right. All those people who said we were still viable and yet we have people saying 'awwww they are so weak now just leave them alone. BH sorc is what I worry about'.Yes thats great for a game. Stupid people suck. BW sucks more for listening to them.

Yeah it's funny looking back and seeing why the Operatives/Scoundrels got nerfed. Because of the many examples like this, where some fresh 50s with 12k HP got owned by a better geared Scoundrel (with alleged 100% crit rate) and ran here crying. Edited February 12, 2012 by Treplos

You dont catch a scoundrel not stealthed if they dont want you too. And if you do, they vanish and open on you, and as we all know, then you die.

 

After opener they boow everyoen away pre 50 with thier ranged dps, thier dps does not suck when u got 40% helath left or less!

"Vanish" is a 2 minute cooldown when specd for it, 3 minutes if healer or dirty fightning.

 

However, the kick stun is 45 sec cd or 30 seconds with talents and he can not do this to you both.

 

He can however open up on you both in the same way but only stun one, and use otherwise flash on the other (which will break in 0.5 seconds due to flechette round).

 

Please remember that this class since release have a roughly 40% nerf to their stealth opener from 1.1 20% damage nerf and the recent surge nerf that placed high surge gear down with 15 up to even 20% if you stacked it massive. But 15% for most.

 

The class needs a buff, not a nerf.

 

And you said youself, you did not react in the roughly 6 seconds it took for him to burn down one guy, which by the way had worse gear and less expertise or he would survive atleast 10 seconds or longer.

 

You did not react during 6-7 seconds when your friend was burned down means you was either AFK, reading a magazine while lazy holding a turret and not bothering, or you simply need to up your reaction times by playing donkey kong on insane mode.

Still waiting for a dev response.

 

Operatives and scoundrels was nerfed to the ground.

 

Overall with the 2 latest nerfs to stealth opener and surge its a 35 to 40% damage reduction on crits.

 

What you faced was an operative in much better gear and higher expertise and a marauder would have done that job alot easier then the operative or scoundrel could have done.

 

The class have so low sustained damage its not even welcome in raids anymore, and you want it nerfed?

 

It needs a buff, thats what it needs.

 

Gear balance is one thing, class balance is another.

 

The only class that needs a bat in this game is the sorc and sage. And BH mercs and gunnery commandos should have a more complicated way of doing the damage they do.

 

Other then that its pretty well balanced.

 

And snipers do have a ton of survival skills.

 

A good sniper can kill a scoundrel even AFTER the scoundrel got in the stealth opener due to the abilities at your disposal. That does not cry for a nerf, but more its just the difference between a good player and a bad one.

 

Snipers, Gunslingers, Vanguards and Powertechs are this games most balanced classes.

Operatives and scoundrels was nerfed to the ground.

 

Overall with the 2 latest nerfs to stealth opener and surge its a 35 to 40% damage reduction on crits.

 

What you faced was an operative in much better gear and higher expertise and a marauder would have done that job alot easier then the operative or scoundrel could have done.

 

The class have so low sustained damage its not even welcome in raids anymore, and you want it nerfed?

 

It needs a buff, thats what it needs.

 

Gear balance is one thing, class balance is another.

 

The only class that needs a bat in this game is the sorc and sage. And BH mercs and gunnery commandos should have a more complicated way of doing the damage they do.

 

Other then that its pretty well balanced.

 

And snipers do have a ton of survival skills.

 

A good sniper can kill a scoundrel even AFTER the scoundrel got in the stealth opener due to the abilities at your disposal. That does not cry for a nerf, but more its just the difference between a good player and a bad one.

 

Snipers, Gunslingers, Vanguards and Powertechs are this games most balanced classes.

 

Complicated like Powertechs. Nerf Operatives and Mercenaries!

Complicated like Powertechs. Nerf Operatives and Mercenaries!

 

Said the lightsaber nerd that reached 50 and can't understand why being a Jedi/Sith with pewpewsabers is not insta-win.

Way to necro a thread. Good job sir.

This thread is a proper gem.

 

After seeing this i honestly believe that the poor developers will never manage to satisfy the playerbase.

This thread is a proper gem.

 

After seeing this i honestly believe that the poor developers will never manage to satisfy the playerbase.

 

I miss those times...

I miss those times...

 

OP is responsible for killing the game for all dps operatives.

Funny story.

 

Threads like these were all over the place, kind of like Smash threads today. Scoundrels/Operatives got nerfed hard in less than two months. Smash specs? Still going strong with no nerfs in sight.

stop this old thread now more then a year ago

stop this old thread now more then a year ago

 

Good idea.

 

Cept, now that we posted in it.... whoops!

Complicated like Powertechs. Nerf Operatives and Mercenaries!

 

cmon man.................

 

 

:rolleyes:

So after a 4.7, 3.8 and 3.0 hit, you have 10% HP left?? hmm

 

4700+3800+3000=11500 x .10= 1,150+ 11500=......... 12650 Total HP at level 50.....

 

lol

 

They are nowhere near OP

Learn to play

Get some Gear

Then come back and complain when you are in a position to do so.

OK, first off. The fact that this thread has 115 pages speaks for itself in regards to whether this class is overpowered.

 

Yeah, I think the Op is OP. Aptly named.

But rather than going into numerical oblivion, let's speak basically.

 

You NEVER NEVER NEVER give a healer in-combat stealth. NEVER.

There are 5 overall leet abilities is MMO classes, any 2 of which should NEVER be combined in any class.

 

1. Burst DPS.

2. Heals (meaning any class that is meant to be a healer).

3. Plate tankage (in this game, meaning heavy armor combined with native tank abilities that dont require an AA tree).

4. Stealth (but I'll refine this to in-combat stealth, meaning the ability to stealth while engaged).

5. Feign Death (which, in this game, is likenable to in-combat stealth).

 

The unique situation with TOR is that 6 of the 8 archetypes (or 6 of the 16 subclasses) have the ability to be a healer AND something else. Now, the scound/op can heal on the run with the majority of their heals. That means instant casts, meaning no interrupts. Most of these are HoTs, so it takes some time to feel their effects, but one of them (slow release medpac) is cheap to cast, a decently large heal and can be stacked. You combine all the instant cast HoT's plus the occasional free sizable instant cast full, and you end up with a very hard to kill PvP healer.

 

Also, a nifty little ability (Sedatives) in the healing tree (that only costs 2 points I might add), reduces the targets DPS by 50% for 10 seconds when First Strike is used (which is a pretty big attack by itself). 50%. 10 Seconds. I couldn't believe it when I saw it. You wanna know why you're dying when they jump you? It's because you're gimped. All your high cooldown big booms are halved. 10 seconds is the majority of the engagement. That ability costs no power and is passive. And it's in the healing tree? Hmm.

 

I have a well geared Sin and Scound. The base dmg (just looking at the base numbers of the abilities) is no comparison. The scound's got em beat. And the scound's attacks are less situational. The biggest Sin ability is assassinate. It requires the target to be below 30%, the attacker to be behind them and within 4M. No scound ability is that high in dmg, but they have several that are near it and they're not situational. First Strike is, but obviously that one's a guarantee. And a scound would be a fool not to open with First Strike since it gimps your DPS by 50%.

 

Now I'm talking about a hybrid scound that went far enough up the healing tree to maximize slow release medpac. So when you combine those remaining points to create a fairly high burst DPS class WITH pimp heals AND in-combat stealth guaranteeing first strike ability (which we all know is at the core of successful PvP), you end up with a class that (when combined with a knowledgeable player) is highly advantaged over the other classes. And if it doesnt work out, they can just *poof* out of the situation, robbing you of your victory against the odds. Believe it or not, there are classes out there that have no significant DoTs to break their poof. Sorcs and Mercs for example.

 

In every other MMO I've played where there was an assassin, they were the best stealthers (nonCombat) and held tier 1 DPS. But in this game, only an allstar can do enough with the pitiful base dmg of a Sin to make it a class to be reckoned with. But an average player can put out similar dmg with a hybrid Op. And to add insult to injury, Ops get every steatlh abiltiy of the Sin (including stealth detection and level boosters & speed haste) PLUS group stealth. Not that I use that much, but the point is they get more stealth ability than the Sin. THE SIN. THAT is a JOKE. I mean, what was BW thinking? They're really showing their green MMO stripes here. My scound is relatively recent. But I've heard that ops/scounds have already been significantly nerfed. I can only imagine what they must have once been. No class should outstealth an Assassin. I've never even heard of such a thing. And to give the Op better DPS (notably better) is mind boggling. But I suppose that's a byproduct of allowing a healer to hybridize.

 

Generally speaking, I've rolled 8 classes to 50 and PvP'd with all them. Some of them are very clearly more instantly suited to PvP than others. Those classes don't require EWH to be stellar. Simple WH is sufficient and you can get that in a week. I have a marauder too, and everyone goes on about how OP they are. I disagree. A high Smash hit requires maximized gear even against an average geared player. AND you have to build a sequence of abilities to maximize it, so you cant use it very often (at high dmg). And once its built up, you got about 10 seconds or you lose it. Not that I consider the marauder to be a fun class, so I dont use him anymore except for crafting. So I'm not all pro-marauder or anything.

 

The point is when I talk about how I think the op/scound is OP, you wont see me whining about the usual class that folks complain about (smashers, who btw are very very squishy, even the juggs). When I say something is OP, I speak from experience. But again, I didnt even have to maximize gear to know. You DO NOT give a healer burst dmg or in-combat stealth/feign death. You get one, not two of anything, or you're OP.

 

1/ Would you like to see a plate tank class with burst DPS?

* A true tank class has native skills that dont require wasting AAs to become a tank. Turning a cloth wearer into a tank by forcing them to use all their AA points does not compare to a plate tank that starts out a tank and merely enhances their tanking with AAs while snatching up other things.

2/ Would you like to be set upon by a Sniper with 200 or 300 healing per second?

3/ Would you like to be jumped by a cloaked tier1 DPS Sin with plate tank survivability?

4/ Or a plate tank with tier1 DPS or 200/300 healing per second?

 

Combining these things is a no-no. But there's no way to fix it without a serious restructuring of the class system. You're a healer, a tank or DPS. You dont get to be a combination of two at 80% effectiveness in both. It's supposed to be an equal trade-off, but BW failed here.

Edited January 30, 2013 by LordXayd

So after a 4.7, 3.8 and 3.0 hit, you have 10% HP left?? hmm

 

4700+3800+3000=11500 x .10= 1,150+ 11500=......... 12650 Total HP at level 50.....

 

lol

 

They are nowhere near OP

Learn to play

Get some Gear

Then come back and complain when you are in a position to do so.

 

Perhaps you missed the 2nd stun he mentioned, during which he's set upon again.

Perhaps you missed the 2nd stun he mentioned, during which he's set upon again.

 

perhaps you missed the fact that this thread was originally posted 12/30/2011? and that today's date is 1/30/2013?

 

perhaps you missed the fact that this thread was originally posted 12/30/2011? and that today's date is 1/30/2013?

 

 

What does that have to do with the price of tea in Zimbabwe?

This thread is a year old they got nerfed a few times

This thread is a year old they got nerfed a few times

 

I mentioned that just above. Everything I wrote up there is current.

OK, first off. The fact that this thread has 115 pages speaks for itself in regards to whether this class is overpowered.

 

Also, a nifty little ability (Sedatives) in the healing tree (that only costs 2 points I might add), reduces the targets DPS by 50% for 10 seconds when First Strike is used (which is a pretty big attack by itself). 50%. 10 Seconds. I couldn't believe it when I saw it. You wanna know why you're dying when they jump you? It's because you're gimped. All your high cooldown big booms are halved. 10 seconds is the majority of the engagement. That ability costs no power and is passive. And it's in the healing tree? Hmm.

.

 

It's funny how you say that because this thread has 115 pages in over a year that means Operatives are OP but then you say Smashers aren't OP when there's a thread with 1000 pages about Mara's. Does that mean they're 10x as OP as Operatives?

 

Sedatives reduces the target's damage output by 50% after Sleep Dart wears off, not after Hidden Strike is used.

 

Could you please provide a link to this super OP hybrid spec you speak of? All of the good Ops I see run either full heals or full dps, if you go hybrid you just end up gimping both specs. I went ahead and tried to make my own hybrid spec, if you don't want to share your OP Hybrid want to pick some nits with mine? I personally don't like it just looking at it. You don't get the CC on Hidden Strike, you don't get the DOT from Acid Blade, and you lose out on the 30% crit chance on backblast. So basically you tickle the other guy for awhile, he beats the crap out you, then you run away and heal yourself up.

 

http://swtor.askmrrobot.com/skills/operative#id2f32-218dd62l2-0

 

Thanks for your help, just trying to become a better OP OP.