Rage/Focus Spec is much like front-loaded contracts in pro sports... You get big money in the first year, then the remaining years you "make" league minimum...

 

 

At the end of the day, after all globals are accounted for, it in no more OP'd than a few other DPS AC's, and actually underwhelming when enemies know how to counter you.

 

 

Instead, people ignore the fact that their own class not only has the tools to limit the damage, but also ignore the other globals where their damage is significantly higher than a Rager, especially the ones that drop crit chance entirely...

 

All they see is big numbers on the screen, and it automatically causes butthurt....

Completely wrong. When not smashing one is spamming vicious slash which does 2.2-2.4k lowering cooldown on smash and building stacks of fury for the next smash then vicious slash spam etc.. Dont have to worry about crit on vicious slash when a talent spec'd 2/2 gives 15% crit bonus not to mention vicious slash only cost 2 rage instead of three with the rage refund talent. I play a power/surge stacked smash mara the build is OP

Completely wrong. When not smashing one is spamming vicious slash which does 2.2-2.4k lowering cooldown on smash and building stacks of fury for the next smash then vicious slash spam etc.. Dont have to worry about crit on vicious slash when a talent spec'd 2/2 gives 15% crit bonus not to mention vicious slash only cost 2 rage instead of three with the rage refund talent. I play a power/surge stacked smash mara the build is OP

funny how different mara rage is from jugg rage. vicious slash is such low priority for a jugg i only use it when I'm toying with someone and don't want to waste any other CD

funny how different mara rage is from jugg rage. vicious slash is such low priority for a jugg i only use it when I'm toying with someone and don't want to waste any other CD

Seems juggs get less smashes but hit harder with their 6% bonus to strength and 6% bonus to force damage in middle tree

[*]Stacks of shockwave increase the critical hit damage.

Correct me if I'm mistaken but I'm pretty sure shockwave increases the BASE DAMAGE of smash, which is a significant difference from increasing the crit damage.

Completely wrong. When not smashing one is spamming vicious slash which does 2.2-2.4k lowering cooldown on smash and building stacks of fury for the next smash then vicious slash spam etc.. Dont have to worry about crit on vicious slash when a talent spec'd 2/2 gives 15% crit bonus not to mention vicious slash only cost 2 rage instead of three with the rage refund talent. I play a power/surge stacked smash mara the build is OP

Churb U noob....

On a serious note: Smash on a Mara is different than Jugg. It is OP'd on a mara, because Maras are OP'd in general... You have better CDs and more escape tools than Smash Juggs. I have not seen a VS crit for over 3k on my Guardian... I'll check my logs, but I doubt it....

Seems juggs get less smashes but hit harder with their 6% bonus to strength and 6% bonus to force damage in middle tree

That would seem to be the case. Jugg set bonus adds a flat 10% to all damage after leap. It lasts long enough to be used on smash + force scream + obliterate or long enough for smash and a couple ticks of ravage.

Biggest hits come from WZ damage % boost + 10% after leap. Although I try to grab these as often as possible regardless of the toon I'm on.

i'm a fairly new 50 and PVPer Juggernaut on PotF and i'll say, as immortal or Vengeance spec i get comepletely crushed and i'm usually one of the lowest on damage for my team. if i run into ANYONE 1v1 i get beat and i feel like i have nearly 0 utility in team fights apart from my taunts and force choke. this all goes without saying i'm most likely a noob PVPer that isn't very good but for the most part i'm one of the best at all of the games i play. my highest hits when specced immortal or vengeance is ravage and that's only if i successfully land all three hits, which would equate to around 3k dmg (and that never happens unless who i'm playing is quite nub or in a stunlock).

maybe i play immortal/vengeance wrong but i just don't see it working for PVP along with... all the tank spec war hero gear i already bought because as it seems, i've read and others have told me, shielding is next to useless in PVP.

where do 'tanks' have a place in PVP because i don't see it? i have yet to try rage spec but i will be doing so as the other specs coupled with my inexperience PVPing in SWTOR are instant fail.

not quite sure what i'm trying to say here...

i'm a fairly new 50 and PVPer Juggernaut on PotF and i'll say, as immortal or Vengeance spec i get comepletely crushed and i'm usually one of the lowest on damage for my team. if i run into ANYONE 1v1 i get beat and i feel like i have nearly 0 utility in team fights apart from my taunts and force choke. this all goes without saying i'm most likely a noob PVPer that isn't very good but for the most part i'm one of the best at all of the games i play. my highest hits when specced immortal or vengeance is ravage and that's only if i successfully land all three hits, which would equate to around 3k dmg (and that never happens unless who i'm playing is quite nub or in a stunlock).

 

maybe i play immortal/vengeance wrong but i just don't see it working for PVP along with... all the tank spec war hero gear i already bought because as it seems, i've read and others have told me, shielding is next to useless in PVP.

 

where do 'tanks' have a place in PVP because i don't see it? i have yet to try rage spec but i will be doing so as the other specs coupled with my inexperience PVPing in SWTOR are instant fail.

 

not quite sure what i'm trying to say here...

many contradictions in this post

i'm a fairly new 50 and PVPer Juggernaut on PotF and i'll say, as immortal or Vengeance spec i get comepletely crushed and i'm usually one of the lowest on damage for my team. if i run into ANYONE 1v1 i get beat and i feel like i have nearly 0 utility in team fights apart from my taunts and force choke. this all goes without saying i'm most likely a noob PVPer that isn't very good but for the most part i'm one of the best at all of the games i play. my highest hits when specced immortal or vengeance is ravage and that's only if i successfully land all three hits, which would equate to around 3k dmg (and that never happens unless who i'm playing is quite nub or in a stunlock).

 

maybe i play immortal/vengeance wrong but i just don't see it working for PVP along with... all the tank spec war hero gear i already bought because as it seems, i've read and others have told me, shielding is next to useless in PVP.

 

where do 'tanks' have a place in PVP because i don't see it? i have yet to try rage spec but i will be doing so as the other specs coupled with my inexperience PVPing in SWTOR are instant fail.

 

not quite sure what i'm trying to say here...

You can only tank in PVP if you stack Defense.... If you run the hybrid spec, drop all shield/Aborb and stack Defense. Your results will be much better....

Completely wrong. When not smashing one is spamming vicious slash which does 2.2-2.4k lowering cooldown on smash and building stacks of fury for the next smash then vicious slash spam etc.. Dont have to worry about crit on vicious slash when a talent spec'd 2/2 gives 15% crit bonus not to mention vicious slash only cost 2 rage instead of three with the rage refund talent. I play a power/surge stacked smash mara the build is OP

Yeah...

I never use VS.

2/8/31 spec

Yeah...

I never use VS.

 

2/8/31 spec

You also can't spam it as a Juggy because you don't have the luxury of a refund on attack.

**cough

**cough...

You also can't spam it as a Juggy because you don't have the luxury of a refund on attack.

**cough

these aren't the DPS you are looking for

**cough...

Ah yes... tier 1 on the Annihilation tree we find "Enraged Slash"

I have an evil Carnage Mara as well :-) Gore+Ravage can make them QQ

I still dont use VS much on him either lol

Ah yes... tier 1 on the Annihilation tree we find "Enraged Slash"

I have an evil Carnage Mara as well :-) Gore+Ravage can make them QQ

 

I still dont use VS much on him either lol

Well.....

Yeah....

But it's there for Rage Maras, so spamming is easier than it is for a Rage Juggy...

BTW: I know why you don't spam it...... hence Maras/Sents are OP'd in general... and have been for a long time...

You can only tank in PVP if you stack Defense.... If you run the hybrid spec, drop all shield/Aborb and stack Defense. Your results will be much better....

For a tank, do you advocate using a focus/generator rather than a shield? I assume you still recommend equipping a shield, just not stacking the sheild/absorb stat.

Another troll picking one part of a chained discussion to take out of context. I wasn't comparing it to rage smash. I wasn't comparing it to anything. It was used in reference because some moron said that tank smash was the hardest hitting attack in game.

 

Tollfest 2013 today.

And he was right! Tank means in SWTOR pvp - high HP+ heavy armor

Nothing to do in SWTOR pvp with taunt, and threat generation and shielding is close to non-factor in SWTOR pvp and the 60% armor buff is 9% melee, ranged dmg reduction.

So yes, the most dmg lander in this games pvp part is a tank.

For a tank, do you advocate using a focus/generator rather than a shield? I assume you still recommend equipping a shield, just not stacking the sheild/absorb stat.

Meh......

When I am PuGGin': Generator with Defense Mods/Enh

When I play Ranked: *Probably Shield, but same stuff mods as above...

Force/Tech Power significantly differs between the two, and with shield/absorb not really being useful in PvP, I have been sticking to my Generator 100% of the time.

And he was right! Tank means in SWTOR pvp - high HP+ heavy armor

Nothing to do in SWTOR pvp with taunt, and threat generation and shielding is close to non-factor in SWTOR pvp and the 60% armor buff is 9% melee, ranged dmg reduction.

So yes, the most dmg lander in this games pvp part is a tank.

Guard

And no, rage jugs don't have high HP... Unreal how much you and your friend don't know about this game.

Guard

 

And no, rage jugs don't have high HP... Unreal how much you and your friend don't know about this game.

^^^^^

19k on average....

Shadows have light armor and are still considered "tanks" because they have tank type CDs, taunts, and guard..

Tank type CDs, taunts, and guard is what makes a tank... a tank. "Class" or "AC" has nothing to do with it...

Ah yes... tier 1 on the Annihilation tree we find "Enraged Slash"

I have an evil Carnage Mara as well :-) Gore+Ravage can make them QQ

 

I still dont use VS much on him either lol

VS builds rage on a Mara with berserk active, in a good run you can get 30 stacks of fury almost a fast as the smash CD. In some Voidstar matches i don't even have to use battering assault to keep my rage up because of the berserk effect. So I would advise using it more.

If rage wasn't so potent for marauders/sents and only Juggs were using it there would be a lot less QQ about smash, besides I think most good mara's would rather be carnage if rage wasn't almost absurdly better at this point.

Guard

 

And no, rage jugs don't have high HP... Unreal how much you and your friend don't know about this game.

It's just a matter of opinion on what a "tank CLASS" is. Is it really worth arguing about?

I am with you on the HP though, they def don't reflect the hp of a PvE tank.

It's just a matter of opinion on what a "tank CLASS" is. Is it really worth arguing about?

 

I am with you on the HP though, they def don't reflect the hp of a PvE tank.

There is no such thing as a "tank class" in the game dude... It's not an opinion...

Sages are "healer class"; nerf the DPS specs

Shadows are a "DPS class"; nerf all HP regeneration and tank type CD's

Sents are "DPS class"; nerf all HP regeneration and tank type CD's

Commandos are a "DPS class"; nerf the entire healer tree..

Operatives are "Stunlockers"; nerf all their specs...

etc, etc..

See how absurd that sounds?

There is no such thing as a "tank class" in the game dude... It's not an opinion...

 

Sages are "healer class"; nerf the DPS specs

Shadows are a "DPS class"; nerf all HP regeneration and tank type CD's

Sents are "DPS class"; nerf all HP regeneration and tank type CD's

Commandos are a "DPS class"; nerf the entire healer tree..

Operatives are "Stunlockers"; nerf all their specs...

etc, etc..

 

See how absurd that sounds?

It's an opinion dude. If a class can heal I call it a healing class. If a class can tank its a tanking class. Call it what you want, it won't change what I call them.

There is no such thing as a "tank class" in the game dude... It's not an opinion...

 

Sages are "healer class"; nerf the DPS specs

Shadows are a "DPS class"; nerf all HP regeneration and tank type CD's

Sents are "DPS class"; nerf all HP regeneration and tank type CD's

Commandos are a "DPS class"; nerf the entire healer tree..

Operatives are "Stunlockers"; nerf all their specs...

etc, etc..

 

See how absurd that sounds?

The absurd part is that they pretty much did exactly that to commandos, ops and sages... In fact- because they have a healing tree they don't deserve to have a decent dps tree for pvp has been the exact excuse that marauders have been using for months to explain why it's fine to have these classes be completely unwanted in a dps role in RWZ.

tank class and tank spec are two different things

guardians, vanguards, and shadows are all tank classes, that can use a tank spec tree. smashers are NOT tanks

the "DON"T NERF ME BRO" camp are trying very hard to deflect the real argument here away from the issues and towards the OP's poor choice in wording.

the fact that smash, as it is currently in game, is overpowered dose not change

tank class and tank spec are two different things

 

guardians, vanguards, and shadows are all tank classes, that can use a tank spec tree. smashers are NOT tanks

 

the "DON"T NERF ME BRO" camp are trying very hard to deflect the real argument here away from the issues and towards the OP's poor choice in wording.

 

the fact that smash, as it is currently in game, is overpowered dose not change

lmao, can't wait til bioware nerfs opertatives.