Because in this game tanks have always been playthings for every mob to come down the pike.

Tossed around like a two dollar whore.

But now tanks are glass two dollar whores that break when played with.

And why should i work my *** off to hold aggro against dps who have become much more powerfull when i have been nerfed into the ground?

Screw it ill dps and take it easy or heal and have the challenge of keeping you glass playthings alive.

People looking to run 55hmfp are popping into every room in mumble to beg folks even on the opposite faction to tank party content.

Thats pathetic.

Tanking is not fun its work.

And the fact that you cant find em proves my point.

Because in this game tanks have always been playthings for every mob to come down the pike.

Tossed around like a two dollar whore.

But now tanks are glass two dollar whores that break when played with.

And why should i work my *** off to hold aggro against dps who have become much more powerfull when i have been nerfed into the ground?

Screw it ill dps and take it easy or heal and have the challenge of keeping you glass playthings alive.

People looking to run 55hmfp are popping into every room in mumble to beg folks even on the opposite faction to tank party content.

Thats pathetic.

Tanking is not fun its work.

And the fact that you cant find em proves my point.

 

I disagree, tanking is fun and challenging but it is a little backwards. Trash is the toughest thing to tank while bosses are quite simple. Of course, if you get an overzealous DPS or a poor healer being a (non-Shadow) tank can really suck but that's why I run with guildies most of the time. Now poorly played or geared tanks trying 55 HMs are just going to get eaten alive and I like that

The majority of folks running tanks will vote on how much fun it is by their availability.

As it stands the results are that its not fun.

Que for anything as dps and see how long the wait is.

Que as tank and you are in instantly.

It needs to be changed.

I dont feel uber as a tank.

I get it done, the group has sucess but i am a punk getting pushed around and pulled off from.

I should get to feel heroic too.

My dps will pull off any tank with ease if i dont walk on eggshells.

My healers can prevent death even in seemingly the toughest situation.

But i always have to strategize and cheese with my tank.

And constantly work to keep and get back aggro especially on trash.

How is that heroic?

The majority of folks running tanks will vote on how much fun it is by their availability.

As it stands the results are that its not fun. Where is your proof it's not fun. There being less tanks is not proof

Que for anything as dps and see how long the wait is.

Que as tank and you are in instantly.

It needs to be changed.

I dont feel uber as a tank. You want us tanks to be beefed so they feel like gods?

I get it done, the group has sucess but i am a punk getting pushed around and pulled off from. Perhaps you are a **** tank

I should get to feel heroic too.

My dps will pull off any tank with ease if i dont walk on eggshells. I highly doubt it. Noone pulls a boss off a competent tank and not all mobs need to be held by the tank

My healers can prevent death even in seemingly the toughest situation.

But i always have to strategize and cheese with my tank. Either your tank is **** or your healer is ****. 55 HM's should be effortless.

And constantly work to keep and get back aggro especially on trash. Again, your tank is probably ****.

How is that heroic?

 

5char

The fact that there are not enough tanks proves that people dont want to play them.

I didnt say I have trouble with 55hm i said its difficult to find tanks for even such simple content .

There should be all sorts of folks to run the low end stuff.

Tanking is in trouble.

Dont care if you agree.

The fact that there are not enough tanks proves that people dont want to play them.

I didnt say I have trouble with 55hm i said its difficult to find tanks for even such simple content .

There should be all sorts of folks to run the low end stuff.

Tanking is in trouble.

Dont care if you agree.

 

Or it proves that there is a massive abundance of DPS and healers. Tanks use a completely different set of gear from either DPS or Healers so while those roles are largely interchangeable with a simple respec, a tank requires a whole new set of gear. Further, when soloing, tanks hit like little girls so clearing stuff can take ages.

 

The funny thing about finding tanks for 55 HMs is that most tanks either run them with their guild to get their weekly or get no benefit from them. It is stupid easy to get fully geared as a tank (I was full 69's by the end of early access) and once you're past that point the only incentive you have to run 55 HMs is the 3x weekly. Personally I think it was a bad decision on BW's part to reduce the incentive for tanks to queue.

 

Your final points comes across as "ner nee ner I'm right and you're wrong *blows raspberry*". Really mature.

One of the reasons there are fewer tanks, IMHO, is due to responsibility. A dps who drops dead doesn't always mean a wipe, you loose the tank and it's a much more serious situation. The tank is a leader; he controls the pace. Typically if something goes wrong and it's a wipe the tank, or healer, is the first to be blamed. A tank screwing up tends to have bigger consequences than a dps. In a group you can usually win even if several deeps are pulling floor duty.

 

People love seeing big numbers, it strokes their "epeens". In just about every mmo I've played people love going "*** PWN PWN PEW PEW ZOMG I'M AWSOME MAH DEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEPPPPPPSSSSSSSSS.NOM NOM NOM" I can't tell you the number of times I've been on a run, or group quest, and someone has called out every crit they had during the entire run.

 

Many people don't want the added pressure of being a leader and the responsibility that implies. They would rather blow up the universe and blame it on the tank or healer when they die.

if you think being the first line of defense agains a huge or epic boss isn't cool, taking them head on and facing the brunt of their attacks, and leading others through a flashpoint isn't heroic, then i dont think your experiencing the tank as it should be. for example, holding the giant god like creature Soa's attention on my first run through a operation was one of my favorite moments in this game, Edited June 17, 2013 by TekAlcon

I get what tanking is and i enjoyed it more pre 2.0.

Getting aggro on trash shouldnt be such a pain.

Trash sholdnt hit harder in many cases than the boss.

Trash should taunt like the boss.

It doesnt.

The gearing curve is the same for all there should be as many tanks looking to run hmfp as other classes.

There arent because there are a select number of people who enjoy tanking as it currently exists.

And they have the gear.

Its all good, i can tank what i like and run flashpoints for my friends like you do.

But it doesnt mean that its as fun as the other classes and even less so since the nerf IMO.

His formatting makes me read it as a poem.

 

A really bad poem.

The only issue I have with tanking, is that I really do not enjoy to be kicked around all the time in HM-FPs. Sometimes I just do not bother to walk up to the mob again, as keeping aggro on range and just wait for the DDs to kill it is more effective.

 

Apart from that I have learned that tanking is not a miracle happening. It doesn't require superspeed reflexes or extensive micro-management.

I even got my debut at tanking with terror from below (only the endboss) and I got to admit, that as a tank, I got a lot less to take care of than as DD or healer.

 

I guess the real reason for not having 25% tanks in game is that there are just so many players, who believe, that an omgwtfbbq uber crit is all that is viable.

SWTOR lacks tanks because few are capable of tanking.

Tanking requires 1) fast pace 2) constant responsibility and 3) awareness.

Most people cannot handle this because they are fools.

 

DPS is just pew-pew weak to strong.

DPS requires no skill whatsoever, which is why a vast majority of players are DPS.

Any monkey with a mouse can DPS.

 

Bad tanking will always be plainly visible. Tanks must take responsibility for tanking.

Bad DPS can simply hide behind good DPS and take credit for good DPS.

Bad DPS likes to hide because bad DPS are cowards and they are retarded.

DPS is just pew-pew weak to strong.

 

And, yet, somehow, very few DPS manage to do this *very* simple thing.

 

I honestly think that misbehaving DPS are one of the big reasons why there are fewer tanks than there would be otherwise. DPS using the wrong kill order or splitting DPS on elite+ targets is *absurdly frustrating*. It probably doesn't help that tanks also have to put their trust in healers: if a healer is bad, a tank is going to faceplant, regardless of their gear. Tanking is a more complex role than healing or DPSing that is *forced* to place a lot of trust in the other players of the group not being idiots. When they *are* idiots, a tank's life is made incredibly frustrating (especially since most DPS will blame you for losing threat when the real reason is their inability to use proper focus DPS and target priority).

So....I play a pvp tank.

 

You wont find tanks pre 55 usually because: 1. It's pointless as story and world missions are more efficient exp. 2. Too much of a risk of idiots/people who can't heal. 3. The gear is available elsewhere cheaper (time and money) and easier. I did two FPs before this weekend on my tank. There was zero reason to FP.

 

I did a 55HM FP for the first time the other day (Instant Queue!) and I had full 66 gear, absorb augs, etc. I explained I don't know my way around because I don't do FPs. Healer was down with this and explaining along the way.

 

1 DD stayed the whole time. Of the other slot, he quit before he saw us. Then we had another, undergeared, also quit before they saw us. 3rd one stayed. Geared fine. Easily killed 10-15 minutes on queuing for DDs and the first DD DCing.

 

Easy peasy HM FP, even as my first time. Went swimmingly. Bosses were easy (No deaths, nothing difficult), and I only lost aggro if I was dead.

 

I died 4 times on trash mobs because ??? (Could have been healer oops. No deaths on the other same trash mobs, and I did the same stuff).

Zero tank gear dropped.

It took like 45? Minutes, and we even sped along at a constant pace (Maybe taking 5 minutes total to explain strats)

I spent nearly all of my time on bosses with my back to a wall or dealing with minor pushbacks. Not really fun watching a small portion of polgons and my UI while doing my rotation and waiting to cancel it's ability.

 

So essentially to tanks that can tank FPs (like me), Pugging for 55HMs is boring visually, as a challenge, gear is few and far inbetween (Although I experienced this on my healer too), and the random queue is fairly annoying (Would have sucked with that way undergeared guy according to my groupmates).

 

The visual and etc issues are the fault of the mechanics chosen by the devs. It's just not interesting to tank, you don't see much at all of the boss fights because you're stuck in a wall. Im sure these fights look great, but I wouldn't know because on my healer Im looking at health bars and CDs, and on my tank Im stuck in a wall.

 

It wasn't hard either, but we may have been well or overgeared (our fault...sorta).

 

No gear dropped. As a matter of fact, out of the 6 drops, only 1 was usuable by people in our group. (Design flaw? Bad luck?)

 

The queues probably need an inherent gear check.

 

But, the main point: I don't queue as an aptly skilled and geared (but inexperienced in specific FPs) because they're boring and theres no loot. IE, zero motivation to do so.

Edited June 17, 2013 by Maelael

And, yet, somehow, very few DPS manage to do this *very* simple thing.

 

I honestly think that misbehaving DPS are one of the big reasons why there are fewer tanks than there would be otherwise. DPS using the wrong kill order or splitting DPS on elite+ targets is *absurdly frustrating*. It probably doesn't help that tanks also have to put their trust in healers: if a healer is bad, a tank is going to faceplant, regardless of their gear. Tanking is a more complex role than healing or DPSing that is *forced* to place a lot of trust in the other players of the group not being idiots. When they *are* idiots, a tank's life is made incredibly frustrating (especially since most DPS will blame you for losing threat when the real reason is their inability to use proper focus DPS and target priority).

 

This is spot on. This is what makes running a 55HMFP horrible as a tank - and healer for that matter.

It is way too often I see the DPS go on different targets, even when there's only 2 targets.

 

I've also seen to many DPS taking the "leader role" and keep moving on to the next group before the current one is killed, which is completely stupid on so many levels.

Edited June 17, 2013 by MFollin

It is way too often I see the DPS go on different targets, even when there's only 2 targets.

 

This idiotic behavior spawns from "Call of Duty" genre of games where you kill anything and everything everywhere by any means necessary as quickly as possible.

I have tanked all content and my answer as to why there are a lack of tanks can be found below:

 

 

1. Tanking drops in HM FPS are very rare. I ran 10 fps in one day as soon as 2.0 hit and I had nothing.

 

2. There is not incentive for me to join the group finder as a tank. With the abundance of DPS, why isnt there a system that rewards tanks? A drop that guarantees a tanking piece at the end of the FP?

 

3. I go in a flashpoint in BIS underworld and I pull the room, fight for aggro hold all on me, play the piano with my shadow and what does the healer do? He does damage, its good, I can heal myself, i got medpacks and cooldowns.

 

4. People do not respect the tactics and what needs to be attacked first. I do not go into the group finder to fight for aggro and compete with the DPS who attack other targets than what I tank.

 

 

5. I spend millions of credits / hours in my tank to have worse gear tanks perform better. So why should I continue to use my tank?

Edited June 17, 2013 by Leafy_Bug

Good points Leafy Bug.

 

The consensus on why the game lacks tanks is threefold:

 

1) Most people are too dumb to tank properly.

 

2) Most people are too dumb to support a tank properly.

 

3) Bioware is too dumb to to give tanks incentives to grind.

3. I go in a flashpoint in BIS underworld and I pull the room, fight for aggro hold all on me, play the piano with my shadow and what does the healer do? He does damage, its good, I can heal myself, i got medpacks and cooldowns.

 

That one can be just as good as it can be bad IMO. When I heal and I see a group of normal mobs approaching, I'll often use my AoE (e.g. Mortar Volley) to take out that group as the tank will have fewer mobs to grab and take less damage. Of course, the healer should swap back to healing when the tank starts taking damage, but the first few seconds are fairly safe in most FPs.

That and add in the fact that tank is the only role that requires a massively different gear set to function between roles. I know that's why I haven't fully committed to tanking on my pt/sin/jugg, tanking is fun and all but I "have" to mix it up or I lose interest in the class.

 

I don't know that there is any way around that other than to do something like give a 75% discount on DPS gear if you have a full tanking set. Not that it would be fair to the dps/healer classes though....

That and add in the fact that tank is the only role that requires a massively different gear set to function between roles. I know that's why I haven't fully committed to tanking on my pt/sin/jugg, tanking is fun and all but I "have" to mix it up or I lose interest in the class.

 

I don't know that there is any way around that other than to do something like give a 75% discount on DPS gear if you have a full tanking set. Not that it would be fair to the dps/healer classes though....

 

Well, then why not give a discount on the tank gear? Current DPS-geared potential tanks wouldn't be affected by your idea anyway, so I doubt we'd see much of a change.

I have tanked all content and my answer as to why there are a lack of tanks can be found below:

 

 

1. Tanking drops in HM FPS are very rare. I ran 10 fps in one day as soon as 2.0 hit and I had nothing.

 

2. There is not incentive for me to join the group finder as a tank. With the abundance of DPS, why isnt there a system that rewards tanks? A drop that guarantees a tanking piece at the end of the FP?

 

3. I go in a flashpoint in BIS underworld and I pull the room, fight for aggro hold all on me, play the piano with my shadow and what does the healer do? He does damage, its good, I can heal myself, i got medpacks and cooldowns.

 

4. People do not respect the tactics and what needs to be attacked first. I do not go into the group finder to fight for aggro and compete with the DPS who attack other targets than what I tank.

 

 

5. I spend millions of credits / hours in my tank to have worse gear tanks perform better. So why should I continue to use my tank?

 

1.) It has an equal chance of dropping as any other spec's piece

2.) The incentive is an insta pop.

3.) But look what YOU did... It was awesome.

4.) The dps should not necessarily be attacking what you do... they should be killing weak to strong.

 

 

I love tanking in this game. I have one of each tank class and I play them all regularly in fp and ops. Sometimes I view my pug group mates as challenges instead of helpers. Crappy groupmates are just another challenge to overcome.

Edited June 17, 2013 by Docmal

Tanking is not fun in pug groups, tanking is fun with a group of friends/guildies. Hence most tanks avoid pugs

And, yet, somehow, very few DPS manage to do this *very* simple thing.

 

I honestly think that misbehaving DPS are one of the big reasons why there are fewer tanks than there would be otherwise. DPS using the wrong kill order or splitting DPS on elite+ targets is *absurdly frustrating*. It probably doesn't help that tanks also have to put their trust in healers: if a healer is bad, a tank is going to faceplant, regardless of their gear. Tanking is a more complex role than healing or DPSing that is *forced* to place a lot of trust in the other players of the group not being idiots. When they *are* idiots, a tank's life is made incredibly frustrating (especially since most DPS will blame you for losing threat when the real reason is their inability to use proper focus DPS and target priority).

 

The master has spoken.

 

This is horrible tbh, as Kitru said, we as tanks have to place our trust to others so we can survive and yet if THE TANK fails (for a reason or the other) the whole group dies. And when that happends people quickly blame the tank even though tanks performance is directley a reflect how the 2x dps & healer handels themselfs.

 

So what happends; good tanks only play with confirmed good players / with their guilds. And when they are not tanking, they are logged in with their alt char (dps / heal). Bottom line, no public tanks.

 

Only way to fix things around is BW creating a hardcore FP training course where a player has to play as all 3 roles and complete the training with fixed and strict parameters and only after this training course you could queue for FP's. But that's too much to ask for, so how about giving FP tanks a guranteed gear drop (good gear raiting) where the gear piece won't even show on the loot list. The tank(s) simply get's it directley, no loot ninja possibilities. I can suffer the wipes and the drama if I know I will get a guranteed *random* gear piece to me that no ninja can steal from me.

The way comms work does not help. All a tank can get is 4 armourings (belt, bracer, non piece and OH, guess Guardians could get 2 more if they ignore their 4pc)

 

DPS and healers can at least farm BiS betl/bracer for mods. Tanks can only get B mods.

 

I think I did about 3 weeks of FPs on each of my tanks, got all the comms I needed and stopped. No reason at all to do them, unless helping out a guildie.

 

I don't even know if Bastion/Bulwark enhancements drop but rather than havin such a random chance I can run ops where I know which pieces have them.