BladeBoques Posted October 31, 2013 Share Posted October 31, 2013 Hey guys, BladeBoques here again. After some good stream sessions our HM Nefra fight became a Q&A and Guardian teaching run. I really enjoyed it, and during the live fight I explained a lot of what I was doing and why. It is pretty tank specific, but it has great info if you guys are interested! http://www.twitch.tv/bladeboques/c/3168699 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ximaus Posted October 31, 2013 Share Posted October 31, 2013 You should preface it by explaining that you are running a hybrid spec. I am sure your spec works for you but, assuming I understand what spec you're running (and correct me if I am wrong), that spec sacrifices 3.5% effective damage reduction + an additional 5% internal/elemental damage reduction in exchange for an effective 3.3% damage reduction. The hybrid's popularity is one of the reasons the Guardian tank tree was made more attractive in 2.0 than it had recently been. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Justcae Posted October 31, 2013 Share Posted October 31, 2013 I enjoyed your upbeat attitude during the video. Not personally how I do it (but i'm not a hybrid Guard ). Couldn't help but notice cleanses seemed to be an issue. Remind your Gunslinger, and Sage that it's worth it to cleanse that themselves. Best wishes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RikuvonDrake Posted October 31, 2013 Share Posted October 31, 2013 (edited) Hey man! Awesome that you wanna get going with guides and stuff, we really need to get more tanks educated, I have three but when I play on my DPS I always feel annoyed when I encounter bad tanks. Anyway it sounds like you know a lot of your specc and that is very awesome and well done, you have done your homework, however your specc is wrong and here is why. The Hybrid Guardian/Jugg Specc vs Full Tank has been discussed a massive number of time and I am the first to say that it was more even before the massive changes in Full Tank, but since then, it's a rockslide victory to Full Tank. First of all you miss 3% damage reduction via crushing blow, this buff on it's own almost matches the 4% you get with hybrid. Second, you lose another 4% shield, seeing how shield isn't the most important stat for Guardian/Jugg it's still more important now then it was before 2.0 since it now also works on energykinetic damage. I agree that with hybrid you can fit in one extra scream each minute and that is around 1400 damage migrated, I would lie if I say that I am awesome with numbers. But I am willing to claim that 4% extra shield is far superior. Third and maybe most important, the rage/focus management become fair more simple with full tank as you will be able to get smash and scream cheap or free if playing correctly, I am even to put in lots of vicious slash in my rotation as well as use vicious throw on cooldown during sub 30% for higher threat/damage. Improved cooldowns is also a advantage, saber ward cooldown is considerably lower, endure pain gets double duration and saber reflect generates lots of threat. I am sorry to say this but I think that you should reconsider your specc, you are taking more damage then you would be if you would respecc and this is something that your healers has to adapt to. I am aware that the current content is only hardmode and is easily blazed through by most guilds even with wrong geared/specced tanks or ****** healers/DPS. But If you want to become a contender and prepare for future nightmare content (or if you still havn't done TFB or Scum Nightmare) I highly recommend you to first read this amazing guide to Juggernaut Tanking, I know that you are a Guardian but the difference is just the ability names. Then respecc into this specc that is full defence, thus the specc that provides far superior damage reduction. Just as a last check you can take a look into this wonderful thread by KeyBoardNinja and dipstick that lines up tanking stats that you should try to aim for when it comes to how to balance defense, shield and absorption. I wish you and your guild the best of luck! Edited October 31, 2013 by RikuvonDrake Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BladeBoques Posted October 31, 2013 Author Share Posted October 31, 2013 (edited) Hey guys! This is exciting I was hoping for these views and discussion and appreciate you all investing your time. No question I should be going over my spec and why, since the aggro drop won't up your damage reduction in the defense tree. Also there are certainly a lot more ways to optimize that fight from a guide perspective, it just so happened I got a lot of tank questions on my stream and thought it served as good enough commentary to post. Okay so all that said, I appreciate your approach RikuvonDrake and I'd like to tell you why I disagree. There is a 3% damage reduction I do not get with guardian strike, that is true. Yet, I get 4% damage reduction from Awe, this is static and always applied to the character sheet. This also does not have to be applied during an ability so I am actually coming out ahead on that one. The loss of 4% shield... I would never lose my shield! I love it, and have that 4% in my build. I would not even try hybrid if I couldn't have both hilt strike and shield. You mention that focus is easier to maintain with defense which I agree, however I am happy dropping focus increase for the added damage mitigation. Also, in my experience my DPS goes up in hybrid not down. This is because of the 3 second reduced cooldown on bladestorm. Every 9 seconds, rather than 12. That plus overhead slash outdamage guardian slash my DPS is usually higher in hybrid. That brings me to my last two reasons behind hybrid. Blade storm, absorbs 20% of incoming dmg on the next hit. In hybrid I can use it 25% more, this is significant and the only other defense I am missing in the defense tree is the added 5% internal/element damage reduction during the 20 seconds enure is active, which is every 90 seconds if its used off cooldown. I also do not believe it should be used off cooldown as I bet many agree. Lastly, overlapping focused defense and double taunts you force the boss to stay on your through your aggro drop, this is a +15 damage reduction for 10 seconds. All that beind said I use both specs depending on the fight, and this major weaknesses are the incredible lack of AOe Threat, guardmanship and the extra 1 second on reflect. All this is understood by my raid team and we compensate with our vanguard handling first aoe taunts during trash and I follow up building off his threat, and I handle all the major single dmg NPCs while he mops us the others. I have to say that is the nicest "Your spec is wrong and you should change" message I've ever gotten! Really good discussion so far. Edited October 31, 2013 by BladeBoques Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paowee Posted October 31, 2013 Share Posted October 31, 2013 (edited) Hey man! Awesome that you wanna get going with guides and stuff, we really need to get more tanks educated, I have three but when I play on my DPS I always feel annoyed when I encounter bad tanks. Anyway it sounds like you know a lot of your specc and that is very awesome and well done, you have done your homework, however your specc is wrong and here is why. The Hybrid Guardian/Jugg Specc vs Full Tank has been discussed a massive number of time and I am the first to say that it was more even before the massive changes in Full Tank, but since then, it's a rockslide victory to Full Tank. OT: Hey since we talking about tanking... I added a Darkness Sin tank (Insaneric's from the Assassin forums) to wordpress.com as well! I recently rolled a VG and going to play around with him and ask any advanced tips from my guild's VG MT as well and make a guide for that. I'm looking to make an Immortal write-up too (I was a Jugg MT during... lol NIM EC >_<,, one of the worst times to play a Jugg tank. Although that was when the Hybrid tank build became really popular iirc. Patch 1.4 ish Edited October 31, 2013 by paowee Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
angrytrout Posted October 31, 2013 Share Posted October 31, 2013 Check your facts. This guy's hybrid spec is weaker in terms of threat (especially AOE threat), but stronger in terms of damage reduction. Go read the trees, try it for yourself and don't always believe everything you're told. "Think for yourself. Question authority." -Timothy Leary Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KeyboardNinja Posted October 31, 2013 Share Posted October 31, 2013 (edited) That brings me to my last two reasons behind hybrid. Blade storm, absorbs 20% of incoming dmg on the next hit. Nope. Blade Barrier / Sonic Barrier is a heal that is functionally identical to a Sage bubble (Force Armor / Lightning Shield). It absorbs about 1.5k damage. The normal cooldown is 12 seconds, and in hybrid it is 9. That's a HPS difference of 167 - 125 = 42 HPS. That's noticeable, and it's definitely a great thing to have, but it's not as much as you seem to think. I'll do the math on the survivability in the post-2.0 hybrid one of these days (could you link a skill tree? 23/23/0?). I know the old hybrid was marginally better, but not by as much as you would think. That was before the DR increase from Guardian Slash, which almost certainly pushes full Defense above the hybrid. I'll reserve judgment until I actually run the numbers though. Edit… Assuming you're using 23/23/0, the relative survivability of the hybrid vs full defense are as follows (in full 75 armorings with a stat budget of 2700, so basically full Kell Dragon): Full defense: 58.3367% Hybrid: 58.8186% Since the average DtPS is 4574.46, that means you're beating full Defense by 4574.46 * (0.588186 - 0.583367) = 22.04 DtPS post-mitigation (on average). Note that if I focus just on Nefra, I suspect they would be dead-even (perhaps slightly advantaging full Defense), because Nefra's DtPS is 8.2k, which dramatically devalues the Blade Storm heal. So, 22 DtPS advantage, but you're sacrificing the AoE and single-target threat from Guardian Slash (which is an order of magnitude higher threat than the damage talents you pick up from Vig), the cooldown reduction on Riposte, the proc forcing on Riposte (meaning that you will have some rare cases where Blade Barricade drops), and the cooldown reduction (and damage increase) on Force Sweep. That's a LOT that you're giving up. Honestly, I don't think it's worth it. Edited October 31, 2013 by KeyboardNinja Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cxten Posted October 31, 2013 Share Posted October 31, 2013 (edited) Assuming you're using 23/23/0, the relative survivability of the hybrid vs full defense are as follows (in full 75 armorings with a stat budget of 2700, so basically full Kell Dragon): Full defense: 58.3367% Hybrid: 58.8186% Would you mind checking what stat budget the 58.8% would correspond to for full defense? It's hard to get a feel for what 22 less damage taken per second on average means in order to compare it to losing some damage, threat, and reliability. All these percentages start to look quite close together, but in the end something is meaningful. I'm sure you have intuition for how big the number 22 is here from playing with this for so long, but it's a bit opaque to me. Perhaps if you can say "the improved mitigation is equivalent to upgrading three Kell Dragon pieces to Dread Forged" or something of this sort, then this would be more understandable. (I really just am asking for the extra mitigation needed in full defense to attain .5% extra DR here.) --------- On another topic, we're lambasting this guy for his spec, but if he can manage the threat problems etc then he does get some (perhaps small) benefit. At the least you could say it would be beneficial to switch to this spec for certain fights, I would imagine. --------- One more question: Do your DR numbers include time-averaging of long cooldowns like Warding Call (which has reduced cooldown for full defense)? Edited October 31, 2013 by cxten Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KeyboardNinja Posted October 31, 2013 Share Posted October 31, 2013 (edited) Would you mind checking what stat budget the 58.8% would correspond to for full defense? It's hard to get a feel for what 22 less damage taken per second on average means in order to compare it to losing some damage, threat, and reliability. All these percentages start to look quite close together, but in the end something is meaningful. I'm sure you have intuition for how big the number 22 is here from playing with this for so long, but it's a bit opaque to me. Perhaps if you can say "the improved mitigation is equivalent to upgrading three Kell Dragon pieces to Dread Forged" or something of this sort, then this would be more understandable. (I really just am asking for the extra mitigation needed in full defense to attain .5% extra DR here.) It's actually more of a change than you would think. :-) It's roughly equivalent to upgrading all five set pieces (including armorings) from Kell Dragon to Dread Forged (assuming optimal itemization). So, it's a lot. I gave the value in terms of HPS because I wanted to drive home how the effect would be seen by healers. To put the HPS in perspective, an average tank is going to require somewhere between 1500 and 1800 HPS to stay neutral on most current content. So, 22 HPS is a 1.4% - 1.2% increase in the burden imposed on the tank healer. Incidentally, the DR numbers ignore cooldowns altogether. So, it depends a bit on how much value you attach to the extra time on Warding Call and Saber Reflect. Edited October 31, 2013 by KeyboardNinja Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RikuvonDrake Posted October 31, 2013 Share Posted October 31, 2013 (edited) On another topic, we're lambasting this guy for his spec, but if he can manage the threat problems etc then he does get some (perhaps small) benefit. At the least you could say it would be beneficial to switch to this spec for certain fights, I would imagine. None is giving the guy crap for being a bad player since it's clear that he knows his class well and the same can be said about his specc and how to use it, however we just pointed out that his specc is bad and inferior to full defense specc, sure there are a few phases were that aggro drop + double taunt is useful, but I think that if you take a look at entire fights and not focus on specific phases, even you will understand that his specc is bad for the raid as whole. That is also the most important thing, raiding isn't just a one man show, you cannot solo Dread Palace or Fortress on HM you need to be in a raid and you need to work with each other in order to kill bosses. But as I state before, current content is only hardmode so it should be easily cleared even with tank in wrong specc =) Edited November 1, 2013 by RikuvonDrake Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HBCentaurion Posted November 1, 2013 Share Posted November 1, 2013 The idea behind this sounds interesting and I would like to test it out. Could you please post your build? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BladeBoques Posted November 2, 2013 Author Share Posted November 2, 2013 (edited) Hey guys, good input for sure. Here is my build http://www.torhead.com/skill-calc#500GMRbddMoMZcGrMbhzzM.3 I am glad we are doing this, because even though I have all the tanks 55, two 55 guardians and have played for years I know there is always more I can learn. I never cling to an idea so when there is evidence to the contrary I am happy to debate it. Keyboard ninja you enlightened me on blade storm, though I still do not see it as a heal, it does not reduce incoming damage by 20% like I thought. So this just absorbs 1.5K for the next hit huh? Is this before or after the 4 piece 20% increase to the blade barrier? I understand and agree that without the guardian slash I do not have an auto proc on repost, though it is up so often it is hard to tell that there isn't 100% up time on it. Certainly though, its not up in the beginning of fights. Now the defense tree perks of 1 extra second to saber reflect and the 30 second reduction to warding call are significant, but I do not believe they compare to the straight up damage reduction of 15% every 60 seconds. This running whether or not you have focus to spend and should not be considered a major focus dump in place of DPS abilities. Coupling this with a focus-less sweep (hybrid only perk) and a master strike can be used without worrying about not having focus. This whole spec revolves around having four abilities. The hilt strike in defense, and the 2/2 shield specialization in defense, the overhead slash in vigilance and the 2/2 Awe in vigilance. Single target threat is not a problem combining hilt and overhead in an early burst, using taunts properly is really how openings work anyways. AoE threat issues are picked up by my offtank, as it was stated by others this is a team effort and everyone on my team understands their roles. Shield Specialization is a must for any guardian tank. Awe allows for that 15% damage reduction every 60 seconds. This is a very strong and very frequent cooldown and enables us as tanks to really take major hitters for a long time. It is comparable to the battle readiness of shadows except this can put us just under 70% DR and much more often. Lastly I wanted to mention again I use both full defense and hybrid for various boss fights. Hybrid is what I run is about 80% of them, and not sure if you guys all saw my NIM Dash'Roode kill but we 1 Tanked it to get 5 DPS. Sure sure, it means our 4 DPS weren't as high as we wanted, but I am confident that I could not have solo tanked 8Man NIM Dash'Roode in another build in the gear I had with was 72 with gloves/belt that were 75. If anyone wants to try in that gear I'd be interested in seeing the video. Edited November 2, 2013 by BladeBoques Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vaidinah Posted November 2, 2013 Share Posted November 2, 2013 I am glad we are doing this, because even though I have all the tanks 55, two 55 guardians and have played for years I know there is always more I can learn. I never cling to an idea so when there is evidence to the contrary I am happy to debate it. Keyboard ninja you enlightened me on blade storm, though I still do not see it as a heal, it does not reduce incoming damage by 20% like I thought. So this just absorbs 1.5K for the next hit huh? Is this before or after the 4 piece 20% increase to the blade barrier? I haven't tested it in a while, but I'm 95% sure that is after the 20% boost. Now the defense tree perks of 1 extra second to saber reflect and the 30 second reduction to warding call are significant, but I do not believe they compare to the straight up damage reduction of 15% every 60 seconds. This running whether or not you have focus to spend and should not be considered a major focus dump in place of DPS abilities. Coupling this with a focus-less sweep (hybrid only perk) and a master strike can be used without worrying about not having focus. There are a couple inaccurate statements here. 1) Saber Reflect lasts 2 extra seconds in full Defense, not 1. 2) There is no 15% damage reduction every 60 seconds (see below). 3) You miss out on 5% elemental/internal damage reduction, which is very significant on HM DF/DP. 4) You lose out on having Guardianship, so you miss out on protecting your team from damage with your AoE taunt. 5) You rely almost completely on your co-tank to deal with AoE. I ran a hybrid Juggernaught tank since it become the best tank spec for our class (1.2 from what I recall), but it's just inferior now to full Defense/Immortal. Single target threat is not a problem combining hilt and overhead in an early burst, using taunts properly is really how openings work anyways. AoE threat issues are picked up by my offtank, as it was stated by others this is a team effort and everyone on my team understands their roles. Shield Specialization is a must for any guardian tank. Awe allows for that 15% damage reduction every 60 seconds. This is a very strong and very frequent cooldown and enables us as tanks to really take major hitters for a long time. It is comparable to the battle readiness of shadows except this can put us just under 70% DR and much more often. Awe does not have a 15% damage reduction every 60 seconds unless it is bugged. The 15% damage reduction should only apply when using Focused/Enraged Defense, which is an underutilized skill, but still only used in certain situations. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RikuvonDrake Posted November 2, 2013 Share Posted November 2, 2013 (edited) Lastly I wanted to mention again I use both full defense and hybrid for various boss fights. Hybrid is what I run is about 80% of them, and not sure if you guys all saw my NIM Dash'Roode kill but we 1 Tanked it to get 5 DPS. Sure sure, it means our 4 DPS weren't as high as we wanted, but I am confident that I could not have solo tanked 8Man NIM Dash'Roode in another build in the gear I had with was 72 with gloves/belt that were 75. If anyone wants to try in that gear I'd be interested in seeing the video. Hey, my guild don't have the same DPS problem as you guys so I have never solo tanked Dash, but when we do it with two tanks, the only time I am not tanking is when I am in the air. Anyway, I have done it in full defense specc with 69/72 gear, don't understand your point with the whole solo tanking dash thought, I mean it only means your DPS don't know their rotation good enough (or as you are playing the wrong specc), I cannot understand how tanking it is different Anyway, I understand that you are happy with your current specc and you won't change your opinion even thought you don't have the math, logic or community behind you. This is normal during HM content, it is pretty much clearable with wrong specc if you have a skilled player (in this case I guess healers) to compensate =) Edited November 2, 2013 by RikuvonDrake Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Falver Posted November 2, 2013 Share Posted November 2, 2013 (edited) One thing I'd like to mention about the 5% elemental, it's extremely important while tanking Brontes since her arc lightning is completely non-mitigatable. The elemental reduction is really the only thing in the tree that helps you out. Edit: But I will say, in content with less difficulty, say HM TFB/SaV, it probably IS better than full defense because of the HPS argument, the same way shadow tanks are functioning currently. Edited November 2, 2013 by Falver Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BladeBoques Posted November 3, 2013 Author Share Posted November 3, 2013 Sorry if I was not clear before, the "Awe" ability does nothing with damage reduction. Specing into "Commanding Awe" in the vigilance tree as linked above allows for the ability "Focused defense" to add 15% damage reduction to whatever DR we currently have. This last 10 seconds and can be used every 60 seconds. So coming from a purely constructive point of view, can additional seconds on saber reflect, or element/internal reduction help on nefra? I don't think either of those are affected by anything done in that boss, but adding +15% DR 3 or 4 times in the fight certainly does. What does everyone think now that I have explained better? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vaidinah Posted November 3, 2013 Share Posted November 3, 2013 (edited) For the HM Nefra fight specifically, hybrid is actually better than full Defense/Immortal if your co-tank holds the boss most of the time. This is because there is nothing to Saber Reflect in the entire fight, you can use Focused/Enraged Defense on every other DoT you get (it's the only elemental/internal damage you take), and depending on your team's positioning, you can't reach many of them to protect them with your AoE taunt, anyways. It's a short enough fight that you can't use your Warding Call/Invincible or Saber Ward twice so the lower cooldowns don't matter. So yeah, it works fine there. My comments before were about hybrid compared to full Defense/Immortal in general. Edited November 3, 2013 by Vaidinah Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RikuvonDrake Posted November 3, 2013 Share Posted November 3, 2013 It's true that if you are the offtank hybrid would be more superior, but in this case he is tank maintank that is holding the aggro of the boss at least 90% of the fight Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BladeBoques Posted November 3, 2013 Author Share Posted November 3, 2013 (edited) Okay I am glad to have your support on hybrid on that level. Can you explain what you both mean by only useful if that is the offtank's build? I don't understand. The person who uses the focused defense aggro drop coupled with his two taunts can force the boss to stay on him through that extra 15% DR increase. So that keeps the boss on him through his added defense and why I run it as a main tank. An offtank using this would not utilize the defenses other than for split attacks only. Wouldn't we want this hybrid taking the boss the majority of the time since their taunts negate the aggro drop anyway? Edited November 3, 2013 by BladeBoques Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Falver Posted November 3, 2013 Share Posted November 3, 2013 Okay I am glad to have your support on hybrid on that level. Can you explain what you both mean by only useful if that is the offtank's build? I don't understand. The person who uses the focused defense aggro drop coupled with his two taunts can force the boss to stay on him through that extra 15% DR increase. So that keeps the boss on him through his added defense and why I run it as a main tank. An offtank using this would not utilize the defenses other than for split attacks only. Wouldn't we want this hybrid taking the boss the majority of the time since their taunts negate the aggro drop anyway? The simple answer: having to blow both taunts just to marginally be better than a standard defense build is hardly an asset. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Justcae Posted November 3, 2013 Share Posted November 3, 2013 Not going to bother with a whole lot of quotes here. Just trying to make a summary of what I'm seeing. The Hybrid build looks like a neat twist on Guardian tanking. It becomes tied to a gimmick almost. I think you are probably going to see more DR with the Focused Defense in Hybrid than the 30s off of each cooldown you'd get from full defense. I do think you give up a great deal of utility for that DR though. I wouldn't use the build on my guardian alt but its an interesting perspective none the less. Having watched your video and seen the mechanics going on though I do have a suggestion if you want. Nefra is an interesting boss in that it doesn't have an autoattack at all. It has it's main attack "Twin Attack", and the DoT it occasionally puts out "Voice of The Masters." Because it doesn't have an auto attack each tank is getting hit by the same stuff at the same time. There's no need for you to blow your AoE after a drop. You could simply hand of threat duty to your co partner. If you wanted to use your Guardian Leap to lower his damage in take you could save your AoE or ST for that.. I may leave that by the wayside though. Anyways, long story short, if you had him hold aggro you could do your Focused Defense thing on cooldown without worrying about the AoE thing. It'll still be just as effective and you won't ever have to see the boss turn away and crush your raid in the beginning. I think the build going forward in your progression will require you build your strategies specifically around what and where your build will be able to function to its utmost. But if you guys are enjoying it, and progressing all the power to you. I'd ask out of curiosity how much damage are you seeing in your logs on Nefra? Or more specifically just the the Twin Attack total. For instance my last four clears I had 244k (2m38s), 269k (2m41s), 249k (2m43s), 252k (2m42s). Best wishes in you endeavours going forward. Hope your twitch thing works out for you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vaidinah Posted November 3, 2013 Share Posted November 3, 2013 Okay I am glad to have your support on hybrid on that level. Can you explain what you both mean by only useful if that is the offtank's build? I don't understand. The person who uses the focused defense aggro drop coupled with his two taunts can force the boss to stay on him through that extra 15% DR increase. So that keeps the boss on him through his added defense and why I run it as a main tank. An offtank using this would not utilize the defenses other than for split attacks only. Wouldn't we want this hybrid taking the boss the majority of the time since their taunts negate the aggro drop anyway? Nefra is unique in that the tank not holding it takes more damage than the "main tank". Thus, to make best use of your 15% DR bonus on Focused/Enraged Defense, you'd want to be the off-tank (aka not holding the boss) to prevent the most damage. Also, to clarify, Focused/Enraged Defense has a 45 second cooldown, but would be used around every 60 for the DoT (Voice of the Masters) since it happens every 30 seconds. As for DPS, my full Immortal Juggernaught is still putting out 1250 DPS on this fight while off-tanking and using Enraged Defense every 60 seconds (2 uses total). Using Focused/Enraged Defense with the hybrid will probably hurt your tank DPS a lot more since it's already resource starved in the first place. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BladeBoques Posted November 4, 2013 Author Share Posted November 4, 2013 I'll let ya know Justcae, travelling for business this weekend but I'll be back to my computer with the combat logs on Tuesday. I did not know the tank with aggro takes less damage, how was this figured out? Did someone test it with the same two tanks in each role many times each and averaged out the hits? I am relatively new to the forum community side of the game so I likely missed such testing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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