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How do you achieve 60+APM?


Ardarell_Solo

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Interesting! Could it be they're exploiting the "taking damage" part of this somehow:

 

"Quickness Set Bonus (Passive) – Grants 5% increase to Alacrity and a 1% chance to proc an Alacrity Surge after taking damage, greatly increasing your Alacrity over 20 seconds. Can happen once every 30 minutes. In addition, grants your companion an Alacrity Surge whenever you use an adrenal. This effect is not applied in PvP."

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It also includes things that are off the global cooldown, like adrenals and such.

 

For Carnage/Combat, they have the passive 3% alacrity, and Berserk/Zen (for Carnage/Combat) adds another 30% alacrity. That means you only need enough alacrity rating to get to 17% alacrity percentage, which is 2159 alacrity rating. Its achievable under current stat budgets with 248 gear but you sacrifice a lot of critical to do it. Its probably easier to get to with 258 gear. With that much alacrity, you can achieve a 1 second GCD under Berserk/Zen.

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It also includes things that are off the global cooldown, like adrenals and such.

 

For Carnage/Combat, they have the passive 3% alacrity, and Berserk/Zen (for Carnage/Combat) adds another 30% alacrity. That means you only need enough alacrity rating to get to 17% alacrity percentage, which is 2159 alacrity rating. Its achievable under current stat budgets with 248 gear but you sacrifice a lot of critical to do it. Its probably easier to get to with 258 gear. With that much alacrity, you can achieve a 1 second GCD under Berserk/Zen.

 

I forgot to mention this is about Annihilation/Watchman parses with no passive alacrity bonus in the spec. I use Adrenals, too, and also Force Camouflage for the extra DPS, but I can only get to 57-58 APM - and I'm usually pretty good at playing with highest APM possible, using everything that's off GCD.

 

Also the parses with up to 62 APM have critical damage percentages and standard damage values on non critical hits of abilities like the dots that indicate the players do not have less Critical or Mastery in their gear - otherwise those numbers would have to be lower. As far as I read those parses, it's the standard 258 gear setup. Only alacrity is way out of bounds.

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Well, assuming they have the guild ship perk for 5% alacrity, you could get to the 1.2s GCD threshold all the time with that, plus 2836 alacrity rating. That is possible with 258 gear and 240 augments if all the augments are alacrity and you substitute in the healer chest alacrity enhancement instead of the usual dps critical. You would have enough accuracy from the stim and the hands/feet accuracy enhancements. Crit would still be a little low as all you would have is the stim, two enhancements, and your color crystals.
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Well, assuming they have the guild ship perk for 5% alacrity, you could get to the 1.2s GCD threshold all the time with that, plus 2836 alacrity rating. That is possible with 258 gear and 240 augments if all the augments are alacrity and you substitute in the healer chest alacrity enhancement instead of the usual dps critical. You would have enough accuracy from the stim and the hands/feet accuracy enhancements. Crit would still be a little low as all you would have is the stim, two enhancements, and your color crystals.

 

That's an interesting guess, thanks. I still doubt you can achieve the amount of critical damage that the parses show with that little amount of critical in your gear.

Edited by Ardarell_Solo
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Either way imo the Quickness Set Bonus Guild Ship Perk needs to be changed or substituted by something else.

 

<- All the other Guild Ship set bonus static stat boosts are ok, because they don't stack with the respective class buffs. Since alacrity is not in any of the class buffs, the Quickness set bonus is the odd man out: a massive static stat buff locked behind guild perks.

 

The other thing they could do would be to disallow guild perks on training dummys like they are disallowed in MM ops. That would makes sense, since dummys are used for minmaxing endgame performance which you really only need to do for MM ops. However, I assume that would be much more complicated, given training dummys are not only on your personal ship, but also on the fleet and possibly in your Rishi stronghold... Thus changing/substituting the Quickness set bonus is probably easier...

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The guild perk is just bugged. It gives 10% alacrity instead of 5% as described, which leads to the next GCD threshold without loosing any crit stat.

 

Parsely-Admin knows this, but refuses to delete these unrealistic parses allthough all other parses with significant bonuses like guild orbital strike got removed. One could simply filter them by removing all parses with higher APM then possible for each class, but its "too much work".:rolleyes:

 

if you want to compare your dps with realistic parses just ignore the ones with 1.2GCDs. (you can calculate the average GCD by looking at the rotations tab i.e. and see if these are legit parses)

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The guild perk is just bugged. It gives 10% alacrity instead of 5% as described, which leads to the next GCD threshold without loosing any crit stat.

 

Parsely-Admin knows this, but refuses to delete these unrealistic parses allthough all other parses with significant bonuses like guild orbital strike got removed. One could simply filter them by removing all parses with higher APM then possible for each class, but its "too much work".:rolleyes:

 

if you want to compare your dps with realistic parses just ignore the ones with 1.2GCDs. (you can calculate the average GCD by looking at the rotations tab i.e. and see if these are legit parses)

 

Oh thank you so much for the explanation, that explains it. Thanks for talking to parsely admin, too. Who is it these days? When I played more actively it was Marisi, I think...

 

The way you explained how to recognize parses as legit sounds to me like something you could write a routine for and eliminate those parses automatically. But I'm not a programmer.

 

Thanks a lot for the info!

Edited by Ardarell_Solo
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if you want to compare your dps with realistic parses just ignore the ones with 1.2GCDs. (you can calculate the average GCD by looking at the rotations tab i.e. and see if these are legit parses)

 

I just did that for Sents/Maras and it turns out all top 8 parses use that bug. In top 10 only those by "Non-sorc Zanwell", "Rana'vex" are legit. #11 ist with the bugged perk, too, from then on the rest of the parses are legit as well.

 

That's a substantially distorted list Parsely presents these days, then. Assuming Sents/Maras are by far not the only spec who does it, imo you can hardly call that a "leaderboard"...

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Carnage parses can be just a little above 60APM without any bugs. You just need to use hidden savagery utility to get an extra offensive skill and mash your buttons very hard overall :D

 

For other 2 specs it's the guild perk bug, for sure.

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Carnage parses can be just a little above 60APM without any bugs. You just need to use hidden savagery utility to get an extra offensive skill and mash your buttons very hard overall :D

 

For other 2 specs it's the guild perk bug, for sure.

 

Everyone uses hidden savagery - and there have never been any good parses without abusing your keyboard ^^

 

Still this explains why eliminating pases using that bug is a little harder than I thought: You have to calculate average standard GCD length based on alacrity bonuses of each spec and then eliminate parses with 0.1 secs shorter GCDs. Still seems doable, if you use this as a basis:

Edited by Ardarell_Solo
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Parsely-Admin knows this, but refuses to delete these unrealistic parses allthough all other parses with significant bonuses like guild orbital strike got removed. One could simply filter them by removing all parses with higher APM then possible for each class, but its "too much work".:rolleyes:

 

I got the impression he got tired of working for free. :shrug:

 

He should slap a discrete ad on his site if he wants to make a little money for his work.

Edited by Rion_Starkiller
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I got the impression he got tired of working for free. :shrug:

 

He should slap a discrete ad on his site if he wants to make a little money for his work.

 

thats absolutly reasonable and i appriciate the work and effort behind this project. we wouldnt have any other solid way to rank all specs and compare them in each boss fight. so dont get me wrong, not wanna be ungrateful here.

 

on the other hand i dont think these kinds of project are designed to get payed for. the community using them is to small and if you would hide them behind a paywall nobody would use them anymore.

 

one should be aware of that situation when starting such projects, and i´m sure the creators of parsely were.

you either do it correct, or dont do it at all.

 

but yeah, thats why I/we cant demand anything from them. but in this case its a very easy check to implement to filter these bugged perks. and seeing the impact of them to such a nice tool, makes me kinda sad.

 

I just did that for Sents/Maras and it turns out all top 8 parses use that bug. In top 10 only those by "Non-sorc Zanwell", "Rana'vex" are legit. #11 ist with the bugged perk, too, from then on the rest of the parses are legit as well.

 

That's a substantially distorted list Parsely presents these days, then. Assuming Sents/Maras are by far not the only spec who does it, imo you can hardly call that a "leaderboard"...

 

at this point i think all top100 parses overall use this perk. theres one guild who discovered it first and literaly spamed the board with these 1.2GCD parses from all specs.

 

on a side note: even some of the "legit" parses arent realistic, as they use pre-build resources to skip some parts of the opener like non-sorc did, since the opener of anni is very slow. you wouldnt have that pre-build rage with anni in a legit bossfight most of the time. but these are minor differences compared to the 10% dps boost the perk provides.

Edited by mrphstar
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on a side note: even some of the "legit" parses arent realistic, as they use pre-build resources to skip some parts of the opener like non-sorc did, since the opener of anni is very slow. you wouldnt have that pre-build rage with anni in a legit bossfight most of the time. but these are minor differences compared to the 10% dps boost the perk provides.

 

Yeah I saw what non-sorc did, but didn't mention it because this thread was about something else. Players have been doing this for as long as dummy parses have been compared and ranked. In the old days before parsely existed, members of the community did the leaderboards here on the forums and checked each and every parse players submitted and disallowed them if stuff like non-sorc's was in them. But that really was a ****load of work. Back then none of the 1.2 GCD parses would have made it on any leaderboard, too, of course.

 

With a tool like Parsely you basically have to rely on participants playing fair game. You can't do much about cheaters. Of course if someone made the effort to extract a legit leaderboard from parsely lists and posted them here, we'd have a clean leaderboard. As much as I would like to do that, I just can't spend the necessary amount of time these days. And I'm not the only one at that for sure...

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Yeah I saw what non-sorc did, but didn't mention it because this thread was about something else. Players have been doing this for as long as dummy parses have been compared and ranked. In the old days before parsely existed, members of the community did the leaderboards here on the forums and checked each and every parse players submitted and disallowed them if stuff like non-sorc's was in them. But that really was a ****load of work. Back then none of the 1.2 GCD parses would have made it on any leaderboard, too, of course.

 

With a tool like Parsely you basically have to rely on participants playing fair game. You can't do much about cheaters. Of course if someone made the effort to extract a legit leaderboard from parsely lists and posted them here, we'd have a clean leaderboard. As much as I would like to do that, I just can't spend the necessary amount of time these days. And I'm not the only one at that for sure...

 

That's basically how its been for a long time now. This days I just look at the math and how much should I be parsing. In the end what trully matters though is whether your are doing good numbers in NiM progression.

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In the end what trully matters though is whether your are doing good numbers in NiM progression.

 

Yeah that's the master class of playing SWTOR. Unfortunately I can't spend the amount of time necessary for that anymore and neither can the players I used to do it with. But I still like to optimize gear and rotation of the current specs and see what can be done with them. To me dummy parsing is a bit like katas are in martial arts. I really enjoy it and I also like the competitive aspect of comparing legit parses. But that's just me :-)

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