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4.0 Tank Stats


Karlbadmanners's Avatar


Karlbadmanners
11.07.2015 , 09:34 PM | #21
Having a hard time understanding the number tables in relation to KBN's old format, I am math illiterate, and help would be appreciated. Thanks for the hard work so far

Voths's Avatar


Voths
11.07.2015 , 09:52 PM | #22
Quote: Originally Posted by Karlbadmanners View Post
Having a hard time understanding the number tables in relation to KBN's old format, I am math illiterate, and help would be appreciated. Thanks for the hard work so far
For 220 rating gear (Hard Mode), you want to shoot for the following stats on average using B mods.

Assassin / Shadow use Reactive Warding and Shield Amplification relic.
Defense = 2506
Shield = 1367
Absorb = 1355

Juggernaut / Guardian use Reactive Warding and Shrouded Crusader relic.
Defense = 2506
Shield = 1333
Absorb = 1369

Powertech / Vanguard use Reactive Warding and Shrouded Crusader relic.
Defense = 2506
Shield = 1564
Absorb = 1138

Voths's Avatar


Voths
11.07.2015 , 10:18 PM | #23
dipstik, thank you for getting this together. I used your numbers during 3.0 and I (and my raid group!) was very happy.

I've been mulling over two ideas for a while now and wanted to bounce them off of you.

First, it's been established that 220 B mods are best for that tier. I'm sold on this, no problems there. What are your feelings on going from 220 B to 224 unlettered? Is it better, worse, or situational? I won't go into tanking styles and ideologies, but I feel that the gain in Defense may not be worthwhile, especially in harder difficulties where there are more shieldable or unresistable attacks.

Second, I've noticed there are three varieties of tank enhancements this time around instead of two. I'm not in game so I can't get their names, but I can give a synopsis. There are standard token enhancements with the "best" stats and the endurance heavy ones from the commendation vendors. However, there is a new variety from the non-token drops in raids that has a very nice balance in stats and endurance. I am very tempted to use these right now and am hoarding them. What are your thoughts on these compared to token or even 224 enhancements?

Thanks.

titanvoyager's Avatar


titanvoyager
11.08.2015 , 08:00 PM | #24
Hey mate, how much HP should a juggernaut tank aim in current hm/nim content?

dipstik's Avatar


dipstik
11.09.2015 , 01:00 PM | #25
@titanvoyager : many are saying 80k. thats easier to hit with a sin. maybe 77k since there are so many cooldowns for juggs.

@voths: you can look at the squish numbers for 224 unlettered versus 220bmods. you do get better mitigation for 224, but you may not hit the hp you want.

lets compare the 138 and 168 endurance enhancements to the 104 endurance enhancements.
168v104
168-104: 64 end
44-116: -72 def
159-168: -9 shield/absorb

now 138v104:
138-104: 34 end
77-116: -39 def
168-168=0 shield /absorb

looking at adding 10 defense, shield or absorb to m=0.5 and m=0.8 profiles gives for damage taken:
m=0.5 base +10def +10shd +10abs ddef dshd dabs
sin 1492.7 1492.3 1491.1 1491.1 0.4 1.6 1.6
jugg 1303.6 1303.1 1302.6 1302.6 0.5 1 1
pt 1316.3 1315.9 1315 1315 0.4 1.3 1.3

m=.8 ddef dshd dabs
sin 1169.8 1169.2 1168.6 1168.6 0.6 1.2 1.2
jugg 1044.5 1043.8 1043.6 1043.6 0.7 0.9 0.9
pt 1122.9 1122.3 1121.8 1121.8 0.6 1.1 1.1

assuming 6k boss dps.

for sins in m=.5, there is a 4:1 ratio between the worth of defense to shild/absorb, 2:1 for juggs and a little less than 4:1 for pts. at m=.8 we get 2:1 for sin, almost 1:1 for jugg and almost 2:1 for pts.

lets take some averages and take the worth of shield/absorb in relation to defense as 3:1 for low melee/ranged fights. so losing 72 points of defense is like losing 24 points of shield/absorb for low m/r fights. so the total for 168v104 endurance enhancements would be 9+27=33 points of shield/absorb loss for 64 endurance. thats a ratio of 2:1 of endurance gained from mitigation lost. for the 138v104 you lose an effective 13 points of mitigation for 34 endurance, which is 2.6:1, much better.

for the m=0.8 fights we get shield/absorb to defense has a 1.5 ish ratio. 168x104 gives (72/1.5)+9=35 mitigation loss for 64 endurance, so a 1.8:1 trade. 138v104 we get 39/1.5=26 mitigation for 34 endurance, giving a 1.3:1 trade, much worse.

the bmods give 34 endurance for 29 more defense which equates to 10 to 15 shield/absorb, so the trade comes out to 2.3:1 to 3:1. so it looks like trading out 104 endurance enhancements for 138 endurance enhancements before mods might be a thing for low melee/ranged fights (since the 2.6:1 is better than the 2.3:1).

tl/dr: the 168 endurance enhancements look better for high melee/ranged fights, and the 138 endurance enhancements look better for low melee/ranged fights.

Karlbadmanners's Avatar


Karlbadmanners
11.09.2015 , 02:42 PM | #26
Thank you very much Shrouded Crusader though? Hmm, I get dropping Fortunate Redoubt now that we have such high DEF numbers, but I would have figured Shield Amp Relic would be the replacement. Though I can't argue against the usefulness of the clicky.

Voths's Avatar


Voths
11.09.2015 , 02:55 PM | #27
Interesting. Thank you.

dipstik's Avatar


dipstik
11.09.2015 , 03:45 PM | #28
Quote: Originally Posted by Karlbadmanners View Post
Thank you very much Shrouded Crusader though? Hmm, I get dropping Fortunate Redoubt now that we have such high DEF numbers, but I would have figured Shield Amp Relic would be the replacement. Though I can't argue against the usefulness of the clicky.
the numbers are based on using it on cooldown. but using it at opportune moments will, i think, be helpful. that said, the numbers between the absorb proc and the on use are very close. you can see this by comparing the S numbers to the A numbers.

titanvoyager's Avatar


titanvoyager
11.11.2015 , 07:13 AM | #29
Thx mate, really appreciate the help.

naikio's Avatar


naikio
11.13.2015 , 10:45 AM | #30
I read dipstik suggesting a rating of m=6 for the m/r vs f/t damage ratio on HM bosses.
Is there any update based on logs, and is there any suggestion for NiM bosses?
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