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ETA on Advanced Class change?

STAR WARS: The Old Republic > English > General Discussion
ETA on Advanced Class change?

Halinalle's Avatar


Halinalle
03.12.2014 , 09:58 AM | #4291
Quote: Originally Posted by ekimmak View Post
And of course, there's the peer pressure of guilds demanding that you switch to the FOTM side so that you aren't hampering their progression, or PUGs that demand you switch so you can provide your alternate classes utility role, even if you don't have the gear for it ...

The option to swap ACs gives people something else they can unrealistically expect you to do.
"We don't want your Guardian, switch to Sentinel or get kicked."
Not something I want to hear after initial "Hi!".

Icebergy's Avatar


Icebergy
03.12.2014 , 10:00 AM | #4292
Quote: Originally Posted by Seldan View Post
I provided a scenario above a few posts back.

You are arguing semantics on the the definition of advanced class vs class. I'm not going to get into a circular argument with you on this, it's been done many times in this thread.
If you think the exact definition of a class and how Bioware themselves has defined it is semantics, then I don't know what else to tell you.

Quote: Originally Posted by Seldan View Post
Using WoW as an example really isn't going to help your point - they are currently selling Level 90 character boosts. So instead of "turning your Mage into a Rogue", you can buy a freshly minted 90 Rogue and keep your 90 Mage as well.
Has nothing to do with the topic. Burying your head in the sand and just denying that every point your opponent makes does not win an argument. This must be what Bill Nye felt like when he was debating Ken Ham.

Quote: Originally Posted by Seldan View Post
As for pay to win, when this feature is implemented I imagine it would be available by Cartel Coins and Credits, so it would not be pay to win.
If paid level 55 showed up in the Cartel Market and was available for both coins or credits would that not be pay to win? It would, so is this.

Now I remember why I quit this argument in the first place. I'm done here. You guys can't provide one valid reason why class change should happen, and you provide no counters for any of my points other than "nuh uh that's not how I want it so its not true".
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I am happy that there will be a renewed focus on story, I love story, its why I picked this MMO. But I picked an MMO, not an episodic single player RPG that I have to pay a subscription to receive the episodes.

TUXs's Avatar


TUXs
03.12.2014 , 10:13 AM | #4293
Quote: Originally Posted by Slicka View Post
And here lies the problem, TUXs. When both sides truly believe there isn't a reason to allow, or disallow an AC change, it just becomes one big argument.
Let me be clear...I have my 55 Mando and my 55 VG...I would NOT have any interest in using this feature at all. None. But I know players who would and if it keeps them interested and playing. Who am I to say they shouldn't be able to? What is the honest and real impact on me if someone does this? Why on earth would I be more interested in some silly punitive punishment to players for picking heads over tails, rather than expanding their freedom to enjoy the game in a way that impacts me in NO way?

See, I don't see this as an argument at all. I haven't read even ONE reasonable excuse as to why this shouldn't be allowed. I've challenged every person I can to convince me otherwise because I am VERY open to being wrong and changing my mind, but not one person has even slightly swayed my opinion.

This is truly as silly as someone suggesting I shouldn't be able to pick the hair color/style I want...it has NO IMPACT on them whatsoever. NONE!
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Darth_Wicked's Avatar


Darth_Wicked
03.12.2014 , 10:32 AM | #4294
Quote: Originally Posted by TUXs View Post
This is truly as silly as someone suggesting I shouldn't be able to pick the hair color/style I want...it has NO IMPACT on them whatsoever. NONE!
Silly comparison to say the least, unless of course changing one's hair or race has a meaningful impact in gameplay, which I think has NOT.

Vhaegrant's Avatar


Vhaegrant
03.12.2014 , 10:36 AM | #4295
Quote: Originally Posted by Icebergy View Post
If paid level 55 showed up in the Cartel Market and was available for both coins or credits would that not be pay to win? It would, so is this.
No, it wouldn't be 'Pay to Win'. At best you could call it 'Pay to Bypass Levelling Timesink'.
'Pay to Win' is often misunderstood, the core definition is buying something with cash than the best item available in game.
So, the only way this would be a 'Pay to Win' is if the max level for a Cartel Market character was 60 while normal characters remained 55.

Seldan's Avatar


Seldan
03.12.2014 , 10:38 AM | #4296
Quote: Originally Posted by Icebergy View Post
If you think the exact definition of a class and how Bioware themselves has defined it is semantics, then I don't know what else to tell you.
There have been several debates on the term "Class" vs "Base Class" vs "Advanced Class". What else is there to discuss? We are requesting a feature to change our "Advanced Class".

Quote: Originally Posted by Icebergy View Post
Has nothing to do with the topic. Burying your head in the sand and just denying that every point your opponent makes does not win an argument. This must be what Bill Nye felt like when he was debating Ken Ham.
You raised the issue of changing your WoW Mage into a Rogue and brought this into the topic, so I'm not sure why you feel it has nothing to do with the topic. I presented the fact that Blizzard is going one step further and allowing someone to retain their 90 Mage, as well as purchase a 90 Rogue.

No one is suggesting the ability to change your base class ( Trooper -> Knight ) so your argument has no substance.

Personal attacks to do not support your argument. Address the issues point by point I have made in other posts.

Quote: Originally Posted by Icebergy View Post
If paid level 55 showed up in the Cartel Market and was available for both coins or credits would that not be pay to win? It would, so is this.
My definition of Pay to Win would be the ability to purchase raid quality gear or a buff that enhances your character's performance.

Do you consider XP boosts Pay to Win? Do you consider Rocket Boosts Pay to Win?

Quote: Originally Posted by Icebergy View Post
Now I remember why I quit this argument in the first place. I'm done here. You guys can't provide one valid reason why class change should happen, and you provide no counters for any of my points other than "nuh uh that's not how I want it so its not true".
I provided several reasonable scenarios a few posts back. Feel free to comment on them if you decide to return to this thread.

TUXs's Avatar


TUXs
03.12.2014 , 10:38 AM | #4297
Quote: Originally Posted by Darth_Wicked View Post
Silly comparison to say the least, unless of course changing one's hair or race has a meaningful impact in gameplay, which I think has NOT.
My hair color impacts your gameplay as much as my AC choice does.
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Slicka's Avatar


Slicka
03.12.2014 , 10:38 AM | #4298
Quote: Originally Posted by TUXs View Post
See, I don't see this as an argument at all. I haven't read even ONE reasonable excuse as to why this shouldn't be allowed. I've challenged every person I can to convince me otherwise because I am VERY open to being wrong and changing my mind, but not one person has even slightly swayed my opinion.

This is truly as silly as someone suggesting I shouldn't be able to pick the hair color/style I want...it has NO IMPACT on them whatsoever. NONE!
Yes, but look at some of the other posts.

Quote: Originally Posted by Icebergy View Post
Now I remember why I quit this argument in the first place. I'm done here. You guys can't provide one valid reason why class change should happen, and you provide no counters for any of my points other than "nuh uh that's not how I want it so its not true".
Quote: Originally Posted by ELRunninW View Post
Why? this is a stupid suggestion why bother arguing?
Quote: Originally Posted by branmakmuffin View Post
It's a stupid suggestion in your opinion. Which is fine, since you're entitled to your opinion.
Quote: Originally Posted by Zerex_Kildron View Post
This is ridiculous
Quote: Originally Posted by Ratajack View Post
That's right. I forgot that you know better than the devs. Or, at least you think you do.
Those above are just a few I found while skimming through about five pages within this mess of a thread. As I said, and I'm not pointing you out as being for, or against it because you want it, I'm just trying to point out that this argument has gone on for over 420 pages and no matter which "facts" are presented on either side. I use the term "facts" loosely here since it's more opinionative than actual facts. These "facts" don't sway either side. They just start belittling, and berating each other because they don't see the other's point of view. It really doesn't matter where the overall decision goes.

The bottom line is this thread is going nowhere because the same arguments that are presented are being denied by the opposition. When that happens, how is there a reasonable discussion? Most of these posters state "Give me ONE reason it should/shouldn't happen! You can't!". So tell me TUXs, how can such an argument be settled without having the Devs get involved by stating whether or not it will happen? Is it the only way? I'm quite intrigued by what you think considering you are one of the one's who regularly posts constructive arguments on such topics in these forums.
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Vhaegrant's Avatar


Vhaegrant
03.12.2014 , 10:40 AM | #4299
Quote: Originally Posted by Halinalle View Post
"We don't want your Guardian, switch to Sentinel or get kicked."
Not something I want to hear after initial "Hi!".
I must be lucky in the PUGs I join. My DPS Powertech (Advanced Prototype) has not once been asked to swap out to Tank. (something I could do at a moments notice with no cost, and I even have a near maxed set of tanking gear as well)

I don't understand why it would be an issue with AC swapping when it doesn't appear to be an issue with current specialisation.

The worst scenario I've encountered is when a member of the PUG volunteers to go Tank or Healer just to get the FP/ OP off the ground. All the times this has happened in my experience has been initiated by the player and never demanded by the group.

TUXs's Avatar


TUXs
03.12.2014 , 10:42 AM | #4300
Quote: Originally Posted by Slicka View Post
So tell me TUXs, how can such an argument be settled without having the Devs get involved by stating whether or not it will happen? Is it the only way? I'm quite intrigued by what you think considering you are one of the one's who regularly posts constructive arguments on such topics in these forums.
They have already spoken though - page 1...the very first post here. This thread didn't start out asking IF it should happen...it started out asking WHEN it would.

Quote:
Quote: Originally Posted by Dulfy and Damion Schubert
18. Will be there any faction or Advanced Class change option available for purchase in the future?

We have had serious talks recently about offering an Advanced Class change option – I think that one will likely happen eventually. Species is likely as well. Doing a faction switch is considerably more difficult for us, though, due to the various quest flags set throughout the level up process, so this isn’t on the horizon anytime soon.
I too would like to know when it's coming
All warfare is based on deception • If his forces are united, separate them • If you are far from the enemy, make him believe you are near • A leader leads by example not by force
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