Two gunships shouldn't be able to dominate an entire match by themselves. Now that more people are learning how to use this class they are becoming more and more out of focus and completely unbalanced. You guys think you're cute going 20 kills and 2 deaths and for some reason think that's ok. Really, its because you're just that good...i promise you that's what it is. It has nothing to do with the class being unbalanced.

Are you talking about the TDM with me just a little while ago? If so I fly a sting. But yes the kills leader was a gunship.

Two gunships shouldn't be able to dominate an entire match by themselves. Now that more people are learning how to use this class they are becoming more and more out of focus and completely unbalanced. You guys think you're cute going 20 kills and 2 deaths and for some reason think that's ok. Really, its because you're just that good...i promise you that's what it is. It has nothing to do with the class being unbalanced.

 

Why weren't your scouts/strike/fighters/bombers dealing with them ? Once you get close they are tissue paper.

Sounds like its a team coordination issue. If gunships are causing that much of a problem, they need to be aware of the range they're at and a couple of scouts/strikes need to peel off and chase them.

Gunships are very easy to deal with in a scout.

1) Gunships just took a nerf. Continue to nerf them, and they won't be fun to play.

 

2) Gunships only have stand-out performances when they're either on a very good team, or up against extremely poor competition (or both). Either way, it's a team balance issue, not a ship balancing issue.

 

3) Nobody should brag when they 'dominate' the scoreboard while flying a gunship. Just like nobody should brag when they kill somebody with a seismic/interdiction mine. Are some people much better at flying a gunship than others? Yes, but nobody really cares how 'skilled' you are with a railgun or laying mines.

 

OP, it sounds like you're upset because people were bragging about their score on a GS. You are right that they have no reason whatsoever to brag, but you're wrong about your recommended fix.

Gunships aren't the problem. Your lack of knowing how to deal with them is. I eat them alive in any of my scouts. Pop bypass and come up where they're not looking with guns blazing? If you're lucky you'll score a crit or two and they'll be dead before they have time to react.

http://i.imgur.com/tuB0sgD.jpg

Gunships are very easy to deal with in a scout.

 

He sounds like a strike

You guys think you're cute going 20 kills and 2 deaths and for some reason think that's ok. Really, its because you're just that good...i promise you that's what it is. It has nothing to do with the class being unbalanced.

 

Because that's a completely impossible score on any other ship, and I didn't get three games of it last night on my Flashfire.

 

Seriously, people, 10.0+ average kills per match in your main ship is not that hard for an ace -- and it's going to be supplemented by matches where you're completely shut down and get 2-5 kills, matches where you can go wild and get 20+ kills (my personal best is 25, if you count the one after the match ended), and matches where you just don't have the components you want and do somewhat less well for it.

 

3) Nobody should brag when they 'dominate' the scoreboard while flying a gunship. Just like nobody should brag when they kill somebody with a seismic/interdiction mine. Are some people much better at flying a gunship than others? Yes, but nobody really cares how 'skilled' you are with a railgun or laying mines.

 

lol, if you say so

 

ever flown a gunship?

Seriously, people, 10.0+ average kills per match in your main ship is not that hard for an ace -- and it's going to be supplemented by matches where you're completely shut down and get 2-5 kills, matches where you can go wild and get 20+ kills (my personal best is 25, if you count the one after the match ended), and matches where you just don't have the components you want and do somewhat less well for it.

 

Silly Armond anyone who gets more than three kills and less than ten deaths is using hacks.

Two gunships shouldn't be able to dominate an entire match by themselves. Now that more people are learning how to use this class they are becoming more and more out of focus and completely unbalanced. You guys think you're cute going 20 kills and 2 deaths and for some reason think that's ok. Really, its because you're just that good...i promise you that's what it is. It has nothing to do with the class being unbalanced.

 

Well this happens, 1 player can also (easily) dominate a match if the opposing team is bad enough regardless of what ship he/she plays, this is certainly not a balance issue.

 

Maybe instead of making another one of these threads then simply ask others how to deal with good Gunships or just Gunships in general and I'm sure you'll get a much better result.

 

I'm happy to help if you play a Scout.

If this is the direction that responses to threads like this are gonna take, the GSF forums are going to be amazing.

 

 

@OP: As has been pointed out, the numbers you quote aren't unique to gunships. In a farm game (and it sounds like you were the food) ships flown by aces and pilots will shift towards being almost purely offense, racking up pretty big kill numbers.

 

Others have pointed out ways to mess with gunships, such as sending a scout to harass. All of that is valid. But I'll also suggest you bind "camera look at target" (I think the default is C) and get in the habit of tabbing around. When you see a gunship appear, take an off-direct angle.

 

Gunships can't turn, can't move fast, can't run very often, aren't very good at taking punches. They also have really low dps and have to be stationary. What they offer instead is frightening range, serious burst, powerful area damage, and solid debuffs. They also have two missile breaks to cycle before they are unable to do otherwise.

 

Simply put, if a gunship is allowed to charge and shoot multiple times, he will begin sweeping your side. You can prevent this by harassment. A lot of the frustration comes when you are a little shy on experience, because there's no UI warning or indicator- it's all situational awareness.

 

Scout: A general battle scout build of burst/clusters is good to get a gunship moving, and it can deal some solid damage too. A wise gunship will fly away from this build of scout. Quad/Rocket Pods or Laser/Rocket Pods: Combine this with an offensive crewman and an offensive system (targeting telemetry or blaster overcharge). In this case, you spend your time looking for gunships, and you try to approach from the side when they are sniping. Your play is to get within about 4km and pop 1+4+left click+right click- you can do lethal damage this way. Type 1 scout can get an EMP field that locks out engine components, and then sab probe- while not generally amazing, this build can lock down any ship, gunship or not.

 

Strike: Strikes have long range threat tones, but normally will engage in several rounds with a gunship. This class can be frustrating to play against a gunship with because you don't have a way to simply burst them down, and a smart gunship will run from you. Still, your solid shield and hull will prevent you from being nommed immediately, and you can get him off his roost good enough.

 

Gunship: As a gunship, run accuracy whenever you can, and try to snipe enemy gunships. Because of sensor ranges, you can often know the general location, boost in to 14km range to a gunship that is on a target, and get at least one free shot off on him.

 

Bomber: Maintain line of sight in general, and always unless you have a full engine pool. Though not your job to chase gunships, you can certainly dive at a gunship with heavy lasers and boost, placing a mine on your way to melee range. If the gunship is nub, he barrels into it- if not nub, he has to adjust before barelling, giving you an extra shot or two with your heavies. On the girl bombers, you can often make your boosted dive if the gunship decides to snipe your drones.

 

Good luck!

Edited May 1, 2014 by Verain

He sounds like a strike

 

I fly a strike. I hunt gunships. I don't necessarily kill them, but I certainly keep them busy. (SammyGStatus might have some comments on this; I always make a point of keeping an eye on him when we're on opposite teams)

 

Any time a gunship is getting those sorts of exorbitant kills, it's because your team is actively letting them do it - whether by not going after the gunship, or by not keeping the opposing team from going after whoever on your team is going after the gunship. In other words, it's not the ship, it's that your team is dropping the ball.

 

Rhodogast / Kelril, The Ebon Hawk

Clearly the OP has never flown with Scrab, Callem, or Rumina / Tomeateeje (or Jaxin, Ayden, Alex in his FF, etc. etc.) I see scouts getting more DPS and damage than gunships more often than not (Scrab, Tomeateeje and I play together, and when they're in a match, one of them will more often than not take the top spot for kills / damage unless I wanna be a wiseass and deny their kills.

 

Just read the post above from Verain b/c he's offering great advice. If you see a "Gunship Ace", focus the crap out of him, even get multiple ships. They can't top the charts if they're contained properly.

 

The GS has been nerfed twice, and extremely hard with the BR. Another nerf would only make the class even less likely to survive a scout / strike confrontation (those 1.3 second lock on missiles are the biggest pain next to rocket pods + quads + TT + CF).

 

Your assumption was very far off, but I understand the frustration of having teammates who're useless too (which never makes events like these easier). I wish you luck figuring out how to play against good pilots in the future!

 

** Also ** Rhodogast and Mae'thon (Armond) did a huge number on my GS yesterday during 1 match in particular. They locked me down until I died, which post 2.7, isn't hard to do. The forced me to call for assistance from a wingman, and when that wingman didn't have the upgrades to actually kill one of them, I had to have either an additional wingman come in to pull them off, or pray to g-d that they self-destructed.... The never did The moral here is AS A GS PILOT, scouts are my most difficult adversary because of their mobility, their insta-kill mentality (which is how the class is supposed to be played), and their evasions (should they be running an evasion build). DO NOT LET A GS HAVE A MOMENT TO BREATHE. Phil on TEH was in his GS when I was on my FF, and the only way I could assure that he wouldn't do any significant damage was to harass him, a lot.... Like restraining order levels. THAT is how you counter a GS. Now, go practice it

Edited May 1, 2014 by SammyGStatus

Gunships are designed to be campers. If you leave them unattended your giving them maximum effectiveness. Think of it as playing against a scout or strike and flying 2k away in a straight line the whole match. If your team did that I'm sure a strike could rack up those numbers. Gunships have to be engaged at close range and forced to move around. When you do that their effectiveness decreases to nearly zero. If you can't get to the gunship because of other gunships/strikes/scouts then your team was just outclassed that match. I'll be bold and say I don't think they are unbalanced at all anymore (I don't fly GS btw). Give them an environment in which they thrive and they will wreck you. That's how it is with any class.

As a side note, I run turning for my T3 BR ability, and even then I can barely compete with scouts on an in-your-face level... And by compete, I mean I'll win 1/4, maybe 1/3 depending on the pilot (newbs are newbs and only serve to bias the statement because any new scout will get dropped by bursts in about 2 shots)

Just venting after a couple of bad rounds. Yes I know how to approach and kill gunships. Yes I have flown against scrab. Yes, I understand anyone can put up those numbers in any ship given the right circumstances, aka crappy opponents. And YES MY TEAM SUCKED!

 

However, I'm not a bad pilot and can usually put some serious pressure on ace gunships even with a few tails on me but when two good gunships are covering each other they are exponentially harder to take down. I do think gunships are out of balance. When all things are equal, assuming equally skilled pilots with upgraded ships, gunships tend to dominate matches and fare better than anyone else. They should be in my opinion, a LOT squishier at close range if they are going to be COMPLETELY dominant at range.

 

Not that any of this matters. GSF is off the road map. Done ranting. Sorry, move along, nothing to see here.

Edited May 1, 2014 by -Streven-

Just venting after a couple of bad rounds. Yes I know how to approach and kill gunships. Yes I have flown against scrab. Yes, I understand anyone can put up those numbers in any ship given the right circumstances, aka crappy opponents. And YES MY TEAM SUCKED!

 

However, I'm not a bad pilot and can usually put some serious pressure on ace gunships even with a few tails on me but when two good gunships are covering each other they are exponentially harder to take down. I do think gunships are out of balance. When all things are equal, assuming equally skilled pilots with upgraded ships, gunships tend to dominate matches and fare better than anyone else. They should be in my opinion, a LOT squishier at close range if they are going to be COMPLETELY dominant at range.

 

Not that any of this matters. GSF is off the road map. Done ranting. Sorry, move along, nothing to see here.

 

Gunships dominate matches? Tell that to the bombers.... At least a GS has to aim and sort of know how to fly. Bombers are sort of like that fat man on a motor scooter putting ahead of you on the side walk. Too big to ignore, too heavy to stop, too slow to maneuver, but if you get too close he'll kill you with a fart.

Just venting after a couple of bad rounds. Yes I know how to approach and kill gunships. Yes I have flown against scrab. Yes, I understand anyone can put up those numbers in any ship given the right circumstances, aka crappy opponents. And YES MY TEAM SUCKED!

 

However, I'm not a bad pilot and can usually put some serious pressure on ace gunships even with a few tails on me but when two good gunships are covering each other they are exponentially harder to take down. I do think gunships are out of balance. When all things are equal, assuming equally skilled pilots with upgraded ships, gunships tend to dominate matches and fare better than anyone else. They should be in my opinion, a LOT squishier at close range if they are going to be COMPLETELY dominant at range.

 

Not that any of this matters. GSF is off the road map. Done ranting. Sorry, move along, nothing to see here.

 

I feel for you, there have been a couple games where I was playing against teams of mostly my own wingmates where they ran 2-3 gunships and focused me HARD. Myself and my rather inexperienced team ended up with our balls to the wall at the cap ship (this was when there were turrets in TDM)

 

We had a little buffer of breathing room, but as soon as I spawned they had me targeted and were watching close. Even my sneakiest of tricks didn't work (since they generally rely on someone taking their eyes off me for a second or two)

 

Needless to say the match didn't end well and I was counting my lucky stars that I had a positive score at least (albeit a low one)

 

There was nothing wrong with this match though, they organized better than we did and handily mopped the floor with our blood (even an extra layer of polish sheesh ) Long story short is there is no way to balance across multiple ships or ship combinations. Balance works ship to ship in a single context. Balancing for combinations seriously hurts teams that dont run 2 of this, 2 of that etc. Its just not how balance is done.

 

That being said I think Gunships "are in a healthy place " They took a sizable ion nerf which fixed the insta / sustained easy power drains, so they are actually good in my book. That and the BR nerf had a very serious effect on them (more than anyone else I venture) People are talkin about slug, which could change but its not a need thing (I kinda think its fine as is)

Edited May 1, 2014 by DamascusAdontise

Gunships dominate matches? Tell that to the bombers.... At least a GS has to aim and sort of know how to fly. Bombers are sort of like that fat man on a motor scooter putting ahead of you on the side walk. Too big to ignore, too heavy to stop, too slow to maneuver, but if you get too close he'll kill you with a fart.

 

I know I didn't specify but I was talking about TDM which is definitely not bomber dominated.

I know I didn't specify but I was talking about TDM which is definitely not bomber dominated.

 

It can be, and if you haven't seen this your lucky =) requires more GS and bombers than you want to ever see in one match and its not that much fun for either side hehe.

I can take out a gunship with a 1/2 mastered Nova-dive. -Easy. Sneak up out of LoS then full throttle, pew-pew &rockets, fly past and come in for another go. Fly through debris and hightail it out of there while jinking. Recharge / pop cooldowns and take on 2nd. - And I wouldn't class myself as an Ace by any means. -Mid-table 'Competant wingman' maybe. Only GS and Bombers in a minefield are a problem as I'm not so well set up for mine clearance.... That's more a teamwork thing.

 

If GSs are getting the better of you, maybe you need a different hammer to break the nut.

Edited May 1, 2014 by Storm-Cutter

Any time a gunship is getting those sorts of exorbitant kills, it's because your team is actively letting them do it - whether by not going after the gunship, or by not keeping the opposing team from going after whoever on your team is going after the gunship. In other words, it's not the ship, it's that your team is dropping the ball.

 

This sentiment has been echoed repeatedly in this thread, but the version above resonated with me. I fly mostly GS these days. When I do, and if I see the other team is ignoring me, damn straight I'm going to wreck them. If I'm getting >100k damage/>20 kills or whatever, it isn't because the class is unbalanced or because I'm particularly good...it's because the opposition isn't doing its job.

 

Similarly, when the other team does keep a bead on me, I'll never rack up numbers like that. Which is fine. I don't consider huge numbers to be the main criterion of success when flying GS. Rather (though granted ultimately of course the goal is to win) I think I've done my job if I've disrupted the enemy enough - i.e. staying on their bombers, keeping them from getting too organized, and of course maintaining as high a kdr as possible. Against a good team that knows how to handle a GS, I may die 5-6 times, but that's ok as long as I'm managing my other responsibilities.

 

tl;dr - nothing wrong with gunships...countering strategies work well, but you have to actually employ them.

Edited May 1, 2014 by MaximilianPower

If GSs are getting the better of you, maybe you need a different hammer to break the nut.

 

^^ This Also, the slug DOES NOT need a nerf. With scouts and their evasion / strikes requiring 2 full charges and a pop shot, and bombers requiring like 30,000, nerfing the slug would make the class unplayable (and many have left the class due to the difficulty of adapting to the BR nerf).