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Iokath... Republic vs Empire


Vaspar

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Pissed as hell about how this was handled and the outcome. First of all, I do not agree with having to choose one side or the other. I feel there should have been a third choice to remain neutral. Secondly, not enough notification was given about what would happen here. My LS Jedi chose Imperial based on rewarding their support when the Republic offered none and chose to remain neutral in the fight. I was grouped with a Republic friend while doing this and our group was immediately disbanded, nor can I group with him or any of my other friends while here or do these things here. Now, I don't really care to hear other people saying 'Well that's what happens when you choose an opposite faction.' There was no indication about the mechanics changing and there should have been. I had always been able, as a Republic player, to group with my Republic friends and do things together. Now I cannot here on Iokath. Also, there was no notification that you would lose the option to have the npc companion of the faction you chose not to ally with. (Never mind the fact that what they did with Dorne was stupid and makes no sense). When we've done the quests for companions in the past, if you were about to make a choice that would cost you a companion, you received a notification first, letting you know that would happen so you could make an informed choice. That was not the case here. So, unpleasant surprises all the way around.

 

My choices would have been different if I had known the mechanics would be changed and I wouldn't have made choices based on story (as I always have in the past, such as Torian vs Vette) but on mechanics. If I could have this decision reversed, I would have and I remain pissed off about it.

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Ultimately it came down to personal preference but what swayed me was when Acina said she wanted to wipe out the Republic, whereas Malcolm claimed he wanted to stabilise the Republic. Either side could have ulterior motives but as my JK chose to be a peacekeeper (SW plans to run his own empire), I sided with the Pubs. While I am worried about the ramifications of breaking the war time alliance with the Empire, I can’t condone the wanton destruction of anyone as a peacekeeeper, especially with a superweapon.

 

That war time alliance was broken by Acina first, when she invaded Iokath. Her fear of being wiped out by the Republic was not valid justification for breaking the alliance between you both.

 

Any smart leader would've instead called the PC (or her people) and relayed what was going on, and gotten the PC to stop the invaders.

 

Acina wants the super weapon and she shows her hand, that she and the empire will betray you, when it suits them.

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Pissed as hell about how this was handled and the outcome. First of all, I do not agree with having to choose one side or the other. I feel there should have been a third choice to remain neutral. Secondly, not enough notification was given about what would happen here. My LS Jedi chose Imperial based on rewarding their support when the Republic offered none and chose to remain neutral in the fight. I was grouped with a Republic friend while doing this and our group was immediately disbanded, nor can I group with him or any of my other friends while here or do these things here. Now, I don't really care to hear other people saying 'Well that's what happens when you choose an opposite faction.' There was no indication about the mechanics changing and there should have been. I had always been able, as a Republic player, to group with my Republic friends and do things together. Now I cannot here on Iokath. Also, there was no notification that you would lose the option to have the npc companion of the faction you chose not to ally with. (Never mind the fact that what they did with Dorne was stupid and makes no sense). When we've done the quests for companions in the past, if you were about to make a choice that would cost you a companion, you received a notification first, letting you know that would happen so you could make an informed choice. That was not the case here. So, unpleasant surprises all the way around.

 

My choices would have been different if I had known the mechanics would be changed and I wouldn't have made choices based on story (as I always have in the past, such as Torian vs Vette) but on mechanics. If I could have this decision reversed, I would have and I remain pissed off about it.

 

While in a previous post, I posted why I thought it flawed to reward the Empire by allying with them, when they betray you in the first place, I have to agree with you.

 

In fact, until reading your post, I didn't know I wouldn't be able to team with people to run Iokath content if they didn't choose the same side. I just thought it would be, "You team with Empire or Republic based on character class"

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  • 8 months later...
This sounds kind of evil, but I would have my inquisitor side with the Republic to wipe out the SIth (seeing as how we all know that the Sith Empire will eventually fall) and then capitalize on a war-torn Republic, that's the smartest play. The Sith are at their weakest. They have their last or one of their Dark Council members as an empress who the Inquisitor himself (if you choose the option) believes that if he went to Drommund Kass, he would've overthrown her. Their strongest Sith are either dead or missing and Marr himself said that prior to getting the isotope-5 they were about to lose the war. It's most beneficial to align with the Republic and let them use most of their finite resources to end the threat of the dying breed that is the Sith. Then, when they're recovering from years of war, you turn on them and try to take over the Galaxy (at least until they eventually find a way to beat you because the Zakuul has to disappear somehow).
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  • 2 years later...

I went into this assuming there was an in between, and was shocked there was not. You spend the previous two story lines working as a bridge between the factions to defeat a common enemy and set up an alliance, just to throw that out by taking sides? As is previously mentioned, they both sorta come off like the bad guys in the conversation leading up to the choice. It would have been nice to have a middle path to tell them they are both being unreasonable and work as the alliance, not as one of two opposing factions.

However, Star Wars gonna Star Wars.

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I went into this assuming there was an in between, and was shocked there was not. You spend the previous two story lines working as a bridge between the factions to defeat a common enemy and set up an alliance, just to throw that out by taking sides? As is previously mentioned, they both sorta come off like the bad guys in the conversation leading up to the choice. It would have been nice to have a middle path to tell them they are both being unreasonable and work as the alliance, not as one of two opposing factions.

However, Star Wars gonna Star Wars.

 

They were going that route but there was a huge and sustained outcry on the forums that Star Wars should be Republic vs Empire and not anything else, ever. So, they threw out a third set of chapters (that they'd been working on) that was to follow KOTFE and KOTET and worked to slowly undo a lot of things like getting rid of the Eternal Fleet and the Gravestone; we're now back to Republic vs Empire. That led to "Fractured Alliances" as the other bookend to the original "Forged Alliances." I suspect they did reuse some of the earlier planned content (for the third series); the most recent content update called Echoes of Oblivion would probably have concluded that proposed third series in my opinion.

 

At any rate, this is on the playerbase; BW responded to demands and complaints on the forums.

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If it makes you feel better don't side with the Republic because of the Republic. Side with the Republic because of Tython, Ord Mantell, Coruscant, Taris, Balmorra, Tattoine, Alderaan, etc. Do it for the people you saved in your Class story. They're the ones who truly matter.
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  • 4 weeks later...
In the end, I would choose the Republic because they're relatively more consistent with my intentions of being pro-freedom and pro-equality. Granted they're more hypocritical and inconsistent with their ideals than the Empire is with its ideals but I could never in good conscience side with the Empire long-term if given the choice. Yes, I know it's just a game but support for an all-out authoritarian regime even in a fictional story never sat well with me. Also given my Bachelors degree in Political Science, politics and the nature of freedom and justice have always been a preoccupation of mine. Personally the whole, "both sides are equally bad because the pro-democracy side had some abuses and was hypocritical" was never a convincing enough argument for me. Their hypocrisy and abuses don't readily or as badly affect the day-to-day lives of the average Republic citizen when compared to the Imperials, who own slaves, discriminate against people who aren't human or Sith pureblood, and can easily kill or sacrifice scores of their own citizens without consequence. Not to mention the Empire itself is actually fairly corrupt as well. Sith ethics at their core are basically "survival of the fittest," mitigated only by their "tradition" of hereditary favoritism on account of lineage Edited by EAFSAMWISE
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  • 2 months later...

To be honest both Republic and Empire made me angry in this moment. The Commander is literally an emperor of a third major force in the galaxy who can easily strike them both down, no matter what path have you chosen in KOTET - being a peacemaker doesn't mean that you can't use the "last warning" tactics, - and it's profitable for both Empire and Republic to shut up and focus on themselves instead of trying to start another war. And what did they actually do? Of course, let's fall into paranoia and try to steal a superweapon under the Commander's nose! Idiots...

 

And I am definitely on the "Give us the Get off my planet option" club because it's what my current main character (LS leaning neutral Jedi Knight) would do. But there were no such option in game and they made me to choose.

 

And to be honest, my JK's decision to side with Reps was more emotional than rational, but not because of loyalty.

 

I headcanon my JK as a Mandalorian Knight, so she is more a mandalorian than a Jedi at this point of the story, and Acina have pissed her off way more than Malcolm. From her point of view, Acina's actions are a sign of cowardice and weakness - the Empress literally starts the whole conflict and tries to steal the superweapon, but not because of trying to be a honourable conqueror who wants to make the Empire great again, but because she is afraid that not only the Republic, but also the Eternal Alliance would try to strike her down, but the moment she realizes that she have been caught red-handed she is like "Okay, my bad, but maybe we can make an alliance and strike those Pubs down?". She literally tries to bribe the Commander because of her paranoia, and shows that alliances means nothing for her and she would easily stab her own friend in the back if it would seem profitable for her.

 

On the other hand, Republic is just trying to protect itself. Their main priority is to survive, and mostly they react on Empire trying to start the war again. They also haven't ever been pretending to be the Alliance's friends, but knowing the Republic from within, JK knows that while being definitely not saints, the Pubs tend to keep their promises.

 

As the result, both Pubs and Imps show that while externally they seem to have changed, in their hearts they're still the same. And Pubs are more acceptable for my JK because 1) they're not cowardy traitors, and 2) their reason in this conflict is more honourable.

 

Also as I've played, I have got a line where Lana says that joining the Imps is a more safe choice while Theron says that joining the Republic shows to people that the Alliance doesn't make deals with traitors. And in the safety vs honour choice, of course my "mando-jedi" would choose honour.

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Can't say I'm surprised that both the Imps AND the Pubs resort to a nonsensical paranoid decision to go back to their older selves. It's called Star WARS after all, not Star Peace. It's comic book logic at its most basic: reverting back to status quo is inevitable. Edited by OriusPrime
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Compared to the 3 Choices in ME3 the choice on Iokath is illogical.

 

In ME3 I fondly remember the amazement on how bold the choice was. It was the first game ever where I stared more than 15mins at that screen, not willing to make any choice. Because I, as a player, was always going to lose - me, the protagonist. To this day I praise the decision that that choice was implemented. It took guts to do the other thing (stating nothing about the apparant lack of time remaining leading up to that before the game's release - just those 3 choices).

 

On Iokath, siding with Republic or Empire at that point doesn't make sense. At all. At that moment you are their peer and you control your own military and territories (which Valkorian built up). Now the Alliance could crumble, but there generally would remain a sizeable portion of significant power.

 

Regardless which side you choose, you will always lose. Both Empire and Repuiblic should respond in exactly the same way: At the first hint, you'll drop your commitments without honoring your mutual agreements. No sane leader would give up their "kingdom" willingly. Let alone leave the impression they can't be trusted (and therefore become a mutual enemy to the Republic and the Empire?). And that's how this feels.

 

Story wise I can imagine a 3rd faction complicates matters in the epic Good vs. Evil fights, but the choice here doesn't make sense. Especially since, when you start, you're aiding in the rebuilding, then pull all aid from both sides (since they both no longer want to play nice). And then you have to pick one of them? This choice basically gave me the feeling "No thanks, gonna stop right here with SWTOR". Which was... a surprising experience.

 

The sense I get is that this was rushed. Or, as one post stated people gave in to a part of the playerbase. Redardless, it leaves a sour taste and a somewhat bitter experience.

 

As for my choices, I think I'll mix and match and see what happens.

Edited by Sehrak
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