Now I know that they cannot scrap the entire new system unless we want to wait 3 more months for release but the price to craft one piece of gear that is green and by the time you hit max level you will have either out ranked it in item level or you will within a week or two. I suggest they just lower the cost for all materials needed to match what we use now 2x all materials has been the norm for sometime. Also possibly lower jawa scraps to 25-50 for 1 material because the way it is now its just not gonna fly.

They know crafting is ludicrously overpriced. They don't care. They won't change nuthin'. Just like with Ossus crafting.

 

If it doesn't suit specific interest of the guilds the devs are playing in, it won't happen. That's the only design philosophy in place for SWTOR's foreseeable future.

Just like with Ossus crafting.

 

Ossus crafting was perfectly viable by just killing Veteran-mode Queen on multiple characters. The fight became pretty easy once people had a chance to learn it.

 

6.0 crafting, on the other hand, is a mess for even the most basic items. There's a big difference.

Ossus crafting was perfectly viable by just killing Veteran-mode Queen on multiple characters. The fight became pretty easy once people had a chance to learn it.

 

I have to add, as a NIM raider, the past few months have been surprisingly profitable. Each member of my group made about 3bn Credits by just doing what we wanted to do either way - farming titles in Gods. The initial price for Queen-materials was also satisfying.

 

However, if crafting in general is getting more difficult, players like me, who rather sell crafting materials dropping in the content I do is also getting worse, so I'd support the issue stated in this thread. I haven't looked into augment-crafting, but I hope it's viable for someone like me who is just logging into the game for raids.

The cost of crafting green items is way too high. I'm fairly certain everyone agrees with that. I didn't even test crafting blues/purples because during phase 1 and 2 the exotic / rare mats weren't available from the terminal. By the time Phase 3 hit PTS, enough people were looking at crafting, it didn't need my input.

 

However, specifically regarding the jawa scrap vendors, don't forget that this is the first time that the newest mats are going to be available at any cost. For 4.0 and 5.0 and even before that, you could not get the newest tier of mats at any cost.

 

The 200 :1 ratio for the tier 11 mats isn't "wrong" in my opinion.

The cost increase that I disagree with are for the tier 1-10 mats. Increasing the base cost from 1 (scrap) : 1 (mat) to 1 (scrap) : X (item based on level of mat) is unnecessary.

 

Eric, in one post, said they did an inventory scan to see how much jawa scraps were out in the game and some people had "thousands" I suspect the only reason for this change is to deplete those inventories. To make up the difference for those of us w/o that level of stockpile they created more means of acquiring them. It remains to be seen if, for levels 1-10 of resource mats, that it balances out.

 

For grade 11 mats...we've wanted them in past expansions on day one...this is the first time we get them even if they are at increased costs, which again, I find acceptable.

Ossus crafting was perfectly viable by just killing Veteran-mode Queen on multiple characters. The fight became pretty easy once people had a chance to learn it.

And 28 CMTs ends your argument of easy Ossus crafting. Seriously, what's the point of even discussing it? It's not subjective. Ossus crafting was just as ridiculously overpriced.

Edited October 10, 2019 by Pietrastor

So lets go over ways you can now get jawa junk. We know you can get them from deconstructing. We also know we will be getting much more drops each run. This means you will be getting more and more items not needed and used. I think 200: 1 i still extremely high. I could be wrong and maybe 200: 1 is where the math should be but even 100: 1 seems more reasonable because you get about 5-10 jawa per item depending on its item type green/blue/purple. That means you would need to scrap about 10 items to get 1 part you need to craft an item you need.

 

Lets do the math full out

 

20 deconstructed purples = 200 jawa junk / 200 Assorted Droid Parts / 200 Scavenged Scrap = 1 of each item

20 x 200 = 4,000.

 

This to me is to high

 

I get some people have it stockpiled but those are usually the hardcore players the rest of us do not.

JediBoadicea has very clearly laid out the situation and what needs to be done:

My opinion, for whatever it's worth, and it's obviously not worth much, is that if you are hell-bent on "making crafting more difficult" then the only change you should keep is the addition of blue and purple quality components. That change alone makes the system three times more expensive and three times more time consuming. Even if you were to knock every single component (green, blue, purple all) back down to requiring 2/2/2 mats, the system would still be three times "harder" than it is now.

 

That is more than enough of a barrier. More than enough of an increase. Anything beyond that is needless, careless, wanton theory-crafted change that is going to earn you outrage and player unhappiness when it hits live. Please do not do that to yourselves. It's not necessary, and it is totally avoidable. When 6.0 drops, I want the dev team focused on ironing out bugs, refining gear, tweaking Ops difficulty, designing new FPs and Warzones, and pretty please for pity's sake giving Strongholds some desperately needed attention. I do not want you suffering scorn and wrath and stress trying to fix crafting after the fact, when we have given you ample warning that you need to fix it NOW.

 

 

• Reduce the materials requirement for all components (green, blue, and purple quality) to 2/2/2 .
  
• Green schematics must only require green materials to make. Remove conquest mats from this equation entirely.
  
• Blue schematics must only require blue and green materials, in reasonable amounts.
  
• Purple schematics can require purple, blue and green, in reasonable amounts.
  
• Legendary schematics are the only ones that should require legendary mats.
  
• Increase your RE chance. (Even with infinite mats your players' testing is showing that current percentages are punitive.)
  
• Remove Grade 11 components from war supplies schematics.
  
• Reduce the cost of buying mats from the vendor using Jawa scrap. (As I showed in one of my previous posts, if deconstructing 150 pieces of gear doesn't give us sufficient scrap to craft a single basic green component, then your math is catastrophically wrong.)
  

 

I suggest checking out the thread from which that quote comes, if you want to read more.

 

And 28 CMTs ends your argument of easy Ossus crafting. Seriously, what's the point of even discussing it? It's not subjective. Ossus crafting was just as ridiculously overpriced.

I cannot agree. In my experience as a non-hotshot, 95% solo-oriented player, CMTs were not hard to get. You just need to be in a conquest guild that makes its goals. Doing missions on my own with a view to each week's conquest goals, or sometimes just crafting, was enough for me to get multiple characters receiving conquest rewards each week. The large yield planets give an average of 2.5 CMTs per character per week. As such, the cost for Ossus crafting was largely fine for someone in a guild that does conquest focusing on large planets (and almost every activity, group or solo, helps with conquest). Ossus crafting is miles and miles better than 6.0 crafting.

 

(If you prefer not to be a guild, or to be in a small guild, or a guild that doesn't focus on conquest, that's your prerogative... but, in my experience, being in a big conquest guild does not force you to play the game differently from how you usually enjoy it. And, anyway, it's a choice. As long as there's an option to get necessary materials without making much change to how one plays, I think that's a friendly crafting system.)

Edited October 10, 2019 by Estelindis

I have to add, as a NIM raider, the past few months have been surprisingly profitable. Each member of my group made about 3bn Credits by just doing what we wanted to do either way - farming titles in Gods. The initial price for Queen-materials was also satisfying.

 

However, if crafting in general is getting more difficult, players like me, who rather sell crafting materials dropping in the content I do is also getting worse, so I'd support the issue stated in this thread. I haven't looked into augment-crafting, but I hope it's viable for someone like me who is just logging into the game for raids.

 

if you dont see this as a problem, there is no hope for you. catering to make your nim raiders rich is not a good business model.

I get some people have it stockpiled but those are usually the hardcore players the rest of us do not.

Stockpiling jawa junk to spend in grade 11 will disapoint everyone, even hardcore players. You can spend today 1 junk to get a mat that is worth 1k, 2k or even 10k+

Each "regular"(from gather/missions) single grade 11 mat will not be too overpriced because mission/time cost per each one has not increase drastically.

Even with all mats jawa cost increased, it will be better to gate anything up to grade 10 than spend 200 in grade 11. So even if you have several tabs of stacks of jawa junk, it is best to spend them now than wait for a miracle after 6.0, it will be too late then.

Stockpiling jawa junk to spend in grade 11 will disapoint everyone, even hardcore players. You can spend today 1 junk to get a mat that is worth 1k, 2k or even 10k+

<snip>

Even with all mats jawa cost increased, it will be better to gate anything up to grade 10 than spend 200 in grade 11. So even if you have several tabs of stacks of jawa junk, it is best to spend them now than wait for a miracle after 6.0, it will be too late then.

Correct! As I posted elsewhere, in the effort to RE just one new chestpiece to its highest rating, I spent grade 11 materials equivalent to a seven-bay hold completely full of max stacks of jawa junk. (More than that, actually.) And I didn't even succeed at learning the top chestpiece. Everyone should spend all their junk now. 6.0 costs are punitive.

 

However, I have to disagree on one thing you said...

 

Each "regular"(from gather/missions) single grade 11 mat will not be too overpriced because mission/time cost per each one has not increase drastically.

...and here's why.

 

Each regular single grade 11 mat is not too expensive to get via missions. But - and this is genuinely a significant drawback - the most-used materials by far are premium grade. And only two yields of mission return much in the way of premium materials. Only one yield of mission, moderate yield, returns solely premium materials. As such, I think the price of premium materials will go up because they will be in high demand but low supply, inherently. Yes, anyone can always still run a mission to get some, and that mission won't cost much. But we can't run as many missions as we want, and when we do get the materials they don't go nearly as far as grades 1-10.

It costs 560,000 green jawa junk to purchase the mats needed to craft 140 green grade 11 components, so you can RE them to have the 140 base MK-11 components you need to start making 14 MK-11 kits (enough for 1 character). That does not factor in the cost of crafting the kit, just the base MK-11 components.

 

While some people and guilds have a large amount saved up, I doubt they have millions and millions of full cargo bays saved up. A full cargo bay with 80 stacks of 9999 green jawa junk is a total of 799,920.

Edited October 10, 2019 by Flying-Brian

It costs 560,000 green jawa junk to purchase the mats needed to craft 140 green grade 11 components, so you can RE them to have the 140 base MK-11 components you need to start making 14 MK-11 kits (enough for 1 character). That does not factor in the cost of crafting the kit, just the base MK-11 components.

 

While some people and guilds have a large amount saved up, I doubt they have millions and millions of full cargo bays saved up. A full cargo bay with 80 stacks of 9999 green jawa junk is a total of 799,920.

 

you can imagine what the cost will be by the time it gets to the GTN !

 

YIKES !!

 

:eek:

 

Maybe I should suggest opening up a loan office that would convert CC's from the CM to credits (for a nice tidy profit of course !)

 

I could call it

Neanderthal Savings and Loan

Slogan:

Do it or die trying …..(but not until you're paid in full)

Edited October 10, 2019 by OlBuzzard

Now I know that they cannot scrap the entire new system unless we want to wait 3 more months for release but the price to craft one piece of gear that is green and by the time you hit max level you will have either out ranked it in item level or you will within a week or two. I suggest they just lower the cost for all materials needed to match what we use now 2x all materials has been the norm for sometime. Also possibly lower jawa scraps to 25-50 for 1 material because the way it is now its just not gonna fly.

 

As Eric put in one of his updates, crafting is already set in stone for production, and they would not allude to that actual numbers.....so now way wait and see how badly we get reamed

Now I know that they cannot scrap the entire new system unless we want to wait 3 more months for release

 

They could simply not go live with it, which is EXACTLY what they did with 4.0 KOTFE. They did not introduce grade 9 materials until a couple of months into 4.0. That's why the C2-N2 Comfort Enthusiast mission on Odessen uses grade 8 materials.

 

And 28 CMTs ends your argument of easy Ossus crafting. Seriously, what's the point of even discussing it? It's not subjective. Ossus crafting was just as ridiculously overpriced.

I cannot agree. In my experience as a non-hotshot, 95% solo-oriented player, CMTs were not hard to get. You just need to be in a conquest guild that makes its goals.

You forget, Estelindis, that was only possible for smaller guilds when they added in the conquest point gain from all activities and mob kills with the first Dantooine event a few months ago. Remember that we are coming up on nearly 11 months that Ossus has been live, and the only crafting missing from Ossus launch was MH and OHs. For the majority of time that Ossus crafting was live, CMTs were hard to come by, and I'm not a 95% solo-oriented player. I do GSF, ground PVP, ops, all sorts of activities. Consistently our guild barely made the small planet invasion target on only one faction, and that was usually with me on at least 4 alts contributing 25-50% of the points ... until the conquest point changes. That's all changing, as conquest goals are getting nerfed big time. I'm with Pietrastor on this point. Crafting in Ossus, relative to the exotics required, was ridiculous for most people. And 6.0 crafting is even worse, which is kinda hard to believe without having been on PTS and seeing the numbers like you and TerraStomper have actually published. I tried myself yesterday and its just broken beyond all reason.

 

I said in Dracmor's "Final Suggestions" thread that 6.0 crafting was a steaming pile of nerf excrement, and I stand by that description. The better thing to do is to completely scrap it until they have time to address our concerns.

- There should be no blue/purple mats required for green gear crafted below 285 Item Rating - I mean we could debate on the exact iLevel but green stuff should NEVER require blue or purple materials, let alone EXOTICS from conquest and group endgame content.

- There should be no Premium Data Spikes (sliced tech item) required for Bioanalysis

- No matter the level, 20% should be the lowest chance to RE for a schematic - again we can debate on this but 5% is WAY too low. You, Estelindis, know better than anyone the effects as you've actually published the data.

- Nesting of blue prototype assembly components requiring premium assembly components should be removed, and similarly with higher grade schematics. - this is my opinion of course, in light of the developers' desires to "make crafting harder" or whatever this may have to stay.

- Material requirements should be reduced to 10% of their current costs. One 4-stack of entry level blue adrenals should not require 120 green premium materials. I don't care what you are saying Musco, resources are not falling out of the sky for me, I spent 7 hours doing group and solo content or more on phase 3 with eight influence rank 50 comps going. There aren't enough nodes on Onderon, the yield is too low from mobs and nodes, and the mission times and yields are terrible even with all eight influence rank 50 companions. You shouldn't need 200 green premium materials to make a single MK-11 augment kit.

 

My opinion, for whatever it's worth,

... is 100% correct. I won't repeat all their criticisms and reasons here but they are spot on.

Edited October 11, 2019 by phalczen

You forget, Estelindis, that was only possible for smaller guilds when they added in the conquest point gain from all activities and mob kills with the first Dantooine event a few months ago. Remember that we are coming up on nearly 11 months that Ossus has been live, and the only crafting missing from Ossus launch was MH and OHs. For the majority of time that Ossus crafting was live, CMTs were hard to come by, and I'm not a 95% solo-oriented player.

Respectfully, I do not forget. I have a different experience, because most of my characters are in two large conquest-oriented guilds that never fail to meet their targets (and always go for a large yield planet, unless there's some smaller planet members want for a title). Since Ossus launched, I have had more CMTs than I've wanted to use. After I made augments for my characters (and some extras for not-so-flush guildies), I had no use for the remaining CMTs except to GTN them. (I don't enjoy selling crafted gear with stats. To me, it feels like a section of the market that is just too saturated and depends far too much on being lucky with crits to make profits. I much prefer crafting and selling cosmetics, of which 5.10 added precious few!)

 

Frankly, it seems like your issue is more with how guilds interact with conquest than the crafting system. That dynamic could be tweaked separately from the overall crafting system.

 

It's not even trauma from my 6.0 crafting experience that's making me speak positively of 5.10 crafting. I just genuinely found it fine. Sure, there are things I would've liked to be different, but those were all more along the lines of "give us more empty shells with new cosmetic looks" opinions that I've been parroting for multiple iterations of crafting now.

 

Anyway, needless to say, I agree with your criticisms of 6.0 crafting! If we can't come together on 5.10, at least we can concur on 6.0.

Edited October 11, 2019 by Estelindis

After ossus and now what 6.0 promises to be it seems like bioware is fairly in love with the idea that fully gearing a character should take you 2+ months and that playing geared alts should be a pipe dream.

 

The reverse engineering probability is particularly gross considering the sinks required to craft in the first place.

Edited October 11, 2019 by ShinLunaAzure

I have to add, as a NIM raider, the past few months have been surprisingly profitable. Each member of my group made about 3bn Credits by just doing what we wanted to do either way - farming titles in Gods. The initial price for Queen-materials was also satisfying.

 

However, if crafting in general is getting more difficult, players like me, who rather sell crafting materials dropping in the content I do is also getting worse, so I'd support the issue stated in this thread. I haven't looked into augment-crafting, but I hope it's viable for someone like me who is just logging into the game for raids.

 

From what I understand, all your hard earned billions will be spent on a few augments and aug kits. Maybe a few reusable things too if anyone is actually able to get the schematics on live...

From what I understand, all your hard earned billions will be spent on a few augments and aug kits. Maybe a few reusable things too if anyone is actually able to get the schematics on live...

 

true … unless you don't have a few extra billion to spend at the rotulet table !

Dont you get tons of stuff from braking down gear? This system is allot like SWGs RE system it seems where you RE junk to get certain items and then RE high stat gear to make power Bits.