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vengeance offhand for arena fight or 1vs1

STAR WARS: The Old Republic > English > Classes > Guardian / Juggernaut
vengeance offhand for arena fight or 1vs1

Exarforce's Avatar


Exarforce
05.05.2014 , 10:35 AM | #1
Hey there fellow jugg/guardians...
I've been trying to experiment with shield offhand in arena and still couldn't get the result I am looking for since solo queing matchs can be extreamly situational.
Basically I try to stay soresu form untill i dive into an attack mode then switch out to shien.
My question is, how much dps would i actually lose in shien form while using shield offhand?
As much as I love to put out dps, I figure it is also as important to try stay alive as long as you can and keep your team alive as much you can by either being a meatshield for time being or...whatever necessary.
Can anyone possibly confirm this? Is it really worth it or not?
Thx in the advance.

acid_s's Avatar


acid_s
05.05.2014 , 04:31 PM | #2
according to ask mr robot, switching to soresu and using shield gen making you lose about 80 bonus dmg.
if you want more survivability and be more asset for a team than pure venge, consider hybrid build - you can still make some dps, but be a hell more of support, as jugg class have potential to be

wadecounty's Avatar


wadecounty
05.05.2014 , 04:40 PM | #3
Stance dancing in an arena isn't really viable because of the fast paced nature, losing all your Rage at times will just simply be too much of a penalty.

My advice if you wanted to go this route, skip the Shien talents, pick up some of the Soresu talents in the tank tree like the cd reduction on charge and reduced Retaliate cost, and just plan on using Soresu full time. As for how much damage you'll lose, it'll mostly hurt your force attacks as that's where shields lag behind, so Scream/Shatter and your dots will all hit for a bit less. The only things you'll miss out on with Ravage/Impale/Vicious Throw are the 6% damage and melee boosts from Shien form.
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Marstrike's Avatar


Marstrike
05.06.2014 , 05:05 AM | #4
I play full immortal spec in PvP and PvE but right now vengeance is very strong (some say OP) so i would consider sticking with the generator and full vengeance atleast until after 2.8.

The reason for this is simple, ED. Without going too much into it ED is more powerful in vengeance than immortal due to the stats (which your offhand adds to). The healing ammount is done via your bonus damage which obviously DPS spec's have more of.

DPS jugg's provide excellent control and pressure to both melee and ranged, that couple with the fact people still love throwing away CC's on unstoppable and ED makes any team work for your death.

Also, as it stands now the nerf in 2.8 will only be a reduction of 20 seconds to ED's life span. This might sound like a lot but realistically people only really pop it when under focus fire and the 10 charges get used up almost insta.
"The wolf does not concern himself with the opinion of sheep"
Neoheart - Jedi Sentinel - The Immortal Legacy

Ansultares's Avatar


Ansultares
05.06.2014 , 03:17 PM | #5
Quote: Originally Posted by acid_s View Post
according to ask mr robot, switching to soresu and using shield gen making you lose about 80 bonus dmg.
if you want more survivability and be more asset for a team than pure venge, consider hybrid build - you can still make some dps, but be a hell more of support, as jugg class have potential to be
Umm, no.

Soresu Vengeance is fine; just adjust your spec somewhat around it. You still probably want Shien/Unstoppable.

Hybrid Vengeance/Immortal isn't much of a DPS spec, with only slightly more utility than pure Vengeance.

Hybrid rage/immortal on the other hand....

Lickshadow's Avatar


Lickshadow
05.27.2014 , 06:31 AM | #6
I woulden't really say that using a shield with full veng spec is worth it. First of all you probably lose a lot of dps, and you tankyness wont really incress at all. On the other hand you can play the (23/23/0) specc with full tank gear on. The damage output is low but you have maximun utlity to support your team. you can still guard your teammates and still beging tanky, you have low CD on CC's (Intimidating roar, force push). You will be able to consantly spam force slow to annoy the enemy teams and having 2 stuns to assist on the target your team focuses on. And the most imporrtant part is that you only swap to Shien form in the force charge and than imitatley swap back to Soresu to get the guard back out.

This will provied maximun support fo you team, and still having farily descent amout of damage at the same time.
Stjart - Juggernaut

TOFN

tanerb's Avatar


tanerb
05.30.2014 , 10:01 AM | #7
Quote: Originally Posted by Ansultares View Post
Umm, no.

Soresu Vengeance is fine; just adjust your spec somewhat around it. You still probably want Shien/Unstoppable.

Hybrid Vengeance/Immortal isn't much of a DPS spec, with only slightly more utility than pure Vengeance.

Hybrid rage/immortal on the other hand....
This. you want immortal/rage .Go with the immortal tree until you get sonic wall, skip things like blade barricade as defense is useless in pvp. from rage tree go until dominate, taking obliterate along the way. you have to get things like strangulate along the way but this comes with being hybrid. from vengeance tree only get first line plus dreadnaught. this way compared to a full tank you lose crushing blow and backhand but get obliterate with autocrit on smash (not as powerful as it used to be but still something), also switch to dps gear (other than shield and reactive warding relic maybe) esp getting 2 piece vindicator set bonus is important. so you will have much higher dps with very little survivability loss

acid_s's Avatar


acid_s
05.30.2014 , 10:29 PM | #8
could you provide some build? lately im testing this:

http://www.torhead.com/skill-calc#10...rRbbZZfbbkrM.3

with tank gear (ofc, two armorings are from vindicator, to have heal on guardian leap). dmg output isn't very high, but dps isn't purpose of this build.

LordTercept's Avatar


LordTercept
06.02.2014 , 07:31 AM | #9
I am of the opinion that stance dancing is something that every Juggernaut should be doing when the situation calls for it.

Playing full vengeance in solo rated matches is viable, playing hybrid is viable. I do find that I personally get frustrated playing hybrid when I get DPS on my team that aren't able to pull their weight, or I get in a match with tank or a hybrid tank. I prefer to play full Vengeance and then if the need arises I'll swap to soresu to guard as necessary. I usually don't use a shield gen unless I know I'm going to be guarding the entire match and that's a decision I make before every fight based on team composition.

Unfortunately I don't think you're going to find that running a shield gen, or a focus all the time is going to be the right decision. My opinion is that you want to play the spec that gives you the most versatility, and the most options in solo ranked, and I think that vengeance gives you the right balance.
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