In Regs you are seeing 50% Assassins. Their damage is retarded, the ease at which the combo is pulled off is simple, the CC is excellent and the worst part is this burst is repeatable an obscene amount.

Don't even start on ranked. A team of 4 assassins beats literally anything. Its outrageous that they have not been nerfed yet..

LoL, big bad Sin had their way with you?

Seriously though. If you know your own class well, Sins aren’t much different than before. Nothing has really changed except the opener and if you haven’t learnt to negate most of that by now, then you need to learn your class.

The biggest differences in this meta (for every class) is the different gear and tactical’s. If you have the wrong ones equipped for the wrong situations or role, then you can have a bad day regardless of class.

(There are too many generic trash sets that people are wearing)

The problems most encountered in regs or ranked for that matter is class stacking. This has always been a problem because 2-3 of the same class (even the weaker ones) can ruin your day. Add that Sins like to roam together and you have little time to defend against them before they surprise you. But this is also no different to operatives doing the same. In all honesty, I fear two operatives over two sins any day of the week.

What you are seeing at the moment is a misconception (which you are also enforcing with this thread) that Sins are OP. This has caused all the FOTM players and noobs to jump on them because they think they’ll be unstoppable. Which isn’t the case in most 1v1 or even 2v2 situations. Most of these guys are just rubbish as well. But they end up with an advantage because of double or triple stealth attacks on one player at a time. This isn’t anything that’s changed in this meta. Stealths have always had this advantage, even when they were weak as ****, 2 of them on you at once could be a pain in the arse.

Once a class gets the FOTM moniker (even if it’s not deserved) it is hard to shake it and then you have an over representation of that class. Which brings me back to my earlier point. The issue is mostly class stacking and the one thing you did get right in your OP is there are a lot of Sins a about.

So all your thread has done is promote Sins as the FOTM class from a poor misconception they are OP. Which means more people will see it and jump to them. You are only perpetuating the problem and adding more sin players to the mix.

I’ll admit, Sins aren’t weak. They aren’t at the bottom of the meta. Are they on top? That’s highly debatable and in my opinion they aren’t the top spec to play unless you can class stack.

A Sin vs a Mara in a 1v1 is going to be close and probably in the Maras favour.

Same goes for a Sin vs sniper or a Sins vs an Operative (which is most likely a stalemate)

Even my Rage Jugg can deal with most Sins unless they are just better players on a Sin (in which case apply lube).

A Sorc has so many defences and can actually hit back now that the Sin will probably give up if they are on their own.

And don’t get me started on a Merc. They may not be at the top anymore, but they aren’t a push over either vs a Sin

Have you even played a Sin or Operative for that matter, before this meta? If you had, you would realise that Sins always have the advantage when together.

See if you can find someone on a Sin that is willing to duel you and help develop your defence tactics against them before you come and unknowingly promote them more, which adds to the class stacking you are seeing.

Lol I have every single class at 306 in Set gear with tacticals. You play a sin and wrote some big long ******** post to defend it.

Get rekt kid, its ridiculous that I can maul ppl for 75k, 60k 60k, then vanish and do it again, then vanish and do it again.

What other class can do that? Essentially if you dont have an immunity DCD you are dead.

Lol I have every single class at 306 in Set gear with tacticals. You play a sin and wrote some big long ******** post to defend it.

 

Get rekt kid, its ridiculous that I can maul ppl for 75k, 60k 60k, then vanish and do it again, then vanish and do it again.

 

What other class can do that? Essentially if you dont have an immunity DCD you are dead.

Yeah dec sin is pretty ridiculous. They need to tune down pts with their 90k hit and 14k dps, sins with 70k mauls and double vanish and opers with both backstab and veiled strike crit. Other specs are so far behind and dying pretty fast in any scenario. Ranked is full of sins, opers and maras. Booring and stupid as hell

Its a stealth meta... it is what it is.

Sidenote, the days of solo guards are numbered with so many stealth and the burst they are putting out. I've seen way too many sin/op combos basically global the guard before he/she can even call for help. Assuming anyone else actually cares about that sort of thing any more.

LoL, big bad Sin had their way with you?

You just embarrass yourself not admitting the problem. There were many FOTM specs in the past to deny the current one. We focused on the Operative yesterday, because in a team of 4 stealth was the only one with 1 vanish.

This is ridiculous.

I hope Deception gets nerfed, like Arsenal should have before that, due to the APPARENT stacking spec problem and the OvP repetitive burst. Anything else is hideous rhetoric.

A Sin vs a Mara in a 1v1 is going to be close and probably in the Maras favour.

Not to take things off topic, but which Sentinel/Marauder spec do you guys prefer for healer killing?

Not to take things off topic, but which Sentinel/Marauder spec do you guys prefer for healer killing?

Fury is the only one that really matter. Carnage has "weak" dps and anni takes too long in comparison.

Fury is the only one that really matter. Carnage has "weak" dps and anni takes too long in comparison.

Thank you! ~HUGS~

So... only Mara, Sin, Oper and Linger are viable now. Even Mercs and snipers are melting to this insane burst meta. Fortunately BW are known for their quick and painless re-balancing and adjust... oh wait... no that was a dream.

I would play tank but it is so... meh.

Its a stealth meta... it is what it is.

Translation: Another update BW created which has added class changes that have made some class specs absurdly overpowered while others are completely useless.

Anyway, either this OP'd simplistic brain dead spec will remain as is for another 3+ years, OR they will nerf it into uselessness within a year's time. Enjoy it now, it might not be around forever. Then again, maybe it will.

Fury is the only one that really matter. Carnage has "weak" dps and anni takes too long in comparison.

Actually in reality Carnage or Combat Sentinel is the best one to kill healers, due to its double (triple) burst with the correct rotation. Yes DPS numbers are less sustained, but Carnage or Combat is still one of the best burst specs in the game. The weak DPS in Carnage comes on Parsers and in 5 mins tests which according to reports id 2-3k dps weaker to Anni (best of sus dps specs), and about 1-2k weaker to Fury.

Lets get the obvious out of the way. Yes I main deception. I've mained deception since pre-launch. Yes, I am here to defend deception, as well as revel in the amount of forum tears deception has caused as of late.

On Star Forge everyone and their brother is role playing the bounty hunter class since the Mandalorian aired, so the claim of "50% assassins in regs" is inaccurate at best.

Assassins get those crazy big hits, right? Yeah they do. Seems everyone ignores the fact snipers, operatives, and mercs are all capable of hitting just as big or bigger. I've even seen Juggs hitting for 55k+ in regs. Let's also not forget every class mentioned above has more sustained damage, better defensive cool downs and tools to keep an assassin from successfully stealthing out of combat. Anyone who's played deception for any amount of time should know that stealthing out does not necessarily mean exiting out of combat. That means the argument of assassin burst too big and repeatable go right out the window against any player with a pulse.

As far as CC goes, deception has 3 soft stuns, one knock down, and one hard stun at their disposal (2 of which they have to be stealthed to use). any combination of 2 of those fills white bar and the player can't be CC'd again until it's depleated. unless the player is under geared, another assassin, or the planets have magically aligned thru team buffs and debuffs, the chances of deception stun locking and killing someone from full health is almost 0.

The rotation for assassin is pretty simple huh? Yeah there's valid a point there, but the rotation is just about the same as it has been since losing access to phase walk, crushing darkness, and force lightening. Only real difference is maul hits harder now.

The only thing read in all the forum post about assassins that actually has merit is the tactical switching when out of combat, which wasn't even mentioned here. All classes should have to choose 1 tactical at the beginning of a match/round and stick with it till the end.

In conclusion, as dirty as it makes me feel agreeing with Trixxie, their assessment of this post is pretty spot on.

Lets get the obvious out of the way. Yes I main deception. I've mained deception since pre-launch. Yes, I am here to defend deception, as well as revel in the amount of forum tears deception has caused as of late.

 

On Star Forge everyone and their brother is role playing the bounty hunter class since the Mandalorian aired, so the claim of "50% assassins in regs" is inaccurate at best.

 

Assassins get those crazy big hits, right? Yeah they do. Seems everyone ignores the fact snipers, operatives, and mercs are all capable of hitting just as big or bigger. I've even seen Juggs hitting for 55k+ in regs. Let's also not forget every class mentioned above has more sustained damage, better defensive cool downs and tools to keep an assassin from successfully stealthing out of combat. Anyone who's played deception for any amount of time should know that stealthing out does not necessarily mean exiting out of combat. That means the argument of assassin burst too big and repeatable go right out the window against any player with a pulse.

 

As far as CC goes, deception has 3 soft stuns, one knock down, and one hard stun at their disposal (2 of which they have to be stealthed to use). any combination of 2 of those fills white bar and the player can't be CC'd again until it's depleated. unless the player is under geared, another assassin, or the planets have magically aligned thru team buffs and debuffs, the chances of deception stun locking and killing someone from full health is almost 0.

 

The rotation for assassin is pretty simple huh? Yeah there's valid a point there, but the rotation is just about the same as it has been since losing access to phase walk, crushing darkness, and force lightening. Only real difference is maul hits harder now.

 

The only thing read in all the forum post about assassins that actually has merit is the tactical switching when out of combat, which wasn't even mentioned here. All classes should have to choose 1 tactical at the beginning of a match/round and stick with it till the end.

 

In conclusion, as dirty as it makes me feel agreeing with Trixxie, their assessment of this post is pretty spot on.

As a DPS Jugg who wishes dps juggs were viable for soio ranked, I would I would disagree on defensive cooldowns, but if I were to adjust anything I would look at caps or DR for amplifiers first as it might be the stacking of alpha strike combined with the tactical and set bonuses that are having unintended consequences for pvp.

The problems most encountered in regs or ranked for that matter is class stacking...

 

What you are seeing at the moment is a misconception (which you are also enforcing with this thread) that Sins are OP. This has caused all the FOTM players and noobs to jump on them because they think they’ll be unstoppable...

 

Once a class gets the FOTM moniker (even if it’s not deserved) it is hard to shake it and then you have an over representation of that class. Which brings me back to my earlier point. The issue is mostly class stacking and the one thing you did get right in your OP is there are a lot of Sins a about.

 

So all your thread has done is promote Sins as the FOTM class from a poor misconception they are OP. Which means more people will see it and jump to them. You are only perpetuating the problem and adding more sin players to the mix.

Class stacking is a major problem. You are right about that. Assassins would not be nearly as blatantly strong if it weren't for the fact that everyone, their mom, their dad, and their dog is playing assassin. A class's strengths are multiplied when accompanied by the same class. This is true with whatever class, operative, powertechs, marauders.

However, your wrong about the fact that sin's aren't weak. They are extremely strong. Easily at the top of the boards in damage, burst, survivibility, peeling, and stuns. There are a lot of FOTM rerollers for a reason. No one rerolls to a weak class lmfao.

Sure class stacking is an issue. But the problem is not solely class stacking. Class stacking only exasperates the already significant issue that, quite simply assassins are too strong.

A Sin vs a Mara in a 1v1 is going to be close and probably in the Maras favour.

Same goes for a Sin vs sniper or a Sins vs an Operative (which is most likely a stalemate)

Even my Rage Jugg can deal with most Sins unless they are just better players on a Sin (in which case apply lube).

A Sorc has so many defences and can actually hit back now that the Sin will probably give up if they are on their own.

And don’t get me started on a Merc. They may not be at the top anymore, but they aren’t a push over either vs a Sin.

A good sin, with double cloak and life warden is arguably the best 1v1 class. It's difficult to determin if oper is ahead, but it is extremely close. One thing is obvious though: sins have been significantly buffed in the 1v1 department. Maras,sorcs, juggs, and mercs don't stand a chance in 1v1s. Don't take my word for it; you will see this in next high level 1v1 tournament.

Not to take things off topic, but which Sentinel/Marauder spec do you guys prefer for healer killing?

IMO, Fury is the better one because it’s more mobile

Actually in reality Carnage or Combat Sentinel is the best one to kill healers, due to its double (triple) burst with the correct rotation. Yes DPS numbers are less sustained, but Carnage or Combat is still one of the best burst specs in the game. The weak DPS in Carnage comes on Parsers and in 5 mins tests which according to reports id 2-3k dps weaker to Anni (best of sus dps specs), and about 1-2k weaker to Fury.

A lot of it comes down to the type of healer. If it’s a Sorc or Operative, then fury has a better chance to keep up with them. If it’s a Merc, then carnage will be able to stay on them long enough to the damage.

Horses for courses.

Lets get the obvious out of the way. Yes I main deception. I've mained deception since pre-launch. Yes, I am here to defend deception, as well as revel in the amount of forum tears deception has caused as of late.

 

On Star Forge everyone and their brother is role playing the bounty hunter class since the Mandalorian aired, so the claim of "50% assassins in regs" is inaccurate at best.

 

Assassins get those crazy big hits, right? Yeah they do. Seems everyone ignores the fact snipers, operatives, and mercs are all capable of hitting just as big or bigger. I've even seen Juggs hitting for 55k+ in regs. Let's also not forget every class mentioned above has more sustained damage, better defensive cool downs and tools to keep an assassin from successfully stealthing out of combat. Anyone who's played deception for any amount of time should know that stealthing out does not necessarily mean exiting out of combat. That means the argument of assassin burst too big and repeatable go right out the window against any player with a pulse.

 

As far as CC goes, deception has 3 soft stuns, one knock down, and one hard stun at their disposal (2 of which they have to be stealthed to use). any combination of 2 of those fills white bar and the player can't be CC'd again until it's depleated. unless the player is under geared, another assassin, or the planets have magically aligned thru team buffs and debuffs, the chances of deception stun locking and killing someone from full health is almost 0.

 

The rotation for assassin is pretty simple huh? Yeah there's valid a point there, but the rotation is just about the same as it has been since losing access to phase walk, crushing darkness, and force lightening. Only real difference is maul hits harder now.

 

The only thing read in all the forum post about assassins that actually has merit is the tactical switching when out of combat, which wasn't even mentioned here. All classes should have to choose 1 tactical at the beginning of a match/round and stick with it till the end.

 

In conclusion, as dirty as it makes me feel agreeing with Trixxie, their assessment of this post is pretty spot on.

Yeah, you hit the nail on the head. The only thing I forgot to bring up is the tactical swapping, which needs changing. One tactical per match and then it locks.

Passes the soap to clean off some dirt

Class stacking is a major problem. You are right about that. Assassins would not be nearly as blatantly strong if it weren't for the fact that everyone, their mom, their dad, and their dog is playing assassin. A class's strengths are multiplied when accompanied by the same class. This is true with whatever class, operative, powertechs, marauders.

 

However, your wrong about the fact that sin's aren't weak. They are extremely strong. Easily at the top of the boards in damage, burst, survivibility, peeling, and stuns. There are a lot of FOTM rerollers for a reason. No one rerolls to a weak class lmfao.

 

Sure class stacking is an issue. But the problem is not solely class stacking. Class stacking only exasperates the already significant issue that, quite simply assassins are too strong.

 

A good sin, with double cloak and life warden is arguably the best 1v1 class. It's difficult to determin if oper is ahead, but it is extremely close. One thing is obvious though: sins have been significantly buffed in the 1v1 department. Maras,sorcs, juggs, and mercs don't stand a chance in 1v1s. Don't take my word for it; you will see this in next high level 1v1 tournament.

I never actually said Sins were weak. My point was they aren’t sitting at the top of the meta by themselves. Nothing about the sin rotation has really changed that much. Even their new ability is useless.

The only change is maul does hit harder and the tactical swapping (which needs to be fixed to kick it per match).

I’m not discounting what you are saying. I do realise that a Sin isn’t a push over. But it’s the double stealth and tactical swapping that’s the real issue here. The Double maul opener or the triple maul (I see some people complain about) can be negated by every single class I play. The only one I’m not sure about is PTs because I hate playing the class.

As you rightly point out, Class stacking in regs and probably ranked is what’s amplifying this. Even before 6.0, two - three sins stacked were nearly unstoppable. The difference is in 5.0, every man and his dog rolled Merc to start with, which meant less Sins and ever other class.

I don’t claim to be the best player and I do look forward to seeing what happens in the next tournament. What I would suggest is when you set the rules, that you restrict tactical swapping. Then I think it will truely show that Sins are not so OP as many believe. It may even reset the FOTM status and it move to some other class.

When it’s a more lvl playing field with the tactical’s, I think Maras and snipers should beat a Sin most of the time. Sorcs and Juggs will be the most interesting to watch for me. Operatives is a forgone conclusion if tactical swapping is removed. They should definitely have the advantage over Sins, the same as they did in the last meta.

Essentially if you dont have an immunity DCD you are dead.

That has not changed since the last meta.

You just embarrass yourself not admitting the problem. There were many FOTM specs in the past to deny the current one. We focused on the Operative yesterday, because in a team of 4 stealth was the only one with 1 vanish.

This is ridiculous.

 

I hope Deception gets nerfed, like Arsenal should have before that, due to the APPARENT stacking spec problem and the OvP repetitive burst. Anything else is hideous rhetoric.

You embarrass yourself by not recognising the match was class stacked and glossing over that when asking for Nerfs. You don’t even seem to understand what the problem is that’s cause people to switch to Stealths.

Let me give you a hint, it’s the tactical swapping

Its a stealth meta... it is what it is.

Sidenote, the days of solo guards are numbered with so many stealth and the burst they are putting out. I've seen way too many sin/op combos basically global the guard before he/she can even call for help. Assuming anyone else actually cares about that sort of thing any more.

It’s only a stealth meta because they can tactical swap. All Bioware needed to do is lock it so you can’t do that.

Then the Stealth meta problem is sort of fixed.

The issue is so many people have put so much work into those classes now, that even if they fix the tactical swapping, the Stealths will still be over represented in pvp and class stacking will still be a problem.

If Bioware had fixed this tactical swapping straight away, this would never have turned into a stealth meta in the first place.

Let's also not forget every class mentioned above has ... tools to keep an assassin from successfully stealthing out of combat. Anyone who's played deception for any amount of time should know that stealthing out does not necessarily mean exiting out of combat.

About those tools.

I've had a fight where the system logs me smartcasting a Stealth Scan on an assassins head 0.2s after they land a maul and and it still doesn't get them: https://i.ibb.co/30qxLkF/tmp.png

That wasn't a casual guess scan, it was exactly cast on them while visible or it wouldn't have cast at all and yet you see, they've dropped combat and stealthed out of it with force speed.

The one tool specifically to reveal stealth is pure trash.

Sniper with Sweeping Blasters has a better stealth reveal. It's bigger, has no cooldown and is a usable ability on everyone else too.