I'm new to the mechanics of pvp so I am curious as to whether I should be guarding. For some reason I don't see alot of my allies or enemies using it, so I am wondering if I am doing something wrong. On the side note, I am a juggernaut and wondering if I should be dps/def spec. I am currently in a def spec and my total dmg /wz is around 33k and protection 20-50k - I have lag so I am wondering if these are adequate numbers or if my lag is killing my dmg. Ty to all for your help.

I'm new to the mechanics of pvp so I am curious as to whether I should be guarding. For some reason I don't see alot of my allies or enemies using it, so I am wondering if I am doing something wrong. On the side note, I am a juggernaut and wondering if I should be dps/def spec. I am currently in a def spec and my total dmg /wz is around 33k and protection 20-50k - I have lag so I am wondering if these are adequate numbers or if my lag is killing my dmg. Ty to all for your help.

 

Yes, Guard is important especially for your healers. It can be difficult to use effectively sometimes, especially in pugs, because you have to stay within range of that guarded person for it to have an effect. With those protection numbers you are obviously taking advantage of taunts, which is perfect. Your protection numbers will get better the more you play.

 

You will probably get more people saying to go DPS over Defense. I say try them both and see what you like. I personally play Defense spec and find it to be a blast in PVP. No, your damage will not be top tier, but it will also get much better than the numbers you are seeing now. A Defense Jug can be a valuable team member due to your utility. We are also fantastic ball handlers in Hutt Ball. Practice, practice, practice.

 

What level are you?

I'm new to the mechanics of pvp so I am curious as to whether I should be guarding. For some reason I don't see alot of my allies or enemies using it, so I am wondering if I am doing something wrong. On the side note, I am a juggernaut and wondering if I should be dps/def spec. I am currently in a def spec and my total dmg /wz is around 33k and protection 20-50k - I have lag so I am wondering if these are adequate numbers or if my lag is killing my dmg. Ty to all for your help.

 

Guard: You should always guard people, if you choose to be in soresu form and geared for defense. Since you are not contributing to the other catergories, taunting/peeling/guarding is the only valuable thing you can do as a Tank in PVP. Guarding healers/guildies takes priority, but even if you and a DPS are guarding a node, you should have your guard up on them.

 

Spec: You might need to tweak your spec. Hybrid is the only way to go, if you plan on taunting/peeling/guarding. This is the guide I started with for my alt.

http://watchmen.activeboard.com/t50144827/a-whole-guide-for-a-whole-guardian/

I wanted a class that could fend off a certain OP'd melee class. It definately worked better for my style (at the core is defense), but I still felt it was lacking because the mitigation/defense was just not strong enough to warrant the 27/12/2 spec... Since 1.4, I have moved to a more balanced approach, which I feel is the only "true" balanced spec for this AC. With the smash/sweep buff, it was stupid not to tweak the Hybrid spec, so I moved to:

 

http://swtor.askmrrobot.com/skills/guardian#21j1k28-1c-2dde0ee

 

I feel the only real value in the tank trees are Warding Call/Invincible for mitigation, proc for no channel choke/stasis, and 8% damage increase. You can stay in Soresu, benefit from the good parts ot the tank tree (still taunting/peeling/guarding), while actually being able to deal out some damage. Even in Tank gear, my Smash Proc was hitting over 4K. That is about as much burst as a Sage/Sorc on a single attack, but you still get the best CD the class has in Warding Call/Invincible. Losing Unremitting/Unstoppable hurts, but I think the damage and 2nd leap/immobilize outweighs the utility in UN/UN.

 

Numbers: A "Pure Tank" number's are never very good in a WZ, especially if healers are not present. It's another reason why I respecd. If a healer is present, I can taunt/peel/guard just as good as the guide's or my tweaked hybrid spec. The difference is when a healer isn't around. I actually have enough DPS to dish out some pain. So my numbers are generally in the 150-200k range when a healer isn't around, and 300k+ when one is...

 

Also Guardian Leap/Intercede is your friend for good protection numbers. And if you can, while in battle, swap guard on people that are losing fast HP or being focused. Your protection should be around 50-75k+ if no healer is around , or 100K+ if one is.

 

Also don't discount your healz from Endure/Endure pain. This should stay on constant CD, and you should also be using a PvP medpack after you pop Endure (if it is off CD). I typically get 75k+ heals (lol, right).

 

Overall, you should be looking at 150K-75k-75K at a minimum, unless the enemies quit. Also go looking for trouble... My sig says I am trying to be Ray Tango, but for a tank, trying to Rambo 3+ guarding a node helps your team (assuming they are trying to cap an opposite one).. You are a punching bag, so don't be worried about dying. It's your job to die, but make it hurt and make it take a long while before they kill you. I am sure the Maras on my server find me incredibly annoying....

 

 

 

TL;DR

1. If you are in Soresu, always guard people, even DPS.

2. Try hybrid spec, and stay in Soresu.

3. Tweak your playstyle and utility a bit..

4. Profit...

Edited November 8, 2012 by L-RANDLE

Guarding healers and taunting targets attacking them can help the protection numbers. But the mistake I see defense tanks make in pvp is that they are guarding the best geared healer. That may be wise, but it can be the cause of small protection numbers in that, one, they tend to know how not to be targets and get hit all the time, and two, they have great gear and mitigate more on their own. If you want to see those numbers soar, guard the healer in recruit gear. Aside from them being greatful, and you effectively power multiplying their contribution, they will get focused and your guard will go off like crazy. Then you'll see really high protection numbers.

 

Taunts are much simpler. If the opponent keeps wacking on the same target, you're reducing their damage even though they are ignoring you. The aoe taunt on someone focusing on a healer you're guarding will get you about 4-5 medals in 15 seconds. And if you do that all match you end up with protection numbers that look like top end dps or healing numbers.

Everyone keeps saying that taunt ups your protection numbers, but I thought taunt showed up as healing? I'm pretty sure mine does (Shadow Tank) . If it shows up as protection, then how am I'm getting all that healing each WZ?

 

[Edit] - Oh, and beyond all that advise up there, I'd say specifically for huttball look to guard the ball carrier if you are not him/her.

Edited November 9, 2012 by Banderal

Everyone keeps saying that taunt ups your protection numbers, but I thought taunt showed up as healing? I'm pretty sure mine does (Shadow Tank) . If it shows up as protection, then how am I'm getting all that healing each WZ?

 

[Edit] - Oh, and beyond all that advise up there, I'd say specifically for huttball look to guard the ball carrier if you are not him/her.

 

Taunt ups protection healing from harness shadows proc with tele throw

 

Spec: You might need to tweak your spec. Hybrid is the only way to go, if you plan on taunting/peeling/guarding. This is the guide I started with for my alt.

http://watchmen.activeboard.com/t50144827/a-whole-guide-for-a-whole-guardian/

 

I tried your spec yesterday. First game was pretty crappy for me getting used to losing one of my stuns. I didn't like giving up my lower cool downs on force push either. Next two games were much better. <10m leap was very nice to have. Oh, and of course, SMASH! I'm going to screw around with it for a bit longer. Thanks for posting.

I tried your spec yesterday. First game was pretty crappy for me getting used to losing one of my stuns. I didn't like giving up my lower cool downs on force push either. Next two games were much better. <10m leap was very nice to have. Oh, and of course, SMASH! I'm going to screw around with it for a bit longer. Thanks for posting.

 

Yeah, that took some getting use to for me as well. I think the situational DPS makes up for it though.

 

Also, if your Force crit rating is under 30% buffed, you might want to move a second point in the smash crit proc. My Force crit is like 37% buffed, so I only put one point in there. As long as you are alternating between the Stasis/Choke & Combat Focus/Enrage for your 25% smash proc, you can frequently crit without needing to leap. I find the second leap much more valuable as another root, especially at the hazards in HB. Leap>Stun>Leap, but don't overlap.

Everyone keeps saying that taunt ups your protection numbers, but I thought taunt showed up as healing? I'm pretty sure mine does (Shadow Tank) . If it shows up as protection, then how am I'm getting all that healing each WZ?

 

I made the same mistake. turn on logging and upload your log to Mr. Robot.

 

Enure counts as healing. Focused defense may count as healing.

 

Do a WZ with no taunts or guards and you will see you have healing numbers but no protection.

I'm lvl 50 with recruit pvp gear working towards next tier

I made the same mistake. turn on logging and upload your log to Mr. Robot.

 

Enure counts as healing. Focused defense may count as healing.

 

Do a WZ with no taunts or guards and you will see you have healing numbers but no protection.

 

I don't think taunts count towards protection... I think its only Guard, and Guardian Leap/Intercede. I could be wrong though.

 

I wish they had a small real time running WZ stats window in the UI!!!

 

Can you suggest that to the Devs Allison?

I'm new to the mechanics of pvp so I am curious as to whether I should be guarding. For some reason I don't see alot of my allies or enemies using it, so I am wondering if I am doing something wrong. On the side note, I am a juggernaut and wondering if I should be dps/def spec. I am currently in a def spec and my total dmg /wz is around 33k and protection 20-50k - I have lag so I am wondering if these are adequate numbers or if my lag is killing my dmg. Ty to all for your help.

 

read these 2 links, after that, you're good to go :

http://watchmen.activeboard.com/t50144827/a-whole-guide-for-a-whole-guardian/

http://www.swtor.com/community/showthread.php?t=468757

TL;DR

1. If you are in Soresu, always guard people, even DPS.

2. Try hybrid spec, and stay in Soresu.

3. Tweak your playstyle and utility a bit..

4. Profit...

 

Thanks for the detailed response; I read the whole thing, just quoting the above for brevity.

 

I am going with a variant of the build recommended by the "Whole Guardian" guide you posted which I had previously read. Lots of people are going for a more DPS oriented Smash build. This is the build I am going for:

 

http://www.torhead.com/skill-calc#101GrhdkzrdZfMd0MZMM.2 (give or take a couple of points here and there).

 

The CC immunity (and to a lesser degree damage reduction) after force leap is huge. I get almost all of the defensive cooldowns and CC/utility of the immortal tree. Yes, it's not a damage spec but that's not what I am going for. I plan to stack endurance and, to a lesser extent, defense chance as discussed in the guide. I'll be picking up the 2-piece Vindicator (8% heal when you intercede to a friend) set and the 2-piece War Leaders (extra second on Force Choke) set.

 

Playstyle is currently (I am only lvl 34) as mentioned in the guide. I use guard, taunt and peels (the extra CC and snares really help) to keep healers alive, unless objectives dictate otherwise. If there are no healers, I guard DPS but as you mentioned that's less than optimal. With all the FOTM Smash juggs in lowbie PvP right now, there are lots of times we don't have any healers, unfortunately. But there are plenty of times were my increased hit points/defense chance allows me to survive long enough to stop the cap until defenders arrive and plenty of Huttball games where my defensive CDs/high endurance are the only thing that let allows us to score.

 

So I am banking on *tanking* which means my DPS numbers will be low with protection/healing high.

Edited November 9, 2012 by DroidDreamer