Class balance – The following Disciplines are receiving changes (details will follow in the next few weeks):

 

Lethality / Ruffian

Concealment / Scrapper

Medicine / Sawbones

Fury / Concentration

Carnage / Combat

 

 

As you can see posted in general section in 5.4 thread, they are nerfing these disciplines.

 

Not a single mention about touching mercs who will be running around with god like DCDs and now they are planning to nerf melee classes like marauder.

 

Good job...

 

This is what happens when developers aren't playing their own game. They got no clue.

Link: http://www.swtor.com/community/showthread.php?t=928103

 

They are not yet saying what they will do to these classes, so take a breath and wait for the update. And I am not surprised the mercs goes free for 5.4. They clearly want to balance DPS prior to any changes to utilities.

 

My wild speculations:

Lethality and Carnage might see a small dps loss - perhaps also Combat. Any nerfs to Concealment would surprise me a bit, as the current DPS must be close to their general goals or even performing a bit below it. And Medicine might even get slightly buffed.

I noticed Lightning Sorcs have been ignored before even after they alluded 6 weeks ago that they would be in this round of changes.

 

Glad I've unsubbed and won't be here for this next patch.

Link: http://www.swtor.com/community/showthread.php?t=928103

 

They are not yet saying what they will do to these classes, so take a breath and wait for the update. And I am not surprised the mercs goes free for 5.4. They clearly want to balance DPS prior to any changes to utilities.

 

My wild speculations:

Lethality and Carnage might see a small dps loss - perhaps also Combat. Any nerfs to Concealment would surprise me a bit, as the current DPS must be close to their general goals or even performing a bit below it. And Medicine might even get slightly buffed.

 

no mate, they are hammering them... what do you think they gonna do ? They nerfed merc DPS and now they will nerf the other classes that top the DPS charts, marauder being oneof them.

 

Now imagine how useless a mara will be against a merc which still gets a free ticket in 5.4. They will walk over melee in 5.4 with their god like defenses.

 

Marauder was one the best merc killers in the game and now it comes to an end.

 

THis game must have a lot of angry merc subs because I don't really get why the hesitate so much to do what must be done.

 

NERF those damn merc DCDS and give JUGG AND PT"S some love ! Is it really that HARD TO UNDERSTAND ?

 

They ruined the PVP experience for dozens of players this year and they still contiune to follow the same road. :mad:

no mate, they are hammering them... what do you think they gonna do ? They nerfed merc DPS and now they will nerf the other classes that top the DPS charts, marauder being oneof them.

 

Now imagine how useless a mara will be against a merc which still gets a free ticket in 5.4. They will walk over melee in 5.4 with their god like defenses.

 

Marauder was one the best merc killers in the game and now it comes to an end.

 

THis game must have a lot of angry merc subs because I don't really get why the hesitate so much to do what must be done.

 

NERF those damn merc DCDS and give JUGG AND PT"S some love ! Is it really that HARD TO UNDERSTAND ?

 

They ruined the PVP experience for dozens of players this year and they still contiune to follow the same road. :mad:

 

There gonna rip every spec apart whether the were overperforming or not.

 

Pretty sure this is going to be it for me. Carnage should not be in the melee burst cateogory, Fury should, Carnage is the quasi-burst because its burst is conditional and variable, while Furys is front loaded and reliable.

They did the same thing with Snipers, putting a spec in a cateogory it doesn't belong.

 

If Fury gets buffed and Carnage gets nerfed, Carnage will be completely obsolete because Fury is easier, more reliable, and it has better burst, it would completely eclipse carnage. They're be no point to it.

 

If that happens, that's it for me. I don't mind adjustment, but not when it's being adjusted for being in a category it doesn't belong.

 

The most balance class in the game, on target DPS, and it and other specs are still getting nailed.

 

It's going to happen to all of us, some will just have to wait a little longer before they get their specs ripped a part.

 

What I find funny here is that Deception isn't getting adjusted, in fact it got buffed and Carnage and Deception are on par with each other.

 

I guess pure DPS class doesn't matter. That third DPS spec just gets in the way because one of them is going to overlap.

 

Fury deserves a boost, but it shouldn't do more damage than Carnage, carnage is mush more challaning and conditional. Fury is the pure burst spec, anyone with a clue about the specs knows that.

 

Doesn't matter, every specs gonna get it anyways.

 

Melee can leave the game too =]

I noticed Lightning Sorcs have been ignored before even after they alluded 6 weeks ago that they would be in this round of changes.

 

Glad I've unsubbed and won't be here for this next patch.

 

They are not going to touch Sorc's defenses until they do it for others too. I think it has been clear for a long time.

 

And why would they buff Lightning DPS? It now outperforms Arsenal by numbers and is close to Marksman but with higher cleave potential. As those 3 are supposed to be close together, I don't inderstand why Lightning needs buffs.

 

Fix the bug, that's all it needs in DPS section.

Edited July 22, 2017 by Equeliber

no mate, they are hammering them... what do you think they gonna do ? They nerfed merc DPS and now they will nerf the other classes that top the DPS charts, marauder being oneof them.

 

Now imagine how useless a mara will be against a merc which still gets a free ticket in 5.4. They will walk over melee in 5.4 with their god like defenses.

 

Marauder was one the best merc killers in the game and now it comes to an end.

 

THis game must have a lot of angry merc subs because I don't really get why the hesitate so much to do what must be done.

 

NERF those damn merc DCDS and give JUGG AND PT"S some love ! Is it really that HARD TO UNDERSTAND ?

 

They ruined the PVP experience for dozens of players this year and they still contiune to follow the same road. :mad:

 

Fury is almost 100% will be BUFFED DPS-wise. We can only speculate what happens to others. Stop panicking too early and wait for class change details.

All those are getting nerfed except fury. Because "dps targets" you know? Fury and Carnage will basically trade places.

I don't understand why the title is "nerf"...

 

...

 

They say as well what the criteria are:

" We feel both Melee and Sustained damage types are inherently disadvantaged, and that is why Melee Sustained damage dealers (with their two inherent disadvantages) make up the top grouping"

 

Lethality is both.

 

According to that table Lethality is at the top group.

According to what they actually did, AT the target 0 dps group, 2 specs were nerfed and 1 was buffed.

What is expected then for Lethality which is already at the +5 group, according to you? Nerf dps because Lethality is (supposedly) now already over the target +5 of their proposed balance?

 

Certainly not a nerf.

Edited July 22, 2017 by Aetideus

Why panic over a discussion of a tweek update until the actual update is out?

 

DOOMSDAY IS COMING!

 

..

 

😅😅😅

All those are getting nerfed except fury. Because "dps targets" you know? Fury and Carnage will basically trade places.

 

That's just it, there is difference between getting nerfed and left untouched.

 

A spec that is "on target DPS" shouldn't be getting nerfed.

 

Fury shouldn't have better DPS than Carnage because Fury really is the burst spec and Carnage is the quasi burst spec. Fury's burst is front loaded and non conditional, Carnage has set up for it's burst, isn't frontloaded and is subject to having it's burst damage reduced greatly by interuptions to it's 3 second window.

 

Fury's burst is the same no matter when it's used, has no condittions, no set up and is reliable burst, which is why it's burst has been lower because you can't stop it's burst and interuptions have no effect on the burst damage of an attack.

 

You can shut down Carnage's burst, you can't do that to Fury. Carnage is definately not the burst spec of the three, it's the quasi burst spec, it always was. Even Fury users agree with that. So carnage is being nerfed as a burst spec even though it's not the burst spec and Fury is.

 

You give Fury higher DPS than Carnage, Carnage becomes obsolete because Fury's Burst is reliable, can't be shut down like carnage's can, it has no conditions as it's frontloaded, and it is a much easier spec to play as it's 'rotation' is far more forgiving that Carnages and doesn't suffer from very tight resource management like Carnage.

 

So in effect, Fury would have better burst damage, more reliable damage, can't be shut down, has no variables in it's effective burst damage [if you use a burst attack with carnage outside of the window the damage it does is significantly less] has no time necessities [Carnage's burst window is 3 seconds] and also has greater uptime than Carnage because it's anti-CC effects make them be efffected less by CC than Carnage, and it's also more mobile.

 

Easier, better, more reliable.

 

Carnage than becomes obsolete because Fury is better in every way than for Burst.

 

You can say well is that how Fury is now, worse than carnage, etc?

 

No, it's not because while the damage may be a bit lower, it's still much more reliable burst damage and can't have it's burst shut down. Carnage is more prone to DPS loss because of it's tight constraints and set up than Fury, so Carnage's burst damage might be able to be higher than Fury under ideal circumstances, the slightest interruption, even a quarter of a second difference, and it's burst can be rendered lower than Fury so there is a give and take to it. Carnage will have it;s windows interrupted at times, there is no way around that, with all the CC that gets thrown around in PVP and the mechanics in PVE it's unavoidable at times and at those times it can be a substantial DPS loss. A delay in Fury's burst will not effect it's burst damage at all.

 

Add to that that Carnage has a very high skill set for optimal performance, whereas Fury is very easy. All these things together would make Carnage totally eclipsed and obsolete if it goes that way.

 

Fury should get a buff, but it's DPS should not be higher than Carnage because Fury is the burst spec in everything but name.

I'm just glad Bioware are taking class balance seriously again. It was so screwed up over the last 3-4 years it will take a long time to untangle. So many classes have reflect and self heals I don't understand the crying about mercs only. But I guess this is what happens when people who play 1 class take over the forums. They don't understand the dcds of others and probably don't appreciate their own. The forums say it is mercs that are OP so let's rage till they are easy kills again like the last 4 years. Then we can jump on a bandwagon and cry PT's have to many dcds.

 

Good job bioware get it right this time examine everything fairly including merc dcds, set out the purpose of each class and give them the tools to fill it. Just don't take to long to do it. Also sort out this RNG rubbish. People would complain less if they could find the class they liked to play and gear it quickly, no one wants to not be able to play the game because they have to grind first. We have reached the end game 5 times now and the grind is over. Let's have some fun.

Class balance – The following Disciplines are receiving changes (details will follow in the next few weeks):

 

Lethality / Ruffian

Concealment / Scrapper

Medicine / Sawbones

Fury / Concentration

Carnage / Combat

 

 

As you can see posted in general section in 5.4 thread, they are nerfing these disciplines.

 

Not a single mention about touching mercs who will be running around with god like DCDs and now they are planning to nerf melee classes like marauder.

 

Good job...

 

This is what happens when developers aren't playing their own game. They got no clue.

 

I see no reasons for nerfing concealment.. i find this class lack of dps, i never saw concealment being r1-3 dps on warzones, their volatile substance crits hardly 20 k lol (if lucky).

I see no reasons for nerfing concealment.. i find this class lack of dps, i never saw concealment being r1-3 dps on warzones, their volatile substance crits hardly 20 k lol (if lucky).

 

'Reason' has nothing to do with it. Unfortunately.

 

I have very little faith in the combat team. There apparently about ripping everything apart whether there is reason too or not and remaking things in the image they want, even if the players themselves are going to be disappointed.

 

Everyone is going to get nailed.

 

We didn't think it could get worse than 5.2. We were wrong.

maraudeur is clearly op and needs a big nerf.

 

so if they buff fury, it will be a big fat joke. they already have two 25k easy burst hit combined with a hilarious amount of seconds of total immunity.

Edited July 22, 2017 by Thaladan

maraudeur is clearly op and needs a big nerf.

 

so if they buff fury, it will be a big fat joke. they already have two 25k easy burst hit combined with a hilarious amount of seconds of total immunity.

 

Merc or Sniper?

 

Please. Some people actually know the state of things in this game.

 

What you're calling OP is the same thing everyone was calling the most balanced class in the game thruout all of 5.x.

 

It totally pays to know what you are talking about before you actually start talking.

Edited July 22, 2017 by WayOfTheWarriorx

i will not waste my time to explain or read your wall of words dude, you already spam the forum everywhere telling all your "wisdom" on all specs.

 

maraudeur is the melee class which needs a nerf do his damage. (deception in second)

Edited July 22, 2017 by Thaladan

i will not waste my time to explain or read your wall of words dude, you already spam the forum everywhere telling all your wisdom on all specs. and it's really often laughable.

 

I don't always agree with mister warrior, but in this instance he is spot on. Marauders are finally in a decent spot and with the dev teams general tendency to over-nerfs I kinda fear for the class.

When they start working defensives and utilities, that's when it's going to get really interesting. These 3-5% dps nerfs, aren't going to change the playing field of WZs and are really nothing to get bent out of shape over unless you're pushing DPS checks in PVE.

they are too bursty in comparaison to others and the legendary 75% resist on obfuscate really needs to be shut down.

 

this utility is by far too strong (and vicious throw facility...)

 

with this, fury is overtuned (2nd leap imune cc in addition) and a thrid busrt with vicious throw.

 

clearly no for a buff to fury -_-'

They are not going to touch Sorc's defenses until they do it for others too. I think it has been clear for a long time.

 

And why would they buff Lightning DPS? It now outperforms Arsenal by numbers and is close to Marksman but with higher cleave potential. As those 3 are supposed to be close together, I don't inderstand why Lightning needs buffs.

 

Fix the bug, that's all it needs in DPS section.

 

If you don't know then do a search of the forums... I'm tired of having to defend the class because people are ignorant and don't understand the class or their own.

If you don't know then do a search of the forums... I'm tired of having to defend the class because people are ignorant and don't understand the class or their own.

 

Stop rephrasing others' words. I never said I don't know sorc. I can play Lightning perfectly, it's an easy rotation. I read most of the whiny posts here as well.

 

As I said, if you compare it to the current state of other 2 ranged Burst DPS it's in a solid spot. COMPARED TO THEM. I am not saying their overall state is fair or anything. I am just saying that if you buff Lightning's DPS, you buff marksman and reverse Arsenals' nerfs. You can't buff just sorcs, it won't be BALANCE. it is just following your wishes.

 

In general, there is no reason for buffing Lightning. Lightning's position is right where they want it together with all ranged burst. If you don't like it, I am sorry but that's their chosen system.

 

Madness should be buffed even more, yes. It is not strong enough compared to other ranged sustained. Each class is supposed to choose a discipline according to the fight. Burst is better - play Lightning. Burst is not needed - play Madness. Madness currently is still not good enough to be taken over Lightning where it is supposed to. I totally agree that THAT spec needs more DPS buffs.

 

Not Lightning.

Stop rephrasing others' words. I never said I don't know sorc. I can play Lightning perfectly, it's an easy rotation. I read most of the whiny posts here as well.

 

As I said, if you compare it to the current state of other 2 ranged Burst DPS it's in a solid spot. COMPARED TO THEM. I am not saying their overall state is fair or anything. I am just saying that if you buff Lightning's DPS, you buff marksman and reverse Arsenals' nerfs. You can't buff just sorcs, it won't be BALANCE. it is just following your wishes.

 

In general, there is no reason for buffing Lightning. Lightning's position is right where they want it together with all ranged burst. If you don't like it, I am sorry but that's their chosen system.

 

Madness should be buffed even more, yes. It is not strong enough compared to other ranged sustained. Each class is supposed to choose a discipline according to the fight. Burst is better - play Lightning. Burst is not needed - play Madness. Madness currently is still not good enough to be taken over Lightning where it is supposed to. I totally agree that THAT spec needs more DPS buffs.

 

Not Lightning.

 

Technically you might not be wrong, but unless they seriously nerf utilities / defenses of most other classes, and also buff sorcerers, they will become the class no one plays. More so than they already are.

They are not going to touch Sorc's defenses until they do it for others too. I think it has been clear for a long time.

 

And why would they buff Lightning DPS? It now outperforms Arsenal by numbers and is close to Marksman but with higher cleave potential. As those 3 are supposed to be close together, I don't inderstand why Lightning needs buffs.

 

Fix the bug, that's all it needs in DPS section.

 

You clearly never play lightning sorc in PvP. This "target dps" you mention is the same garbage BW keeps repeating. Did you factor in suvivability, mobility or the ability to sustain dps while being focused? If you do not understand why MM sniper is top tier and lightning is garbage, my advice is stick to PvE forms.

 

Fury is almost 100% will be BUFFED DPS-wise. We can only speculate what happens to others. Stop panicking too early and wait for class change details.

 

As balance currently stand classes that require adjustment in terms of priority:

 

Sorc

PT

Merc

Sniper

Jug

Ops

Mara

Sin

 

BW clearly are ignoring classes with most issues and targeting classes that are working well. No good can come out of this. If you think that nerfing carnage by lets say 5% overall damage will make sorc dps viable you are gravely mistaken.

Merc or Sniper?

 

Please. Some people actually know the state of things in this game.

 

What you're calling OP is the same thing everyone was calling the most balanced class in the game thruout all of 5.x.

 

It totally pays to know what you are talking about before you actually start talking.

 

It's point less arguing with them. It's the same person whose been trolling the Sorc threads telling us how OP Lightning is in pvp.