I've quietly been reading but tbh I'm getting tired of the forums lately. It's the same old argument no matter what thread you open and if the subject isn't already at the standard chewed out drivel, someone will ensure it reaches that subject.

 

"Game's dead!"

-"No it's not!"

"Check out these fleet numbers!"

-"But not everyone plays on the fleet!"

"It takes me 30 minutes to get a queue!"

- "Not everyone uses the queue system!"

"No the game is dead!"

- "No it's not!"

"My opinion is all that matters"

- "No there's other players too"

"They're wrong if they don't see it my way!"

- "No they just have a different opinion"

"Yes and I understand how that means they're wrong and I'm right!"

- "I enjoy playing by myself."

"You're subbed to an MMO, how dare you enjoy solo gameplay!!!!"

- "Because I like Star Wars and other aspects of the game?"

"That's not good enough you're wrong! Let me dictate to you what should matter to you!"

- "Uhm, no thanks, I'm happy with how I do things now?"

"You're lying and selfish! I'm right you're wrong!"

 

.. you get the gist. It's getting tiresome, dull and tbh it's sucking the enjoyment out of having social and interesting debates here on the forum. These aren't debates and healthy discussions anymore, it's a repetitive tug of war with some mud slinging here and there and absolutely nothing good comes out of it.

Yup. I reached the saturation point. Just going to sit back and watch the state of the game, but I'm willing to bet that despite the best efforts of some to convince otherwise the game lives on and many people enjoy it.

Yup. I reached the saturation point. Just going to sit back and watch the state of the game, but I'm willing to bet that despite the best efforts of some to convince otherwise the game lives on and many people enjoy it.

You see the problem is that you think I and others who share my opinion WANT it to die. You are missing the parts where I state that I LOVE THIS GAME. Where I say that I feel it has SO much potential and all I want is to see it reach that potential, in EVERY way.

You are reading your own bias into my statements, your own desire to silence those who dare to speak their mind and say what needs to be said. People like you are the ones that will kill the game, folks who feel that their opinion is the only one that matters.

And before you try to claim that is what I am doing re-read what I have written. I agree with with much of what others have said, the game IS NOT dying, the game WILL continue on. SWTOR is transitioning to a more solo and casual based game and there are those who enjoy that. For me and those that share my opinion we would like for this MMO to continue to be an MMO, not a solo, story based RPG.

You can't have a discussion if you refuse to read what has been written.

You see the problem is that you think I and others who share my opinion WANT it to die. You are missing the parts where I state that I LOVE THIS GAME. Where I say that I feel it has SO much potential and all I want is to see it reach that potential, in EVERY way.

You are reading your own bias into my statements, your own desire to silence those who dare to speak their mind and say what needs to be said. People like you are the ones that will kill the game, folks who feel that their opinion is the only one that matters.

 

And before you try to claim that is what I am doing re-read what I have written. I agree with with much of what others have said, the game IS NOT dying, the game WILL continue on. SWTOR is transitioning to a more solo and casual based game and there are those who enjoy that. For me and those that share my opinion we would like for this MMO to continue to be an MMO, not a solo, story based RPG.

 

You can't have a discussion if you refuse to read what has been written.

No, I don't, Rivan. I didn't take you for one of those who would gleefully blort "I told you so".

Where we do disagree is coming into an MMO written by a studio who is known for their story based games and expecting what, for lack of better terms, I'll call a "standard MMO". It wasn't going to be that way, never meant to be that way. Yes, it's an MMO but it's a different one.

I have absolutely NO problem with it being a story-based MMO. In fact, I quite like that aspect. Makes a change from all the other "standard" MMOs. It's BW.

Not sure why you took my "I'm really getting bored with the same people trying to fob off the same BS" as aimed at you. It was not. It was aimed at those who make sweeping statements, expect everyone to believe their opinion is fact and get right shirty if people don't.

OP, did you miss the memo? The game is now called "Star Wars: The Dressing Game"

No worries though, "Star Wars: The Sims Edition" is coming next year!

What everyone seems to forget is there are lots of ways to play this game. If any one of those gets neglected, the game loses players. I can tell you that my guild has lost 13 8 man raid teams. That's 104 players who aren't logging in, aren't subbing and are sending their money to some other game company. (Most went to WoW, but not all.) My guild isn't the only one with the problem. Also, keep in mind that the lack of endgame material is what almost killed this game just after launch. Just like now, people got there, said they didn't have anything to do and left, and most never came back.

So, is BW right to do more story, sure. But they also need to do more endgame content or they're going to keep losing a chunk of their player base and in the end, they need all of those players to stay viable. Losing any good sized group of players is bad for any game, this one included.

Many folks here on these forums, on Reddit and other fan sites agree, most raiding in SWTOR is compartmentalized within the raid guilds that currently exist these days and very few HM PUG's are successful and therefore the practice is being abandoned.

Overall yes, the raiding is dead now, but there are still good guilds around. We are doing NiMs everyweek with various people and mostly oneshoting bosses (only end bosses poze a challenge sometimes). I dont get what you mean by "teaching new people" who would be interested in that? The only thing you do is just gather the people that are good, thats all. The game is not hard at all, it just requires a bit of awarness and common sense.

Like you said, many people remain, you can see that on things like Parsely, who is posting their numbers. The thing is, people just love the game, same as me and will keep on playing it. There is still lots to do, but mainly, play with friends. If you play with friends it doesnt matter that there is no new ops, you can pvp, lowbie pvp, troll, level new toons (even if u have a zillion already), heroics, achievements etc. Just for the fun!

There are still key people around that play the game cause they like it, as you mentioned your leaveing the game, well sorry to see ya leave and good luck. As for the preassure you make on Bioware, I spend over 1500,- euros a year on the game, so if people like me were to leave, its another story, but if people leave that just pay sub, its no issue.

Overall I am fine with what the game has to offer. We have a great guild that does everything and succesfuly, also I have great friends in the game that are fun to play with. As long as that always works, im fine with the game.

StarParse is a violation of the EULA/TOS. And I don't need it. I can play games without some not allowed Software telling me what to do. Might surprise you, but some players actually do have skill.

some might do but apperently not you as u said above u got rejected by 5 guilds and even kicked from story modes.

Overall yes, the raiding is dead now, but there are still good guilds around. We are doing NiMs everyweek with various people and mostly oneshoting bosses (only end bosses poze a challenge sometimes). I dont get what you mean by "teaching new people" who would be interested in that? The only thing you do is just gather the people that are good, thats all. The game is not hard at all, it just requires a bit of awarness and common sense.

 

Like you said, many people remain, you can see that on things like Parsely, who is posting their numbers. The thing is, people just love the game, same as me and will keep on playing it. There is still lots to do, but mainly, play with friends. If you play with friends it doesnt matter that there is no new ops, you can pvp, lowbie pvp, troll, level new toons (even if u have a zillion already), heroics, achievements etc. Just for the fun!

 

There are still key people around that play the game cause they like it, as you mentioned your leaveing the game, well sorry to see ya leave and good luck. As for the preassure you make on Bioware, I spend over 1500,- euros a year on the game, so if people like me were to leave, its another story, but if people leave that just pay sub, its no issue.

 

Overall I am fine with what the game has to offer. We have a great guild that does everything and succesfuly, also I have great friends in the game that are fun to play with. As long as that always works, im fine with the game.

Mero you are way too optimistic

And I am quoting Customer Support. There ends the discussion for me. So yes, this is a hard fact.

Care to post a link to CS stating StarParse is violating the TOS? Otherwise your "quote" and "hard fact" are nothing but personal opinions.

And I am quoting Customer Support. There ends the discussion for me. So yes, this is a hard fact.

Can you please share the details, even via PM? That conclusion is definitely not true, so if there is a CS statement indicating otherwise, I would like to clear things up.

Thank you.

StarParse is a violation of the EULA/TOS. And I don't need it. I can play games without some not allowed Software telling me what to do. Might surprise you, but some players actually do have skill.

Oh look u even attracted the author of starparse to this thread to call u out on your BS.

Yo ixale o/

Where we do disagree is coming into an MMO written by a studio who is known for their story based games and expecting what, for lack of better terms, I'll call a "standard MMO". It wasn't going to be that way, never meant to be that way. Yes, it's an MMO but it's a different one.

 

Only that it was a "standard MMO" when it launched and in all likeliness would still be now if the initial dev team hadn't managed to tank it that bad.

Then came the budget cuts and F2P which led them to sell us what would in other MMOs only pass as a questpack as an expansion and now they're turning a MMO into a SP game and people happily lap up the 30mins worth of content for 15$/month they're throwing at our feet. I bet the people who are content with this are the same who buy horse armor DLC and similar ripoffs.

OP, there will be no raids in foreseeable future , if at all. My advice , if you want new raids to be made , buy operation passes , unlocks and go ftp. Only way SWTOR team will change their new approach to the game is if it will be less profitable then the previous one. Sub for month a year to get access to all chapters , 15$ for entire season of KOTFE is fair.

Basically any raider that still pays the subscription now actually makes sure that SWTOR team will not allocate more resources to new group content , as weird as it sounds.

And yes i am practicing what i preach,in 2 weeks my subscription runs out.

I'm trying to figure out where in the OP he attempts to express the opinion of anyone other than himself or people he knows.

It does not matter, trolling does not need to be coherent or make any sense, just pick a couple words remove all possible context and you're game brah.

And I am quoting Customer Support. There ends the discussion for me. So yes, this is a hard fact.

Cool story bro. While you are at making fiction, you might want to include dragons next time to make it more exciting ;-)

imo a indicator of a healthy and growing game is to have proper end game group content for larger groups of people, ie. raids, I doubt anyone is asking for like four per year, but one would be nice.

StarParse is a violation of the EULA/TOS. And I don't need it. I can play games without some not allowed Software telling me what to do. Might surprise you, but some players actually do have skill.

 

Hey, I will quote myself from a recent reply to your similar assesment posted in another thread regarding StarParse and its compliance with TOS:

 

Hey there, just to clarify: StarParse is definitely NOT in any TOS violation as it does not interact with the game and does process only data provided by the game for the sole purpose of parsing. I personaly checked its compliance with a Bioware rep, you can do it too if my humble word is not enough :-)

(see my full reply here: http://www.swtor.com/community/showpost.php?p=8917457&postcount=193)

 

I respect your decision about (not) using 3rd party tools to craft your own gtaming experience, however, please refrain from presenting your personal statements about its legal (non)compliance as hard facts (as it is objectively not true).

 

Anyways, enjoy your own SWTOR (parsing or not parsing, whatever you fancy :-)

Kortio got rekt by Ixale xD

I love your posts they always get right to the crux of the matter.

 

I believe swtor - whether intentionally or not - used to be a uniquely fulfilling raiding experience.

 

Team size, SM/HM/NM, no attunement, interesting mechanics....

 

You could have one or two nights a week where you spent 2 hours with a few friends and actually make some progress. It was nothing like my older days of WoW and nothing like W*. You could raid casually at any difficulty level. Yes, including NM.

 

It was perfect. And more or less, spotty QA aside, I loved the encounters. I tried going back to WoW. Hated it. I began downloading FF. Stopped because I realize I love this game too much to switch while there is still some life left in it.

 

But nearly everyone in this part of the community is gone. I've recently begun running a team of 9 players with a rotation since it's literally impossible to find people to sub in for NM when someone needs a night off.

 

I guess my frustration comes from reading post after post of people describing the raiding community as toxic/elitist/exclusionary.... when my personal experience is that the best part of my online gaming life which began back with Q2 and EQ1 has been endgame here. The community here was fantastic. The forums are far more toxic.

 

And, IMO what little of the community that is left is just as helpful/enabling/generous with their time as ever.

 

I just see it as strange, knowing this community, why everyone is in such a rush to see the rest of us go.

You and I quite often see eye to eye. Thank you for continuing in that vein with this post as well. I was there and loved every minute of it, too. It was a fantastic time and the best raiding in any MMO that I've played (and I've played a LOT of them!). Unfortunately, if people weren't in that community or in the game at that point in time, they don't understand what we are pining for... and don't know what they are missing. It's another part of the vicious circle... don't make new operations so people don't know they'd love operations if only Bioware would do a new one once in awhile. Self-fulfilling prophecy style "metrics".

What server are you on, by chance?

Sorry for snipping your post, I didn't want to take up more room on the page than I already am. ...return snip!

I should probably do people's page loading times the courtesy of snipping more often myself, so no harm done.

I always hate to see people that loved the part of the game that I loved leave, as it's just another nail in the coffin. Best wishes to you in whatever comes next!

No, I don't, Rivan. I didn't take you for one of those who would gleefully blort "I told you so".

 

Where we do disagree is coming into an MMO written by a studio who is known for their story based games and expecting what, for lack of better terms, I'll call a "standard MMO". It wasn't going to be that way, never meant to be that way. Yes, it's an MMO but it's a different one.

 

I have absolutely NO problem with it being a story-based MMO. In fact, I quite like that aspect. Makes a change from all the other "standard" MMOs. It's BW.

 

Not sure why you took my "I'm really getting bored with the same people trying to fob off the same BS" as aimed at you. It was not. It was aimed at those who make sweeping statements, expect everyone to believe their opinion is fact and get right shirty if people don't.

But it WAS going to be that way. It was absolutely that way, in fact... for the first 3 years of its life. You all act like we want something we can't have... but we've had it! We had it for the first more than half of the game's life. All we're asking is to have that BACK.

And one of the reasons we loved it is so precisely because it was more story focused. We get that people love story! Guess what? We loved it too! It was the thing that immersed us and tied us into the other parts of the game. I paraphrase what KBN famously said here, but story is FLAVOR. It gives flavor to the content. If it is enough for you, then you should be playing single player games that give you much better story for much, much, much cheaper! We want what we used to have in SWTOR... and that includes GROUP content. With both of those things? SWTOR is the end-all, be-all. If only...

What server are you on, by chance?

Mainly Shadowlands, although I'm on a Fri/Sat team on Harbinger.