Yep, just created a thread on this issue just a few minutes ago. at 50 its like hitting a wall with the expertise thing. My fresh 50 which did awesome 1-49 was hitting people for like 400-1K while I was getting whacked for 3-4K.

 

The whole entire expertise thing just blows. didnt they learn anything from WoW or rift which made the same mistake?

Actually Bioware is owned by EA, who is a publicly traded company.

Getting people to spend $15/month going after pve gear on timers and then spending another $15/month going after pvp gear on timed bags is great business.

As a public company their responsibility is solely to the stockholders, not to the customers. The customers are simply the means to make the profit.

They will design the best carrot on a stick they can possibly make. That is why we got WoW in space rather than a unique MMO like SWG (like it or not SWG was unique before the profit mongers took over).

Either you haven't played alot of 10-49, or you're bad.

 

14-30 (kinda need sprint) you can kill anyone that plays worse than you, even if they are 49.

 

Hit 50 and a paraplegic guy can kill ya with the auto-attacks his hand spasms trigger. Until you suffer through long enough to get enough gear to not insta-die, so you can continue to play at a sizable disadvantage until you're on par. It's not fun, sorry.

Who's bad? A new 50 is MUCH more of a competitor then a 14-20 vs. a 40-49.

If you can't compete at all at 50, it's you. I guess it is a wake up call when you are crushing lvl 10's one day with your PvP geared 49 and then the next day your the one getting owned.

Who's bad? A new 50 is MUCH more of a competitor then a 14-20 vs. a 40-49.

 

If you can't compete at all at 50, it's you. I guess it is a wake up call when you are crushing lvl 10's one day with your PvP geared 49 and then the next day your the one getting owned.

Try it yourself, duel your guildmate in his BM with a fresh 50 and have him just hit autoattack. You'll lose, sad but true, and utterly broken.

As one of my guildies put it...

With my new level 50 toon, it feels like being a lvl 10 in the Warzone all over again.

It seems hopeless at first but honestly it only lasts a week. In that time you can earn 20 bags from the daily's and weekly's plus the bags you can buy from the warzone commendations. I upgraded every slot except weapon to centurion and some champion gear in less then a week. You just got to suck it up, the results are well worth it.

 

Honestly anyone who isn't willing to do it isn't a serious PVPer IMO. Bottom line is you gotta gear up in any MMO's PVP. I wouldn't be opposed to a newbi 50 bracket though for the casuals. The geared players don't really want you on their team anyway because you will be ineffective.

^^^exactly. It's been a week since I hit 50 and have over 400 exp now. Sucks at first but it gets better each day.

I don't get the qqing, if it wasn't pvp gear it would be epic pve gear, unless we all wear no gear, or all have identical gear, someone will always have better gear than you, just do your best and have fun.

Wouldn't call it a mistake, I don't think i would be to happy if i spent all my time getting to BM then some average joe hits 50 and comes in doing the very same dmg i do. I actually like expertise.

So you like gear advantages rather than skill advantages.

Gotcha.

problem is people like me who hit 50 3-4 weeks ago are in a huge disadvantage than people who hit 50 rly quickly. they used illum 1.0 and illum 2.0 day 1 to get battlemaster in a week,while i have been pvping for 3 weeks non stop winning 70% of my games and doing illum runs in operation of daily (so i get valor no armament ****) every day and i am still not a battlemaster.

there is a really easy fix for that, just let us stuck battlemaster bags (or champion bags in the 1-50 bracket) so people who exploited/were lucky dont have such a huge advantage over us.

i still do not understand what the harm is in storing champion bags while you are leveling or BM bags when you arent 60 rank if you cannot open them anyway.

can someone explain to me why this is not allowed? if it was the case in a week that i will be hitting valor 60 i would have 60 bags to open and so be competitive again full BMpeople (not that i am not now but still every bit helps). my champions bags so far have only given me 5 champion pieces(out of ~110 bags) anyway so not that i lost anything off it.

all this system does is allow players who kill-trade and exploited first versions of illum to stomp on undergeared people.

The gear progression is so fast anyone complaining about it is a total joke as to a valid reason 50 pvp is not as fun.

Valid reasons you may like 10-49 PvP better:

a) Its something new from your main, which you may have played to death

b) Sense of progression through lvling your char as you PvP.

c) Fighting against the odds(lacking skills)

Reason that are not valid, but likely play large role in why people like it:

a) Being PvP geared(or twinked) gives you a much greater gear advantage, than BM over 50/50 Champ/Cent people.

b) Much higher% of players that have no clue what they are doing(free kills).

c) A GREAT advantage from having skills that your opponents do not due to lvl difference, as well as talents half the people your playing have no acces to.

Essentailly, the difference in 10-49 PvP that are out of player control are MUCH GREATER than when you're 50. SO to get to 50 and blame the gear as the problem of unfair play being the issue is UTTER BULL@#$%!

It's much more likely you simple don't like not having inherent advantages over the people you are playing against. Something the 10-49 bracket provides a LOT MORE of.

So you like gear advantages rather than skill advantages.

 

Gotcha.

Eventually the gear gap will close. Just keep chipping away, then you will have equal footing, and skill will become the deciding factor. Even if there was no "pvp gear", there would still be gear that would be superior and we would be forced to get it to be competitive, it always happens. Everyone wants the best gear for the edge, no matter what said gear is called. I mean you do get the best gear possible for your level for pve, right? Why would it be any different for pvp?

Eventually the gear gap will close. Just keep chipping away, then you will have equal footing, and skill will become the deciding factor. Even if there was no "pvp gear", there would still be gear that would be superior and we would be forced to get it to be competitive, it always happens. Everyone wants the best gear for the edge, no matter what said gear is called. I mean you do get the best gear possible for your level for pve, right? Why would it be any different for pvp?

A fresh 50 who's made an effort to pick up 48-50 gear versus a player in full champion gear is not a significant gear difference. The main significance is the level of experience they have in Warzones.

In short, I agree - sub-50 PvP is simply more fun for me.

I enjoy 50s pvp much more.

But then I understand the gearing system and had 15k health at 49. I'm sure all the people I see rolling into 50s warzones for the first time with 11-12k hate it.

Who's bad? A new 50 is MUCH more of a competitor then a 14-20 vs. a 40-49.

 

If you can't compete at all at 50, it's you. I guess it is a wake up call when you are crushing lvl 10's one day with your PvP geared 49 and then the next day your the one getting owned.

This completely shows your lack of understanding on how this game functions in terms of PvP. You obviously are missing a few key points...

In the 10-49 bracket all players are bolstered, everyone's stats and skill damages are increase to what they would be at level 49. Gear stats are also increased to that of level 49 gear, basically everyone is put on an even playing field. That is why in a WZ a level 20 can kill a level 35 or higher. The only difference is the actual skills available at hand, based off level. In addition to this the Expertise stat is nearly non-existing in this bracket, with the exception of a few rare items that have a very small amount.

Now when that level 49 player ticks 50 he is still on par base stat wise as the others, the exception being the massive amounts of stats that BM gear gives. Mainly the Expertise stat, which makes a huge difference. For the most part every player is kept on the same playing level throughout PvP, with that exception of BM gear and the high amount of Expertise it gives.

This can't be compensated for with player skill, it is hard raw math. Your skills do a fixed amount of damage, you being better at PvP can't change that. In the 1-49 a level 36 Ops' Hidden Strike does the same base damage as a level 49 Ops. Now in 50 the Expertise really comes into play. You hit BM for X amount of damage, that is then reduced because of Expertise. He in return hits you for X amount of damage, that is then increased because of Expertise.

These two functions are completely outside of player control and outside the scope of ability. When you have a flat reduction and amplification taking place, and for only one of the two involved, someone is left in the cold. The total damage scale is completely changed in favor of the BM when fighting someone without it. Again, skill can't change that scale.

There is something inherently wrong with the system if pvpers enjoy lvl 1-49 moreso then 50.

Yeah I bet you miss harvesting my lvl 15 character for assassin medals.

Wouldn't call it a mistake, I don't think i would be to happy if i spent all my time getting to BM then some average joe hits 50 and comes in doing the very same dmg i do. I actually like expertise.

OF COURSE YOU DO!

What ruins PVP fun is getting into a UNFAIR FIGHT where you lose as the gear not talent rules.

Gear is not good for the game in PVP as it provides a unfair advantage and the other problem is it creates a Over Powered Faction.

Here is a good question:

Why do you have to have a ADVANTAGE if you are talented?

Does this mean not only are you talented but you also require a added advantage?

I think it is very obvious that the points is the gear does more then your talent, FACT!

This can't be compensated for with player skill, it is hard raw math. Your skills do a fixed amount of damage, you being better at PvP can't change that. In the 1-49 a level 36 Ops' Hidden Strike does the same base damage as a level 49 Ops. Now in 50 the Expertise really comes into play. You hit BM for X amount of damage, that is then reduced because of Expertise. He in return hits you for X amount of damage, that is then increased because of Expertise.

 

Like I said, as a fresh 50, with all lv 48-50 armaments in my gear I was hitting people for 400-1K. while i was being hit for 3.5K-5K. There is no amount of skill that will overcome a 3:1 damage ratio.

I say in the 50s bracket, bolster everyone to lv 60 and get rid of expertise. Then you once again have an even playing field, and you can still reap the rewards of your PvP gear by sheer stat increases.

Like I said, as a fresh 50, with all lv 48-50 armaments in my gear I was hitting people for 400-1K. while i was being hit for 3.5K-5K. There is no amount of skill that will overcome a 3:1 damage ratio.

 

I say in the 50s bracket, bolster everyone to lv 60 and get rid of expertise. Then you once again have an even playing field, and you can still reap the rewards of your PvP gear by sheer stat increases.

What?

there is no level 60. 50 is as high as it goes. Sixty refers to valor level which is the mandate for getting the current max level of PVP gear.

So your suggetion is to make everyone a battlemaster and remove the expertise from PVP equipment.

My response to that idea is what would then be what would be the point of PVPing at all then?

You have to give players a reason to do anything. And since PVP gear has reduced endurance and primary stats from its PVE counterparts, you would then make PVP gear the absolute worse end level gear in the game.

No, there has to be a way to give PVP players an incentive to play. Otherwise what you end up with is a mess.

Make the PVP and PVE raid gear equal and you end up with raids with well geared PVP members who don't have a clue about the raid and can potentially lead to the whole OPS wiping. On the same hand, in PVP you would end up with PVE players with exceptional raid gear who don't even know how to pass a ball in Huttball.

Either way, you add to the frustration level of the serious PVP and PVE raid players. These are the very guys who devs depend on to find the bugs in end game content before the mass of casual players reach that point.

Without keeping them happy, games will be more exploited, more buggish, and more empty. Because one a player reaches their set goals in a game, they will simply unsub and move on to the next one.

I dont agree, pre 1.1 maybe.

 

Now with the comms.

 

There is no excuse to turn 50 without having 1 epic champ bag in storage and 10000/1000 wz and merc coms.

Thats 6 bags right there, then you do the daily and get the weekly done in one day, and thats 10 bags.

Thats 150 cent coms and 70 champ coms.

 

That will net you, in a day, from 9 won games, which also means you can afford another bag, 11 bags as a matter of fact, which translates to 165 cent coms and 77 champ coms.

 

You should have 50% pvp gear after 10 games of played more or less, and the moment you ding 50 you will have 2 or 3 parts cent and 1 champion pieace, or even 2.

 

To gear up today goes so fast its redicilous, but makes it more fun.

The champ takes longer and BM gear ofc, but atleast you get into cent gear incredibly fast with this system.

 

Rerolling cause you cant handle lvl 50 bracket is for people that dont want to pvp.

 

I also enjoy the low level bracket but full BM gear gives what, like 12% expertise or more.

You have 6% expertise the moment you ding 50 more or less, after you done the weekly and some more.

In 2 days you will be more or less full pvp geared if you hit the warzones without overdoing it.

 

What I do see though is a lot of people that rushed to 50 did a few warzones, join warzones in orange pve gear then complain.

Many dont even know what mods is, and that you can atleast mod your gear.

 

There is many in the 50 bracket without good gear now adays, and its a fun bracket.

 

My only grudge is that often as rep we face 4, even up to 6 sorcs in the imp teams.

There is a minimum of 3 sorcs per imperial team, I say average 4.

 

Its actually ALOT more fun to play hutball vs republic as the classes is just so much more mixed, not just sorcs but a mix of all classes.

Don't cry about sorcs until you take the time to think of what is like for imps to step into a WZ with 8 trooper/commandos that take the whole team to kill, in which time the ones that did manage to die fly in and cap the other objectives or score the ball. There's your Sorc balance right there, and i'm fine with it. You won't find threads from me calling anyone OP. Theres is sick power on both sides.

There is something inherently wrong with the system if pvpers enjoy lvl 1-49 moreso then 50.

Good lord ... I turned 50 on Saturday afternoon, by Sunday evening I had Cent/Champ in every slot ... and that was good enough to be competitive.

This was the fastest entry level pvp gear up I've had in any game.

Good lord ... I turned 50 on Saturday afternoon, by Sunday evening I had Cent/Champ in every slot ... and that was good enough to be competitive.

 

This was the fastest entry level pvp gear up I've had in any game.

^see its not that hard

This is your opinion.

Frankly I got bored of stomping noobs in sub-50. In 50, many players actually have a clue.

That being said, I'm also fine with the idea that gear shouldn't matter. Afterall, if a game isn't worth playing for the fun factor, it isn't worth grinding for gear.

I hear some people talking about how the 10-49 bracket is just as hard on low levels as the 50 bracket is on new 50s. I still have yet to feel like I got stomped by math with any 14-20 alt I start pvping with.

I understand the appeal of playing with more experienced players, but for me that is outweighed by the current lack of WZ ranking, longer queue times, and a need to put up with an 'inevitable loss while gearing up' period of time, (regardless of how short it may be).

I already had an alt hit 50 with 1000/1000 tokens + bag. Went straight to the dailys and got those mods, filling the remainder with 49 epic mods from the GTN. Yeah, I started back in the 50 bracket with a workable handicap, but why bother? What is the point of working with that handicap, again, to power up, again, to do the same WZ that I was already doing? (playing the same maps with a closer to level playing field)

It's easier and more fun to me to make another alt and just PvP without getting exploded and pondering what sort of gear discrepancy there was between me and my target. That just doesn't happen to me in the 10-49 bracket, and I'd be surprised if it didn't happen to most people in the 50 bracket.

Until 50 PvP offers something new and worth working towards, it's time better spent elswhere, IMO.