I would say push them to fix solo ranked up. At his point I think as a pvp community we can understand that there is not that many of us playing in a system designed for many many players. I think adjusting how much elo is lost and gained from loss's would help alot. There is an rng nature to ranked where alot of it is decided at the comp screen many times. After for quing for more then 3 min people are able to identify the weaker links and exploit that. This is not even the weaker players fault when in a real ranked system like in other games that player would be dropped a tier and not matched in my 1430+ elo game. Meanwhile I would not be thrown in a 1150 - 1250 elo game either. I think this is why people get very frustrated on both side. You have not as good players or hell even players new and learning being constantly matched into games so far out of their league it creates anger. Imagine playing league of legends and for an entire afternnoon your gold account is getting matched with diamonds and masters on a constant basis. You are not going to climb for along time. I think a system should be created to compensate for this rng nature and mix mash of skill nature to solos by making it less punishing for a loss. People get mad when they lose not just because they lost but how the system goes well out of there way to punish them for the lose. This doesn't make things more competitive but frustrating. Will bioware address this probably not maybe one day tholl.

You're describing a "problem" with no solution. Even if you made losses less punishing, people would still get mad when they lose. And even in games where all the players are close in skill, you still see flaming sometimes, because people get frustrated and look for someone to blame. Sometimes they're right, sometimes they're just venting. But that behavior will never change, no matter how matchmaking and elo works.

Bioware has made a ton of positive changes to ranked lately that they should really be getting more credit for. Adding win requirements, lessening the impact of placement games, banning wintraders and queue locking throwers. And coming up we have changes to guard, no more cross role backfills (or at least, very rare), a 306 gear requirement and no more vote kick abuse.

People are constantly clamoring for ranked to change...well it's happening before your eyes, but apparently some still can't appreciate it.

You're describing a "problem" with no solution. Even if you made losses less punishing, people would still get mad when they lose. And even in games where all the players are close in skill, you still see flaming sometimes, because people get frustrated and look for someone to blame. Sometimes they're right, sometimes they're just venting. But that behavior will never change, no matter how matchmaking and elo works.

 

Bioware has made a ton of positive changes to ranked lately that they should really be getting more credit for. Adding win requirements, lessening the impact of placement games, banning wintraders and queue locking throwers. And coming up we have changes to guard, no more cross role backfills (or at least, very rare), a 306 gear requirement and no more vote kick abuse.

 

People are constantly clamoring for ranked to change...well it's happening before your eyes, but apparently some still can't appreciate it.

In a competitive environment it is impossible to remove toxic behavior by 100%. But i know many players who become more toxic because of how the system is designed at its core. Also it is not my job to design a system for them, another company does that atm. I am trying to give feedback on circumstances that can enrage or frustrate a player at greater length. Yes will some venting happen and you blame someone for a lose. But there is a difference between being out played in a silvers match vs watching *insert name here* of a player getting globaled round after round and his team losing every game because he is not ready to play at that caliber of players. I am not saying bioware is not trying. I think they have been doing pretty damn good job and commend them for really taking in feedback and communicating alot with the pvp community as of late. It's a nice change of pace. But there is a different level of frustration which leads to flaming and venting that comes from getting that 1150 healer who just keeps losing and watching as the team with the better heals is winning every time so the solution is get out of que which works when you have all the free time in the world to que. But I work long days for example and if ques suck for 2 hours after work because X player is very very obviously not good and i am losing 18 elo a game or hell farming elo because luckily he is not the healer I get it makes the game more frustrating. You cant fix toxic people but bioware can attempt to fix things that cause people to get more frustrated. How they do that is up to them, so far we are seeing that. After all they have way more data then I do, which i am sure they review. For example how granked gets very little activity and we are getting incentives to que it again. I can't design a solution for them only give feedback of experiances that I have seen, talked about with other ranked players.

In a competitive environment it is impossible to remove toxic behavior by 100%. But i know many players who become more toxic because of how the system is designed at its core. Also it is not my job to design a system for them, another company does that atm. I am trying to give feedback on circumstances that can enrage or frustrate a player at greater length. Yes will some venting happen and you blame someone for a lose. But there is a difference between being out played in a silvers match vs watching *insert name here* of a player getting globaled round after round and his team losing every game because he is not ready to play at that caliber of players. I am not saying bioware is not trying. I think they have been doing pretty damn good job and commend them for really taking in feedback and communicating alot with the pvp community as of late. It's a nice change of pace. But there is a different level of frustration which leads to flaming and venting that comes from getting that 1150 healer who just keeps losing and watching as the team with the better heals is winning every time so the solution is get out of que which works when you have all the free time in the world to que. But I work long days for example and if ques suck for 2 hours after work because X player is very very obviously not good and i am losing 18 elo a game or hell farming elo because luckily he is not the healer I get it makes the game more frustrating. You cant fix toxic people but bioware can attempt to fix things that cause people to get more frustrated. How they do that is up to them, so far we are seeing that. After all they have way more data then I do, which i am sure they review. For example how granked gets very little activity and we are getting incentives to que it again. I can't design a solution for them only give feedback of experiances that I have seen, talked about with other ranked players.

Good posts, I think this accurately sums up how most ranked players feel. I think most of the problem is population based. Especially when you throw healers and tanks into the mix. Right now matchmaking takes the highest elo player and the lowest and pairs them. When I feel the Q should do its best to separate higher elo players and stick them in to a match....but in low pop times with only 1 game going it is impossible.

I quit QQ about toxicity in ranked because I know I have brought it upon myself. My mouth gets in the way. If only I could learn to keep my mouth shut. lololololol

I still truly enjoy ranked and expect to get ribbed. I don't mind that at all. What I cannot stand is a lack of effort because I queue up.

The only people that want solo ranked removed are those that are bad at solo ranked. They blame the game mode itself, because their egos can't handle the shame of their inability to succeed there. There's no other plausible reason for someone to want to actually remove content from the game that other people enjoy.

Well, I have quite a lot of all star titles from seasons 1-6, and I agree that solo ranked should never have been a thing in its format. Solo should be a practice place where you scrimmage and learn perhaps, and not get season ranked rewards, and true rewards should come from TEAM ranked. Kind of too late to change now though.

Well, I have quite a lot of all star titles from seasons 1-6, and I agree that solo ranked should never have been a thing in its format. Solo should be a practice place where you scrimmage and learn perhaps, and not get season ranked rewards, and true rewards should come from TEAM ranked. Kind of too late to change now though.

Not wanting it in the first place is entirely different from wanting it removed now.

Also, it has never made any sense that people think team ranked is a more appropriate place to test skill and give rewards. There are so many players that do decently, and are even known as "good players" in team ranked (in spite of the fact that many are either wintraders themselves or happily play with wintraders) that are consistently average at best in solo ranked.

If you really want to be picky, there should be no individual ratings for group ranked, because it says almost nothing about your individual skill, only how well your team performs relative to the other teams.

Coming from someone who's whole life revolves around swtor and achievement hunting.

That is a very different thing. I am a "completionist" if something like that even exists, I just want things done. If swtor shuts down, I wont mind, ill find something else to complete. These guys however, for them its far more than just a game.

Why do people always come to this conclusion? If the mode is **** in your eyes, don't play it.

 

If I think The Ravagers is a **** operation, I don't run it. But I don't ask for it being deleted, why would I

 

If I think SWTOR is a **** game, I don't play it. Plenty other games around that you can get addicted of. Do I ask for SWTOR being deleted? ofc not

 

There is more to this I feel like. You guys are just making yourself clowns with these posts.

The example what you state is not that correct. People do play swtor or ravagers, but they do not encounter so much toxicity as in ranked. When I do a GF ops I do not get people who trash talk me for gear, class knowledge etc. You do not get vote kicked for no reason etc. The same in swtor as a whole. The game is big and has many parts so you can do many things and never encounter any toxic people. Ranked on the other hand, is full of it.

It doesn't help if PVP'ers insult or kick every newcommer.

If you are getting vote kicked for no reason, you should report those doing it.

Also, as of the 6.1.4, due out on the 20th, vote kick is being removed.

Ranked Arena is broken in many ways. But it really is not fault of BW.

The new changes will also make BW clean there hands even more. I think they are also putting 306 gate in it.

It is the fault of the community. People always find ways to cheat, just as ugly as it sounds.

Then you have the insults. I like to do Ranked for the competitive nature, and also for the reason that getting competitive Regz are rare. Personally I prefer Objective games cause they give a purpose.

Winning or losing I can do three / five games in Ranked the most.

Any Ranked game to be taken seriously needs to be Group Ranked, and also if you want to set tier higher I would do guild based. BW lost an opportunity when they removed eights ranked. A system which at the time needed little improvements and they scraped it for Arenas.....

Group Ranked is near dead, possibly they will be revived with the new patch. But BW needing to do something to revive GR shows us the reality that Core competitive PvP in this game is dead. And its been dead for quite some time.

You'll never be able to get rid of toxicity and toxic behavior entirely. People are human and get frustrated. That said, the removal of solo ranked entirely will force pvp to be on the same level as PVE end game. If you're too much of an unpleasant chud you aren't going to find people willing to queue with you for very long and either their behavior will self moderate or they'll find something else to do with their time. Besides, PVE players have to find a group of people they get along with well enough to see "end game" content...why shouldn't PVPers?

Lol ever heard of group ranked? thats WAYYY more toxic. Ive been apart of many raids where people are fighting amongst eachother and still achieve their goals. Competition doesnt care about your feelings. You dont have to play pvp if you dont like the people. You cant force others to change.

If you are getting vote kicked for no reason, you should report those doing it.

 

Also, as of the 6.1.4, due out on the 20th, vote kick is being removed.

Wow, i'm glad it is being done. The feature is being abused so much in ranked right now. I did not report the players, but I should have. I guess I just didn't think I could report them for that.

Ranked Arena is broken in many ways. But it really is not fault of BW.

The new changes will also make BW clean there hands even more. I think they are also putting 306 gate in it.

 

It is the fault of the community. People always find ways to cheat, just as ugly as it sounds.

Then you have the insults. I like to do Ranked for the competitive nature, and also for the reason that getting competitive Regz are rare. Personally I prefer Objective games cause they give a purpose.

Winning or losing I can do three / five games in Ranked the most.

 

Any Ranked game to be taken seriously needs to be Group Ranked, and also if you want to set tier higher I would do guild based. BW lost an opportunity when they removed eights ranked. A system which at the time needed little improvements and they scraped it for Arenas.....

Group Ranked is near dead, possibly they will be revived with the new patch. But BW needing to do something to revive GR shows us the reality that Core competitive PvP in this game is dead. And its been dead for quite some time.

BW lost the pvp community when the 8v8 were omitted. 8v8 created a pvp community. It created pvp guilds which I miss. They listened to too many pve'ers that were excluded. Butt hurt because they could not receive the pvp rewards. Why do you all think the rewards have been so pitiful since...with the exception of season 7. Which the current ranked players want so bad.

The pvp community is a different bird....we are what we are....competitive and have a tendency to talk $hit from time to time. That does not make use bad at all....just means we want to win.

All of this toxicity crap is not what it is actually like in solos.....if you just try to get better. That it, plain and simple.

All of this toxicity crap is not what it is actually like in solos

I dunno, he had this crazy look in his eyes and he said LETS GET IT ON!

Why do you all think the rewards have been so pitiful since...with the exception of season 7

Season 3 seems to be pretty popular as well

You'll never be able to get rid of toxicity and toxic behavior entirely. People are human and get frustrated. That said, the removal of solo ranked entirely will force pvp to be on the same level as PVE end game. If you're too much of an unpleasant chud you aren't going to find people willing to queue with you for very long and either their behavior will self moderate or they'll find something else to do with their time. Besides, PVE players have to find a group of people they get along with well enough to see "end game" content...why shouldn't PVPers?

Been hearing a lot about this >>>>

Now why in the world those individuals dedicate their lives to this kind of behavior?? truly mentally challenge individuals.. sick

And then the question goes back to Why players need to constantly unguild/rename their toons because of a few individuals constantly watching/monitoring in order to make sure your rank is ruin?? I mean who as time in life to do those things..

their life's gotta have no meaning at all.. they must come from broken homes at the very least

You think i'm gonna have time to monitor someone so i can ruin their rank match.. No I won't .. definitely not..

got my own priorities in life to be paying attention at someone else.

Again agree with the video; game produces too many Enablers for those kind of individuals to continue foment their behavior.

Here is something that enablers them.. 'Mats' Yes you heard that right. If by loosing a player still get his/her share of mats then why win.. at all.

Just got back about 30days ago and i'm about to leave for good.

I dont mind loosing. had lost a lot of matches, but loosing because they intentionally throw .. same individuals.. it just sick.

There is a “chance” of getting the mats based on an RNG percentage depending on if you are playing solo or granked.

Exactly! and the percentage is Broken right now in Rank. Players brag/had show me the mats. This pass weekend along had a particular player farm closed to 700+ mats. It got to the point where he just got into the area and just / stuck and still got the mats. System bug?? who knows. Funny they manage to arrange the composition; meaning I always end up with his buddies even after switching from main to one of my alts and still end up in his group.

He farm mats while his buddies farm rating; I didn't report him because at least they were honest with me. So why bother..

Go figure; Kid's nowadays

Exactly! and the percentage is Broken right now in Rank. Players brag/had show me the mats. This pass weekend along had a particular player farm closed to 700+ mats. It got to the point where he just got into the area and just / stuck and still got the mats. System bug?? who knows. Funny they manage to arrange the composition; meaning I always end up with his buddies even after switching from main to one of my alts and still end up in his group.

 

He farm mats while his buddies farm rating; I didn't report him because at least they were honest with me. So why bother..

 

Go figure; Kid's nowadays

There was a bug for the first few days where pvp weeklies were getting auto completed, so people going into granked were getting absurd amounts of mats. They patched it.

Just for perspective, getting mats from solo ranked is extremely unreliable. I have played dozens of dailies (5% chance from the daily box) at this point, and probably like 10 weeklies (25% from the weekly box), and I have gotten a grand total of 1 of the new pvp mats. There is literally no point playing solo ranked to farm mats with the current drop rates.

There was a bug for the first few days where pvp weeklies were getting auto completed, so people going into granked were getting absurd amounts of mats. They patched it.

 

Just for perspective, getting mats from solo ranked is extremely unreliable. I have played dozens of dailies (5% chance from the daily box) at this point, and probably like 10 weeklies (25% from the weekly box), and I have gotten a grand total of 1 of the new pvp mats. There is literally no point playing solo ranked to farm mats with the current drop rates.

Man I wish would it had an answer. I'm just a returning player that though things would get better with the new changes. In fact I did confront them and said it was not possible due to the new changes, and they just laugh.

No matter what I play and what spec the results were the same. Throw, / stuck, farm mats, farm rating..

I'm just sharing what i witness this pass week, but to get into details.. Just clueless how they manage..

Didn't even know it was broken at the beginning of the season until you brought it.

Maybe this entire aspect of the game needs to be redesign. Turn pvp into some sort of mechanics.

btw: my server is Star Force.. cant speak for other servers

Amazing idea, make ques even longer, also less people to even play PvP.

10/10

some players use ranked stuck to avoid and lose matches to lose players they find unworthy of ranked solo. I think in ranked we should make stuck impossible

That’s all well and good in a game that doesn’t have bugs or problems with terrain and dysnc. Sadly this game has an over abundance of technical issues and /stuck is needed and used more often to get out of those than it is to troll or throw games.

Also, there are enough bugs in some maps that just leaving the respawn kills you and it looks like you’ve used /stuck. Mando arena is a prime culprit and last night I died leaving the respawn. I also got stuck in the decking on Rishi arena and needed to use /stuck.

You'll never be able to get rid of toxicity and toxic behavior entirely. People are human and get frustrated. That said, the removal of solo ranked entirely will force pvp to be on the same level as PVE end game. If you're too much of an unpleasant chud you aren't going to find people willing to queue with you for very long and either their behavior will self moderate or they'll find something else to do with their time. Besides, PVE players have to find a group of people they get along with well enough to see "end game" content...why shouldn't PVPers?

Look i'm sorry so many pvpers are such unpleasant people they cant manage to get 3 other people to regularly play games with them, but thats what the community degenerated to after they killed 8v8 ranked.

First, let me say that I am a devoted PVP player, since Ultima Online. World of Warcraft. And SWTOR as a "founder". I only play the game for PVP, and I only play PVE when it is required for PVP play.

Now, let me tell you about toxicity. Toxicity usually comes from hardcore players who want fame and glory. To them, adversarial gameplay itself is not a means to joy, but rather bragging rights. True, especially in the early days, WoW encouraged this. The insane grind to get that OP weapon only given to a single top player who acquired the most honor points. And let me tell you about these people, as I knew several of them personally. They played day and night, often skipping sleep. As it is in the real world, they learned eventually organized warfare of an army is the key to winning. They became tyrants. Many less proficient players were either scolded and kicked out. All this pathetic drama for a game that is meant to be enjoyed.

Blizzard began to see the toxicity in this system, so they made ranked PvP more casual. It was either 4v4 or 2v2, and PVP gear was no longer the One Ring to Rule Them All. PVP gear became acquirable for people who had a life other than WoW. In these days, I personally led a 4v4 team. We were a mediocre team, not at the top, but not at the bottom either. Teammates made mistakes, but we just encourage each other, that this is just a game, and people can make mistakes. The team consisted of college students and older adults with jobs and wives, so we were just grateful that other teammates showed up on time to have a good time. And in those times, PVP was just great in WoW. When you didn't have a team, you can go on 2v2 matches. There was also faction PVP. I still remember when I lead the charge against all the capitals of the Horde, killing their leaders, and leaving them in ruin full of skeletons of our sworn enemies. That was a PVP system where both casual players like myself and hardcore players, many of whom were involved in e-sports, can enjoy without scolding other players. Actually, such toxic players who made a habit of scolding other less capable players often were challenged to a one-on-one duel by famous top-class PVPers. These one-on-one duels were not just simple duels, the losers had to delete the account.

You blame the less capable players for sucking at PVP teamplay, and they deserve the scolding by others. You are the kind of player who drive players away from ranked PVP. I remember a few years ago when I first played tried a ranked PVP round. The response I got was, "hey, why does this dude don't have any adrenals on?" Not just once, but throughout the game. I never again played ranked PVP in that season. So in my opinion, it is players like you that ruined ranked PVP in SWTOR. You argue that PVE also requires coordination. But PVE is against predictable gameplay. As long as you know how each boss fights progress, casual players can participate and enjoy the run. But in PVP, players are more unpredictable. They have different strategies. There's a much more steeper learning curve and requires a lot more time and training to become a useful player for demanding players like you. I'm not saying PVE is less challenging than PVP; there are those pioneers who venture into the complete unknown. It is they who figure out how the system works, and make it far easier for those that follow. But those pioneers know that they are all in a situation where they are being seriously challenged and finding it difficult. They encourage each other. Not scolding each other. Of course, there are a few exceptions, but they become laughingstocks at YouTube.

What SWTOR needs to do to revitalize PVP is NOT more toxic team-oriented ranked PVP. What SWTOR needs is a 2v2 ranked PVP, or even a 1v1 ranked PVP. It is detrimental to have casual or solo-oriented PVP players be forced to join a group, which often have toxic players. It just makes more and more players avoid ranked PVP. But more importantly, SWTOR needs faction-based PVP and more field PVP. Most of the field needs to be PVP-only, with only very few limited zones retaining the current system where players can play in avoid PVP. Some of the more enjoyable experiences I had in recent months was the swoop racing event, which attracted enough players from opposite factions to cause some field PVP. There should also be massive instanced-PVP of 16v16 to 32v32 where true teamplay and team victory can take place, not some small band of four players who dare think they have the entitlement of defining players trying to enjoy PVP as toxic undesirables. To make it blunt, it is players like you that ruined ranked PVP, not the players who tried to try it out.

SWTOR's downfall is when it chose to become what is essentially a PVE game. What made WoW so successful is its PVP element and factional adversary. Most early WoW players became emotional vested and devoted to PVP gameplay when the Horde players were slaughtered mercilessly in the Gurubashi Jungle, and Alliance players suffered the same when the Horde players took their revenge in Southshore. It's not that SWTOR didn't try. In the beginning of SWTOR, the Dev team tried this out in Illum, but the players ended up going round and round trying to get those crates rather than fighting. And with a declining player base, PVP and PVE servers were merged, making field PVP optional for all players. That's when SWTOR died. SWTOR became a single player game. With a few PVE gameplay at the end. The PVP player base became so thin that PVP matches began mixing Imps and Pubs in the same team.

And this thin PVP player base resulted in exclusive groups of PVP players like you who think 8v8 ranked PVP is the answer to revitalizing PVP in a game where PVP is dead. Something like that will only make more exclusive group of players as a 8 player team needs more coordination to win in high-stakes competition, and this means more and more players get defined as toxic players by these exclusive groups and they just resort to PVE or entirely leaving the game. A non-ranked faction-based 8v8~16v16 warzone(not an arena, a warzone where either factions progressively advance against the other like battleground in WoW or campaign mode in Battlefield) would do far better to increase the PVP player base in SWTOR. This is a tested PVP system, in WoW and also in other genres, like Battlefield. This is when real teamplay and strategy takes places, and roles of different classes actually become relevant to PVP, such as a group of stealth units going behind the lines, AoE units pushing and defending lines of battle, tanks bravely charging in to push the line, and healers trying to keep those tanks alive so that the team can advance to victory.

Currently, the PVP player in SWTOR is so thin and the PVP system is so lacking in content that it needs a major overhaul. If SWTOR really wants to succeed, it should add faction-based campaign-mode warzones where many players can enjoy PVP together with a sense of us vs. them roleplaying, where the large size of players involved can ignore a few toxic players who whine about other players sucking at gameplay. And where we don't see Imps and Pubs being in the same team, as if any Star Wars advertisement where Palpatine and Yoda fight side by side against Darth Vader and Saw Gerrera can be any appeasing to Star Wars fans at all. And with the PVP player base being so thin at the moment, if SWTOR direly wants ranked PVP, it needs to be 1v1 or at least 2v2, because there aren't enough PVP players around, and especially with players with this "hey, you're not good enough for the team, so get out of ranked PVP" mindset. It's common sense. This will just further thin out ranked PVP with players getting discouraged from playing by these toxic players.

My guess is that SWTOR actually knew the direction PVP should take, but there were inherent server issues that limited such large-scale gameplay. If so, SWTOR is a dead game, and it's just better to wait for the next Star Wars MMORPG than to invest any further into this game. If not, SWTOR should take some risk and do some major rework, and maybe SWTOR will gain a lot larger player base where we can really start enjoying the game to the fullest.