I know the surviving mob wil go enraged when one of the 2 dies

There is a soft enrage when one gets below 10%

what I'm not clear on is there a "hard" enrage at 4.30 (read some conflicting stuff about this)

Yeah I guess you could say there's 3 enrages:

When you reach the sub 10% or 5% (not sure which) phase, where both of them start using all their abilities.

Next when one dies, the other goes crazy hitting much harder

Finally hard enrage at 4.30 at you said (think thats correct) where they start one-shotting.

The sub 10 or 5% one can actually be quite hectic. Everyone, healers, tanks and dps need to be on the ball. If tanks have cooldowns left, best to use them. For this reason we tell the melee to push it, and some of the ranged help out too to kill Toth asap.

Zorns soft-enrage once Toth dies isn't that bad, except that the rocks he throws hit very hard. Wheras if Zorn dies first Toths aoe-jump becomes crazy powerful and will likely kill all your melee.

Hard enrage is nasty. If both of them are still alive you'll be lucky to last more than 10 seconds However if just one is alive, kite away. As a tank, if it reaches hard enrage, I just start running. Even with 1 healer alive (on 16m) I can usually be kept alive for quite a while, I just run big circles around the whole group while Zorn hits me a bit and slowly 1-shots everyone else.

However it usually buys enough time for remaining dps to get him down.

I know you didn't really ask for strategy about how to deal with them maybe you kill them every week and were just curious, but I figured i'd throw my advice in anyways

Thanks for the reply's.

That bit about kiting might realy help. Reason I asked this was that I was checking combat logs as we can't seem to get past the last few % and I coldn't find a significant increase in damage at 4.30.

However if he starts one shotting at that point that would explain the logs, every one dies with one big damage spike at the end

That bit about kiting might realy help.

People have been saying "just kite Zorn around" for a while now; I haven't found that to be helpful advice. In my experience, if you get to the timed enrage, you're just going to explode VERY suddenly. If you don't get to the timed enrage, you can stand there and take it.

Apologies if it was confusing, I mean only start kiting AFTER he goes all red and angry (the timed, hard enrage). Simply because it gives you atleast a chance at surviving and killing him, just buys a few extra seconds.

You can run after Toth has died (the soft-ish enrage) and start kiting, and it can work fine, you likely will survive a bit longer. But generally unless we hit the hard enrage, I just stand there and take it, and I usually save a cooldown or two for that final bit.

Its true sometimes, after he goes red (hard enrage) he just pwns the crap out of everyone But I have had times where I've literally survived for a good 20+ seconds by the running and taunting while dps finish him off (Some dps die in the process ofc). It wont always work but better thna getting crushed by him.

Thanks to topic starter fot bringing this topic up and for those who answered. Now it's much more clear about all those enrages of this boss.

The only thing I still have question about is the enrage which starts when you go below 10%. What is the exact trigger for this enrage - when one of bosses reach 10%, or when both of them? This trigger will affect both bosses or the one who is under 10%?

I really don't understand why so many people still have problems with those 2. I always beat them with even the worst pugs as long as the tanks are able to switch just once.

Just keep toth berserked and kill them off around the same time. There are no mechanics to these guys after the first jump (especially if you have a ranged/self healing dps on zorn, you don't even have to worry about the fearful debuff).

If anyone has a lot of trouble with these two they should save some time and give up hm and practice on sm because the next 3 bosses will spank you so hard your dead ancestors will feel it. And I'm not trying to be snooty or condescending, I am serious. The other boss mechanics are so hard they make zorn and toth look like a joke. If you are having problems, save yourself a lot of frustration and practice this on sm (more than once) until you get the mechanics down.

We have reasons trying this boss in HM and want to kill him in HM. We did this twice in SM and this is not what we are going to do next time.

So I would really appreciate if someone explain me the point about 10% enrage I was asking in my previous post.

We have reasons trying this boss in HM and want to kill him in HM. We did this twice in SM and this is not what we are going to do next time.

 

So I would really appreciate if someone explain me the point about 10% enrage I was asking in my previous post.

Actually, 10% is the last swap. The soft enrage is at 5%. When either boss hits 5%, both bosses go into their soft enrage behavior: Toth pounds the ground and summons random spikes, while Zorn tosses boulders that hurt a lot.

Actually, 10% is the last swap. The soft enrage is at 5%. When either boss hits 5%, both bosses go into their soft enrage behavior: Toth pounds the ground and summons random spikes, while Zorn tosses boulders that hurt a lot.

Thanks a lot! That is exactly what I needed!

We have reasons trying this boss in HM and want to kill him in HM. We did this twice in SM and this is not what we are going to do next time.

 

So I would really appreciate if someone explain me the point about 10% enrage I was asking in my previous post.

Was that directed at my post?

What level are you doing this?

2 geared level 55 tanks don't even need to swap in HM (this goes for Stormcaller / firebrand also).

I know the surviving mob wil go enraged when one of the 2 dies

There is a soft enrage when one gets below 10%

 

what I'm not clear on is there a "hard" enrage at 4.30 (read some conflicting stuff about this)

It goes without saying, but you should be beating the enrage timer. Dpsing them down evenly takes the bite out of the soft enrage when it happens.

The main problem is that you have new level 50's that never ran EC pre 2.0, when the strongest gear out there was Dread Guard. They see EC grouped with EV and KP in one of the Weeklies and think its just as easy. Many of us will agree that it is not. I have been in a lot of EC HM and NiM runs where one or two people admit as soon as they draw the first mobs on the way up to Zorn and Toth that they've never done EC in any form before. That stops everybody from being able to complete the Operation because you underestimated the content. If its new to you, please run the SM content first. You'll be doing yourself and everyone else a HUGE favor.

EC is extremely Mechanics heavy, even in SM, and if you're not careful, you're dead. On to Zorn and Toth. One of the biggest issues I see with this encounter is that, again, people don't understand the mechanics. There is a reason mdps do not attack Zorn. When you have a Red Circle under you in any fight, walk out of it. Don't stand in it.

In HM, when you get the yellow circle, get behind Toth. when fighting Zorn as rdps, stay more than 28 meters away from it, so you don't get hit with Fearful, which stops you from dpsing for as long as the debuff is on you. This really isnt difficult.

This isn't meant to be personally directed at the person who started this thread, so please don't take this personal. I'm just venting my frustrations about players who don't take the time to learn the fights before coming into them. There's this thing called Youtube. Someone, somewhere on there, took the time to record the fights. Watch them. Study them and emulate.