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Eternal Championship and Star Fortress


Brother_Wolf_NZ

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Okay, this is it, I am now making this official! The difficulty settings for both the Eternal Championship and Star Fortress has been increased to being almost to completely un-beatable. This is unacceptable! :mad: These two flashpoints weren't this hard to begin with, which suited our needs to have fun and a great time. But now, they've gotten to a point where people now refuse to run them entirely, even me! :mad:

 

I'm not the only here, the devs have completely screwed things up real bad this time! They ought to turn down the difficulty settings for both Eternal Championship and Star Fortress and make them as they once were. I don't care if it was meant to bring people back to the game, they'll still refuse to run things that are nigh unbeatable! The devs need to fix this, or we're not doing those kinds of flashpoints, quests and etc anymore! If they want us to keep playing SWTOR, they'll need to think about our needs, our wishes and NOT things that'll cause people to quit the game forever! Things that'll allow us to have fun and enjoy ourselves. Otherwise, people will NOT pay good money for a game like this if the devs keep screwing things up! I am speaking truthfully from my heart regarding this discussion.

Edited by Brother_Wolf_NZ
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I agree. I don't know if it is the reverse bolstering (bringing our characters down to 70), or they just pumped these guys up too much (or a combination of both). But it is ridiculous now. Especially since these are part of the story and companion quests (something a lot of people want to do).

 

My smuggler lost his lvl 50 bowdaar companion, but I can't beat the eternal championship solo, and nobody wants to do it with me. Who wants to study all the fights and do an hour long fight for no real rewards? It's just stupid and remains a sore-spot for me.

 

I realize that some people like near-unbeatable content, so they can feel a sense of achievement if they manage to beat it. But more don't. And, this isn't these aren't the place for that anyway. Most players want just enough challenge to have fun. Not so much that they have to treat their recreation like a job (involving sacrifice, lots of hard work, major struggling, frustration, etc.). Most people have enough frustration in their real lives.

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When the game came out it was harder than it is now and much much harder than it was pre-6.0 so I really do not see an issue here.

 

Its fairly easy to get 306 gear and with that EC and SF should be on level as they were prior 6.0 however I have yet to try it. I only tried EC when i was level 70 cause i wanted to do conquest and before i just ran through EC for easy conquest points. I failed since the bosses were level 75 and i was 70, but I need to go back and try it now with full optimized 306 and set bonus.

 

Regardless EC is a mode that is not really meant to be done over and over unless you are after the achievements or trying to get Bowdar. SF is also done just once in the story line and thats it. I am not sure why you would be running these over and over.

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Okay, this is it, I am now making this official! The difficulty settings for both the Eternal Championship and Star Fortress has been increased to being almost to completely un-beatable. This is unacceptable! :mad: These two flashpoints weren't this hard to begin with, which suited our needs to have fun and a great time. But now, they've gotten to a point where people now refuse to run them entirely, even me! :mad:

 

I'm not the only here, the devs have completely screwed things up real bad this time! They ought to turn down the difficulty settings for both Eternal Championship and Star Fortress and make them as they once were. I don't care if it was meant to bring people back to the game, they'll still refuse to run things that are nigh unbeatable! The devs need to fix this, or we're not doing those kinds of flashpoints, quests and etc anymore! If they want us to keep playing SWTOR, they'll need to think about our needs, our wishes and NOT things that'll cause people to quit the game forever! Things that'll allow us to have fun and enjoy ourselves. Otherwise, people will NOT pay good money for a game like this if the devs keep screwing things up! I am speaking truthfully from my heart regarding this discussion.

 

My companion is max 50 level influence and my character had the best highest item rating 277 with Alliance base influence level is max 20 for run a veteran mission for star fortress and eternal championship is too hard. Lose the mission every time now after beat this before. No matter how high your gear is max. We have disgruntled people discriminatory dictate over other customers and me for telling DEV that we can't have companions use modify status bonus gear or change the laws of nature of game for player grouping and not letting us solo play it. Let us summon out more companions out to make a group to resolve. Worth a million to billion lawsuit. Really not fair and they need to stop neglect the game.:mad:

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My companion is max 50 level influence and my character had the best highest item rating 277 with Alliance base influence level is max 20 for run a veteran mission for star fortress and eternal championship is too hard. Lose the mission every time now after beat this before. No matter how high your gear is max. We have disgruntled people discriminatory dictate over other customers and me for telling DEV that we can't have companions use modify status bonus gear or change the laws of nature of game for player grouping and not letting us solo play it. Let us summon out more companions out to make a group to resolve. Worth a million to billion lawsuit. Really not fair and they need to stop neglect the game.:mad:

 

Exactly what I've been saying! We're supposed to pay good money for this?? Their loyalty maybe to the stock holders, but they need to do everything in their power to keep the entire fan-base appeased! If they keep neglecting the game, we'll lose faith and interest, and just quit entirely forever. And no gaming company wants that to happen (eventually leading to bankruptcy)! Remember what happened to Pirates of the Caribbean Online, for those who had played it. The game needs people to keep it alive, with their hearts and souls placed into making it awesome and fun to play. Please Devs, think about what's best for us and not for you. Keep us appeased with fun and enjoyment, and we will not quit the game.

Edited by Brother_Wolf_NZ
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Regardless EC is a mode that is not really meant to be done over and over unless you are after the achievements or trying to get Bowdar. SF is also done just once in the story line and thats it. I am not sure why you would be running these over and over.

 

EC remains the sole source of some pretty cool weapon shells, ones with visual effects (VFX) that adjust to your color crystal and, in my opinion, look cool. EC is also a working source of color crystals for colors that used to be obtainable from reverse engineering certain ops drops, but now reverse engineering those color crystal schems is broken. Third, back in the day, it used to be a source for Exotic Isotope Stabilizers. With 5.0, the bosses became a source for Refined Isotope Stabilizers, but the weeklies still awarded the defunct EIS. When 6.0 was on PTS, the bosses had a chance to drop a Processed IS, but the weeklies STILL only award EIS. Fourth, there are unique pets and mounts, like the Eternal Empire Walker and Cybernetic Rancor, some of which are bound to character and not legacy. Finally, its a daily repeatable conquest objective. For people who want to contribute to conquest, but don't want to do group activities, it is one pathway to help that.

 

SF lost its repeatability value only because the decorations stopped dropping from heroic mode, and the bracers stopped dropping. With the removal of legacy-bound CXP packs, and the lack of tie-in to the Spoils of War system, its truly pointless now, but it doesn't have to be.

 

So, the lack of replay value of TEC and SFs is more of an issue of bugs, and lack of inclusion, rather than a pure failure of the content.

 

For that matter, one could make the same complaint about Uprisings. This was content not updated to fit with Spoils of War, although it retained its tie-in to Conquest objectives and its bonus day to renown. The was another oversight on the part of the developers.

 

Honestly, one could say that about ANY content in SWTOR. Why is Terror from Beyond any more replayable than Dread Palace? The only reason they are worthwhile is because they relate to conquest; or because they have higher yields of personal loot and tech frags; or because they are a source for specific tacticals/set bonus shells.

 

I would say, regarding The Eternal Championship and Star Fortresses, fix the bugs/oversights:

 

  1. Missing decorations from the bosses and paladins in heroic (veteran) but not solo mode
  2. Missing Conquered Exarch (blank) Bracers, which apparently don't drop unless you are between 60-65 if at all any more. In fact, I'd probably add all 7 anatomic slot pieces as drops since you only get the other 6 pieces from the one-time resistance member companion recruitments, but just fixing the missing bracers is a step in the right direction
  3. Occurrences of Exotic Isotope Stabilizers instead of Processed Isotope Stabilizers
  4. Broken scaling or bolster, especially since they were intended for level 60s originally, with level 70s encountering level 75 mobs unbolstered. Challenge or not, its clearly not working as intended.
  5. No tie in weeklies to Spoils of War; no purple or gold equipment crates, personalized loot drops, tech fragments, or any combination of these..

 

and then, when those five things are addressed, then assess the replay value.

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EC remains the sole source of some pretty cool weapon shells, ones with visual effects (VFX) that adjust to your color crystal and, in my opinion, look cool. EC is also a working source of color crystals for colors that used to be obtainable from reverse engineering certain ops drops, but now reverse engineering those color crystal schems is broken. Third, back in the day, it used to be a source for Exotic Isotope Stabilizers. With 5.0, the bosses became a source for Refined Isotope Stabilizers, but the weeklies still awarded the defunct EIS. When 6.0 was on PTS, the bosses had a chance to drop a Processed IS, but the weeklies STILL only award EIS. Fourth, there are unique pets and mounts, like the Eternal Empire Walker and Cybernetic Rancor, some of which are bound to character and not legacy. Finally, its a daily repeatable conquest objective. For people who want to contribute to conquest, but don't want to do group activities, it is one pathway to help that.

 

SF lost its repeatability value only because the decorations stopped dropping from heroic mode, and the bracers stopped dropping. With the removal of legacy-bound CXP packs, and the lack of tie-in to the Spoils of War system, its truly pointless now, but it doesn't have to be.

 

So, the lack of replay value of TEC and SFs is more of an issue of bugs, and lack of inclusion, rather than a pure failure of the content.

 

For that matter, one could make the same complaint about Uprisings. This was content not updated to fit with Spoils of War, although it retained its tie-in to Conquest objectives and its bonus day to renown. The was another oversight on the part of the developers.

 

Honestly, one could say that about ANY content in SWTOR. Why is Terror from Beyond any more replayable than Dread Palace? The only reason they are worthwhile is because they relate to conquest; or because they have higher yields of personal loot and tech frags; or because they are a source for specific tacticals/set bonus shells.

 

I would say, regarding The Eternal Championship and Star Fortresses, fix the bugs/oversights:

 

  1. Missing decorations from the bosses and paladins in heroic (veteran) but not solo mode
  2. Missing Conquered Exarch (blank) Bracers, which apparently don't drop unless you are between 60-65 if at all any more. In fact, I'd probably add all 7 anatomic slot pieces as drops since you only get the other 6 pieces from the one-time resistance member companion recruitments, but just fixing the missing bracers is a step in the right direction
  3. Occurrences of Exotic Isotope Stabilizers instead of Processed Isotope Stabilizers
  4. Broken scaling or bolster, especially since they were intended for level 60s originally, with level 70s encountering level 75 mobs unbolstered. Challenge or not, its clearly not working as intended.
  5. No tie in weeklies to Spoils of War; no purple or gold equipment crates, personalized loot drops, tech fragments, or any combination of these..

 

and then, when those five things are addressed, then assess the replay value.

 

I admire your assessment on the situation. It's true that TEC has some very neat and awesome stuff to gain and use, but what I'm addressing here is the difficulty of it. A lot of players can't even complete it successfully and wipe on the very first round, making it un-beatable. As for the SFs, it's true that it's not the most popular content as it used to be. Hell, I was even sick of them due to the companion disappearing bug, which was extremely annoying. But making them more harder to complete (even soloing it) than it was before is NOT the way to go to encourage people to play SWTOR again!

 

I would completely recommend that the Star Fortresses get re-vamped with new Stronghold Decorations, new crafting materials (preferably Grade 11) and most importantly a brand new gearing system that players will enjoy. But in all fairness, tone down the difficulty to a point where it IS actually doable for Solo, Veteran and Master Modes. I may sound like Gordon Ramsey here, but making hard to near un-beatable content for people who don't want an extreme challenge at certain times is NOT the way to go.

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This weekend I did a couple of story mode Star Fortress and also two heroic+2 runs (had to get my achivements finally). I played my Lightning sorc with 306 gear but with 2 different sets with only the first bonuses on both meaning +2% mastery x2. Stormwatch tactical and no amplifiers related to my specc at all. No good gear imho. My companion was Andronikas rank 50.

 

Took forever imho to do it but was never "hard". Named champions one has to focus a Little, might even have used a dcd cant say for sure but i used my CDs to burn them down fast. Never died except once when i got bored and tried to rally all trash from couple of rooms at one spot to aoe them down. Companion died on the way left me with 20 adds=rip. Yes it made me hate my sorc so much cause it took forever to complete theese runs. All the time I ran it i wished i had completed this on my OP instead which would have taken 80% less time cause i do lots of more dps (full set, amplifiers, augments + skill!) and stealth is king. Someone who mains a sorc with BiS would easily done this a lot faster then me.

 

Point is no its not hard just slow. Companion on heals and ur good to go :)

 

Edit: since i now got my achievements (wanted the decos) i will never go back there ever since there is nothing in heroic+2 at all and storymode i got the decos x many.

Edited by yohansvea
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This weekend I did a couple of story mode Star Fortress and also two heroic+2 runs (had to get my achivements finally). I played my Lightning sorc with 306 gear but with 2 different sets with only the first bonuses on both meaning +2% mastery x2. Stormwatch tactical and no amplifiers related to my specc at all. No good gear imho. My companion was Andronikas rank 50.

 

Took forever imho to do it but was never "hard". Named champions one has to focus a Little, might even have used a dcd cant say for sure but i used my CDs to burn them down fast. Never died except once when i got bored and tried to rally all trash from couple of rooms at one spot to aoe them down. Companion died on the way left me with 20 adds=rip. Yes it made me hate my sorc so much cause it took forever to complete theese runs. All the time I ran it i wished i had completed this on my OP instead which would have taken 80% less time cause i do lots of more dps (full set, amplifiers, augments + skill!) and stealth is king. Someone who mains a sorc with BiS would easily done this a lot faster then me.

 

Point is no its not hard just slow. Companion on heals and ur good to go :)

 

Edit: since i now got my achievements (wanted the decos) i will never go back there ever since there is nothing in heroic+2 at all and storymode i got the decos x many.

 

I noticed you didn't say you did the eternal championship. How come? Could it be because it is freaking ridiculously difficult and Looonng? Also, you seem to be contradicting yourself a little by saying star forge (non-story mode) is not hard, but you aren't ever going to do it again. Taking forever is part of what we mean when we say it is too difficult. You seem to agree by saying you never want to do it again....as well as choosing not to do the eternal championship (which if you ever do (or have done), you probably never will want to do it again either).

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since i now got my achievements (wanted the decos) i will never go back there ever since there is nothing in heroic+2 at all and storymode i got the decos x many.

 

This is ofc my view on the matter, yet I want to try EC and SF to see how it is. I will try it with a fully geared toon with level 50 comp and also with a toon that just got the 267 gear from 6.0 story.

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Yesterday, I tried to regain Bowdaar on my Gunslinger. It is not my favorite class and honestly, I suck at that sitting duck class.

I noticed Bowdaar affection was only 7, so I had to start the EC.

I managed to get through 2 rounds, the 3rd was impossible - adds did not want to die, and that nasty AOE of boss, had slowed and killed me twice.

Saboteur, despite of being quite good on AOE damage, unfortunately is not good in holotraversing AND keeping that damage. So, the result is more adds and non touched boss.

 

Previous iterations of Eternal Championship, was pretty doable, but I admit I did that on melee classes only. But definitely it seems much harder that it used to be. Aha, he is only lvl 70 with 258 gear.

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I didnt say anything about the eternal Championship cause i cant contribute any real info there, i only done it in 5.0 and i only managed meaby 6-7 rounds cant remember. I wiped at the boss who spawn adds and one has to pick up some rocket thingy. I did it because i wanted Bowdar after that I never been motivated to do it again or go higher in rounds since there is no reward well except achievments which i dont care for. If they added some cool decos hell i would learn mechanics and grind it like there is no tomorrow! :)

 

I dont Think i contradict my self when saying i dont find star forge is not hard and the reason I dont go back is cause I never liked it. I never enjoyed it nor do i find it entertaining even the slightest. Only wanted the decos and now I got it no way im going back there.

 

But this is OT I Think, my reply was about the difficulty of the SF which I can contribute something about since i done it multiple times a few days ago. I done it plenty of times pre 6.0 aswell and it is no different now. It was slow then and its slow now yes but slow isnt the same as hard for me. Hard is including none forgiving mechanics, the chance to wipe is high and one cant slack even for a moment without being punished for it. Like playing pvp against a real good player or doing ops in hard mode (never done nim but some hm been hard imho).

Its slow to level to 75 but its not hard, kind of the same thing.

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EC and SF should be on level as they were prior 6.0

 

They "sort of" are, however the nerf to the companion heals in 6.0 has made them harder than they were prior. When 4.0 launched companions gained a massive boost in healing ability and I think it's the now nerfed companions that have caused a lot of issues with the content like this.

 

It probably didn't factor into BioWare's "balancing" when they made those companion changes, it could be resolved in things like the eternal championship by making the kolto stations reusable within a certain time frame to compensate for the lack of healing now in 6.0.

 

Definitely needs some fine tuning, I personally think BioWare went too far the wrong direction with the companion nerfs and should have found a better balance than what they've done.

Edited by Transcendent
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They were both difficult enough FPs prior to 6.0. I did all the related cheevos I cared to do prior to 6.0, so now I'm not interested in doing them at all. What that says for new players who haven't run the content is that either they're screwed or they need to git gud.
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I was able to complete all 6 SFs and all 10 levels of the EC in non set bonus 306 gear with a 50 level companion set to healing. In the EC there were 2 fights that I had some issue, I believe they were 7 & 9. All other levels seemed pretty easy. I went through a week or 2 after 6.0 dropped.

 

So doable for sure. Whether they are doable at a lower level or lower gear level maybe the issue.

Edited by Kawiki
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Ok I tried EC now, it is a bit harder, but I still went through the whole instance without dying and pretty fast. The sprint run would be harder now, but its nothing to complain about. Before it was too easy, now its fine even if you have top gear.

 

Yeah I don’t think it’s a problem for level 75s. The problem is that the thing was intended for level 65s. Now, I don’t have an issue with it being boosted to 75 per se. I wish it was updated reward-wise to correspond to other level 75 content, but that’s a replay/incentive issue not a completability problem. The problem is that a level 65 would encounter this naturally after completing KOTFE chapter 9, and that level 65 may want to recruit Bowdaar. To gain influence you have to complete rounds. The more rounds you complete in a single session, the more influence you gain with Bowdaar. If you do manage to complete all ten rounds in a single sitting, you will earn enough influence to get Bowdaar from rank 1 to rank 11. However, I have seen multiple reports of people at level 70 trying to do the actual Eternal Championship rounds (not the final steps of the bowdaar recruitment) and encountering the mobs as level 75 and no bolster being present.

 

It is possible to earn influence more piecemeal by completing a few rounds, handing that in, doing those same rounds, handing those in, etc etc until you reach rank 10. So there is a workaround.

 

However, I am of the philosophy that the devs should try their best to make sure content remains accessible at the level it was originally designed for. Therefore, there are really only two choices: add a bolster so 65+ can complete it, or level lock it down to 65.

 

Now, both options have issues. After all, why is it ok to keep bolstering and bolstering TEC to level cap but not ok to do so for OPS and FPS? Why keep bolstering If eventually the level cap is so high that even with bolster 65s can’t compete. So that leaves us with level lock down to 65. But, that won’t be as challenging for level cap players in BiS in much the same way that older FPs and OPs are presently.

 

So, there’s the rub. Personally, I am in favor of a solution that leaves the encounter accessible to the level it was originally intended. But since it won’t be as much of a challenge as originally conceived, it will have to have a major overhaul to its rewards to remain relevant and replayable.

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Just finished another SF run. Lvl 67 with lvl 5 heal comp.

Easy.

If u cant do this.. well, just dont go into group content ever, make us a favour.

 

Were you doing normal or heroic? I didn't think a lvl 67 would even be able to land a hit on a lvl 75 mob let alone be able to out damage an Exarch's healing. I usually end up in stalemates on just regular mobs when they are only +5 levels above me.

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Yeah I don’t think it’s a problem for level 75s. The problem is that the thing was intended for level 65s. Now, I don’t have an issue with it being boosted to 75 per se. I wish it was updated reward-wise to correspond to other level 75 content, but that’s a replay/incentive issue not a completability problem. The problem is that a level 65 would encounter this naturally after completing KOTFE chapter 9, and that level 65 may want to recruit Bowdaar. To gain influence you have to complete rounds. The more rounds you complete in a single session, the more influence you gain with Bowdaar. If you do manage to complete all ten rounds in a single sitting, you will earn enough influence to get Bowdaar from rank 1 to rank 11. However, I have seen multiple reports of people at level 70 trying to do the actual Eternal Championship rounds (not the final steps of the bowdaar recruitment) and encountering the mobs as level 75 and no bolster being present.

 

It is possible to earn influence more piecemeal by completing a few rounds, handing that in, doing those same rounds, handing those in, etc etc until you reach rank 10. So there is a workaround.

 

However, I am of the philosophy that the devs should try their best to make sure content remains accessible at the level it was originally designed for. Therefore, there are really only two choices: add a bolster so 65+ can complete it, or level lock it down to 65.

 

Now, both options have issues. After all, why is it ok to keep bolstering and bolstering TEC to level cap but not ok to do so for OPS and FPS? Why keep bolstering If eventually the level cap is so high that even with bolster 65s can’t compete. So that leaves us with level lock down to 65. But, that won’t be as challenging for level cap players in BiS in much the same way that older FPs and OPs are presently.

 

So, there’s the rub. Personally, I am in favor of a solution that leaves the encounter accessible to the level it was originally intended. But since it won’t be as much of a challenge as originally conceived, it will have to have a major overhaul to its rewards to remain relevant and replayable.

 

Yeah I agree with your previous post too, I myself was doing this before to get the Rancor and also to get the Rifle from the vendor, cause it was really nice. Sure, its harder now, mainly for lower level toons as you really have to go with mechanics and also deal with the big hits due to level change. So yeah, maybe they should consider all this.

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Eternal championship is not fully required for the companion. You can go halfway, or even just first phase, then go back to Bowdaar, and get some influence for it. Repeat a few times, and you got the companion.

 

Story wise the Star Fortresses are kinda optional. I mean once you are the Eternal Emperor you might as well have them dismantled. It's not in the story, but understandable, that they wanted to keep old content playable. Though i would make it into a phase shift system. Basically you could switch phases, and in the last one that quest is no longer there to bother you.

 

But i agree, that since it's no longer end-game content it should be soloable. Or at least have an optional solo mode like most flashpoints.

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