After Game Update 5.10.3 “The Dantooine Incursion” , here are some comments:

PLUS:

I liked that we got next bit of story.

I liked defferent options with Theron and Aygo.

I liked that Saboteur got different dialog. I liked that I could choose to reveal myself.

MINUS:

Please don't force me to publicly make fool of myself. That's not pleasant, also that's not very good idea for saboteur strategy because I can imagine important people might easily get impression that I'm not so trustworthy and reliable to include me in important missions.

I'd like my saboteur character to be portrayed as cunning, maybe having to make some sacrifice, maybe taking some hard decisions, maybe forced to take the harder route...

BUT not as a clown.

And moving to Dantooine, suddenly no loyal/saboteur difference in quest? Why? Every update should develop this diversity further, not ignore it.

Or am I missing something?

SUGGESTIONS

My Imperial Agent is somewhat unforgiving, that left me with 3 people at the table (Hylo, Lana, Doctor Hutt).

OK, Sana-Rae is there somewhere on Voss, but some replacements would be advisable.

Saboteurs could have some opportunities to reveal themselves to the wrong people, that would later backfire.

IF you are going to play the double agent -- like my Hunter ...

I have a feeling we will have to make some dark side choices for this thing to work -- or at least make it RP wise work;

next decision she makes will more than likely be DS -- not LS --- but since what has happened, has happened ( not going to give spoilers here, trust me) --- I feel a LOT better about it now -- my Hunter can go FULL undercover

Besides if you didn't look like a clown ...

I need more sabotage missions! Why is it that we do the dailies that loyalists do?

Because this event is technically meant to be done at any point in the entire story, not just post Ossus. So unless they made entirely different event quests for saboteurs then this is what we get stuck with.

Frankly I don't like the saboteur storyline at all and would prefer to openly side with the other faction.

Exactly... my bh merc chose to side with the republic... and yet today I am still killing Pub soldiers and a few Jedi...

The in game solution should be as easy as a race change.. just use mirrors of the current race. My bh merc is a imp zabrak... all it takes is for BioWare to create other races, mirrored, one for each existing class.

It’s always been wrong anyway... a dark side Jedi should have always had dark side powers.

but as someone said somewhere -- dark side Jedi = sith

and a light side sith = jedi

so that might be the logic in the powers they have -- just a theory

but as someone said somewhere -- dark side Jedi = sith

and a light side sith = jedi

 

so that might be the logic in the powers they have -- just a theory

Saboteur Sith =/= LS Sith =/= Jedi...

Funny fact: my saboteur SW is max DS.

But my saboteur Jedi consular is DS and frankly it would be probably easier for me to convert at least skills icons into corresponding icons from SI, because my brain just can't match them properly and SI is my main, lol. And while on SI I play almost on autopilot, on JC I'm always guessing. Some icons look too alike and don't represent the effect. Also, I "hate" Jedi ;-)

snip... Please don't force me to publicly make fool of myself. That's not pleasant, also that's not very good idea for saboteur strategy because i can imagine important people might easily get impression that i'm not so trustworthy and reliable to include me in important missions. ...snip

Empire! Empire! Empire!

Exactly... my bh merc chose to side with the republic... and yet today I am still killing Pub soldiers and a few Jedi...

 

The in game solution should be as easy as a race change.. just use mirrors of the current race. My bh merc is a imp zabrak... all it takes is for BioWare to create other races, mirrored, one for each existing class.

 

It’s always been wrong anyway... a dark side Jedi should have always had dark side powers.

Darkside and lightside powers have always been something I thought would be cool.

Grant a mirror ability for dark side levels, like a darkside level 2 jedi could have force choke which is on the same cool down timer as force statis.

The down side to this is that the reverse side to this looks lame. Who would want to use force stasis or pebble throwing instead of the force choke and lightning.

Please don't force me to publicly make fool of myself. That's not pleasant, also that's not very good idea for saboteur strategy because I can imagine important people might easily get impression that I'm not so trustworthy and reliable to include me in important missions.

I'd like my saboteur character to be portrayed as cunning, maybe having to make some sacrifice, maybe taking some hard decisions, maybe forced to take the harder route...

BUT not as a clown.

I'm of two minds on this. On the plus side, it is great as comic relief, and the appearance of incompetence (or just having an off day) is a shield against the appearance of disloyalty. On the other hand, if a character previously has a reputation for intelligence, cunning, and good leadership, an incident like this can be jarring, and as you point out could lead to the saboteur not being trusted as much with crucial information or missions.

My SIS-loyal operative is as clever as they come. Since agent chapter two (which I played orginally at launch, so this approach with her has been going on for years), I've had her stealth past all avoidable Republic mobs. She doesn't do any optional missions that require killing Republic forces or even sabotaging their efforts (instead she focuses on impeding third parties that get in the way of both Republic and Empire, so for instance she only does the missions against geonosians and droids on Ossus). She always finds a way to seem competent and loyal in spite of shielding the Republic as much as possible. This... open misplay in front of the troops... really isn't her.

I appreciate that the writers can't make their material fit everyone perfectly, though. I think we have to accept an amount of that, considering how different our characters can be.

Look like a clown -- they will never see, or expect, the knife in their back later ... BH tactic ... she really has no loyalties except to her friends and crew ( and Theron of course)

not so much my agent, but I haven't gotten her past Nathema yet --- still haven't decided if she will be a loyal Imp or not

I appreciate that the writers can't make their material fit everyone perfectly, though. I think we have to accept an amount of that, considering how different our characters can be.

OK, maybe my SW isn't super bright, especially in comparison to secret agents. Lets say this wasn't totally out of character for him.

Nethertheless, I still think that for long-term saboteur strategy displays of incometence are the wrong way of doing this. We should rather aim for keeping good reputation, just ensuring that some terrible fate complicates the war effort and we may even be the ones who supposedly prevented total catastrophe. We sholud be competent, so we are ivited to important meetings, so we know secret plans and have opportunity to for example poison someone, arrange some obstacles etc.

We sholud be competent, so we are ivited to important meetings, so we know secret plans and have opportunity to for example poison someone, arrange some obstacles etc.

Hopefully the next installment of saboteur story will be more up this alley. Maybe they just needed to get the bit of comic relief out of their systems.

I'm of two minds on this. On the plus side, it is great as comic relief, and the appearance of incompetence (or just having an off day) is a shield against the appearance of disloyalty. On the other hand, if a character previously has a reputation for intelligence, cunning, and good leadership, an incident like this can be jarring, and as you point out could lead to the saboteur not being trusted as much with crucial information or missions.

I think that's true. In terms of comic relief, I thought it was some of the funniest writing seen in the game, and I appreciated it for that.

From a story standpoint, I've already said that I think that the saboteur storyline is not believable for some characters given what they have already chosen to do in the game. If you have a character like my Republic saboteur who has been undermining the Republic every time the story has allowed her to do so, going back to the class stories, and has publicly supported the Empire during KOTET and Iokath, it's just not believable that the Republic would trust her with anything on Ossus or Dantooine. The Republic wouldn't trust her as far as they could spit, and they'd have good reason for that.

If she were brought in for an interview with RNN, she'd probably say exactly what the saboteur interview said, and would barely be able to contain her hatred for the Republic with her answers.

On the other hand if you have a character that secretly hates their faction or knows how to covertly work for the other side, the saboteur speech/interview is a bit more jarring because they'd be savvy enough not to blow their cover that way. But in that case you could always choose one of the other two conversation options and continue to bluff through as the Imperial or Republic "hero" everyone thinks the character is.

In at least one post-story communication someone noted saboteur Commander's erratic behavior, which I thought was an nice touch.

In at least one post-story communication someone noted saboteur Commander's erratic behavior, which I thought was an nice touch.

I thought that was hilarious too. Good to see you on the forum again, btw.

Exactly... my bh merc chose to side with the republic... and yet today I am still killing Pub soldiers and a few Jedi...

 

The in game solution should be as easy as a race change.. just use mirrors of the current race. My bh merc is a imp zabrak... all it takes is for BioWare to create other races, mirrored, one for each existing class.

 

It’s always been wrong anyway... a dark side Jedi should have always had dark side powers.

on ossus they explained that... you still need to appear as working for the empire, you are a double agent, its the same reason undercover cops participate in some crimes so there cover doesnt get blown, or spies will work for other governments top gain their trust. balker straight up says you can do far more for the republic from inside the empire instead of outside. its an "ends justify the means" scenario, and as boyd said in an livestream, the saboteur storylines will get very dark and conflicting and he hopes they will make you question everything about your toon. (iirc this was in a livestream with badfeeling podcast b4 ossus came out)