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BowtieJones

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I've never created a thread, though I've been playing since Anchorhead server existed. I read the forums far more often than is healthy. I now reside, mostly, on POT5.

 

My guild disbanded, and I became a server traveler. I've been playing on the Ebon Hawk, and I gotta tell ya: I'm astounded. My very first warzone (I wish I took a screenshot) as a level 10 guardian had one of the best moments of my time here. A jugg lept to a scoundrel on my team. Not a big deal, but what appeared in chat stopped me in my tracks.

 

The scoundrel typed /e cowers before the might of [name].

 

I watched this happen, and I laughed. "Ok, this is a role play server. I get it. I'd try to kill him instead of cowering, but ok."

 

I was hooked. Now, I'm not a role-player at all. I like games, and that's it, but I get a real kick out of watching the commitment to that style of play. The detail is great. the "join me in the vip area for some private force training" cracks me up. I'm happy to play the game and enjoy. Of course I want to win. I will kick you in the nuts, or hit you with the butt of my saber, or whatever. If you call incoming, I will be there just as soon as my perfectly average legs can take me.

 

But to my point. When calling an incoming, why say left or right? It's not precise. Why not use cardinal directions? East and West are always the same. Left and right are only always the same if you use them as if they were east and west, as in left side of the map or right side of the map. It seems nobody uses them that way.

 

Too many times have I seen someone on defense in a voidstar say "I need help left," meaning they need you to turn left out of the door. This will put you on the right side of the map, which wouldn't happen if you were on offence. In that case you'd turn left and be on the left side of the map.

 

I've asked "Do you mean West or East?" and been told "LEFT AND RIGHT IS EASIER! COME LEFT!" so I go to the left side of the map, and they die on the right, only to call the team names.

 

I don't get it, my friends.

 

Am I alone? Should I just type /e doesn't know why people don't know East from West?

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why not use what ur comfortable with and call it a day?

 

Personally I use East and West for Novare coast, Snow and grass for Civil ware, left and right for Voidstar(as u exist spawn), in AH i call home pylon( in case we capped both)

Edited by iDraxter
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So what you're trying to say is that East/West always have fixed positions but Left/Right don't?

 

Hmm...

 

So... West is always <------ and East is always ----> on the map. But Left <---- and Right ---> can also be Left ---> and Right <----? Yeah, it's totally obvious now, people should use East/West, there won't be so much confusion.

 

If 7 people are fighting 4 people at the left door (SORRY, WEST DOOR! Confusion averted!) and someone yells "ZOMG, 4 INC, LEFT SIDE!!! HALP!!!!!!!!!!!!111" the average braindead person will get completely confused because "hey, we're at the left door and we're completely ok here, I'm just gonna continue killing until there's nothing red left".

Edited by AlphaInquisitor
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I guess I'm talking specifically about the Voidstar, since there are no landmarks. Snow is snow, grass is grass, mid is mid. Same thing with AH: ours, theirs, mid. Granted, I don't know how we all decided which side was going to be the default side in AH, since they both take the same time to get to. Probably roll over from civil war. Huttball is huttball. I love huttball.

 

Voidstar is the only one that changes what left and right mean.

 

I'm not going to be satisfied with "what is comfortable for me."

 

Considering all the talk about premades and their ability to communicate exceeding that of a pug's, I just want some consistency.

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So what you're trying to say is that East/West always have fixed positions but Left/Right don't?

 

Hmm...

 

So... West is always <------ and East is always ----> on the map. But Left <---- and Right ---> can also be Left ---> and Right <----? Yeah, it's totally obvious now, people should use East/West, there won't be so much confusion.

 

If 7 people are fighting 4 people at the left door (SORRY, WEST DOOR! Confusion averted!) and someone yells "ZOMG, 4 INC, LEFT SIDE!!! HALP!!!!!!!!!!!!111" the average braindead person will get completely confused because "hey, we're at the left door and we're completely ok here, I'm just gonna continue killing until there's nothing red left".

 

I'm saying if we only used left and right the way you just mockingly presented, we'd be fine. In my example, the person called the direction to go from the door, not the side of the map.

 

Let me guess. You call left and right? When people don't show up in time to stop the cap you say things like "i called for 'halp'."

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Learn to look at the minimap from time to time. Check who's guarding and if his health starts lowering, someone's probably there (unless if it's a retarded sage/sorc sacrificing). If there's 3 red people running around at your door, think for a second where the other 5 are... It's really not that hard. If you're half decent, you'll be at the other door BEFORE anything bad happens!

 

And I don't call. If I'm on my shadow/sin I'll be annoying for long enough for them to realize that I have 2 or 3 people at my thingy. If they don't, they don't deserve to win. If I'm not on my shadow/sin, you won't see me guard.

Edited by AlphaInquisitor
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why not use what ur comfortable with and call it a day?

 

Personally I use East and West for Novare coast, Snow and grass for Civil ware, left and right for Voidstar(as u exist spawn), in AH i call home pylon( in case we capped both)

 

I use these too.

 

Edited after reading posts posted while I was writing: Yes, to use left/right in voidstar with any success requires the point of reference to be "as you exit spawn". Personally I've never seen anyone use anything else, although some people still complain and insist on using east/west anyway.

 

If you've run into people using left/right from some random point of reference, I think you've just been REALLY unlucky. There's lots of stupid people out there, but that's quite far below the average methinks.

Edited by MagikFingerz
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People are quicker orientating on left and right than they are on east and west.

The only map this simply won't work on is Novare Coast. Which is a map where in my personal experience people have learned to memorize that, west is the "Republic" upper base and east is the "Imperial" upper base, anyway.

 

 

Just always assume from the POV of the spawn and go from there.

 

 

Also if there are specific landmarks like "snow/grass" on alderaan civil war or "sand/solid" on hypergates people can relate to those even faster.

Edited by Evolixe
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Also if there are specific landmarks like "snow/grass" on alderaan civil war or "sand/solid" on hypergates people can relate to those even faster.

 

I have never seen "sand/solid" before. Usually its "inc pylon!" or if we have both "inc the other pylon!"

 

Guess its a server thing

Edited by Zoom_VI
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I have never seen "sand/solid" before. Usually its "inc pylon!" or if we have both "inc the other pylon!"

 

Guess its a server thing

 

I actually called east and then called sand (no pylon had been capped yet) and some r'tard went off on me for not saying pylon. and get this, his rationale was that ppl won't know what you mean and it will pull ppl out of mid. pulling ppl out of mid is kinda the point, isn't it? lol

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I have never seen "sand/solid" before. Usually its "inc pylon!" or if we have both "inc the other pylon!"

 

Guess its a server thing

 

It's way faster than anything else.

 

People don't have to open up their map and be like "North East South West"... "oh, so that must be east!"

Or memorize what side of the warzone they spawned on which can be particulary time consuming when two teams of the same faction are having a go at eachother.

Edited by Evolixe
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Usually I say left and right as of spawn, this IMO makes it easier for the team to understand(unless I'm playing ACW where snow and grass are easy land marks) because IMO it takes too much thought power to figure out which side is which on the fly
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Usually I say left and right as of spawn, this IMO makes it easier for the team to understand(unless I'm playing ACW where snow and grass are easy land marks) because IMO it takes too much thought power to figure out which side is which on the fly

 

In VS, though, it really shouldn't take that much thought power, if you can remember one thing;

 

According to the minimap, the datacore is always, always, always North*. (Well, technically Northeast, but still North of everything else. If you can remember that, getting W/E is way easier to remember.

 

*Except if you're in the top hallway leading down to it. But if you're up there, you don't really have anything left to call out anyway.

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I guess I'm talking specifically about the Voidstar, since there are no landmarks. Snow is snow, grass is grass, mid is mid. Same thing with AH: ours, theirs, mid. Granted, I don't know how we all decided which side was going to be the default side in AH, since they both take the same time to get to. Probably roll over from civil war. Huttball is huttball. I love huttball.

 

Voidstar is the only one that changes what left and right mean.

 

I'm not going to be satisfied with "what is comfortable for me."

 

Considering all the talk about premades and their ability to communicate exceeding that of a pug's, I just want some consistency.

 

I always use east and west for void star, simply because it makes more sense. I tend to call the doors what they are actually called yet it still confuses some people. I mean when the bomb is planted it tells you what is east or west whatever so I could never fathom why people would find this was difficult to work out. East and west are the same on the map, and the doors correspond to the map. /shrug

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In VS, though, it really shouldn't take that much thought power, if you can remember one thing;

 

According to the minimap, the datacore is always, always, always North*. (Well, technically Northeast, but still North of everything else. If you can remember that, getting W/E is way easier to remember.

 

*Except if you're in the top hallway leading down to it. But if you're up there, you don't really have anything left to call out anyway.

 

not that what you're saying is rocket science, but you're still over complicating the matter. East and West (just like North and South) never change. Learn which side is which just once, and you'll (impersonal) know where the F you're going. Left/Right is dependent on orientation, and orientation changes on every map, either because of rounds or depending on which faction you play on. I've had ppl call east when they meant west. I've had complete morons try to argue that E/W change depending whether you're attacking or defending. I've had equally stupid teammates insist that L/R doesn't change in voidstar, depending on whether you're attacking or defending.

 

but my all time favorite was in CW when someone took the east/snow node from us. one or two ppl give the obligatory "what? no call?" complaint, and the guy who was guarding said, "I was stunned!" yeah. that deserves a super special award of some kind.

 

edit:

I always use east and west for void star, simply because it makes more sense. I tend to call the doors what they are actually called yet it still confuses some people. I mean when the bomb is planted it tells you what is east or west whatever so I could never fathom why people would find this was difficult to work out. East and west are the same on the map, and the doors correspond to the map. /shrug

lol well said.

 

edit2:

people will argue this, but w/e: "pylon" is harder to type quickly that east/west, especially if you're giving the numbers (which you should), e.g., 2 west, 3 east, etc. it's all left hand, and you shouldn't ever need to go beyond 5, rarely beyond 4, so they're not even the "far away" keys for left hand (like a ~ or 5).

 

this is, of course, nitpicking. 2p or 3e or 4w are all fine.

Edited by foxmob
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not that what you're saying is rocket science, but you're still over complicating the matter. East and West (just like North and South) never change. Learn which side is which just once, and you'll (impersonal) know where the F you're going. Left/Right is dependent on orientation, and orientation changes on every map, either because of rounds or depending on which faction you play on. I've had ppl call east when they meant west. I've had complete morons try to argue that E/W change depending whether you're attacking or defending. I've had equally stupid teammates insist that L/R doesn't change in voidstar, depending on whether you're attacking or defending.

 

but my all time favorite was in CW when someone took the east/snow node from us. one or two ppl give the obligatory "what? no call?" complaint, and the guy who was guarding said, "I was stunned!" yeah. that deserves a super special award of some kind.

 

edit:

 

lol well said.

 

edit2:

people will argue this, but w/e: "pylon" is harder to type quickly that east/west, especially if you're giving the numbers (which you should), e.g., 2 west, 3 east, etc. it's all left hand, and you shouldn't ever need to go beyond 5, rarely beyond 4, so they're not even the "far away" keys for left hand (like a ~ or 5).

 

this is, of course, nitpicking. 2p or 3e or 4w are all fine.

 

 

I might be overcomplicating it a bit - but I *personally* don't have problems remembering which is which. For others that seem to, though, I think remembering it in terms of where the datacore is could be helpful. Because you pretty much always know where you are in relation to that. If you can remember it's north, but STILL can't figure out what's west and east from that? Well, I wonder how those people managed to even log themselves into the game.

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I might be overcomplicating it a bit - but I *personally* don't have problems remembering which is which. For others that seem to, though, I think remembering it in terms of where the datacore is could be helpful. Because you pretty much always know where you are in relation to that. If you can remember it's north, but STILL can't figure out what's west and east from that? Well, I wonder how those people managed to even log themselves into the game.

 

yeah. didn't wanna seem like I was attacking your explanation. just trying to say it's even simpler than that, imo.

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I always use east and west for void star, simply because it makes more sense. I tend to call the doors what they are actually called yet it still confuses some people. I mean when the bomb is planted it tells you what is east or west whatever so I could never fathom why people would find this was difficult to work out. East and west are the same on the map, and the doors correspond to the map. /shrug

 

And this is why I use left and right on that map. If you want to be understood you have to use directions that everyone will understand. Sadly this means dumbing down the directions.

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And this is why I use left and right on that map. If you want to be understood you have to use directions that everyone will understand. Sadly this means dumbing down the directions.

 

Y I agree that most people have grasped the concept of left and right. A lot of people cannot understand east/west in relation to the map. But then people don't understand a lot of things in pvp so it's not really surprising.

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Left/right to me and many people, mean simply left or right of the spawn point... If you spawn in void star and they say left door they mean left if they say right they mean right... Look at it this way, if they call left and if defending it's west... If attacking, its east

The only map that really needs east, west, South is nova cost... Civil War is grass, mid, snow... It can't get much simpler... Most people know their right from their left... But can get confused from east/west lol

 

.

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I must say I am very disappointed. I am sad to say it, but there it is.

 

Why must we defend mediocrity?

 

I created this thread specifically to start a conversation. I am not new to this game. I look at my minimap. I am not a stupid person. I actually expected the responses that said "If you looked at your minimap you'd know." I planned on having people defending the players unwilling to improve just a little bit. I was not expecting known good players to be those that said it, though.

 

Read these forums. They are full of people complaining about pre-made groups. Complaining about those able to respond quickly. Complaining, instead of finding a way to be better. Communication is key, yet based on the responses I've read, it seems to be more popular to nitpick those asking for individual improvement.

 

I respect good players. Unfortunately, I find the good players wanting in this thread.

 

Evolixe, you made a twitch stream with the title to the effect of bw will never learn. You have in your signature something like people need to open themselves to new ideas. You also seem to get annoyed when people bring up your sig, or take it out of context, yet you still say left out of spawn. You are bending to the meta. You are being the meta. Shame on you. You are better than that. Much better. I ask you to be better than that. Simple fix.

 

I watched Snave's stream a few days ago. He popped Voidstar. Same deal. He's well above average as far as OP goes, yet he asked people to go left. A very well above the curve player, speaking the language of the dunce.

 

It's been pointed out that the doors themselves are called east and west, yet we insist on saying left and right. I learned my left from right in kindergarten. Are we at that point? Do we not know our ABC's?

 

The rest of you. Well. Be better. Be better.

 

We are on the precipice of a new level cap.

 

Be better.

 

Bee Tee Jay

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Hey, you're clearly done discussing this, so sorry for my late entrance in the debate, this is an old topic around here I feel. We often speak of situational awareness as something like, "trust the Force" kinda thing, but it really is about thinking ahead and some adding of experience and then of course the 'right' conclusions

 

My point? Well in situations of what is what and why there's no call; In VS my standard advice is, always;

"If u outnmbrs the attackers u r probably needed at the other door" this is a simple enough rule together with a fast map count of your own forces to decide where you are needed most.

When it comes to who's guarding what node and why aren't there any calls;

A simple thing is to focus target your lone node guard and notice if he's being attacked by watching his health bar, again that lone guard is probably not where you currently are, so if you're fighting at 1 of your 2 capped nods, or fighting over the last 'gray' objective, you can pretty much assume that it's at the lone guard you need to be . . .

OR if your main force just capped the second objective, well, then your least guarded capped objective probably need to be strengthen . . .

 

Now, it's not my intention to be QQing here, it's a common fact that the simple solution often is the hardest to apply!!

Edited by t-darko
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