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Zero reason to play gsf - need "ground" incentive and LEGACY based requisition

STAR WARS: The Old Republic > English > Galactic Starfighter
Zero reason to play gsf - need "ground" incentive and LEGACY based requisition

Ramalina's Avatar


Ramalina
04.28.2018 , 11:20 PM | #11
I play GSF on alts that I want to gear up, because with the CXP from GSF I can gear them faster than I can in the ground game.

Back when it was the cool thing to do, I tried CXP farming with the Vet/Master mode 5 minute Chapter 2 speedruns, where you basically just skipped all the NPCs. It was a nifty trick, but aside from being repetitive to the point of being boring it was significantly slower at earning CXP than GSF matches were. The speedrun got nerfed because the rewards were too good. GSF rewards haven't been nerfed, at least not yet.

You do have to participate for GSF to yield good rewards, and at least modest skill is also needed. Meet those conditions though, and in terms of gearing from CXP level 1 to the end of CXP level 3 playing GSF for the ground game gearing is more rewarding than playing the ground game is.



Looking around I couldn't find an updated requisition earning guide. With changes in 5.0 most people of the guide writing persuasion figured that requisition had become so easy to earn that no one could possibly need a guide to earning requisition anymore.

Which was perhaps a bit silly, because the GSF gearing system isn't really very intuitive, at least not if you look at the long history of posts by people who spent lots of time and effort and got very little out of it because they didn't understand how to make the system work efficiently in their favor.

So here are some fossilized old ones:

http://www.swtor.com/community/showpost.php?p=8186591&postcount=373

http://www.swtor.com/community/showp...0&postcount=30

The costs are old, so now things cost either 50%, 25%, or 0% of what they cost back then, and at least my guide predated the intro mission, so it's short by whatever the giant pile of fleet req. that mission gives you.

Also the meta changed a bit with 5.5 so I'll supplement Siraka's guide with a current budget friendly deathmobile:

Pike/Quell
Unlock with fleet req. 5k? 2.5k? Does anyone even keep track now that things are so cheap? At any rate, buy it with the intro mission rewards, you'll probably have plenty left over.

Barrel roll: 1750 ship req. to upgrade 2
Efficient targeting Magazine: 3000 ship req. to unlock and upgrade to 3
Concussion missiles: 1750 ship req. to upgrade 2
Proton torpedoes: 500 ship req. to upgrade 1
Leaving 6000 to 8000 ship req worth of discretionary spending under Siraka's 7 game budget, for a monstosity that can fire missiles until smoking wreckage is all that's left of the other team.

I'd probably put 3k into regen thrusters, unlock Heavy Lasers, and spend the remnant on Quick Charge shields, but one could just as easily sink that into upgrading Proton torpedoes and/or Concussion missiles.

The core functionality of what's a contender for the deadliest TDM ship in the current meta costs just 7000 ship requisition. Take the weekly mission, then for 4 days take the daily mission and play enough games, win or lose (so 4 to 8 games) do those dailies, which will also finish the weekly, and you have enough ship req for the base of a Pike or Quell build. At that point any productivity issues in matches are a pilot skill issue, not a ship gear issue.

Not all ships are that cheap. The Starguard/Rycer runs around 20k to 30k req for a similar level of core competitiveness, but assuming that the player actually plays during matches and earns some requisition, that's still on the order of 2 games a day for a week or a week and a half. Try gearing a character starting from level one for HM Ops, and get it done in 10 hours of play time.

Grind is mostly a subjective matter of whether you enjoy the content for its own sake or are doing it for other purposes, but in terms of getting to a competitive gear level per hour of game played, GSF is orders of magnitude more time efficient than the ground game is.
"A padawan's master sets their Jedi trial, Rajivari set mine."
- Zhe Lian, Sage.

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Pietrastor's Avatar


Pietrastor
05.02.2018 , 04:34 AM | #12
Being perfectly blunt, all the apologist "you don't need this or that, it's not that grindy, stop complaining, etc" excuses is why Bioware messed GSF implementation and integration with the main game among other systems and features. You guys do more harm than good with the excuses. The reality is simple - Starfighter IS too grindy (despite the changes), there's little incentive, it's not integrated with the ground game etc. And the result is that few play it and this is coming from a regular GSF player
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Lendul's Avatar


Lendul
05.02.2018 , 09:09 AM | #13
Quote: Originally Posted by Pietrastor View Post
Being perfectly blunt, all the apologist "you don't need this or that, it's not that grindy, stop complaining, etc" excuses is why Bioware messed GSF implementation and integration with the main game among other systems and features. You guys do more harm than good with the excuses. The reality is simple - Starfighter IS too grindy (despite the changes), there's little incentive, it's not integrated with the ground game etc. And the result is that few play it and this is coming from a regular GSF player
Compared to the command grind the starfighter grind is a sprint. The funny thing is as you regurgitate "no ties to the ground game", starfighter is one of the best ways to grind command.

Toraak's Avatar


Toraak
05.02.2018 , 10:34 AM | #14
Quote: Originally Posted by Lendul View Post
Compared to the command grind the starfighter grind is a sprint. The funny thing is as you regurgitate "no ties to the ground game", starfighter is one of the best ways to grind command.
I would also add that Starfighter is a great way to get Unaseembled components which ties into upgrading gear in the ground game.
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Ramalina's Avatar


Ramalina
05.02.2018 , 10:40 PM | #15
Quote: Originally Posted by Pietrastor View Post
Being perfectly blunt, all the apologist "you don't need this or that, it's not that grindy, stop complaining, etc" excuses is why Bioware messed GSF implementation and integration with the main game among other systems and features. You guys do more harm than good with the excuses. The reality is simple - Starfighter IS too grindy (despite the changes), there's little incentive, it's not integrated with the ground game etc. And the result is that few play it and this is coming from a regular GSF player
When I'm gearing alts I consider the ability to earn more than 60,000 CXP per hour to be a pretty compelling incentive to play GSF. You have to know how to work the reward system to stack multipliers.

GSF gives rewards relevant in practically every other aspect of the game.

For the most part though, it doesn't communicate that those rewards exist, or how to go about obtaining them. That plus the steep gameplay learning curve is quite discouraging to new players.

Factually, the rewards are there, the rewards are generous, and the gearing is absurdly fast compared to the rest of the game. GSF is the least grindy part of SWTOR.

Perceptually though, none of that information is readily available to a player that hasn't already mastered how the GSF reward systems (which are a complicated confusing mess) work. Efficient earning of rewards pretty much requires understanding how the reward systems work, so ignorance is punished on the rewards front even if the player is doing well in terms of learning to play otherwise.

It's not surprising though. SWTOR's reward systems game-wide are a complicated confusing mess right now. GSF is just a bit more of a last minute patched together messy tangle than the rest.



It's not likely to change though. This sort of communication/guiding of players is considered relatively low priority, and they don't have enough time to properly address their higher priorities. We're probably stuck with what we have for quite a while.
"A padawan's master sets their Jedi trial, Rajivari set mine."
- Zhe Lian, Sage.

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NerfGatherer's Avatar


NerfGatherer
05.04.2018 , 03:58 PM | #16
Stock rycer/starguard gets me in top five spots a good amount of the time. The problem is the exceptionally good players out there in pairs or 3 or 4 makes life difficult. Plus there is just so much to know and understand that takes experience only hard won by aloooot of games. The sheer amount of strategy and awareness many players havent even guessed at is always very apparent.

Playing on and off since it launched im still figuring out new things, and how to emulate strategies that once frustrated me to the point of "omg hackers,unfair,broken,etc" . It doesnt take that long though to catch up(maybe not equal, but to a point where losing feels like winning) to the very best, but like all indepth pvp people expect to jump in on top. Playing against much better players and asking experienced people questions helps alot. Plus lvling with GSF is great, multi tasking crew skills/gsf/class missions/heroics/GTN marketting good way to get alot done at once .

NerfGatherer's Avatar


NerfGatherer
05.04.2018 , 04:02 PM | #17
GSF is very skill based, and team strategy oriented...that said one player can litterally be good enough to carry a bad team, against a team that doesnt understand their options to deal with any one pilot.

ALaggyGrunt's Avatar


ALaggyGrunt
05.07.2018 , 05:45 AM | #18
There are plenty of game-mechanics reasons to play GSF, mostly related to progression (conquest, achievement farming, command points/unassembled components).

And there are plenty of reasons not to, mostly related to how hard it is for a newbie to find a fun match where your team isn't completely afk, or killing everything before you get in range. They still exist, they're just pretty rare.

Mournblood's Avatar


Mournblood
05.14.2018 , 08:01 PM | #19
I'll agree that GSF is a good way to supplement UC, which is pretty much the only reason I step foot into that acrid pond, but I disagree that it's more efficient for grinding CXP than regular WZs. I'll sit in queue for 20-30 minutes on average waiting for GSF to pop, whereas WZs pop within a minute or so of being in queue. I can get 2-3 regular WZ matches in the same time it takes me to get one GSF match. And I win the majority of my WZ matches, unlike GSF.

The elephant in the room here is that GSF isn't very popular because most matches are ridiculously lopsided. Getting 3-capped or being on the losing end of a DM where the score is 47-3, is about as fun as a proctology exam. Add to that premade GSF teams and spawn camping, and it becomes a rather miserable experience rather quickly. For these reasons, I find that the most adamant defenders of GSF are often the very same players farming everyone else they convinced to play. For those of you that love GSF and have some skill at it, good for you, but don't pee on my head and tell me it's raining.

While that may ruffle some feathers here, the fact remains that the OP has a certain point. There needs to be some better incentives to play GSF, which in turn will increase the queue pops and bring more healthy competition to this area of the game. Otherwise, why would someone queue up for GSF and get obliterated over and over again, when they can queue up for several regular WZs in the same amount of time and at least have a fighting chance due to Bolster. God help them if they are new to the game and/or PvP in GSF, but regular WZs are much more forgiving in this respect. Until there is some game mechanism to draw more players to GSF, it will continue to be some back-water ghost town where few people live and most are simply passing by.
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Lendul's Avatar


Lendul
05.15.2018 , 12:29 PM | #20
I defend GSF...and now let's have a show of hands from the people that have been farmed by Lendul.

I understand making generalized all-encompassing remarks is easier, but it is also mentally lazy and disingenuous.

To speak to your analysis on WZ vs GSF rates. WZ only accrue points faster due to increased pops. Pops being equal, GSF gives more points and the games are faster. Following your logic, in a desert, sand is superior to water due to increased availability.