I've had high hopes that they'd turn around and redevelop F2P system into something better but I'm slowly losing hopes. It seems the whole point of is to force new people to subscribe or buy all these unlockables and to make subscribers spend in the cartel. They're putting out this overpriced stuff and mainly relying on packs to intice people. IMO they're going at it the way wrong way and eventually they'll lose the respect and hope of players.

They keep going backwards instead of forward.

That being said, I don't think I'll be buying coins again if they don't take the initiative to modify F2P and stop relying solely on packs to wring money from subscribers. I mention F2P because the success of this game will ultimately lie on what they do with F2P. If they continue with the same I don't expect to see any growth after February 2013. Why should people be expected to dip any more money in this game when ultimately this game will sink due to the bad decisions of EA/Bioware?

Don't expect reason or logic to apply here, this is just one of the forms of SWTOR endgame:

 

- Flashpoints

- Operations

- Space

- PvP

- Forum ranting & trolling

Ha! I love it First time I hear it in an MMO forum.

I guess I haven't given up on Bioware completely, but I'm close due to the Cartel packs and now the Life Day failure. I will unsub, if it continues, and move on to another game.

I haven't given up on BioWare, but I have given up on their relationship with EA. And it's the latter group that is calling the shots now - BioWare seems to be without a strong leader to contradict the self-destructive profitmongering of their publisher.

My beef? You're forgetting your subscribers! I should not have to open my wallet for ANYTHING other than my subscription for anything in that game. Having to do so goes back on your 'full access' promise you made to us.

This is what your 500+ coins per month are for my friend. To accumulate and spend on limited time content on the coin market. You would have a valid point if your subscription did not include a monthly award of coins. But that is not the case, and most veterans were sitting on enough coins to buy any event content they wanted... unless they pissed them away on cartel packs at F2P launch.

There is never any compelling reason for any subscriber to ever buy coins, EVEN when there is exclusive content on the coin market.

Now, if for whatever reason, a subscriber is too impulsive to save coins for the future... that's on them.

I'd just like BW to at least say something about acknowledging how things went wrong with 1.6 .

False premise begets false expectations.

If a smoker simply stopped smoking maybe they won't develop a form of cancer.

 

Things aren't as easy as they sound. The playerbase has proven that they are addicted to the CM to an extent and that this is most likely the biggest profit gainer in the game.

 

========================

 

+1 sub to this thread

So...rather than expecting players/smokers to exhibit their own self-control, you blame the people making the game/cigarettes? That's utterly stupid. Bioware is a company trying to make a profit, not a charity. If people can't control themselves, that's THEIR problem.

The drama in this thread, all over a few reskinned holiday and spaceship items? Man I can't wait for a real problem to arise.

LOL.. yeah... I've been thinking the same thing.

The drama in this thread, all over a few reskinned holiday and spaceship items? Man I can't wait for a real problem to arise.

There is no hope for the future of mankind.

As i said, i like the game and, as a person who likes it, i'm worried about the direction SWTOR is following.

As a person who likes it, you also ought to see the features we've seen over the past 4~5 months:

- August: Grand Acquisition Race

- September: Terror From Beyond

- November: EC Nightmare Mode + Section X + HK-51

- December: New Warzone + Additional space missions

They have picked up their pace on content releases, they've also spread it out more into aiming for bite sized chunks.

Sure there's some cartel stuff going up along with it, however none of that is mandatory. Want premium access? Simply subscribe. Want to get the fluff and junk, well simply spend some cartel coins. It's not as if the game is impossible to play without the use of cartel coins.

The last week of January we'll most probably see the next patch hit live servers, it including another flashpoint or two and perhaps a daily area wouldn't surprise me. With a new raid most probably to be thrown in after that somewhere in March. Anywhere between February ~ April I wouldn't be shocked to see another event pop up either.

This is what your 500+ coins per month are for my friend. To accumulate and spend on limited time content on the coin market. You would have a valid point if your subscription did not include a monthly award of coins. But that is not the case, and most veterans were sitting on enough coins to buy any event content they wanted... unless they pissed them away on cartel packs at F2P launch.

 

There is never any compelling reason for any subscriber to ever buy coins, EVEN when there is exclusive content on the coin market.

 

Now, if for whatever reason, a subscriber is too impulsive to save coins for the future... that's on them.

A friend of mine subscribed for the first time when the model launched. He wasn't given enough coins with that subscription to even think about getting all the Life Day items. Sorry, but your logic simply doesn't work here. Unless subscribers are given enough coins to purchase at least one of everything that isn't provided in the subscription, the "This is what your 500+ coins per month are for my friend"-argument holds no water.

LOL.. yeah... I've been thinking the same thing.

It's not a single event. It's the trend that has been established. I'm sorry that you refuse to allow yourself to see it.

I got 2 weapons from 1.5 cartel packs for under 100k each. Just wait for the prices to lower or just grind dailies until you have the cash. It's not that hard to get credits.

It's not that it's hard. It's that you shouldn't have to. I think the root problem here is that the subs are not feeling the love. I play DCUO. It's got a F2P model. I'm a sub and I still feel like the game is hooking me up with the good stuff though because every time they come out with something new (new power set, player housing, etc.....) the f2p people have to pay for it and the subs get it for free. So it becomes another motivation to sub up. I don't see any real hatred toward the f2p people that I see in TOR either because the subs feel like they're being taken care of. Lately TOR feels like the subs are being pushed to the side and everything is catering towards the f2p people.

Legacy is meaningless now. Used to be that it meant something as you had to play through chapter 1 to get it. Now it means nothing as you can get it much easier. Used to be that legacy unlocks meant something as you had to level your legacy and/or grind out millions of creds in order to unlock stuff. Now you don't any more. You just fork over real money. So you have f2p players who have the exact same perks that subs do. Why sub? For $40 I can get the same stuff I've got now and I pay that one time. The other option is to pay $10-15 a month. So I can pay $120 a year to get stuff or I can pay $40 one time. Which is better?

So...rather than expecting players/smokers to exhibit their own self-control, you blame the people making the game/cigarettes? That's utterly stupid. Bioware is a company trying to make a profit, not a charity. If people can't control themselves, that's THEIR problem.

No Mr. Constructive, I was saying that people have a possible issue of not being able to step away from something (in this case the CM). Thanks for reading my post fully...

There is no hope for the future of mankind.

and for SW:ToR

Now, if for whatever reason, a subscriber is too impulsive to save coins for the future... that's on them.

I haven't spent any of my coin yet, I have subbed since launch, I have collector edition : I sit at 3550 CCs as of right now.

I have 9 characters, but enough CCs for just one character for the life day pack since even if I save more it'll be gone before I can get enough.

Without paying more than my sub, no matter how you calculate :

This is the FIRST AND ONLY MMO (and I've played tons the past 12 years) where I can't have seasonal event items on the number of characters I wish them on.

So the overused "This is what your 500+ coins per month are for my friend." spin that you USE in every thread about the matter is getting old... Frankly it's *really* getting old !

This is what your 500+ coins per month are for my friend. To accumulate and spend on limited time content on the coin market. You would have a valid point if your subscription did not include a monthly award of coins. But that is not the case, and most veterans were sitting on enough coins to buy any event content they wanted... unless they pissed them away on cartel packs at F2P launch.

 

There is never any compelling reason for any subscriber to ever buy coins, EVEN when there is exclusive content on the coin market.

 

Now, if for whatever reason, a subscriber is too impulsive to save coins for the future... that's on them.

The point here is that Bioware is failing subscribers. We WANT to earn these things in game! Not have to open our wallet or be given these items for free. We want something to do in game other than grind gear!

The point here is that Bioware is failing subscribers. We WANT to earn these things in game! Not have to open our wallet or be given these items for free. We want something to do in game other than grind gear!

So.... rather than grinding gear.... you wish to grind .... christmas .... gear?

What the?

As well all know the event itself is not what people seek, we saw that by seeing all the flames during the grand acquisition race as there was no lightsaber weapon available.

This is what your 500+ coins per month are for my friend. To accumulate and spend on limited time content on the coin market. You would have a valid point if your subscription did not include a monthly award of coins. But that is not the case, and most veterans were sitting on enough coins to buy any event content they wanted... unless they pissed them away on cartel packs at F2P launch.

 

There is never any compelling reason for any subscriber to ever buy coins, EVEN when there is exclusive content on the coin market.

 

Now, if for whatever reason, a subscriber is too impulsive to save coins for the future... that's on them.

If the current trend continues there'll be less subscribers and less new players in the future. What they're doing with the packs and unlocks is a quick cash grab that is not gaining them any fans. It's unhealthy in the long term. But I'm not saying they should stop with the packs, but rather they should stop solely relying on packs to get people to spend money. People want to buy some of this stuff straight from the cartel as well (and at more reasonable prices not 1200 coins) and people want to see NEW stuff not repainted items that probably took someone 5 minutes to do. I'm not saying this as an opposer but a new player and subscriber who wants to continue having hope that the game won't start sinking 2 months from now.

They can continue doing whatever they're doing now and you can continue to agree with everything but eventually people will lose patience and outsiders will forget about the game once again (the attention the shift to F2P has gathered will not last long if F2P stays the same).

I'm a subscriber and I don't feel like Bioware is failing me at all.

My biggest fear is that the game goes under. If F2P helps save it, sell sell sell.

And I enjoy the game enough that even though I could get a free Reindeer in WoW, its not exactly what i'd call a deal-breaker.

I think BW never realized how many players would give up their extensive voice acted storylines for the ability to throw virtual snowballs.

The point here is that Bioware is failing subscribers. We WANT to earn these things in game! Not have to open our wallet or be given these items for free. We want something to do in game other than grind gear!

But being a sucker doesn't help. I had some 2k coins and i used them all to buy packs hoping for the Revan mask. Not because OMG REVAN but because republic side completely lacks full-face masks. Heck, even half-face masks, like respirators. But i'm a sucker and instead of using those coins for some quality of life unlock (like account-wide extra cargo bay) or a 100% "drop" (like honored adept's shroud) i hoped to get something i wanted for a long time.

See, they lure you with stuff that should be in game but isn't:

- Full face masks that work with hoods (especially for republic side)

- Hood down robes for consulars/knights

- Hood up non-tunic robes (especially for imperial side, for both inquisitors and marauders)

- Good looking blasters/rifles/lightsabers that can be achieved at a lower level

- Cross-faction and cross-class items (trooper-like gear for bounty hunter and the reverse, imperial agent gear for smuggler, adaptive armor for any class, etc)

And because i care so much about how my characters look and feel, i'm a sucker and their cheap tactic WORKS on me. That's what's really insulting for me. Lurk the forums, see what community wants then put a price tag on it, and/or make it a gamble and profit. Disappointing.

EA, man. Bloody EA.

So.... rather than grinding gear.... you wish to grind .... christmas .... gear?

 

What the?

 

 

As well all know the event itself is not what people seek, we saw that by seeing all the flames during the grand acquisition race as there was no lightsaber weapon available.

I want to get away from the grind by having some FUN! Doing a quest to get one of these items can hardly be considered a grind. I think most people liked the GAR, but it was a bit short and short sighted if they didn't think people would be upset by not having equal rewards across classes. Yet another example that Bioware doesn't know or doesn't care about our thoughts.

But being a sucker doesn't help. I had some 2k coins and i used them all to buy packs hoping for the Revan mask. Not because OMG REVAN but because republic side completely lacks full-face masks. Heck, even half-face masks, like respirators. But i'm a sucker and instead of using those coins for some quality of life unlock (like account-wide extra cargo bay) or a 100% "drop" (like honored adept's shroud) i hoped to get something i wanted for a long time.

 

See, they lure you with stuff that should be in game but isn't:

 

- Full face masks that work with hoods (especially for republic side)

- Hood down robes for consulars/knights

- Hood up non-tunic robes (especially for imperial side, for both inquisitors and marauders)

- Good looking blasters/rifles/lightsabers that can be achieved at a lower level

- Cross-faction and cross-class items (trooper-like gear for bounty hunter and the reverse, imperial agent gear for smuggler, adaptive armor for any class, etc)

 

And because i care so much about how my characters look and feel, i'm a sucker and their cheap tactic WORKS on me. That's what's really insulting for me. Lurk the forums, see what community wants then put a price tag on it, and/or make it a gamble and profit. Disappointing.

 

EA, man. Bloody EA.

Here's the difference between Subscription and F2P.

Subscription based MMOs want to give you things like the Revan Mask as a 1/5000 drop from a boss to keep you playing for months to come while F2P just wants you to fork over the money for it NOW. They can co-exist, but I haven't seen an effort to do so yet.

A friend of mine subscribed for the first time when the model launched. He wasn't given enough coins with that subscription to even think about getting all the Life Day items. Sorry, but your logic simply doesn't work here. Unless subscribers are given enough coins to purchase at least one of everything that isn't provided in the subscription, the "This is what your 500+ coins per month are for my friend"-argument holds no water.

Except for the fact that I can't get OPs level gear on the first day of my sub either. Things take time. I do feel for your friend in that they did not receive the same amount of reward for being a new sub as one who support the game for much longer, but then that's to be expected isn't it? I certainly wouldn't go into GW2 in the 11th hour of the Halloween event and expect to get all the rewards for the entire thing either. So yes, in this case, your friend, if he wanted to get those items before they were gone would have to spend some extra money now, but don't forget that these things can also be had from the GTN or other players who may not have listed them yet. If he has enough friends like you in game, perhaps you can all perform a collection for him so he can use credits to get the items without having to spend any additional real cash.

BJ

Except for the fact that I can't get OPs level gear on the first day of my sub either. Things take time. I do feel for your friend in that they did not receive the same amount of reward for being a new sub as one who support the game for much longer, but then that's to be expected isn't it? I certainly wouldn't go into GW2 in the 11th hour of the Halloween event and expect to get all the rewards for the entire thing either. So yes, in this case, your friend, if he wanted to get those items before they were gone would have to spend some extra money now, but don't forget that these things can also be had from the GTN or other players who may not have listed them yet. If he has enough friends like you in game, perhaps you can all perform a collection for him so he can use credits to get the items without having to spend any additional real cash.

 

BJ

That's beside my point. Andy stated that mere act of subscribing allows you to get the limited time items. That is a demonstrably false assertion.